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[DISCUSSION] Unjust RMB Ban

Who needs it, who got it, who hands it out and why.
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Fanvm Tax
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[DISCUSSION] Unjust RMB Ban

Postby Fanvm Tax » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:07 pm

So I was scrolling through the Fifth Empire RMB when I saw that The Iron Stars had been RMB banned for 1 day for saying "Reeeeeeeeeee" because "Autistic screech comments are not acceptable". Not only is this a gross abuse of moderation power (pretty sure onomatopoeia doesn't violate the site rules) and unprofessional, but it is also deeply offensive to the many users of this site who are actually autistic to describe such a post as an "autistic screech". Not only this, but the discussion was in-character roleplay, and as such, it is even more absurd that such a benign post was seen as rule-breaking.
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Last edited by Fanvm Tax on Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Spoonbreaker
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Postby Spoonbreaker » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:12 pm

Nation states got on him for saying reee
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Park0ur Civilization
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Postby Park0ur Civilization » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:14 pm

Yeah no this is bad, but it's only one day so you probably won’t get it appealed. The best thing you can do is try and get the mods to not consider it part of your history.

Oh wait this isn’t you

My point still applies. Get him to talk to the mods about it.
Last edited by Park0ur Civilization on Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Earthly Cossack
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Postby Earthly Cossack » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:17 pm

I have three letters to give you on this:
GHR.
That is the appropriate place for game side issues and moderation acts.
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Vastiuq
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Postby Vastiuq » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:17 pm

How the hell did this get connected to "Autistic" screech? It's more akin to someone posting something meant to be stupid and funny. But since he's in a region that's hated by some people it's unlikely anything will happen unfortunately

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Fjolmidlum
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Postby Fjolmidlum » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:24 pm

As I understand it, "autistic screeching" type comments are generally considered trolling as they are typically only used to be antagonistic and don't contribute to the discussion to boot. The reason it is called autistic screeching is because, well, that's what it's been called for a while and where that usage of "REEEE" originated from.
irregardless, its the same difference and i literally could care less for all intensive purposes so you're point is mute per say
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Knights of LUSITANIA
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Postby Knights of LUSITANIA » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:38 pm

Earthly Cossack wrote:I have three letters to give you on this:
GHR.
That is the appropriate place for game side issues and moderation acts.

The thread is tagged [DISCUSSION] because its meant to be an open ended dialogue with all parties involved (users that were in the post exchange, moderators, and the wider community at large). This is what forums are for, this "speech blindspot" cannot exist with something as important as moderation (and conversational) guidelines, under some bizarre loophole where forum rules (and apparently the style of their enforcement too now) are simultaneously upheld site wide, yet only discussable on the forum if it's on the forum they happen- when realistically a user is just as likely to lose his account strictly through RMB interactions as he is if he's a more forum-centric user.

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It is not too much to ask for this thread to be a precedent on this level of exchange between moderator and userbase, if the users involved in this exchange are doing it in good faith and not for the purpose of reverting the game side infraction itself, but to actually discuss the implications of this moderation.
Furthermore, the Help section is useless unless you're the player affected by the decision and wish to appeal, and also lacks the transparent / public nature of the forum, where people have usernames (and some of those usernames have roles and responsibility attached to them).

Fjolmidlum wrote:As I understand it, "autistic screeching" type comments are generally considered trolling as they are typically only used to be antagonistic and don't contribute to the discussion to boot. The reason it is called autistic screeching is because, well, that's what it's been called for a while and where that usage of "REEEE" originated from.


1) Nobody else seems to "understand it", is there a reasonably extensive history of forum warnings being handed out for "autistic screeching"? In what contexts?
2) It is impossible to consider that user's comment as "trolling", it is unreasonable and unfair to presume anyone would think that reply was any more offensive than "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" which they responded, I may add, to a roleplay post as part of a long multi-hour (multi-day even) RMB posting chain about a regional civil war RP. Nation 1 says they're pulling out their armies, Nation 2 doesn't want that b/c they've been stoking the fire of the military conflict for a couple of weeks now, hence, "autistic screeching" (a display of frustration, not an antagonistic remark or a joke at the expense of anyone else (besides maybe himself)).
3) "don't contribute to the discussion to boot" But its THEIR discussion, THEY know what contributes and what doesn't (frankly it does because seeing TIS getting frustrated that Crumpetopia peaced out of the conflict just b/c someone corrected the spelling of their national motto is hilarious)
Last edited by Knights of LUSITANIA on Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:59 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Fanvm Tax
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Postby Fanvm Tax » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:58 pm

Park0ur Civilization wrote:Yeah no this is bad, but it's only one day so you probably won’t get it appealed. The best thing you can do is try and get the mods to not consider it part of your history.

Oh wait this isn’t you

My point still applies. Get him to talk to the mods about it.



>appeal
>nothing happens
>stays in your history
>3-20x of these kinds of warnings later (some of which aren't appealed b/c "whybother:(.jpeg", the rest get a "No, because, well, your history [which we made] was taken into account here!")
>account deleted

Do you see why the problem is systematic, self-perpetuating, and largely hidden away from the public (b/c these discussions seldom leave the private Help section exchange)?
Again, the problem isn't just the warning itself, this isn't an appeal thread, it's a [DISCUSSION] thread.

The mod guidelines are messed up, the gameside warning system is opaque, and you can see it is dysfunctional (and possibly even corrupt) ONLY when a decision this out of left field pops up in an RMB- where it usually DIES, unseen by the rest of the NationStates community, and with player pleads unanswered by whomever trawls the RMB for actionable material. This is messed up.
Last edited by Fanvm Tax on Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Fjolmidlum
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Postby Fjolmidlum » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:00 pm

Knights of LUSITANIA wrote:
Fjolmidlum wrote:As I understand it, "autistic screeching" type comments are generally considered trolling as they are typically only used to be antagonistic and don't contribute to the discussion to boot. The reason it is called autistic screeching is because, well, that's what it's been called for a while and where that usage of "REEEE" originated from.


1) Nobody else seems to "understand it", is there a reasonably extensive history of forum warnings being handed out for "autistic screeching"? In what contexts?
2) It is impossible to consider that user's comment as "trolling", it is unreasonable and unfair to presume anyone would think that reply was any more offensive than "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" which they responded, I may add, to a roleplay post as part of a long multi-hour (multi-day even) RMB posting chain about a regional civil war RP. Nation 1 says they're pulling out their armies, Nation 2 doesn't want that b/c they've been stoking the fire of the military conflict for a couple of weeks now, hence, "autistic screeching" (a display of frustration, not an antagonistic remark or a joke at the expense of anyone else (besides maybe himself).
3) "don't contribute to the discussion to boot" But its THEIR discussion, THEY know what contributes and what doesn't (frankly it does because seeing TIS getting frustrated that Crumpetopia peaced out of the conflict just b/c someone corrected the spelling of their national motto is hilarious)

  1. Precedent? Yes, there is.
  2. I am not stating an opinion on this specific case. It is far and away from me to jump to conclusions on the intent of somebody from literally one word.
  3. "Ownership" of the discussion is not and should not be a metric when determining if something is trolling or flaming.
irregardless, its the same difference and i literally could care less for all intensive purposes so you're point is mute per say
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Earthly Cossack
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Postby Earthly Cossack » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:02 pm

Fanvm Tax wrote:
>appeal
>nothing happens
>stays in your history
>3-20x of these kinds of warnings later (some of which aren't appealed b/c "whybother:(.jpeg", the rest get a "No, because, well, your history [which we made] was taken into account here!")
>account deleted

Do you see why the problem is systematic, self-perpetuating, and largely hidden away from the public (b/c these discussions seldom leave the private Help section exchange)?
Again, the problem isn't just the warning itself, this isn't an appeal thread, it's a [DISCUSSION] thread.

The mod guidelines are messed up, the gameside warning system is opaque, and you can see it is dysfunctional (and possibly even corrupt) ONLY when a decision this out of left field pops up in an RMB- where it usually DIES, unseen by the rest of the NationStates community, and with player pleads unanswered by whomever trawls the RMB for actionable material. This is messed up.

If the appeal is denied then there is a reasoning, that being it broke the rules. As such there warrants no discussion if the mod team has decided it fell under trolling.
It is solely on the user to prevent their own deletion. You cannot argue with mods on something someone else did and got warned for.
I suggest not to gripe with the NS rules. You find that only builds up a history doing so.
Last edited by Earthly Cossack on Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Overmind » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:04 pm

Fanvm Tax wrote:So I was scrolling through the Fifth Empire RMB when I saw that The Iron Stars had been RMB banned for 1 day for saying "Reeeeeeeeeee" because "Autistic screech comments are not acceptable". Not only is this a gross abuse of moderation power (pretty sure onomatopoeia doesn't violate the site rules) and unprofessional, but it is also deeply offensive to the many users of this site who are actually autistic to describe such a post as an "autistic screech". Not only this, but the discussion was in-character roleplay, and as such, it is even more absurd that such a benign post was seen as rule-breaking.

I'm autistic. It mocks autistic people. Moderation got it right.
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Ultra Earth
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Postby Ultra Earth » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:05 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Fanvm Tax wrote:So I was scrolling through the Fifth Empire RMB when I saw that The Iron Stars had been RMB banned for 1 day for saying "Reeeeeeeeeee" because "Autistic screech comments are not acceptable". Not only is this a gross abuse of moderation power (pretty sure onomatopoeia doesn't violate the site rules) and unprofessional, but it is also deeply offensive to the many users of this site who are actually autistic to describe such a post as an "autistic screech". Not only this, but the discussion was in-character roleplay, and as such, it is even more absurd that such a benign post was seen as rule-breaking.

I'm autistic. It mocks autistic people. Moderation got it right.

I’m autistic, and I find it hilarious.
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Postby The Overmind » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:06 pm

Ultra Earth wrote:
The Overmind wrote:I'm autistic. It mocks autistic people. Moderation got it right.

I’m autistic, and I find it hilarious.

You're firmly in the minority.
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Ultra Earth
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Postby Ultra Earth » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:07 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Ultra Earth wrote:I’m autistic, and I find it hilarious.

You're firmly in the minority.

I find that rather difficult to believe.
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Postby Earthly Cossack » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:08 pm

Ultra Earth wrote:
The Overmind wrote:I'm autistic. It mocks autistic people. Moderation got it right.

I’m autistic, and I find it hilarious.

I'm autistic and it's just annoying. Not to mention the context of it being mocking is not going to make anyone with ASD very pleased.
Well some might not find it bad, but does that suddenly allow it? No.
Last edited by Earthly Cossack on Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Overmind » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:10 pm

Ultra Earth wrote:
The Overmind wrote:You're firmly in the minority.

I find that rather difficult to believe.

You would ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Postby Park0ur Civilization » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:11 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Ultra Earth wrote:I’m autistic, and I find it hilarious.

You're firmly in the minority.

Just because the onomatopoeia OP used happens to have negative connotations like that doesn’t mean it’s bad.

1. I don’t think it’s that funny but that’s more because it’s not my style of comedy than anything inherent.

2. He wasn’t using it to mock autistic people, he was using it as an obvious joke. Just because that specific onomatopoeia is sometimes used to mock autistic people doesn’t make a use of it that is clearly not in that way bad.

Edit in form of a haiku:
I’m not posting now
I’m backing out of this thread
G’evening and goodnight.
Last edited by Park0ur Civilization on Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Supurior
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Postby Supurior » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:11 pm

I retracted my comment because I decided I dont want to get involved
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Postby Neo-Hermitius » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:12 pm

the whole "REEEE" think comes from making fun of autistic people. also if you do think its "moderator abuse" go and report it.
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:13 pm

Ultra Earth wrote:
The Overmind wrote:You're firmly in the minority.

I find that rather difficult to believe.

Well, if it makes you feel better, I'm autistic too.

The joke is nothing short of obnoxious.
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Postby The Overmind » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:14 pm

Park0ur Civilization wrote:
The Overmind wrote:You're firmly in the minority.

Just because the onomatopoeia OP used happens to have negative connotations like that doesn’t mean it’s bad.

1. I don’t think it’s that funny but that’s more because it’s not my style of comedy than anything inherent.

2. He wasn’t using it to mock autistic people, he was using it as an obvious joke. Just because that specific onomatopoeia is sometimes used to mock autistic people doesn’t make a use of it that is clearly not in that way bad.

Using a known pejorative reference to autistic people to make a joke is mocking autistic people. It's also long since been held up in moderation rulings as trolling. This is nothing new. Again, moderation got it right.
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Postby Fjolmidlum » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:17 pm

Perhaps using "I have autism" to legitimize your points is pointless and won't get a discussion anywhere, especially in one where anybody can claim to have it and use it to legitimize any viewpoint on the matter. The reason "REEEE" or other pejorative "autistic screeching" is trolling or flaming is because it usage is pejorative. not because somebody with autism might get offended seeing it.

Adding this as well, "autistic screeching" might not be considered problematic unto itself: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=462812&p=35558576#p35558576

EDIT: existence -> usage; grammar
Last edited by Fjolmidlum on Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
irregardless, its the same difference and i literally could care less for all intensive purposes so you're point is mute per say
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Postby Arelont » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:17 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Park0ur Civilization wrote:Just because the onomatopoeia OP used happens to have negative connotations like that doesn’t mean it’s bad.

1. I don’t think it’s that funny but that’s more because it’s not my style of comedy than anything inherent.

2. He wasn’t using it to mock autistic people, he was using it as an obvious joke. Just because that specific onomatopoeia is sometimes used to mock autistic people doesn’t make a use of it that is clearly not in that way bad.

Using a known pejorative reference to autistic people to make a joke is mocking autistic people. It's also long since been held up in moderation rulings as trolling. This is nothing new. Again, moderation got it right.



What if.. it was like, completely unrelated to autistic people?

From what I am reading I think you assume that whoever wrote the "reee" is targeting it against autistic people. It could just be unrelated yknow
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Postby The Overmind » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:19 pm

Arelont wrote:
The Overmind wrote:Using a known pejorative reference to autistic people to make a joke is mocking autistic people. It's also long since been held up in moderation rulings as trolling. This is nothing new. Again, moderation got it right.



What if.. it was like, completely unrelated to autistic people?

From what I am reading I think you assume that whoever wrote the "reee" is targeting it against autistic people. It could just be unrelated yknow

Intentions notwithstanding, it is what it is, and it's pretty cut and dry what the intention is.
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Postby Park0ur Civilization » Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:20 pm

Edited because comments like this have been marked “spam” before
Last edited by Park0ur Civilization on Fri Jan 17, 2025 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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