What was bad about NS2?

[Tanzoria]

I was around the days NS2 was active so I dont know what it was like. However I have heard older players critiscise it and I would like to know why everyone hates it.

[Ballotonia]

IMHO, the biggest flaw was that it divided the user base into very small groups of nations, each living in its own game. One starts a nation and typically ends up in a group of sleepy nations which show no activity whatsoever. As a result one logs in less often, etc... Downward spiral, game over.

Ballotonia

[Oceanic Vakiadia]

From what I heard, you had to continuously pay money to maintain a custom flag.

[Romanar]

Also, there were a lot of technical glitches that took forever for them to fix.

[Unilisia]

Everything was wrong with that game.

[Syvorji]

NationStates2 was actually a really fine game, since I joined it a while ago and played from the start to the end. In fact, I have the 501st beta key to NationStates2, but that is another topic for another time, but here goes why you are wrong.

NationStates2 simplified how nations are categorized, by merging them all into one, and split them again into billions of regions. The reasons why they put the cost on custom flags is because it is to make all the custom flags on NationStates2 look amazing. They even have their online forums, which was very active, by having NS2's separate forums (like the NSForum, connected by a link to the NS2 game) not exist in the first place. They simplified nation descriptions, to make it even more complicated, like unlike, "Animal X frolics in the forests," it is, "Animal X sits on the side of the leader..." Bugs were easy to fix, by not fixing them in the first place, because Jolt wanted to make a modern NationStates 2. Raiding was made harder to do, because almost everyone is sleepy, and even then, it is too easy. In other words, NationStates2 was a good game because it was very crappy.

In conclusion, I hope that you are officially proven wrong and that I am right, because this statement is not ad nauseam, nor reductio de absurdum, nor an ad hominem, but rather, a short and sweet praise to NationStates2, and why it is actually very good, so therefore, every holder of the position of NS2 is crappy is wrong and is defeated, making that whole statement null and void.

[Unilisia]

NationStates2 was actually a really fine game, since I joined it a while ago and played from the start to the end. In fact, I have the 501st beta key to NationStates2, but that is another topic for another time, but here goes why you are wrong.

NationStates2 simplified how nations are categorized, by merging them all into one, and split them again into billions of regions. The reasons why they put the cost on custom flags is because it is to make all the custom flags on NationStates2 look amazing. They even have their online forums, which was very active, by having NS2's separate forums (like the NSForum, connected by a link to the NS2 game) not exist in the first place. They simplified nation descriptions, to make it even more complicated, like unlike, "Animal X frolics in the forests," it is, "Animal X sits on the side of the leader..." Bugs were easy to fix, by not fixing them in the first place, because Jolt wanted to make a modern NationStates 2. Raiding was made harder to do, because almost everyone is sleepy, and even then, it is too easy. In other words, NationStates2 was a good game because it was very crappy.

In conclusion, I hope that you are officially proven wrong and that I am right, because this statement is not ad nauseam, nor reductio de absurdum, nor an ad hominem, but rather, a short and sweet praise to NationStates2, and why it is actually very good, so therefore, every holder of the position of NS2 is crappy is wrong and is defeated, making that whole statement null and void.

That didn't change my opinion in the least.

[The Southern Dictators]

Never played it but I would like to, just to see how it is.

[Oceanic Vakiadia]

NationStates2 was actually a really fine game, since I joined it a while ago and played from the start to the end. In fact, I have the 501st beta key to NationStates2, but that is another topic for another time, but here goes why you are wrong.

NationStates2 simplified how nations are categorized, by merging them all into one, and split them again into billions of regions. The reasons why they put the cost on custom flags is because it is to make all the custom flags on NationStates2 look amazing. They even have their online forums, which was very active, by having NS2's separate forums (like the NSForum, connected by a link to the NS2 game) not exist in the first place. They simplified nation descriptions, to make it even more complicated, like unlike, "Animal X frolics in the forests," it is, "Animal X sits on the side of the leader..." Bugs were easy to fix, by not fixing them in the first place, because Jolt wanted to make a modern NationStates 2. Raiding was made harder to do, because almost everyone is sleepy, and even then, it is too easy. In other words, NationStates2 was a good game because it was very crappy.

In conclusion, I hope that you are officially proven wrong and that I am right, because this statement is not ad nauseam, nor reductio de absurdum, nor an ad hominem, but rather, a short and sweet praise to NationStates2, and why it is actually very good, so therefore, every holder of the position of NS2 is crappy is wrong and is defeated, making that whole statement null and void.

That did not make any sense at all. Mainly because:
Crappy = Bad
Bad ≠ Good

And just because the flags were good does not mean I would want to pay to have one.
Also how the heck can you simplify something by making it complicated?

[Consaria]

One issue I had was that it added a lot more features that took away the point of the game, running a nation, and turned it into a Cybernations clone. War and regional legislation being added to the actual game, rather than roleplay, made it less casual.

[Durkadurkiranistan II]

The problem was that it sucked.

[Flibbleites]

It would take less time to tell you what was good about NS2.

[Daynor]

It would take less time to tell you what was good about NS2.

1. Cool logo (at least I thought it was cool)
2. It eventually went away on its own

Can't come up with much else.

[Unibot II]

Cool Logo was about the only thing it had going for it. The Game design was awful it essentially took away everything that successful about NationStates and then added some crap features to it. It added a billion industries, set nations in fixed 'worlds' removing the region aspect, and lacked communication everywhere.

[New South Hell]

All of the above. The thing that really killed it for me was the bug level. It was impossible to do anything in the game, down sometimes to simple things like joining an alliance, without getting a "this element encountered an error" crap diagnostic. I felt the NS2 concepts had some promise, but the bug level made it completely aggravating to play in practice.

I tell ya, it's real hard to get upset about minor problems and temporary glitches in NationStates after experiencing NS2. [violet] and the gang would never leave major features broken for months and, while that doesn't sound all that amazing or unusual, after you've seen a "professional" abortion like NS2, it's impossible to have anything but undying respect and admiration for the NS crew, who are doing it all for love.

Gee, I was almost feeling warm and fuzzy there for a moment. Time to go slaughter some dissidents to get my usual mood back...

- nsh -

[Zarvarza]

I joined it, with high hopes, that Finally, after all the whining and crying we finally got NS2, only, like everyone else, to emerge in shock of what the game actually was. I played it for a week only after loosing interest. And here are my reasons:

1. I could not move regions. Making it so I can transplant my NS1 players and start up a similar organization with NS2 was impossible, because noone could move (at least if you could, It was not obviously easy to do and I never found the links).

2. Could not defend or raid - again, if you actually could, oops, I didnt find the way to do it.

3. it was a Cluster Fvck of various elements with no functionality. Great and wonderful I have Iron Ore, or whatever the hell it used to show my region had, but really, who cares... no wait, who cares? I didnt care, and thats why I forgot what specific things it actually showed that were non essential.

4. By far too complicated. Everyone hates reading manuals on games. The best games are ones that you can figure out on your own rather quickly. NS is borderline under this discription, but NS2 it was just impossible. NS is actually getting that way now, but at least the evolution is slow.

5. Pay - Book sales were not enough apparently, and the whole pay thing just Had to be put in there. Major turn off, not because I dont have the means to pay, no, but because im not going to invest a dime in a game, seriously, a game, pixils and images, that I dont even own or can even save on my own computer!. I think its great that a (no offense) but a relatively no-name author chose such a creative method to promote his books, and by all means, it has worked for his success, but I think that biting the hand that feeds is a bad idea, and pushing a pay option was too much.

[Dauntasa]

5. Pay - Book sales were not enough apparently, and the whole pay thing just Had to be put in there. Major turn off, not because I dont have the means to pay, no, but because im not going to invest a dime in a game, seriously, a game, pixils and images, that I dont even own or can even save on my own computer!. I think its great that a (no offense) but a relatively no-name author chose such a creative method to promote his books, and by all means, it has worked for his success, but I think that biting the hand that feeds is a bad idea, and pushing a pay option was too much.

NS2 was mostly owned by a company called Jolt, I think. They were the ones who were trying to suck money out of it, not Barry.

[Crazy girl]

I can't believe no one posted this link here yet.

http://www.nationstates.net/page=news/2 ... index.html

[Evil Wolf]

Oh Nationstates 2. My hatred for it can hardly be contained in words.

Ok, so let me address a few things. Nationstates 2 was basically contracted out by Max to a company called OMAC whom promised they would take good care of it and follow their contract because, hell, its a legally binding contract, amirite? OMAC bought Jolt somewhere along the way.

About OMAC, so basically they are this company that likes to go around and buy up successful games and then ride them to a horrible screaming death like the cash cows they see them as. They legitimately don't care if the game is fun, they don't care what the players think about it, they don't bother to improve anything once they have bought out the site, nope, they just care about the money. A good example of this? Earth: 2025.

So OMAC quickly decided it was going to flat out ignore every detail of the contract they had made with Max, completely ignoring his vision for Nationstates 2 and turning into an almost exact copy of...Nationstates. Yeah, that's right, these mofo's couldn't even come up with original ideas (despite what I can only image would be countless suggestions from not only Max Barry himself but the NS mods and Admins, nevermind the players) so they outright stole the basic game elements of Nationstates and tried to hide this theft with a pretty new skin.

That's just the start of it. Nationstates 2 didn't even make it out of Beta! This is important because even though the game was badly made, untested, had plenty of bugs, was a shitty remake, and by their own admission was still in beta they wanted you to pay money to use the game. Yeah, go back and read that again and tell me if it makes any sense to you, because to the brilliant minds at OMAC, it was the best idea ever. Bonus insult to intelligence, the features they wanted you to pay for were free in Nationstates and there were very little new (buy-able) features and none of them were good for anything at all.

They basically hoped that the internet is full of people who have the attention span of a flee. For the most part they'd probably be correct, because a fair amount of people did fall for this horrible scam. What they were not counting on is the long time Nationstates fans who have been playing for years. I remember a few of the Nationstates mods, Reploid Productions and Scolopendra, writing a bit in a review on Nationstates 2 that was clearly written by someone at OMAC. The review more or less hailed NS2 as the best thing since life itself, maybe even better, and was full of total lies. Scolopendra's posts were so long and full of seething hatred that I will not include them here, plus I don't feel like copying and pasting all that. Here's a quote from Reploid Productions instead:

I pretty much second and agree wholeheartedly with everything Scolopendra has stated about Nationstates 2, as well as the parent company OMAC. Though NS1's OMAC problems first began way back when the deal was between us and Jolt.

The OMAC staff with perhaps one or two exceptions are uncommunicative, unresponsive, unhelpful and seem more interested on how much more intrusive they can make their ads or how they can whore out their Legends of Zork game via the games they've acquried. The game they've created in NS2 is counter-intuitive, unpleasant, badly designed, tedious, and generally unfun. Functions that were long-heralded as great new features have turned out to be utter garbage, cramping what in NS1 is a vibrant and creative community.

In full disclosure,
~Reploid Productions
~Nationstates 1 game moderator since 2003

The whole thing can be seen right here along with other player comments. I commented in there too and some others talked about how completely bad the whole scheme was. I really can't comment about what was said about the game play, since I have since repressed all memories of actual NS2 game play.

Anyway, you might have seen Reploid mentioned this "Legends of Zork" thing. Yeah, to make a very, very, very long rant short, when OMAC finally shut down NS2 for (never ending) "maintenance" they posted a link directly to Legends of Zork, trying to get players hooked to the *real* cash cow that they had put actual money, time, effort, and development into. Zork, by the by, is a classic text based adventure game that came out in the early 80's. "Legends of Zork" is a shitty game OMAC tried to whore out using "Zork" in the title. Oh, by-the-by, back to NS2's forever maintenance, when they posted that message they also deleted the entire game off the site...you know, just in case someone wanted to use the code for something else.

When Max saw this I guess he finally had it and, since he still had ownership of the NS2 address itself, he put a stop to OMAC's shameless self-promotion of a bad game and posted the message that is still visible to this day.

Hi there. On July 1st, 2009, Jolt closed NationStates 2 and began redirecting all visitors to a different Jolt game.

Earlier, Jolt announced they were taking NS2 down only to retool it, and would bring it back at some indefinite time in the future. But since they've wiped the entire site, not even leaving a News page for updates, this seems unlikely.

I've therefore taken back the domain name. It is, unfortunately, beyond my power to restore the NS2 game: that code belongs to Jolt. But if you would like to return to the original NationStates, now proudly Jolt-free, we would love to have you.

—Max Barry, http://www.nationstates.net

The whole NS2 situation fills me with such nerd-rage that I need to stop typing right now lest I go berserk and start punching babies in the face. In conclusion, burn in hell OMAC.

[United Earthlings]

I waswasn't around the days NS2 was active so I dont know what it was like. However I have heard older players critiscise it and I would like to know why everyone hates it.

A picture is worth a thousand words, you really want to know why go see for yourself in the now long since abandon and closed NS2 forum on Jolt-36,622 reasons why NS2 went extinct .

But, put simply Jolt/OMAC took everything that was great about NS and turned it into a Frankenstein and then to top it off had the audacity to charge for features that were once free. You think the animosity is bad now, you should have seen it then and now you can.

If, it wasn't so funny considering the final outcome that become of NS2, it was truly a sad day in NS history the day NS2 came online.

Using Smilies I'd rated it between a and a with a lot of thrown in.