Why is health care a business?

[Helertia]

Why is it a business today? Because very few people in history ever took the initiative (in the United States, anyway) to prevent it from falling into the hands of people who were just in the industry to make money and nothing else. A better question would be why is this still an issue today in 2010? Why is it that the United States is still having this much controversy over universal health care when almost every other country in the West- including Germany (which was the country that first created the concept universal health care under Chancellor Otto von Bismarck during his social and welfare reforms of the 1880s), France, the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Canada, the United Kingdom, Spain, and Portugal, among others-- has adopted the system already? Even Cuba has universal health care FFS.

Cuban healthcare is a joke. You know who else has universal healthcare? North Korea. You know how they perform amputations? Without anesthesia.

Business competing in a free market are able to provide goods and services of better quality, for better prices than any centrally planned system. The problem in the US is that we have businesses providing the good and services, but we do not have a free market in healthcare. And the government has been protecting them.

And yet all the best healthcare systems in the world are universal health care, and your hated public-private partnership appears at No.3 - Italy.

[Fartsniffage]

Too bad he died before there was a North and South Korea.

You really think that the best the US could hope for is to equal NKs healthcare system?

[Eastern Rhomania]

Every service is a business. Even government is one. The problem is, they don't even need to advertise to get money.

[Wamitoria]

You know who else said things like ^this? Hitler.

Too bad he died before there was a North and South Korea.

Too bad you don't get correlation jokes.

[Sibirsky]

Cuban healthcare is a joke. You know who else has universal healthcare? North Korea. You know how they perform amputations? Without anesthesia.

Business competing in a free market are able to provide goods and services of better quality, for better prices than any centrally planned system. The problem in the US is that we have businesses providing the good and services, but we do not have a free market in healthcare. And the government has been protecting them.

And yet all the best healthcare systems in the world are universal health care, and your hated public-private partnership appears at No.3 - Italy.

I did not say anything about public-private partnerships.

Europe takes a short cut for costs. Europe's medicinal costs are subsidized by the US. The US is a leader in pharmaceutical breakthroughs. You know why? Big spending on research and profit.

[Sibirsky]

Too bad he died before there was a North and South Korea.

You really think that the best the US could hope for is to equal NKs healthcare system?

[Sibirsky]

Every service is a business. Even government is one. The problem is, they don't even need to advertise to get money.

Government is not a business.

[The Black Forrest]

Even in normal times, charitable contributions won't pay for the quality of care most people want.

And most people have insurance.

And that number was going down every year.

[Fartsniffage]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

[Helertia]

And yet all the best healthcare systems in the world are universal health care, and your hated public-private partnership appears at No.3 - Italy.

I did not say anything about public-private partnerships.

Europe takes a short cut for costs. Europe's medicinal costs are subsidized by the US. The US is a leader in pharmaceutical breakthroughs. You know why? Big spending on research and profit.

So is China. Not sure if it has any relavance, but I like knowing that some stuff I read can be used.

You have previously almost ranted about how public-private partner ships are awful in healthcare and how it's destroying the American healthcare industry.
"The problem in the US is that we have businesses providing the good and services, but we do not have a free market in healthcare."
Hmm...

[The Black Forrest]

And yet all the best healthcare systems in the world are universal health care, and your hated public-private partnership appears at No.3 - Italy.

I did not say anything about public-private partnerships.

Europe takes a short cut for costs. Europe's medicinal costs are subsidized by the US. The US is a leader in pharmaceutical breakthroughs. You know why? Big spending on research and profit.

Yes the universities do great research.

[Sibirsky]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

I'm saying that when you all speak of universal healthcare, you cherrie pick.

[Sibirsky]

And most people have insurance.

And that number was going down every year.

Because of the idiotic way they got insurance in the first place.

[The Black Forrest]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

He is probably mad because the North Koreans keep eating the free markets faeries.......

[Fartsniffage]

I'm saying that when you all speak of universal healthcare, you cherrie pick.

No, we compare like for like. I go back to my original question, do you really think that a univeral healthcare system in the US would be like the system in NK?

Or do you think it would match the universal systems in other wealthy first world nations? You know, those nations that always seem to be above the US on heathcare standard rankings.

[Sibirsky]

I did not say anything about public-private partnerships.

Europe takes a short cut for costs. Europe's medicinal costs are subsidized by the US. The US is a leader in pharmaceutical breakthroughs. You know why? Big spending on research and profit.

So is China. Not sure if it has any relavance, but I like knowing that some stuff I read can be used.

You have previously almost ranted about how public-private partner ships are awful in healthcare and how it's destroying the American healthcare industry.
"The problem in the US is that we have businesses providing the good and services, but we do not have a free market in healthcare."
Hmm...

Yeah, that's a problem. We don't have competition. We have ridiculous mandates. We have a tax penalty for people wanting to buy their own insurance. Amongst other problems.

[Helertia]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

I'm saying that when you all speak of universal healthcare, you cherrie pick.

You can't use NK as an example of why Universal Healthcare is a flawed concept. You could use it as an example of the dangers of mismanagement, corruption, poor implemtation, little investment and inefficiency, though.

Developed countries, such as America, are able to and do implement Universal Healthcare properly and efficiently and their healthcare improves as a result.

[The Black Forrest]

And that number was going down every year.

Because of the idiotic way they got insurance in the first place.

Yea that cost too much thing does cause problems.....

[Sibirsky]

I did not say anything about public-private partnerships.

Europe takes a short cut for costs. Europe's medicinal costs are subsidized by the US. The US is a leader in pharmaceutical breakthroughs. You know why? Big spending on research and profit.

Yes the universities do great research.

Big pharma spends quite a bit on research.

[Greed and Death]

health care is a business because it started out as a scam perpetrated on desperate people.

now that it WORKS its still a business.

in the US.

health insurance is a Ponzi scheme.
You always pay more into it then you get out.
Now healthcare with the doctors and the like that's a legitimate business.

[North Suran]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

I'm saying that when you all speak of universal healthcare, you cherrie pick.

Clearly the one exception to the rule is, in fact, the rule.

Y'know, it's like how Albania retroactively renders all the accomplishments of capitalism moot.

[Sibirsky]

I don't understand. You were the one who brought up NK amputating limbs without anesthetic as though it had some bearing on a possible universal healthcare system in the US.

He is probably mad because the North Koreans keep eating the free markets faeries.......

You never learn.

[The Black Forrest]

Yes the universities do great research.

Big pharma spends quite a bit on research.

Not as much as you think. Did you know marketing is part of "development" costs?

[Jello Biafra]

And that number was going down every year.

Because of the idiotic way they got insurance in the first place.

Through their places of employment?

[Wikipedia and Universe]

Why don't we make healthcare mixed, and give people options? Sure, government and non-profit healthcare are fine, but if it were completely taken over by the government, a lot of jobs would be lost, which even Obama despises. It would be a great compromise, the people can have free and affordable healthcare, yet institutions like Highmark wouldn't be forced out of business.