NATION

PASSWORD

The United States vs Vatican City - Who would win?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Who would win?

The United States
29
20%
Vatican City
31
21%
Other
10
7%
This is a stupid question
76
52%
 
Total votes : 146

User avatar
Plutonium Blondes
Attaché
 
Posts: 74
Founded: May 27, 2010
Ex-Nation

The United States vs Vatican City - Who would win?

Postby Plutonium Blondes » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:45 am

In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.
Need a map? Let me know!
My maps.

User avatar
Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 109016
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:47 am

Plutonium Blondes wrote:In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.

Except that the global economy is so intertwined that collapsing the US economy is like sitting on a tree branch and sawing it at a spot between you and the truck. It doesn't end well.
Wash Your Damned Hands!

Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

User avatar
Militsia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1384
Founded: May 21, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Militsia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:50 am

Plutonium Blondes wrote:In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.


Is it even possible to attack the holy see? Not only catholics would refuse an illegal order. If the president ordered such an attack he would probably very quietly be shipped off to a psychiatric hospital to get the right medication to treat the psychosis or delusions. People would challenge the attack order at every level of command.
The only easy day is yesterday
Report Suspicious Activity
Nightkill the Emperor wrote:
Sdaeriji wrote:Let's ban Militsia from making threads, eh?

I agree. It's usually some sort of xenophobic moral guardian stuff.

User avatar
Call to power
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6908
Founded: Apr 13, 2005
Ex-Nation

Postby Call to power » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:51 am

Catholics don't work that way the Vatican would be annexed by Italy and nothing much would change beside the US killing a bunch of Italians in friendly fire

Farnhamia wrote:Except that the global economy is so intertwined that collapsing the US economy is like sitting on a tree branch and sawing it at a spot between you and the truck. It doesn't end well.


only one side has the entire planet and the other the US

I can imagine who would come out worse off from this act of hubris and its not the US

Militsia wrote:SNIP


"offensive wars are illegal" well done but that's easily dealt with by fudging some wmd evidence
Last edited by Call to power on Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Parkus Empire wrote:Theoretically, why would anyone put anytime into anything but tobacco, intoxicants and sex?

Vareiln wrote:My god, CtP is right...
Not that you haven't been right before, but... Aw, hell, you get what I meant.

Tubbsalot wrote:replace my opinions with CtP's.


User avatar
Neo-Erusea
Diplomat
 
Posts: 507
Founded: Jun 17, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Neo-Erusea » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:53 am

A better question is why?

User avatar
Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 109016
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:55 am

Militsia wrote:
Plutonium Blondes wrote:In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.


Is it even possible to attack the holy see? Not only catholics would refuse an illegal order. If the president ordered such an attack he would probably very quietly be shipped off to a psychiatric hospital to get the right medication to treat the psychosis or delusions. People would challenge the attack order at every level of command.

You're assuming that the President instigated this conflict all on his own. Suppose the Pope issued an edict that somehow threatened US national security and after weeks and months of negotiations and escalating tensions ... You get the idea. It doesn't have to always be the US's fault, you know.
Wash Your Damned Hands!

Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

User avatar
Jervak
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1501
Founded: Oct 05, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Jervak » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:56 am

Catholics would be pissed.

Aren't we already unpopular enough?
Last edited by Jervak on Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:56 am, edited 2 times in total.
Marx-Engels-Lenin-Stalin-Mao
COMMUNIST INTERNATIONAL LEAGUE|-|LEARN MARXISM|-|BASICS|-|THE MARXIST-LENINIST|-|CPGB-ML
"The socialist system will eventually replace the capitalist system; this is an objective law independent of man's will. However much the reactionaries try to hold back the wheel of history, eventually revolution will take place and will inevitably triumph." - Mao Zedong
Economic L/R: -8.75
Social Lib/Auth: -6.72

User avatar
Call to power
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6908
Founded: Apr 13, 2005
Ex-Nation

Postby Call to power » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:56 am

Neo-Erusea wrote:A better question is why?


the US government has been deliberately infecting condoms in Africa with the aids virus and the only people who see through the lies are Catholics who need to be stopped so that we can exterminate the natives of Africa obv

haven't you been paying attention to your Soviet era propaganda!?
The Parkus Empire wrote:Theoretically, why would anyone put anytime into anything but tobacco, intoxicants and sex?

Vareiln wrote:My god, CtP is right...
Not that you haven't been right before, but... Aw, hell, you get what I meant.

Tubbsalot wrote:replace my opinions with CtP's.


User avatar
Great Nepal
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28677
Founded: Jan 11, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Great Nepal » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:56 am

Vatican City cos of internal rebel in United States itself and also refusal to fire by troops. And also president would be soon assassinated thanks to gun culture of Americans. :p
Last edited by Great Nepal on Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last edited by Great Nepal on Sun Nov 29, 1995 7:02 am, edited 1 time in total.


User avatar
Sierra Lobo
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1314
Founded: Jul 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Sierra Lobo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:58 am

Do not underestimate the power of the pope. See how the USSR fared in that.
Economic Left/Right: -2.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.21

"Then there are the fanatical atheists whose intolerance is the same as that of the religious fanatics, and it springs from the same source . . . They are creatures who can't hear the music of the spheres." - Einstein

“Liberals are very broadminded: they are always willing to give careful consideration to both sides of the same side”

User avatar
Jervak
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1501
Founded: Oct 05, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Jervak » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:00 pm

Sierra Lobo wrote:Do not underestimate the power of the pope. See how the USSR fared in that.

How many divisions does the pope have? :p
Marx-Engels-Lenin-Stalin-Mao
COMMUNIST INTERNATIONAL LEAGUE|-|LEARN MARXISM|-|BASICS|-|THE MARXIST-LENINIST|-|CPGB-ML
"The socialist system will eventually replace the capitalist system; this is an objective law independent of man's will. However much the reactionaries try to hold back the wheel of history, eventually revolution will take place and will inevitably triumph." - Mao Zedong
Economic L/R: -8.75
Social Lib/Auth: -6.72

User avatar
Sierra Lobo
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1314
Founded: Jul 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Sierra Lobo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:03 pm

Jervak wrote:
Sierra Lobo wrote:Do not underestimate the power of the pope. See how the USSR fared in that.

How many divisions does the pope have? :p

The pen is mightier than the sword
Economic Left/Right: -2.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.21

"Then there are the fanatical atheists whose intolerance is the same as that of the religious fanatics, and it springs from the same source . . . They are creatures who can't hear the music of the spheres." - Einstein

“Liberals are very broadminded: they are always willing to give careful consideration to both sides of the same side”

User avatar
Militsia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1384
Founded: May 21, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Militsia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:03 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Militsia wrote:
Is it even possible to attack the holy see? Not only catholics would refuse an illegal order. If the president ordered such an attack he would probably very quietly be shipped off to a psychiatric hospital to get the right medication to treat the psychosis or delusions. People would challenge the attack order at every level of command.

You're assuming that the President instigated this conflict all on his own. Suppose the Pope issued an edict that somehow threatened US national security and after weeks and months of negotiations and escalating tensions ... You get the idea. It doesn't have to always be the US's fault, you know.


Even with an extreme case of the scenario above. That the pope has ordered the words catholics to boycott the USA and catholics in the US not to obey the authorities. It would still be idiotic to actually invade Italy and arrest the pope. Eighter the pope has a valid reason that could be addressed, or he don't. There are options for both alternatives.
The only easy day is yesterday
Report Suspicious Activity
Nightkill the Emperor wrote:
Sdaeriji wrote:Let's ban Militsia from making threads, eh?

I agree. It's usually some sort of xenophobic moral guardian stuff.

User avatar
Call to power
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6908
Founded: Apr 13, 2005
Ex-Nation

Postby Call to power » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:04 pm

Jervak wrote:
Sierra Lobo wrote:Do not underestimate the power of the pope. See how the USSR fared in that.

How many divisions does the pope have? :p


exactly how many times has Switzerland been successfully occupied? this was done by the Swiss militia forces whereas the Pope has professional soldiers who feel that gunpowder is for girls

Militsia wrote:Even with an extreme case of the scenario above. That the pope has ordered the words catholics to boycott the USA and catholics in the US not to obey the authorities. It would still be idiotic to actually invade Italy and arrest the pope.


have you not heard of antipopes?
Last edited by Call to power on Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Parkus Empire wrote:Theoretically, why would anyone put anytime into anything but tobacco, intoxicants and sex?

Vareiln wrote:My god, CtP is right...
Not that you haven't been right before, but... Aw, hell, you get what I meant.

Tubbsalot wrote:replace my opinions with CtP's.


User avatar
Angleter
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12359
Founded: Apr 27, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Angleter » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:05 pm

Well, Italy might have something to say about the Yanks deciding to invade a nation that lies slap bang in the middle of its capital. By extention of that, the EU won't like it either, and Latin America won't be too pleased for religious reasons.

So maybe it just wouldn't happen after all.
[align=center]"I gotta tell you, this is just crazy, huh! This is just nuts, OK! Jeezo man."

User avatar
Draconikus
Envoy
 
Posts: 333
Founded: May 29, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Draconikus » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:05 pm

Bearing in mind that the US has a high level of Christians in unusually concentrated amounts (I beleive the phrase is 'Bible Belt') A good twenty percent of the US is placed under seperatist control almost immediately, with widespread civil unrest everywhere else. Italy has a defence treaty with VC so anyone declares war on the VC declares war on Italy. And screw economic sanctions, most countries in the Western hemisphere will be forced to offer some sort of military response in order to keep the voting public happy. Not to mention the massive influx of people from Africa and South America, who have both the religious fervor to actually march off somewhere and kill people themselves, but the access to weapons to do it.
Finally, the majority of other religions on the planet would also be forced to condemn the US, simply for the 'what-if-we're-next' factor.

End result being; Either America gets divvied up into various nation states (I have a feeling the Texans would rescind their U.S membership at the outset of any US/VC war), or the current administration gets removed from office, and a puppet leader is put in place to make sure the Americans don't get any more bright idea's whilst he is in power.
La Verus Draconii Nunquam Mortis

User avatar
The Alma Mater
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21784
Founded: May 23, 2004
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Alma Mater » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:05 pm

Neo-Erusea wrote:A better question is why?


Because the USA is devoted to fighting evil ?
At least, so they claim.

Or because the vikings first discovered America, and since the vikings liked to pillage monastries, so should real Americans.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
- Terry Pratchett, Hogfather

User avatar
Cosmopoles
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5541
Founded: Sep 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Cosmopoles » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:06 pm

Plutonium Blondes wrote:In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.


You mean it would be similar to 1870, when the Kingdom of Italy collapsed while trying to seize Rome from the Pope, thus leading to the collection of smaller states which now comprise the Italian peninsula rather than a united country?

User avatar
Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 109016
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:08 pm

Militsia wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:You're assuming that the President instigated this conflict all on his own. Suppose the Pope issued an edict that somehow threatened US national security and after weeks and months of negotiations and escalating tensions ... You get the idea. It doesn't have to always be the US's fault, you know.


Even with an extreme case of the scenario above. That the pope has ordered the words catholics to boycott the USA and catholics in the US not to obey the authorities. It would still be idiotic to actually invade Italy and arrest the pope. Eighter the pope has a valid reason that could be addressed, or he don't. There are options for both alternatives.

All we do is dress some Special Ops guys up like tourists and ... ta-da! The Pope's on a plane headed for Gitmo.

Of course it's silly. The whole thread is silly.
Wash Your Damned Hands!

Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

User avatar
The Parkus Empire
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43030
Founded: Sep 12, 2005
Ex-Nation

Postby The Parkus Empire » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:08 pm

A: Napoleon got away with it pretty well.
B: I doubt most of the world would care to stand up for rape-little-children-heaven.
American Orthodox: one, holy, catholic, and apostolic church.
Jesus is Allah ن
Burkean conservative
Homophobic
Anti-feminist sexist
♂Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know men and women aren't the same.♀

User avatar
Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 109016
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:10 pm

Cosmopoles wrote:
Plutonium Blondes wrote:In the tradition of the US vs X threads:

Who would win a war between the the US and the worlds smallest sovereign state? On the one hand you have an incomparably powerful conventional military force, on the other you have the Swiss Guard and a billion pissed off Catholics - including many Americans. In my opinion the VC would win since the worldwide economic sanctions that would fall on the US would cause its economy to collapse and it would have to sue for peace.


You mean it would be similar to 1870, when the Kingdom of Italy collapsed while trying to seize Rome from the Pope, thus leading to the collection of smaller states which now comprise the Italian peninsula rather than a united country?

I remember that. Didn't the Swiss Guards capture Garibaldi and Count Cavour and imprison them in the Castel Gandolpho for, like, 20 years?
Wash Your Damned Hands!

Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

User avatar
Sierra Lobo
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1314
Founded: Jul 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Sierra Lobo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:11 pm

Not to mention the UN general assembly will be turned into a pulpit as the vatican is also a legitimate member. :rofl:
Economic Left/Right: -2.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.21

"Then there are the fanatical atheists whose intolerance is the same as that of the religious fanatics, and it springs from the same source . . . They are creatures who can't hear the music of the spheres." - Einstein

“Liberals are very broadminded: they are always willing to give careful consideration to both sides of the same side”

User avatar
Draconikus
Envoy
 
Posts: 333
Founded: May 29, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Draconikus » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:11 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Militsia wrote:
Even with an extreme case of the scenario above. That the pope has ordered the words catholics to boycott the USA and catholics in the US not to obey the authorities. It would still be idiotic to actually invade Italy and arrest the pope. Eighter the pope has a valid reason that could be addressed, or he don't. There are options for both alternatives.

All we do is dress some Special Ops guys up like tourists and ... ta-da! The Pope's on a plane headed for Gitmo.

Of course it's silly. The whole thread is silly.


He does kind've have security for things like that. Y'know, Italian police, Papal police, non-ceremonial Swiss Guard (as in, guys wearing proper kevlar CBA and carrying guns). Makes it rather difficult to kidnap him.
La Verus Draconii Nunquam Mortis

User avatar
The Parkus Empire
Post Czar
 
Posts: 43030
Founded: Sep 12, 2005
Ex-Nation

Postby The Parkus Empire » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:12 pm

Great Nepal wrote:Vatican City cos of internal rebel in United States itself and also refusal to fire by troops. And also president would be soon assassinated thanks to gun culture of Americans. :p

I doubt many Catholics under forty would rebel against the U.S. government for that.
American Orthodox: one, holy, catholic, and apostolic church.
Jesus is Allah ن
Burkean conservative
Homophobic
Anti-feminist sexist
♂Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know men and women aren't the same.♀

User avatar
Aeronos
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1948
Founded: Jun 03, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Aeronos » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:13 pm

I agree, why is the US immediately the one assumed at fault? Globalization has its ups and downs, but at least it has ups. The Catholicization of Africa has damaged it more than any neoconservative imperial policies have. With sectarian violence, AIDS, polio, witch-hunts and oversized familial poverty plaguing the continent so that the Pope can extend his palaces like some sick game of Dwarf Fortress, the Iraq War and Globalization seem almost (ironically) saintly compared...
My Political Compass
Economic: Left/Right (2.18)
Social: Libertarian/Authoritarian (-9.71)

Note: I am female, so please get the pronoun right!

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Disgraces, Idzequitch, Kowani, Miku the Based, Novostia, Salitzein, Shrillland, The Black Forrest, The Two Jerseys, Uiiop

Advertisement

Remove ads