Deport illegal immigrants?

[Gravlen]

Yes. They are people with siblings whom are US citizens.

Then the wait period is absurd. If the person already has family here, they shouldn't make them wait that long.

The problem isn't that they're making them wait, the problem is (as I understand it) that they're flooded with applications. And they have to prioritize, and naturally, people with stronger family ties (spouses, children, parents) get priority.

[Zeppy]

The immigration laws, IMO, should be a bit more humane.

Canada uses the point system. It is an improvement over any other system I have seen.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Then the wait period is absurd. If the person already has family here, they shouldn't make them wait that long.

The problem isn't that they're making them wait, the problem is (as I understand it) that they're flooded with applications. And they have to prioritize, and naturally, people with stronger family ties (spouses, children, parents) get priority.

That makes sense then.

Just not 131 years.

[Gravlen]

Israel should really kicked out those illegal immigrants from the former Soviet Union.

They are taking our jobs!

And Spain has a problem with illegal immigration from Africa.

The fun part about getting expelled from Spain is that you'll be banned from re-entering the entire Schengen area...

[JuNii]

I think we should be more harsh than simple deportation. Chop off a hand and then kick them out of here. Maybe people will stop trying it then. On the flip side, the U.S. really does need to have an easier and more efficient way to legally enter and become a citizen. General rule: if you have no criminal record (other than non-violent misdemeanors), welcome to the U.S. Here are your citizenship papers...

nah, too harsh.

I say treat them as spies (like those hikers were accused of)

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

And Spain has a problem with illegal immigration from Africa.

The fun part about getting expelled from Spain is that you'll be banned from re-entering the entire Schengen area...

Yup. That is absurd though.

[North Calaveras]

Does deporting illegal immigrants from a country do more harm than good?

Personally I think it violates human rights and is very impractical...Any comments on this issue?

A nation without borders is not a nation at all.

Illegal immigrants are a national security issue.
Letting just anyone in can do far more damage than good.
People who come in may be there to traffic drugs and so on which is bad usually in an unregulated setting.
Quite easy for enemy nations to sabotage and create rebellions if you do not protect and manage your intake and outtake of people.
Open borders make a nation vulnerable.

Letting in illegal immigrants stay shows that vulnerability.

This ^

[AiliailiA]

In their home countries.

Depends. Most of the time they will not face jail time. But it will all depend on the individual person and the individual country.

Some people are fleeing their home countries for good reasons. The people who are being persecuted by the regimes of their homeland face jail time, if not worse. Some people will face jail time simply for having left their home countries without proper authorization, while others will only face jail time if they are forcibly deported back to their home countries.

So yeah; it depends.

It's true for refugees ... which is to say it is more true for Europe than it is for the US. Europe is taking in (willingingly or unwillingly) immigrants from the middle east and Africa, and from everywhere east. There's a lot of poverty there but also political repression and ethnic strife. Some are moving country purely for fear of their lives, some are economic refugees (seeking better economic conditions to live in) but there are many who are a bit of both.

The US is rather different, for obvious reasons of geography. Immigration from the south is from South America, which is patchy but overall not terribly poor and not terribly oppressed. The main driver of immigration from Mexico/South America is economic opportunity.

Oh, and those damn Canadians. You know they are going to burn down the White House again when the night-shift guys try to convert the heating boilers into a giant bong.

Not exactly related, but worth repeating: the US grants citizenship to more asylum seekers (those emigrating for fear of their lives) than any other nation. That is admirable, and should be considered quite aside from questions of what is best for the economy or best for economic migrants. Asylum-seekers often bring trauma with them, they're not the ambitious people who willingly move to seek opportunity, but people who have been driven out of their homeland against their will. Taking them in is harder than taking in other immigrants but it is very noble work of which America should be proud. America was not so noble just 75 years ago when the Jews of Germany needed somewhere to go. Not many other countries were either.

[Gravlen]

The fun part about getting expelled from Spain is that you'll be banned from re-entering the entire Schengen area...

Yup. That is absurd though.

I don't think so. With the open borders of the Schengen area, it's the only thing that makes sense, really.

Also, it's yet another incentive to go to Europe by legal means, and to not become a criminal while there.

[Lessnt]

Yup. That is absurd though.

I don't think so. With the open borders of the Schengen area, it's the only thing that makes sense, really.

Also, it's yet another incentive to go to Europe by legal means, and to not become a criminal while there.

Aww I heard someone told me spain was a perfect place with no problems and no violet crimes.
Must be because I heard it on these forums.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Yup. That is absurd though.

I don't think so. With the open borders of the Schengen area, it's the only thing that makes sense, really.

Also, it's yet another incentive to go to Europe by legal means, and to not become a criminal while there.

It is absurd in the sense that if these people decide to apply legally for entering the Schengen area, it seems like they won't be able to. In any case, perhaps it doesn't matter. In the end, most of these people came illegally to the country lacking the means -financially- to enter it properly.

[Neo Avon]

Doesn't Spain have a high rate of robbery? I remember a friend of mine from Nordreich was talking about travelling in Iberia, I believe, and was promptly carjacked on the highway. He said later on he found out that area had plenty of hidden opportunistic thieves in hiding.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Doesn't Spain have a high rate of robbery? I remember a friend of mine from Nordreich was talking about travelling in Iberia, I believe, and was promptly carjacked on the highway. He said later on he found it that area had plenty of hidden opportunistic thieves in hiding.

We have problems, like any other country. Not sure what that poster is on about.

[Zeppy]

Aww I heard someone told me spain was a perfect place with no problems and no violet crimes.
Must be because I heard it on these forums.

We also just frolic in the grasslands while sodomizing each other between collecting our welfare checks.

[Neo Avon]

Doesn't Spain have a high rate of robbery? I remember a friend of mine from Nordreich was talking about travelling in Iberia, I believe, and was promptly carjacked on the highway. He said later on he found it that area had plenty of hidden opportunistic thieves in hiding.

We have problems, like any other country. Not sure what that poster is on about.

Well, of course. He did address it as though it was an abnormally prevalent problem, however. I don't know if there's a correlation between high crime rates and stricter immigration in spain, but just speculation on my part.

[Neo Avon]

Aww I heard someone told me spain was a perfect place with no problems and no violet crimes.
Must be because I heard it on these forums.

We also just frolic in the grasslands while sodomizing each other between collecting our welfare checks.

Sigged.

[Baltenstein]

That, Sibby, would be the ideal thing to do. Work to change the laws on immigration.

The correct "change" is to eliminate them altogether.

There is zero moral justification whatsoever for immigration restrictions or border controls of any sort.

Wishing for civil wars much? Cause that's what unrestricted immgration would inevitably lead to.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

We have problems, like any other country. Not sure what that poster is on about.

Well, of course. He did address it as though it was an abnormally prevalent problem, however. I don't know if there's a correlation between high crime rates and stricter immigration in spain, but just speculation on my part.

Well, this is the same poster that has problems with Spanish being spoken in California or the rest of the US, so he might just be fishing to start an argument. *shrug*

In any case, it's not like it matters. We're not discussing crime rates, we're discussing idiotic immigration laws.

[AiliailiA]

I wonder what happens to the mostly Central American illegal immigrant who are caught entering Mexico in attempting to enter the States?

In theory, they're arrested and deported (to their country of citizenship of course, that's what deportation is).

In practice, Mexico doesn't bother. Not their problem, right?

[Neo Avon]

Well, of course. He did address it as though it was an abnormally prevalent problem, however. I don't know if there's a correlation between high crime rates and stricter immigration in spain, but just speculation on my part.

Well, this is the same poster that has problems with Spanish being spoken in California or the rest of the US, so he might just be fishing to start an argument. *shrug*

In any case, it's not like it matters. We're not discussing crime rates, we're discussing idiotic immigration laws.

Emphasize idiotic.

I'm mostly on the immigration debate bandwagon because I tend to focus on the North American migrant "issue". I pay very little heed to international issues concerning this, as I'm only familiar with refugee migration in Africa, and even that knowledge is heavily limited.

[North Calaveras]

I wish we had Samuel L. Jackson

" Im tired of these muthuafucken immigrants(illegal) in this muthafucken state."

[Gravlen]

I don't think so. With the open borders of the Schengen area, it's the only thing that makes sense, really.

Also, it's yet another incentive to go to Europe by legal means, and to not become a criminal while there.

It is absurd in the sense that if these people decide to apply legally for entering the Schengen area, it seems like they won't be able to. In any case, perhaps it doesn't matter. In the end, most of these people came illegally to the country lacking the means -financially- to enter it properly.

I'm not sure that's true. Many people who come illegally do so by paying people smugglers. And they can be very expensive.

People who can pay $30.000 US to be transported from Iraq to Sweden, could have paid the $300 US fee for the application, airfare, and still retained a healthy sum of money to support themselves with.

I think the reason they can't enter legally is that they don't have the qualifications demanded of them. There's few (official) jobs available for unskilled labour from outside the EU.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

It is absurd in the sense that if these people decide to apply legally for entering the Schengen area, it seems like they won't be able to. In any case, perhaps it doesn't matter. In the end, most of these people came illegally to the country lacking the means -financially- to enter it properly.

I'm not sure that's true. Many people who come illegally do so by paying people smugglers. And they can be very expensive.

People who can pay $30.000 US to be transported from Iraq to Sweden, could have paid the $300 US fee for the application, airfare, and still retained a healthy sum of money to support themselves with.

I think the reason they can't enter legally is that they don't have the qualifications demanded of them. There's few (official) jobs available for unskilled labour from outside the EU.

Add to that that most countries in the EU protect the few jobs available from immigrants.

[Baltenstein]

Well, voters will be voters, won't they. Considering the recession and the huge youth unemployment in countries like Spain, Italy or Greece, even among graduates, it's somewhat understandable that getting immgrants into employment isn't exatly given top priority.

[Gravlen]

Well, this is the same poster that has problems with Spanish being spoken in California or the rest of the US, so he might just be fishing to start an argument. *shrug*

In any case, it's not like it matters. We're not discussing crime rates, we're discussing idiotic immigration laws.

Emphasize idiotic.

I'm mostly on the immigration debate bandwagon because I tend to focus on the North American migrant "issue". I pay very little heed to international issues concerning this, as I'm only familiar with refugee migration in Africa, and even that knowledge is heavily limited.

There's more than 16 million refugees outside their countries in the world. IOM estimates there are 200 million migrants in the world. A 2009 survey by Gallup found roughly 700 million adults would like to migrate to another country permanently if they had the chance. Nearly one-quarter (24%) of these respondents, which translates to more than 165 million adults worldwide, named the United States as their desired future residence.

Just some numbers to mull over.

I really would like to see what would happen if the US opened its borders and allowed for unrestricted immigration. It would be a very interesting experiment.