Ron Paul

[Wamitoria]

I love that son of a bitch. I want to run my hands through his steely grey hair and kiss his supple lips.

Brüno?

[Distruzio]

Read the Confederate Constitution much? It established a federative political system. That is to say that Texas, for all its saber rattling, wasn't the Confederacy. It was a single Republic within the Southland. You can read any of the Secession declarations by any of the states and it means nothing when used to levy moral condemnation on the Confederacy as a whole.

That is like saying that since Bill Clinton left office with a budget surplus, all presidents are good with money. Can we logically deduce this?

The Confederate States may acquire new territory; and Congress shall have power to legislate and provide governments for the inhabitants of all territory belonging to the Confederate States, lying without the limits of the several Sates; and may permit them, at such times, and in such manner as it may by law provide, to form States to be admitted into the Confederacy. In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected by Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States.

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

[Distruzio]

Does it mean that all firemen are arsonists?

Just the ones that throw firebombs into homes.

Then we agree. The only racists were the ones who said blacks were beneath whites.

Oh...

[Farnhamia]

These folks were obviously racist as well weren't they?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Louisiana_Native_Guard_(CSA)

My ancestor was in that regiment.

We need to read our sources rather more closely:

The South did not use this Confederate Native Guard regiment in any military action, and failed to provide it with uniforms or arms. Most of the men in the unit used their own resources to obtain weapons and uniforms which were displayed in a parade in New Orleans on January 8, 1862. It was largely considered part of the Confederacy's "public relations" campaign. The Native Guard tried to gain notoriety by offering their service to escort Union prisoners, captured from Manassas, through New Orleans. Despite the Confederacy choosing white militiamen instead, the Native Guard still participated in two other grand reviews. When the Louisiana State Legislature passed a law in January 1862 that reorganized the militia by conscripting “all the free white males capable of bearing arms… irrespective of nationality”, the 1st Louisiana Native Guard was also affected. It was forced to disband on February 15, 1862, and many of its white officers reassigned to the new Confederate regiments.

[Xsyne]

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

When the slavery is explicitly based on race, then yes, it is racist.

[Wikkiwallana]

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

If your economy is built on human suffering, you don't deserve to have it, so yes, they were the bad guy for firing the first shot.

[Xsyne]

Not to mention that the slavery is the objectionable part. The racism is just icing on the cake.

[Sorratsin]

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

[Terra Agora]

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

[Xsyne]

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

Ever heard of a kapo?

[Wamitoria]

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

Source?

[Distruzio]

Which explains that they were pro-slave... not racist. As I said, when a gov't is threatening your livelihood, wouldn't you get a little pissy and buck back? The morality of the foundation of you economy be damned, it was the economy that they had. Any threat to limit it's growth was a threat to limit their prosperity. On top of that, Lincoln demanded the Morrill Tarriffbe collected. So strangle their economy from two directions and they are the bad guys for firing the first shots?

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

Again, not mine. I'm not a neo-Confed.

I am merely suggesting that perhaps the South had legitimate concerns for their actions. As reprehensible as the institution was, it was the foundation of their economy. Any federal decree limiting its expansion would have put the southern economy in a stranglehold. Any federal decree abolishing slavery would have instilled significant disruptions in the southern economy. After 30 years of rancor and vitriol, they acted in the only manner they saw fit. Secession.

[Terra Agora]

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

Source?

"The free colored population love their home, their property, their own slaves and recognize no other country than Louisiana, and are ready to shed their blood for her defense. They have no sympathy for Abolitionism; no love for the North, but they have plenty for Louisiana." - Free Blacks of Louisiana
From a letter written to the New Orleans' Daily Delta

They supported slavery because it was part of their culture, not because one race is better then another.

[Sorratsin]

I'm so dreadfully sorry that black people's right to not get beaten to death is so troubling to your bottom line.

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

Why do you think this statement has any relevance to what you quoted?

[Terra Agora]

Does it blow your mind that free blacks in the south (where most of the free blacks where by the way) owned slaves?

Ever heard of a kapo?

The loved their slaves just as you would love a friend.

[Sorratsin]

Ever heard of a kapo?

The loved their slaves just as you would love a friend.

This has got to be the dumbest thing I have ever read, anywhere.

Read the slave codes FFS.

[CIB EMPIRE]

My ancestor was in that regiment.

We need to read our sources rather more closely:

The South did not use this Confederate Native Guard regiment in any military action, and failed to provide it with uniforms or arms. Most of the men in the unit used their own resources to obtain weapons and uniforms which were displayed in a parade in New Orleans on January 8, 1862. It was largely considered part of the Confederacy's "public relations" campaign. The Native Guard tried to gain notoriety by offering their service to escort Union prisoners, captured from Manassas, through New Orleans. Despite the Confederacy choosing white militiamen instead, the Native Guard still participated in two other grand reviews. When the Louisiana State Legislature passed a law in January 1862 that reorganized the militia by conscripting “all the free white males capable of bearing arms… irrespective of nationality”, the 1st Louisiana Native Guard was also affected. It was forced to disband on February 15, 1862, and many of its white officers reassigned to the new Confederate regiments.

Why do all of them black men have uniforms and arms when that quote states that they were never provided with such things.. THE PIC IS A LIE

[Wikkiwallana]

Ever heard of a kapo?

The loved their slaves just as you would love a friend.

Friends don't force you to work for no pay under pain of getting beaten.

[Sorratsin]

We need to read our sources rather more closely:

Why do all of them black men have uniforms and arms when that quote states that they were never provided with such things.. THE PIC IS A LIE

It isn't when you read past the first line.

[Sibirsky]

If I were to trade in one of my ounces of gold right now I'd receive back more than $1400. If I had traded in one of my ounces of gold in 2001, I'd have received just over $200. The economy would persist. Quite well actually. What was that main reason?

That's not what he meant and you should know it if you genuinely advocate a gold standard. The US dollar of mined gold in the world is not equal to even half the dollar value of the US yearly economy.

Relevance?

The US economy alone contains more money than every speck of gold every mined on the planet is worth by a gargantuan margin. Going on the gold standard would literally erase half of all wealth in the country, and that's assuming that the US could acquire all the gold beforehand. If we limit it just to the gold the US has in its reserves, we would see 96% of our wealth disappear in the blink of an eye. We're not talking depression here, we're talking "the economy no longer exists" here.

Oh, and that's not even the main reason why just about every economist alive thinks going back on the gold standard is a completely idiotic move.

That's bullshit. Going on the gold standard would not make the economy disappear. What gives you that preposterous idea? Factories would vanish amirite?

The value of all the gold ever mined is less than the US economy priced in fiat US dollars. Had we been on a gold standard all along, the nominal price of an item would be less.

[Terra Agora]

My ancestor was in that regiment.

We need to read our sources rather more closely:

The South did not use this Confederate Native Guard regiment in any military action, and failed to provide it with uniforms or arms. Most of the men in the unit used their own resources to obtain weapons and uniforms which were displayed in a parade in New Orleans on January 8, 1862. It was largely considered part of the Confederacy's "public relations" campaign. The Native Guard tried to gain notoriety by offering their service to escort Union prisoners, captured from Manassas, through New Orleans. Despite the Confederacy choosing white militiamen instead, the Native Guard still participated in two other grand reviews. When the Louisiana State Legislature passed a law in January 1862 that reorganized the militia by conscripting “all the free white males capable of bearing arms… irrespective of nationality”, the 1st Louisiana Native Guard was also affected. It was forced to disband on February 15, 1862, and many of its white officers reassigned to the new Confederate regiments.

They weren't the only ones. The only thing that kept them from fighting was regulations.

There were many that did fight for example "The Richmond Howitzers" which were partially manned by free blacks.

[Terra Agora]

The loved their slaves just as you would love a friend.

Friends don't force you to work for no pay under pain of getting beaten.

I wouldn't say they were forced.

Im not going to say all relationships between "slave" and "master' where good but from what I read a lot of slaves liked their "masters".

[Wikkiwallana]

Friends don't force you to work for no pay under pain of getting beaten.

I wouldn't say they were forced.

Im not going to say all relationships between "slave" and "master' where good but from what I read a lot of slaves liked their "masters".

How many of those were being described by the master, or a slave while still serving a master?

[Distruzio]

That's not what he meant and you should know it if you genuinely advocate a gold standard. The US dollar of mined gold in the world is not equal to even half the dollar value of the US yearly economy.

Relevance?

That's bullshit. Going on the gold standard would not make the economy disappear. What gives you that preposterous idea? Factories would vanish amirite?

The value of all the gold ever mined is less than the US economy priced in fiat US dollars. Had we been on a gold standard all along, the nominal price of an item would be less.

He'll accuse you of not playing fair b/c you have reasons to believe what you believe, and run away. He won't play.

[Distruzio]

I wouldn't say they were forced.

Im not going to say all relationships between "slave" and "master' where good but from what I read a lot of slaves liked their "masters".

How many of those were being described by the master, or a slave while still serving a master?

Well considering that most slaves couldn't read or write, and the slave owner was likely too busy beating his prized slaves and source of wealth senseless, I'd venture to say a third party.