Postgender

[Alvecia]

Don't bring religion into this

Actually three, "thou."

Given how many of those on one side of this argument justify it on religious grounds, I'd say it's exactly the sort of topic bound to be explored.

Putting aside its religious significance for a minute, the biblical manuscripts from antiquity (~400 B.C. to well into 3rd century A.D.) also gave us a glimpse of life in several mediterranian cultures, Greeks, Roman, Samaritan, and of course, Jewish. None of the unearthed scrolls and artifacts ever mentioned or depicted figures of any genders outside the norm. Not even at Pompeii, the sinful city obsessed with all things sexual and graphic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Androgyny#History

[Sovaal]

Don't bring religion into this

Actually three, "thou."

Given how many of those on one side of this argument justify it on religious grounds, I'd say it's exactly the sort of topic bound to be explored.

Putting aside its religious significance for a minute, the biblical manuscripts from antiquity (~400 B.C. to well into 3rd century A.D.) also gave us a glimpse of life in several mediterranian cultures, Greeks, Roman, Samaritan, and of course, Jewish. None of the unearthed scrolls and artifacts ever mentioned or depicted figures of any genders outside the norm. Not even at Pompeii, the sinful city obsessed with all things sexual and graphic.

No comments on the 'thou', it's bait.

Eh, plenty of old cultures had an idea of a "third" gender.

And I don't think Pompeii was notably "sinful" so much as it was just well preserved.

[Soyouso]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

[Rosod Enutro]

Not sure what you are trying to say, but I sexually identify as Optimus Prime.

[Alvecia]

Not sure what you are trying to say, but I sexually identify as Optimus Prime.

Does that mean you're sexually attracted to Optimus Prime, or that you're sexually attracted to the same things as Optimus Prime is sexually attracted to?

Either way, it's entirely unrelated to gender.

[Thervingia]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

Wait, so you admit to having a mental disorder, but then write how you're not supposed to have the sexual organs that you do?

[The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom]

...
I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because ...

This is really, really abnormal. Have you considered the possibility that your distress may have a spiritual cause?

...

Do your experiences agree?

[Alvecia]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

Wait, so you admit to having a mental disorder, but then write how you're not supposed to have the sexual organs that you do?

What it really breaks down to is there's a mismatch between the brain and the body.
The solution is to bring them back into alignment. That can be done by changing the brain, or changing the body.
One is significantly easier than the other, and is something that we actually know how to do.

[Rosod Enutro]

Not sure what you are trying to say, but I sexually identify as Optimus Prime.

Does that mean you're sexually attracted to Optimus Prime, or that you're sexually attracted to the same things as Optimus Prime is sexually attracted to?

Either way, it's entirely unrelated to gender.

Probably Both
Anyway,
It's just what I say as a joke to people who say they aren't female or male but something else, it makes them facepalm and run for the hills.
Lastly, I guess I still don't understand.

[The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom]

...
The solution is to bring them back into alignment. That can be done by changing the brain, or changing the body.
One is significantly easier than the other, and is something that we actually know how to do.

NSG forums is not the place to offer unsolicited medical advice, even if you were a qualified physician irl. It is dangerous for the recipient and risky for the site admins. Please refrain.

[Alvecia]

...
The solution is to bring them back into alignment. That can be done by changing the brain, or changing the body.
One is significantly easier than the other, and is something that we actually know how to do.

NSG forums is not the place to offer unsolicited medical advice, even if you were a qualified physician irl. It is dangerous for the recipient and risky for the site admins. Please refrain.

lolno

[Donut section]

Still don't know how someone can identify as a post. Or even how you realised it.
Like did you feel bad about yourself until one day at work you held up a sign and said to yourself "wait, this is really good, I feel better, this is who I am!"

[Soyouso]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

Wait, so you admit to having a mental disorder, but then write how you're not supposed to have the sexual organs that you do?

The disorder is exactly what causes me to feel that way involuntarily. That's why I can't make it leave.

...
I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because ...

This is really, really abnormal. Have you considered the possibility that your distress may have a spiritual cause?

I am religous and believe in souls, so my soul must be both male and female and my body does not match. If you're saying I should try to "pray it away", I have too much respect for myself to mentally abuse myself in such a way any longer. I used to try to do that with my sexuality and this, and it just gave me more issues - it contributed to my low self esteem, was part of the reason I was suicidal, and I now have a fear of being around Christians despite being one. Being myself to the best of my ability is much better for my mental health.

[Infinite Coscotlan]

a̼̭͈͖͖͓ͣ͜s̞̫̙͙̣̬̞ͤ̎͒̐ͥ́̆̍͛̀͝ͅd̩ͤ͑́ͨ͂̾ͥ̀̕͝f̸̣͓̩͎͙ͭͫ̓̆̕͡g̺̣ͣ͋ͧ̅̒̇́͡

[The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom]

I am religous and believe in souls, so my soul must be both male and female and my body does not match. If you're saying I should try to "pray it away", I have too much respect for myself to mentally abuse myself in such a way any longer. I used to try to do that with my sexuality and this, and it just gave me more issues - it contributed to my low self esteem, was part of the reason I was suicidal, and I now have a fear of being around Christians despite being one. Being myself to the best of my ability is much better for my mental health.

Well, tact is not exactly my strong suit so I'll be straightforward:
May I ask which church were you baptised at?
Do you receive communion regularly?
Have you told this to a priest?

[Alvecia]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

That is a most curious situation. Considering this constant alternation of gender identity causes so much distress, perhaps it is prudent to consider ontologically (i.e. philosophically) discarding both identities and simply see oneself as a conscious brain, no matter what the support structure looks like? After all, sex-based traits are as arbitrarily assigned as skin colour or nose shape, and need not be foundations of identity at all.

I know I could wake up as a floating green sphere or a planet-sized tetrahedron without experiencing any identity dissonance, provided my personality was not changed as well.

How much acid have you taken and do you need help?

[Infinite Coscotlan]

a̼̭͈͖͖͓ͣ͜s̞̫̙͙̣̬̞ͤ̎͒̐ͥ́̆̍͛̀͝ͅd̩ͤ͑́ͨ͂̾ͥ̀̕͝f̸̣͓̩͎͙ͭͫ̓̆̕͡g̺̣ͣ͋ͧ̅̒̇́͡

[Alvecia]

How much acid have you taken and do you need help?

Mind rephrasing for clarity?

Are you currently melting?

[Infinite Coscotlan]

a̼̭͈͖͖͓ͣ͜s̞̫̙͙̣̬̞ͤ̎͒̐ͥ́̆̍͛̀͝ͅd̩ͤ͑́ͨ͂̾ͥ̀̕͝f̸̣͓̩͎͙ͭͫ̓̆̕͡g̺̣ͣ͋ͧ̅̒̇́͡

[Soyouso]

If you are transgender, whether you are nonbinary or binary, you have some sort of gender dysphoria. That's literally what not being comfortable being your assigned sex and mentally being something else no matter how you try to pretend to fit into it is, dysphoria. I don't see how a literal mental disorder can't possibly cause someone to feel nonbinary instead of the opposite just because people don't think it's possible. It's literally a disorder, it's not going to follow our rules or disappear because we don't want to think of it that way. The new gender identity names were made to describe it, not to confuse people and be edgy. There are people who think that they're nonbinary because they don't fit into gender stereotypes. That's not what being transgender is.

I am a bigender alterating person that has gender dysphoria. I don't choose which I am when I wake up in the morning. It just happens by itself and I have to hope to God I don't wake up male, because it's a burden. I hate my voice more than usual because it doesn't match my mental voice. Looking at myself in the mirror feels like looking at another person. I feel dread knowing I'll never have the "parts" I'm missing, and just want to get rid of the "parts" I do have because they just shouldn't fucking be there. Because I'm fluid, I'll never be able to fully transition like binary trans men get to, because guess what? Then my female side would start triggering dysphoria! It's not like I have different personalities, the problem is that they are both me, and I'll never get to fully live my life as either. Because of my female side I'll never get to fully transition as a male, and because of my male side I have to avoid certain things. I'm probably not even going to have kids (aside from adoption) because I wouldn't be able to handle the dysphoria. I'm so jealous of people that aren't fluid or aren't trans, they don't have to deal with this.

Don't try to act like my experience means nothing because you don't think it's possible. No amount of denial is going to just remove people like me from existing.

That is a most curious situation. Considering this constant alternation of gender identity causes so much distress, perhaps it is prudent to consider ontologically (i.e. philosophically) discarding both identities and simply see oneself as a conscious brain, no matter what the support structure looks like? After all, sex-based traits are as arbitrarily assigned as skin colour or nose shape, and need not be foundations of identity at all.

I know I could exist as a floating green sphere or a planet-sized tetrahedron, without experiencing any identity dissonance.

I do something similar to that. See, I see myself as me. The male side and the female side are different forms of me. Different names, but overall the same being. For whatever reason, God decided to give make the human vessel that I live in a physical manifestation of the female form. If my male side is active, I feel like I am seeing the world from "her" body. It's still mine, but not "his". That occasionally helps, but not as much as I wish it did, since it's more so the bodily difference from my identity thst bothers me than societal influence. I can be really damn tomboyish as a girl and really brattish-princelike as a boy depending on my mood, but it doesn't change which is active.

[Kenmoria]

I am religous and believe in souls, so my soul must be both male and female and my body does not match. If you're saying I should try to "pray it away", I have too much respect for myself to mentally abuse myself in such a way any longer. I used to try to do that with my sexuality and this, and it just gave me more issues - it contributed to my low self esteem, was part of the reason I was suicidal, and I now have a fear of being around Christians despite being one. Being myself to the best of my ability is much better for my mental health.

Well, tact is not exactly my strong suit so I'll be straightforward:
May I ask which church were you baptised at?
Do you receive communion regularly?
Have you told this to a priest?

A priest would not be able to help with gender dysphroia unless they were also a trained doctor, as it is a medical condition. Likewise, the entire concept of gender and sex is mainly medical so religious advice can be useless.

[Soyouso]

I am religous and believe in souls, so my soul must be both male and female and my body does not match. If you're saying I should try to "pray it away", I have too much respect for myself to mentally abuse myself in such a way any longer. I used to try to do that with my sexuality and this, and it just gave me more issues - it contributed to my low self esteem, was part of the reason I was suicidal, and I now have a fear of being around Christians despite being one. Being myself to the best of my ability is much better for my mental health.

Well, tact is not exactly my strong suit so I'll be straightforward:
May I ask which church were you baptised at?
Do you receive communion regularly?
Have you told this to a priest?

I was baptised at a protestant church long before I knew what I was experiencing was dysphoria. I haven't gone to any church in a long time, I don't plan to again and would rather focus on a relationship with God. And no, I don't plan to talk to any priest, they intimidate me.

[Liriena]

Geesh, that's a low-effort OP.

Anyway, I'm not sure OP understands what "postgender" means. Also, non-binary people aren't "special snowflakes". If anything, being non-binary is the worst way one could choose to be a "special snowflake". You'd have a better shot at being one by calling yourself the biggest Twilight fan ever than you would at rejecting the Western gender binary.

[The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom]

I was baptised at a protestant church long before I knew what I was experiencing was dysphoria. I haven't gone to any church in a long time, I don't plan to again and would rather focus on a relationship with God. And no, I don't plan to talk to any priest, they intimidate me.

By God's grace, perhaps you will change your mind. Do bear in mind that Holy Communion is the bread of life. As for opinions you get from those who believe not, Scripture says:

"But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:14)

[Soyouso]

I was baptised at a protestant church long before I knew what I was experiencing was dysphoria. I haven't gone to any church in a long time, I don't plan to again and would rather focus on a relationship with God. And no, I don't plan to talk to any priest, they intimidate me.

By God's grace, perhaps you will change your mind. Do bear in mind that Holy Communion is the bread of life. As for opinions you get from those who believe not, Scripture says:

"But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:14)

I don't need a building and other Christians around me to worship God. I just need God.