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[GA DRAFT] Addressing Religious Discrimination

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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[GA DRAFT] Addressing Religious Discrimination

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:43 am

This resolution is no longer co-authing Alkzine, but instead Ice States. Again, looking for feedback, and any help would be appreciated.
The World Assembly,

Realising that [resolution=GA#457]Resolution #457[/resolution] (Defending the Rights of Sexual and Gender Minorities) states that “religious organizations and their internal discrimination do not fall under this resolution, and should be addressed by future legislation”,

Concerned that such future legislation is yet to come about, and

Desiring to finally close this gap in the body of international law so as to protect the civil rights of minorities from arbitrary discrimination by religious organisations,

Enacts as follows, subject to relevant past World Assembly resolutions still in force:

  1. In this resolution, “identity-based discrimination” refers to:

    1. the denial of any service or privilege from an individual based on an immutable characteristic of that individual, except where (i) that characteristic renders that individual incompetent to receive the service or privilege, or (ii) the service or privilege directly concerns that characteristic or the lack thereof; or

    2. any act motivated by an immutable characteristic of an individual intended to harm that individual.

  2. No religious organisation or institution may perform identity-based discrimination. If an individual believes that they were subject to identity-based discrimination by a religious organisation, they may bring a civil case against said religious organisation.


Co-authored by The Ice States.

edits listed in spoiler:
edit 1: forgot to put a square bracket on the end of [/box] so it looked like [/box. How embarassing.
edit 2: making it enforceable by removing the first part that member-states cannot change the beliefs of people, because it's simply not possible and it conflicts with 1.
edit 3: listing edit 2.
edit 4: listing edit 3.
edit 5: changing title to current title, Preventing Religious Discrimination Towards LGBTQIA+ Groups. this title will likely be only temporary.
edit 6: grammar fixes
edit 7: more grammar fixes
edit 8: changed title to Regarding Religious Discrimination
edit 9: changed title to Addressing Religious Discrimination, included edits in spoiler.
edit 10: fixed stupid part of section 3.
edit 11: added [GA DRAFT] to title so people will know what it is when clicking the title.
edit 12: changed 1. as to include a clause that means that religious organizations can preach against LGBTQIA+ individuals or groups, but not based on their gender or sexuality. As Goobergunchia pointed out, a gay criminal couldn't be preached against due to this, and now this means only homophobic/transphobic rhetoric in preaching is banned, but not preaching against someone who is coincidentally LGBTQIA+.
edit 13: Completely removed all mentions of LGBTQIA+. Why? Because I realized GA#457, paired with every other resolution out there, does absolutely nothing to prevent race, gender, sex-based, any discrimination at all from these religious groups.
edit 14: yeah, Religious discrimination against other religions from their churches and whatnot is fine, but I'll need to fix this later because this is only a temp fix.
edit 15: much less temporary fix to fix edit 14
edit 16: complete re-vamp done by The Ice States, therefore am co-authoring him.
edit 17: removed line break before list.
edit 18: changed the 'and' at the end of 1a to an 'or'.
edit 19: removed 'sponsor' for more concise wording.
edit 20: re-wrote 1a.
edit 21: removed all mentions of 'rights' in 1a, as that concerns governments, TIS told me.
edit 22: extra line break, removed the 'support for discriminatory orgs thing
edit 23: first line changed
edit 24: expanded 2 so it covers 1b and 1a appropriately
edit 25: removed advocating for discrim bit
edit 26: added immutable to the first clause.
Last edited by Of The Revived Soviet Union on Sat Jan 18, 2025 9:49 pm, edited 26 times in total.
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:51 am

1. Religious organisations may not discriminate nor preach against LGBTQIA+ individuals, nor use their beliefs to justify violence, hatred, or any crimes against LGBTQIA+ individuals,

2. Member states shall not force religious institutions or their members to change their own beliefs; however, religious institutions may not bar entry nor attendance, to LGBTQIA+ individuals based on their sexuality nor gender identity,

OOC: 2 still making 1 unenforceable... as an example the defence of using honest belief to shield a religious organisation against hate crime ordinances would now become a thing.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:56 am

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:
1. Religious organisations may not discriminate nor preach against LGBTQIA+ individuals, nor use their beliefs to justify violence, hatred, or any crimes against LGBTQIA+ individuals,

2. Member states shall not force religious institutions or their members to change their own beliefs; however, religious institutions may not bar entry nor attendance, to LGBTQIA+ individuals based on their sexuality nor gender identity,

OOC: 2 still making 1 unenforceable... as an example the defence of using honest belief to shield a religious organisation against hate crime ordinances would now become a thing.

Removed.

Now?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:57 am

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:OOC: 2 still making 1 unenforceable... as an example the defence of using honest belief to shield a religious organisation against hate crime ordinances would now become a thing.

Removed.

Now?

OOC: A marked improvement. Some people may disagree vehemently tho...
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:59 am

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:
Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:Removed.

Now?

OOC: A marked improvement. Some people may disagree vehemently tho...

oh well.

Any other parts that may need improving? Unlike what BBD asserts, I am not actually trying to badge-hunt and generally want help/want improvements to these resolutions I write instead of relentless criticism.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Comfed
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Postby Comfed » Sun Jan 12, 2025 10:57 am

You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.
Last edited by Comfed on Sun Jan 12, 2025 10:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Kyete
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Postby Kyete » Sun Jan 12, 2025 4:55 pm

I would not vote for this unless it was changed heavily. It goes against free speech and freedom of worship. Protecting people (any group of people) from violence? Yes. Dictating what people can believe? Absolutely not. This might be well intentioned but I don’t support it.
Last edited by Kyete on Sun Jan 12, 2025 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 4:57 pm

Comfed wrote:You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.

Do you have any good replacements for those then?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Fachumonn
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Postby Fachumonn » Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:22 pm

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Comfed wrote:You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.

Do you have any good replacements for those then?

I'm trying to get this through to you, but nobody is going to be super willing to do your work for you.

While it can be beneficial to get feedback, at the end of the day, you need to do the work yourselves.
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The Ice States
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Postby The Ice States » Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:27 pm

Comfed wrote:You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.

I disagree; Section 3 of #436 permits "restrictions required to fulfill the mandates of WA legislation, or restrictions permitted in future, unrepealed WA legislation". This means that a new resolution which restricts free expression beyond #436 does not contradict #436.
Last edited by The Ice States on Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:28 pm

The Ice States wrote:
Comfed wrote:You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.

I disagree; Section 3 permits "restrictions required to fulfill the mandates of WA legislation, or restrictions permitted in future, unrepealed WA legislation", therefore a new resolution which restricts free expression beyond #436 does not contradict that resolution.

That's good to know.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Alkzine
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Postby Alkzine » Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:47 pm

what is the definition of “preaching against”?
שמע ישראל ד אלוקינו ד אחד | Listen, Jews: Hashem is Our G-d; Hashem Is The Only One | אין עוד מלבדו | There Is Nothing Other Than G-d | ועשיתה את הטוב ואת הישר | You Must Do What Is Good and Straight| אלוקים עשה את האדם ישר והמה ביקשו חשבונות רבים | G-d Made Man Upright, But They Made Excuses | ובחרתה בחיים | Choose To Live

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 6:54 pm

Alkzine wrote:what is the definition of “preaching against”?

Definition of 'preaching against' is as in saying that it is sinful, members aren't allowed to, proclaiming gospel when what you're saying is homophobic, et cetera.

And let me ask, are you Straightness?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Alkzine
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Postby Alkzine » Sun Jan 12, 2025 7:01 pm

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Alkzine wrote:what is the definition of “preaching against”?

Definition of 'preaching against' is as in saying that it is sinful, members aren't allowed to, proclaiming gospel when what you're saying is homophobic, et cetera.

And let me ask, are you Straightness?

Pretty sure straightness has CTE’d.

Could we have a definition in the resolution, because otherwise it’s just too vague and could be defined in myriad different ways?

And needless to say, opposed on principle.
שמע ישראל ד אלוקינו ד אחד | Listen, Jews: Hashem is Our G-d; Hashem Is The Only One | אין עוד מלבדו | There Is Nothing Other Than G-d | ועשיתה את הטוב ואת הישר | You Must Do What Is Good and Straight| אלוקים עשה את האדם ישר והמה ביקשו חשבונות רבים | G-d Made Man Upright, But They Made Excuses | ובחרתה בחיים | Choose To Live

טוב טעם ודעת למדני כי במצוותיך האמנתי | Teach Me Logic And Understanding, For I Have Been Faithful To Your Commandments

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 7:03 pm

Alkzine wrote:
Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:Definition of 'preaching against' is as in saying that it is sinful, members aren't allowed to, proclaiming gospel when what you're saying is homophobic, et cetera.

And let me ask, are you Straightness?

Pretty sure straightness has CTE’d.

Could we have a definition in the resolution, because otherwise it’s just too vague and could be defined in myriad different ways?

And needless to say, opposed on principle.

If you're opposed on principle purely because you're a right-wing homophobe, be that.

I am not defining it more clearly as it is up to member-states to interpret. Simply put, it's pretty clear what preaching is, and you can go look it up on Google.

By the way, even though you originally made the thread that started my idea of an anti-religious discrim resolution, I'm not co-authing you because you're homophobic and I've deleted all the original stuff you wrote so it's not plagarized.

Now, if you have nothing better to contribute, then this can be the end of our conversation.

Anyone else have opinions that aren't pointed at me being auth or on-principle opposition?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Comfed
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Postby Comfed » Sun Jan 12, 2025 8:31 pm

The Ice States wrote:
Comfed wrote:You're in contradiction of Protecting Free Expression with sections 1 and 3.

I disagree; Section 3 of #436 permits "restrictions required to fulfill the mandates of WA legislation, or restrictions permitted in future, unrepealed WA legislation". This means that a new resolution which restricts free expression beyond #436 does not contradict #436.

Fair enough.

In that case, I am merely opposed to this resolution for that reason, rather than thinking it to be illegal.

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 8:53 pm

Comfed wrote:
The Ice States wrote:I disagree; Section 3 of #436 permits "restrictions required to fulfill the mandates of WA legislation, or restrictions permitted in future, unrepealed WA legislation". This means that a new resolution which restricts free expression beyond #436 does not contradict #436.

Fair enough.

In that case, I am merely opposed to this resolution for that reason, rather than thinking it to be illegal.

Define what you mean.

Which reason? It doesn't restrict free speech, just restricts funding of hate groups.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Comfed
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Postby Comfed » Sun Jan 12, 2025 8:55 pm

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Comfed wrote:Fair enough.

In that case, I am merely opposed to this resolution for that reason, rather than thinking it to be illegal.

Define what you mean.

Which reason? It doesn't restrict free speech, just restricts funding of hate groups.

It does restrict speech; you've forbidden religious institutions from "preach[ing] against LGBTQIA+ individuals."

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 8:59 pm

Comfed wrote:
Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:Define what you mean.

Which reason? It doesn't restrict free speech, just restricts funding of hate groups.

It does restrict speech; you've forbidden religious institutions from "preach[ing] against LGBTQIA+ individuals."

Ah, yes. That.

I might ask a bunch of major regions (such as TNP, TLA, TCB, and others) what they think of it. If I get that approval, then I'll keep it, but if not, then I'll remove that line.

However, that's as to prevent them from espousing homophobia/transphobia and the rest, which is supposed to prevent discrimination.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Goobergunchia
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Postby Goobergunchia » Sun Jan 12, 2025 9:32 pm

We observe that as written the proposal would ban preaching against LGBTQIA+ individuals regardless of the reasons behind the sermonizing, thereupon preventing religious organizations from inveighing against the sins of people who, as the kids say, "are gay, do crimes" even if said crimes are unrelated to their sexualities.

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Sun Jan 12, 2025 9:34 pm

Goobergunchia wrote:We observe that as written the proposal would ban preaching against LGBTQIA+ individuals regardless of the reasons behind the sermonizing, thereupon preventing religious organizations from inveighing against the sins of people who, as the kids say, "are gay, do crimes" even if said crimes are unrelated to their sexualities.

[Lord] Michael Evif
Goobergunchian WA Ambassador

Thanks for pointing this out - I'll fix it now, as to make it far more clear.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:27 am

Lansfietland wrote:Looks great

Please delete your post. Thank you.

Truly a shame that this joke of a nation had to be from a DOS who wants to troll the mods.

I'm hoping that mods can quickly ban you.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Kasdados
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Postby Kasdados » Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:30 am

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Lansfietland wrote:Looks great

Please delete your post. Thank you.

Truly a shame that this joke of a nation had to be from a DOS who wants to troll the mods.

I'm hoping that mods can quickly ban you.

Exactly.

Anywho, I don’t support it.
Last edited by Kasdados on Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:31 am

Kasdados wrote:
Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:Please delete your post. Thank you.

Truly a shame that this joke of a nation had to be from a DOS who wants to troll the mods.

I'm hoping that mods can quickly ban you.

Exactly.

Anywho, wanna talk about Phonecia?

No.

This post is talking about my GA draft, not Phonecia.

Please remove this, or I'll be required to report you as well.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Kasdados
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Posts: 1014
Founded: Jun 02, 2024
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby Kasdados » Mon Jan 13, 2025 3:37 am

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Kasdados wrote:Exactly.

Anywho, wanna talk about Phonecia?

No.

This post is talking about my GA draft, not Phonecia.

Please remove this, or I'll be required to report you as well.

Done.

Anyway, as I’ve previously stated - I don’t support this proposal. It is a blatant violation of a faith’s right to its own beliefs.
Aussie Patriot. Proud grandson of Greeks - prouder Son of Our Lord And Saviour. Passionate lover of creative writing, the bridge betwixt the realms beyond our own and the comprehension of our minds. Aspergers is its name, awesome is its game. Suave gentleman, debonair intellectual, kind soul. Lover of history, of politics, of civilisation. Devotee of Tolkien, of Frank Herbert, of George R. R Martin - the forgers of worlds. Supporter of Thomas Aquinas, of Aristotle, of Marcus Aurelius. Opponent of blasphemers, of uncreatives, and impolites.

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law" — Galatians 5:22-23.

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