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Where WA members debate how to improve the world, one resolution at a time.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Left-wing Utopia

-DEFUNCT THREAD NOW MOVED-

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Wed Jan 08, 2025 6:22 pm

THIS THREAD IS NO LONGER RELEVANT, I WILL NOT BE RESPONDING TO ANY POSTS MADE HEREAFTER!
Last edited by Of The Revived Soviet Union on Sun Jan 12, 2025 2:44 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
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The Overmind
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Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Wed Jan 08, 2025 7:02 pm

As I said, unlikely to pass due to coauthor even though your motives may be entirely different and this draft an effort to rehabilitate this proposal. Again, just speculation based on my time in the WA and the general opprobrium surrounding all of Alkzine's drafts.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Wed Jan 08, 2025 7:44 pm

The Overmind wrote:As I said, unlikely to pass due to coauthor even though your motives may be entirely different and this draft an effort to rehabilitate this proposal. Again, just speculation based on my time in the WA and the general opprobrium surrounding all of Alkzine's drafts.

Fair. Might be worth asking Alkzine if I can withdraw his co-authorship.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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The Overmind
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Founded: Dec 12, 2022
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Wed Jan 08, 2025 7:46 pm

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
The Overmind wrote:As I said, unlikely to pass due to coauthor even though your motives may be entirely different and this draft an effort to rehabilitate this proposal. Again, just speculation based on my time in the WA and the general opprobrium surrounding all of Alkzine's drafts.

Fair. Might be worth asking Alkzine if I can withdraw his co-authorship.

You would probably have to rewrite this completely as your own draft. I do not know if it actually resolves the issue of plagiarism just to ask the original author to withdraw their involvement, but that would be more of a [Q] thread in Moderation than any sort of discussion about this proposal in and of itself. Or Refuge Isle can just weigh in if they're around.
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Comfed
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Founded: Apr 09, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Comfed » Wed Jan 08, 2025 8:24 pm

The speech forbidden under s. 1 of this proposal is almost certainly protected by s. 1(a) of Protecting Free Expression without being exempted by any of the qualifications under s. 2 of that resolution.

I frankly have no idea what ss. 3-4 actually mean in practice. They're both incredibly broad and vague, with no specific mandates, which isn't helped by the use of the passive voice. If you're writing a new draft, I would go back to the drawing board on these.

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Wed Jan 08, 2025 9:00 pm

Comfed wrote:The speech forbidden under s. 1 of this proposal is almost certainly protected by s. 1(a) of Protecting Free Expression without being exempted by any of the qualifications under s. 2 of that resolution.

I frankly have no idea what ss. 3-4 actually mean in practice. They're both incredibly broad and vague, with no specific mandates, which isn't helped by the use of the passive voice. If you're writing a new draft, I would go back to the drawing board on these.

Fair, it was Alkzine who wanted 1. in.

Could you re-word 3 and 4?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Thu Jan 09, 2025 1:31 am

OOC:
2. Member states shall not compel religious institutions, leaders, or followers to adopt, endorse, or affirm beliefs or practices regarding sexual minorities that conflict with their religious doctrines; however, religious institutions may not arbitrarily and entirely bar attendance to LGBTQIA+ because they are part of the LGBTQIA+ community,

This clause makes the rest of the resolution entirely unenforceable. It needs to either go or be rewritten so that it doesn't interfere with the rest of the proposal.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Thu Jan 09, 2025 2:33 am

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:OOC:
2. Member states shall not compel religious institutions, leaders, or followers to adopt, endorse, or affirm beliefs or practices regarding sexual minorities that conflict with their religious doctrines; however, religious institutions may not arbitrarily and entirely bar attendance to LGBTQIA+ because they are part of the LGBTQIA+ community,

This clause makes the rest of the resolution entirely unenforceable. It needs to either go or be rewritten so that it doesn't interfere with the rest of the proposal.

again, can you re-word that then?
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Thu Jan 09, 2025 3:16 am

Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:
Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:OOC:
This clause makes the rest of the resolution entirely unenforceable. It needs to either go or be rewritten so that it doesn't interfere with the rest of the proposal.

again, can you re-word that then?

OOC: I am not certain that this project could be pursued in good faith and conscience. Certainly it would have to permit some level of oppression against the already oppressed if we are to pursue one of those so-called compromises.
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something something the sole legitimate Austria-Hungary larp'er on NS :3

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Torregal
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Founded: May 14, 2005
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Torregal » Thu Jan 09, 2025 6:10 am

Opposed due to co-author. Additionally, the phrase "different lifestyles" in section 1 is jarring given that it's generally used IRL by homophobic and transphobic bigots to belittle queer and trans lives. Philosophically, I'm not sure why any of this is necessary.

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Untecna
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Untecna » Thu Jan 09, 2025 10:12 am

Opposed due to coauthor and the fact that this is still a nothingburger draft that continues to be detrimental to the LGBTQ+ community.
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Ultra Earth
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Corporate Police State

Postby Ultra Earth » Thu Jan 09, 2025 10:58 am

A shame, I liked the original better.
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The Overmind
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Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Thu Jan 09, 2025 11:33 am

Ultra Earth wrote:A shame, I liked the original better.

I guess it has at least one endorsement then.
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Alkzine
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Founded: Nov 12, 2012
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Alkzine » Thu Jan 09, 2025 5:01 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Ultra Earth wrote:A shame, I liked the original better.

I guess it has at least one endorsement then.

It actually had several endorsements privately communicated to us, but nations didn’t want to go public with them (potentially because of the aggressive, bullying atmosphere that has been regrettably on show in the GA).

(As well as the 56+ endorsements given as a matter of
public record).
Last edited by Alkzine on Thu Jan 09, 2025 5:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.
שמע ישראל ד אלוקינו ד אחד | Listen, Jews: Hashem is Our G-d; Hashem Is The Only One | אין עוד מלבדו | There Is Nothing Other Than G-d | ועשיתה את הטוב ואת הישר | You Must Do What Is Good and Straight| אלוקים עשה את האדם ישר והמה ביקשו חשבונות רבים | G-d Made Man Upright, But They Made Excuses | ובחרתה בחיים | Choose To Live

טוב טעם ודעת למדני כי במצוותיך האמנתי | Teach Me Logic And Understanding, For I Have Been Faithful To Your Commandments

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Alkzine
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Founded: Nov 12, 2012
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Alkzine » Thu Jan 09, 2025 5:04 pm

Ultra Earth wrote:A shame, I liked the original better.

king
שמע ישראל ד אלוקינו ד אחד | Listen, Jews: Hashem is Our G-d; Hashem Is The Only One | אין עוד מלבדו | There Is Nothing Other Than G-d | ועשיתה את הטוב ואת הישר | You Must Do What Is Good and Straight| אלוקים עשה את האדם ישר והמה ביקשו חשבונות רבים | G-d Made Man Upright, But They Made Excuses | ובחרתה בחיים | Choose To Live

טוב טעם ודעת למדני כי במצוותיך האמנתי | Teach Me Logic And Understanding, For I Have Been Faithful To Your Commandments

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The Overmind
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Founded: Dec 12, 2022
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Thu Jan 09, 2025 5:23 pm

Alkzine wrote:
The Overmind wrote:I guess it has at least one endorsement then.

It actually had several endorsements privately communicated to us, but nations didn’t want to go public with them (potentially because of the aggressive, bullying atmosphere that has been regrettably on show in the GA).

(As well as the 56+ endorsements given as a matter of
public record).

As a reminder to you, since you so easily forget, you were DEATed twice for trolling the LGBTQ+ community. You're the bully here. Calling your proposals out as harmful, thinly veiled prejudice, by the reasonable majority is not "bullying."
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Untecna
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Founded: Jun 02, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Untecna » Thu Jan 09, 2025 5:23 pm

Alkzine wrote:
The Overmind wrote:I guess it has at least one endorsement then.

It actually had several endorsements privately communicated to us, but nations didn’t want to go public with them (potentially because of the aggressive, bullying atmosphere that has been regrettably on show in the GA).

(As well as the 56+ endorsements given as a matter of
public record).

Both of those are bullshit. One is you lying about people endorsing it, the other is you misinterpreting the processes of the GA.
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Elyreia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 574
Founded: Jun 29, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Elyreia » Thu Jan 09, 2025 7:17 pm

Alkzine wrote:
The Overmind wrote:I guess it has at least one endorsement then.

It actually had several endorsements privately communicated to us, but nations didn’t want to go public with them (potentially because of the aggressive, bullying atmosphere that has been regrettably on show in the GA).

(As well as the 56+ endorsements given as a matter of
public record).


Casual reminder the bar to quorum is 6%

If your resolutions were better and more supported, a raid on 2 or 3 delegates would not drop it from quorum. You barely passed the quorum bar once, and failed to reach quorum the other times.

In short, just shy of 6% of the community is on your side, and your name has become poisonous to any other good faith proposals in the realm of these topics.
Last edited by Elyreia on Thu Jan 09, 2025 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Alkzine
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Posts: 234
Founded: Nov 12, 2012
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Alkzine » Thu Jan 09, 2025 7:45 pm

Elyreia wrote:
Alkzine wrote:It actually had several endorsements privately communicated to us, but nations didn’t want to go public with them (potentially because of the aggressive, bullying atmosphere that has been regrettably on show in the GA).

(As well as the 56+ endorsements given as a matter of
public record).


Casual reminder the bar to quorum is 6%

If your resolutions were better and more supported, a raid on 2 or 3 delegates would not drop it from quorum. You barely passed the quorum bar once, and failed to reach quorum the other times.

In short, just shy of 6% of the community is on your side, and your name has become poisonous to any other good faith proposals in the realm of these topics.

Sorry to correct this, but the proposal was actually raided twice. The average proposal right now has around 85 approvals, so by your logic only around 10% are “on the side” of any proposal, which is patently false. Let's try not to make false claims—the second draft had around 62 proposals and was gathering more before being raided; this was also in the face of somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning from Haymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role (including using disingenuous phrasing to make it sound as if opposition to the proposal was a foregone conclusion, rather than being actively debated).

Of course, if some nations hadn’t petulantly decided to raid the proposal (after histrionic claims that it was “dead on arrival”), we wouldn’t be having this conversation. This marked insecurity and desperation to ensure it doesn’t reach a vote would imply that the few shrill voices claiming to speak for all of NS aren’t quite as confident in the universality of their opinions as they claim to be.
Last edited by Alkzine on Thu Jan 09, 2025 7:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.
שמע ישראל ד אלוקינו ד אחד | Listen, Jews: Hashem is Our G-d; Hashem Is The Only One | אין עוד מלבדו | There Is Nothing Other Than G-d | ועשיתה את הטוב ואת הישר | You Must Do What Is Good and Straight| אלוקים עשה את האדם ישר והמה ביקשו חשבונות רבים | G-d Made Man Upright, But They Made Excuses | ובחרתה בחיים | Choose To Live

טוב טעם ודעת למדני כי במצוותיך האמנתי | Teach Me Logic And Understanding, For I Have Been Faithful To Your Commandments

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The Overmind
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Posts: 1995
Founded: Dec 12, 2022
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Thu Jan 09, 2025 7:56 pm

Alkzine wrote:
Elyreia wrote:
Casual reminder the bar to quorum is 6%

If your resolutions were better and more supported, a raid on 2 or 3 delegates would not drop it from quorum. You barely passed the quorum bar once, and failed to reach quorum the other times.

In short, just shy of 6% of the community is on your side, and your name has become poisonous to any other good faith proposals in the realm of these topics.

Sorry to correct this, but the proposal was actually raided twice. The average proposal right now has around 85 approvals, so by your logic only around 10% are “on the side” of any proposal, which is patently false. Let's try not to make false claims—the second draft had around 62 proposals and was gathering more before being raided; this was also in the face of somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning fromHaymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role (including using disingenuous phrasing to make it sound as if opposition to the proposal was a foregone conclusion, rather than being actively debated).

Of course, if some nations hadn’t petulantly decided to raid the proposal (after histrionic claims that it was “dead on arrival”), we wouldn’t be having this conversation. This marked insecurity and desperation to ensure it doesn’t reach a vote would imply that the few shrill voices claiming to speak for all of NS aren’t quite as confident in the universality of their opinions as they claim to be.

Actually, despite some members of the WA deciding it would be better for your proposals not to waste four days of voting space for more worthy proposals, some of us were hoping you'd get to watch them burn at vote with us.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
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Posts: 600
Founded: Jun 21, 2024
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Thu Jan 09, 2025 8:41 pm

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:
Of The Revived Soviet Union wrote:again, can you re-word that then?

OOC: I am not certain that this project could be pursued in good faith and conscience. Certainly it would have to permit some level of oppression against the already oppressed if we are to pursue one of those so-called compromises.

Mhm.

The only reason why I made this resolution is so we wouldn't have a blatantly transphobic/homophobic resolution that actually harms the LGBTQIA community.

This one is a bit of a lame duck at the moment by what people are saying, so I'd request that y'all help out writing it so it does something.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Of The Revived Soviet Union
Diplomat
 
Posts: 600
Founded: Jun 21, 2024
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Thu Jan 09, 2025 8:48 pm

Alkzine wrote:
Elyreia wrote:
Casual reminder the bar to quorum is 6%

If your resolutions were better and more supported, a raid on 2 or 3 delegates would not drop it from quorum. You barely passed the quorum bar once, and failed to reach quorum the other times.

In short, just shy of 6% of the community is on your side, and your name has become poisonous to any other good faith proposals in the realm of these topics.

Sorry to correct this, but the proposal was actually raided twice. The average proposal right now has around 85 approvals, so by your logic only around 10% are “on the side” of any proposal, which is patently false. Let's try not to make false claims—the second draft had around 62 proposals and was gathering more before being raided; this was also in the face of somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning from Haymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role (including using disingenuous phrasing to make it sound as if opposition to the proposal was a foregone conclusion, rather than being actively debated).

Of course, if some nations hadn’t petulantly decided to raid the proposal (after histrionic claims that it was “dead on arrival”), we wouldn’t be having this conversation. This marked insecurity and desperation to ensure it doesn’t reach a vote would imply that the few shrill voices claiming to speak for all of NS aren’t quite as confident in the universality of their opinions as they claim to be.

I'm dangerously close of dropping everything you wrote specifically and re-wording it entirely so I can dump you as co-auth. Watch yourself.

Calling Ultra Earth a 'king' for supporting your originally LGBTQIA+-phobic resolution is awful. Please don't do that, or again, I will withdraw your co-auth and re-write it in a much more progressive way.

And finally, stop bickering with The Overmind about how many approvals your old proposals were getting. It is NOT relevant to the conversation.

Thanks.
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Pathonia
Envoy
 
Posts: 272
Founded: Jan 21, 2020
Anarchy

Postby Pathonia » Thu Jan 09, 2025 8:51 pm

Alkzine wrote:somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning from Haymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role


I should like to note that counter-campaigning with telegrams isn't unprecedented within the General Assembly, and that counter-campaigning at all doesn't mean that they're overstepping their GenSec position. To my knowledge, being a Secretariat doesn't necessarily inhibit one's ability to telegram (or counter-telegram, in this case) as they otherwise might have done without the role.

-=-=-

Opposed due to co-author.
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Of The Revived Soviet Union
Diplomat
 
Posts: 600
Founded: Jun 21, 2024
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Of The Revived Soviet Union » Thu Jan 09, 2025 8:56 pm

Pathonia wrote:
Alkzine wrote:somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning from Haymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role


I should like to note that counter-campaigning with telegrams isn't unprecedented within the General Assembly, and that counter-campaigning at all doesn't mean that they're overstepping their GenSec position. To my knowledge, being a Secretariat doesn't necessarily inhibit one's ability to telegram (or counter-telegram, in this case) as they otherwise might have done without the role.

-=-=-

Opposed due to co-author.

again, that's fine. I'm considering dumping him as co-auth and re-writing the resolution (same idea, very different wording because I completely changed the whole idea of this resolution)
Political Views>
https://leftvalues.github.io/results.html?a=11.8&b=54.7&c=53.3&d=57.1&e=42.3&f=33.3&g=29.4
Those are my political positions within the left - I consider myself to be a market socialist, which isn't a surprise. https://politicaltests.github.io/12axes ... &k=31&l=88
This is my 12axes test, which said I'm Revolutionary Socialist.
I stand with Palestine!
LGBTQIA+ Rights are human rights!
Pronouns: He/him. Am a cisgender half-Lebanese guy, but I'm more progressive than most people you'll meet.
'Capitalism and social conservatism are just the political manifestations of narcissism.' - Me.
Fixed my signature for being too long. You're welcome :)

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Elyreia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 574
Founded: Jun 29, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Elyreia » Thu Jan 09, 2025 10:41 pm

Alkzine wrote:
Elyreia wrote:
Casual reminder the bar to quorum is 6%

If your resolutions were better and more supported, a raid on 2 or 3 delegates would not drop it from quorum. You barely passed the quorum bar once, and failed to reach quorum the other times.

In short, just shy of 6% of the community is on your side, and your name has become poisonous to any other good faith proposals in the realm of these topics.

Sorry to correct this, but the proposal was actually raided twice. The average proposal right now has around 85 approvals, so by your logic only around 10% are “on the side” of any proposal, which is patently false. Let's try not to make false claims—the second draft had around 62 proposals and was gathering more before being raided; this was also in the face of somewhat unprecedented counter-campaigning from Haymarket Riot in a ludicrous overstepping of their Secretariat role (including using disingenuous phrasing to make it sound as if opposition to the proposal was a foregone conclusion, rather than being actively debated).

Of course, if some nations hadn’t petulantly decided to raid the proposal (after histrionic claims that it was “dead on arrival”), we wouldn’t be having this conversation. This marked insecurity and desperation to ensure it doesn’t reach a vote would imply that the few shrill voices claiming to speak for all of NS aren’t quite as confident in the universality of their opinions as they claim to be.


I've spoken with the raiders of the first quorum raid.

They did not quorum raid it a second time (insofar as they know). It failed to meet quorum, it was like 2 or 3 votes shy.

Also, your proposal did not have 85 before it was burned to the ground. You were only 4 over quorum (the day before it got raided at least, that number may have changed), hence why it was so easy to raid the first time. Just because other proposals get 85 approvals doesn't mean yours did. You're free to resubmit at any time if you'd like to test that theory. If you had 85 or more, you would have not been so easy to raid.

Second, GenSec are permitted to participate as private individuals. They may author, co-author, campaign, or counter-campaign whatever they please. I'd love for you to quote the rule that says they can't. So long as they a: abstain from legality votes on proposals they participate directly in, and b: don't use their title as leverage for pass/fail quid pro quos or threats, they are well within their rights to do as they please. If you believe Haymarket Riot overstepped their bounds, the remediation for this is to file a formal complaint, not whinge about how unfair it was.

Disregarding the peanut gallery and focusing on the current resolution at hand, I would be in favor of seeing a top-down rewrite to purge the stain of dishonor. I have too many backend projects of my own or else I'd provide some more assistance in that matter; the only thing of value Alkzine has stated is that religious minorities must also be prevented from persecution just as sexual minorities should be, and ensuring a law that prevents either group from being allowed to do so to one another (within tolerable bounds; tolerance is a social contract and breaching that contract with hate and vitriol and violence voids the oppressor's membership of that social contract) is something I am heavily in favor of.

Just because only a small percentage of persons believe in Kynaz the Nomad or the great dragon Tireyana does not mean we want to stamp out those unique points of view, so long as they never use their beliefs as a shield against consequences for bigotry and hatred.
Last edited by Elyreia on Thu Jan 09, 2025 10:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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