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[Last call] - Gender Affirmation Procedures

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Simone Republic
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[Last call] - Gender Affirmation Procedures

Postby Simone Republic » Mon Jan 06, 2025 1:36 am

Update
This has been pulled and re-drafted to avoid all subordination clauses.

Main goals of this resolution:
  1. This takes GA467 and GA571 further by requiring that all gender affirmation procedures be free of charge at the point of use. (If a state uses health insurance, health insurance premiums may not be varied). There's also a requirement that gender affirmation procedures cannot be denied except under extremely limited circumstances.
  2. It also takes GA559 further by requiring free health coverage for anyone who has already undergone conversion therapy.
  3. It also expands the role of Choice Plus to also cover gender affirmation procedures. It also makes Choice Plus clinics assess competence without considering chronological age, so teenagers and others that want to get puberty blockers can go to Choice Plus clinics that are outside of a WA state for such treatment.
  4. It also tightens several loopholes regarding gender affirmation in previous resolutions, hence the long list of 15 resolutions cited because of the need to navigate through several quirks in previous resolutions.

Note that health care is already generally state-funded in WA states (under GA97). The insurance provisions are to cover for the exceptions in that resolution for voluntary private insurance and there is a specific provision in case gender-adequate procedures are classified as elective care (due to an ambiguity in GA97). Puberty blockers etc is covered (as a form of hormone therapy) as available to anyone mature enough to request it to cater to both concerns over the Cass Report in the UK and GA299, this also makes any territory of the WA (as well as the WA headquarters) a sanctuary for teenagers looking for gender affirmation procedures.

This has been re-drafted to avoid anti-contradiction clauses (primarily to do with legal competence, GA299). Any repeals of resolutions superseded by this resolution will come only after this has been passed and bedded down in full.

Category: civil rights, strong

Last call

The World Assembly (WA),

Noting related GARs 29, 41, 91, 97, 161, 389, 457, 467, 480, 499, 523, 559, 571, 582 and 659;

Seeking to expand the right to gender affirmation procedures, as well as the responsibilities of Choice Plus in providing care;

The WA enacts as follows:

  1. Definitions.
    1. "Conversion therapy" means any activity or procedure intended to alter or reverse anyone's sexual orientation or gender identity.
    2. "Entity" means any entity or individual under the jurisdiction of a WA state or the WA.
    3. "Hormone therapy" includes any use of hormones, chemicals, drugs, or other injected or digested substances to help align an individual's physical form with their gender identity.
    4. "State" means a WA member state, including its sub-national authorities.
    5. "Territory" means any place under the direct jurisdiction of the WA.
    6. "Treatment" means a gender affirmation procedure. This term is broadly defined for the benefit of users of such procedures, and includes (as examples) all kinds of surgery, hormone therapy, puberty blockers, and related care such as urological care, psychological care, therapy, and mental health care. It also includes any support and care provided under sub-clause (2)(c).
    7. References to "the WA" include its committees. Terms in the singular include the plural and vice versa.
  2. Availability. Subject to clause (3):
    1. All treatments shall be legal in all states and territories. All treatments shall be available to all inhabitants in all states and territories. All treatment shall be available (i) free at the point of use, (ii) through convenient means, and (iii) subject to relevant health care quality standards.
    2. No state or entity may deny or impede anyone from seeking or receiving any treatments anywhere for any reason. This includes denial as penalty for an offence. No state or entity may deny or impede travel by anyone to another state or territory for treatment unless they are prohibited from travel by relevant laws. No state or entity may compel or entice anyone to seek or receive any treatment anywhere.
    3. No state may permit conversion therapy in that state, nor permit advertising for such therapy in that state. Each state shall provide all relevant support and care at the request of any inhabitant who has already undergone conversion therapy.
    4. If a state's care system operates (partly or fully) through insurers, no insurer may deny claims or coverage for any treatment, or vary any premiums or charges due to the use of any treatment.
    5. Anyone who contravenes this clause (2) in a state, territory, or the WA headquarters ("headquarters") commits an offence.
  3. Denials.
    1. No state may deny any treatment to anyone except on the grounds of mental acuity and competence. Incarceration or penalty for an offence are not valid grounds to deny treatment. Delays in treatment due to quarantine may only be imposed according to prevailing laws.
    2. No state may deny the use of specific forms of treatment, such as specific puberty blockers, except for a legitimate danger to their health. A state is responsible for seeking reasonable alternatives, if available, in case of contraindications.
    3. The burden of proof for "legitimate danger" in this clause shall at least be on a "clear and convincing evidence" basis.
  4. Choice Plus.
    1. If a state is unable to (or CP deems it unable to) adequately provide any treatment for any reason, Choice Plus ("CP") shall provide such treatment at its own facilities located in convenient locations at the said state free-of-charge. CP shall also provide all treatments (as well as abortions) free-of-charge in all territories and the headquarters to anyone who is subject to the jurisdiction of the WA or a state.
    2. CP (and each state) shall keep their treatment records in confidence. CP services are subject to applicable health care quality standards, and monitoring by relevant WA committees.
    3. CP shall independently assess the mental acuity and competence of anyone seeking treatment at its facilities. For any treatment conducted at any facility located in any territory or the headquarters, CP shall disregard chronological age as a factor in such assessment.
    4. Each state’s government shall fully indemnify CP for its services in that state. If CP believes that this will afflict genuine hardship, CP may partly or fully waive such payments in favor of other funding sources such as donations.
  5. Interpretation. Each state is to enforce and interpret this resolution in good faith and for the benefit of anyone that seeks any treatment.


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Last edited by Simone Republic on Fri Feb 07, 2025 3:20 am, edited 155 times in total.
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Postby Alkzine » Mon Jan 06, 2025 6:59 am

isn't this a contradiction with the previous gap resolution which, as far as i remember, bans gap's for minors ?
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Simone Republic
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Postby Simone Republic » Mon Jan 06, 2025 7:24 am

GA91 clause 6. Clause 2(d) of this proposal words around that.
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Postby Fanvm Tax » Mon Jan 06, 2025 7:27 am

Against, also I'm pretty sure this has already been covered.
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Postby Second Sovereignty » Mon Jan 06, 2025 7:31 am

Alkzine wrote:isn't this a contradiction with the previous gap resolution which, as far as i remember, bans gap's for minors ?

OOC:
If you're referring to GAR #91, that is not what it says.
A Convention on Gender wrote:6) No intersex, transgender or intergender persons of any age shall have GAPs until they are mature enough to make an informed decision regarding their own future;

While that is a potentially valid reading, it is not necessarily so, and is limited to 'GAPs' as defined in the resolution:
A Convention on Gender wrote:“Gender-adequation procedure (GAP)”: Medical procedures seeking to assign to intersex, transgender or intergender persons gender-related anatomical and/or genetic features needed to fit in a person-centered adequate gender.

This definition clearly targets surgical interventions along the lines of sex re-assignment surgery, - or, to use a term not depreciated in modernity, and which more correctly encompasses such things, gender-affirmation surgery. This draft also includes such things as hormone replacement therapy and associated, non-surgical treatment.

While GAR #91 is likely best repealed at this point - we can do better, - there is not a conflict between it and this draft at a glance.

With regards to the draft itself, Member-States should not have the ability to make determinations about 'Significant Detrimental Health Effects'; we can see in many places, (the UK makes an unfortunately easy example, of late,) exactly how easily such a standard can be used for vast amounts of harm.
Last edited by Second Sovereignty on Mon Jan 06, 2025 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:01 am

Second Sovereignty wrote:With regards to the draft itself, Member-States should not have the ability to make determinations about 'Significant Detrimental Health Effects'; we can see in many places, (the UK makes an unfortunately easy example, of late,) exactly how easily such a standard can be used for vast amounts of harm.

Agreed. Member states can even earnestly pursue good scientific information to guide medical policy and still end up with totally unscientific garbage like the Cass Review (not that I think it was meant as anything more than an intentional justification for the UK to enact regressive policies), so I don't buy the inclusion even under the good faith provision of GA#654 "The Civil Charter of the World Assembly".
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Postby The Error Onion » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:10 am

Against. If I were to state the reasons, we would be here all day reading the list. But to simplify, religious reasons and a huge lack of trust with the GAP stuff.
Last edited by The Error Onion on Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:11 am

The Error Onion wrote:Against. If I were to state the reasons, we would be here all day reading the list. But to simplify, religious reasons.

My reasons for supporting a resolution protecting affirmative care in principle are, by comparison, very simple: I prefer kids alive.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35212746/
Last edited by The Overmind on Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Error Onion » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:36 am

The Overmind wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:Against. If I were to state the reasons, we would be here all day reading the list. But to simplify, religious reasons.

My reasons for supporting a resolution protecting affirmative care in principle are, by comparison, very simple: I prefer kids alive.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35212746/

I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.
Last edited by The Error Onion on Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:39 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Second Sovereignty » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:40 am

The Error Onion wrote:[snip]

OOC:
Please save us all the time time and just say you're a fascist up front next time; you can go now.
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Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:48 am

The Error Onion wrote:
The Overmind wrote:My reasons for supporting a resolution protecting affirmative care in principle are, by comparison, very simple: I prefer kids alive.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35212746/

I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.

You're too young to entrench yourself in positions that you don't have evidence for and to reject the scientific enterprise and to other large swaths of the population because they've been introduced to you as your enemy. I work for the NIH, and scientists there do not receive funding contingent on their findings. In fact, that's not how it works pretty much anywhere that grants are involved.

More to the point, it is well-established that affirmative care saves lives and prevents the need for more invasive forms of affirmative care later in life. The same cannot be said for withholding affirmative care, the effects of which, by contrast, are permanent without such invasive forms of care later in life (and, even then, some things cannot be reversed).
Last edited by The Overmind on Mon Jan 06, 2025 9:51 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Postby Alkzine » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:00 am

The Overmind wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.

You're too young to entrench yourself in positions that you don't have evidence for and to reject the scientific enterprise and to other large swaths of the population because they've been introduced to you as your enemy. I work for the NIH, and scientists there do not receive funding contingent on their findings. In fact, that's not how it works pretty much anywhere that grants are involved.

More to the point, it is well-established that affirmative care saves lives and prevents the need for more invasive forms of affirmative care later in life. The same cannot be said for withholding affirmative care, the effects of which, by contrast, are permanent without such invasive forms of care later in life (and, even then, some things cannot be reversed).

OOC: firstly, is scientific discussion taking rwr a bit too far?

the overmind—it’s self-contradictory to attack the legitimate Cass Report as illegitimate just because it didn’t concur with what you’d want it to, and then attack others for “reject[ing] the scientific enterprise”. Cass raised legitimate concerns about puberty blockers being diagnosed to young children and the serious failings of the Tavistock in a wider sense.
/ooc.

If we’re dealing in character, Alkzine’s stance here is supportive—any move to free-at-the-point-of-use healthcare is a good one and we’d like to see this rolled out more comprehensively. The clause allowing for cost-benefit analysis is supported as nations such as the JDRA will be able to follow the science in restricting access to treatments that have limited efficacy and cause lifetime health difficulties pretty easily. Much as the UK did.
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The Overmind
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Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:15 am

Alkzine wrote:
The Overmind wrote:You're too young to entrench yourself in positions that you don't have evidence for and to reject the scientific enterprise and to other large swaths of the population because they've been introduced to you as your enemy. I work for the NIH, and scientists there do not receive funding contingent on their findings. In fact, that's not how it works pretty much anywhere that grants are involved.

More to the point, it is well-established that affirmative care saves lives and prevents the need for more invasive forms of affirmative care later in life. The same cannot be said for withholding affirmative care, the effects of which, by contrast, are permanent without such invasive forms of care later in life (and, even then, some things cannot be reversed).

OOC: firstly, is scientific discussion taking rwr a bit too far?

the overmind—it’s self-contradictory to attack the legitimate Cass Report as illegitimate just because it didn’t concur with what you’d want it to, and then attack others for “reject[ing] the scientific enterprise”. Cass raised legitimate concerns about puberty blockers being diagnosed to young children and the serious failings of the Tavistock in a wider sense.
/ooc.

If we’re dealing in character, Alkzine’s stance here is supportive—any move to free-at-the-point-of-use healthcare is a good one and we’d like to see this rolled out more comprehensively. The clause allowing for cost-benefit analysis is supported as nations such as the JDRA will be able to follow the science in restricting access to treatments that have limited efficacy and cause lifetime health difficulties pretty easily. Much as the UK did.

The Cass Review outright eschewed, by its own admission, nearly all studies performed on affirmative care and overrepresented or outright misrepresented the few that it did include. Being as my background is in general biology, neuroscience, and psychology, and that these are my job as a scientist, and as someone who has closely followed the literature about affirmative care long before the Cass Review was ordered, I will absolutely attack it as garbage. Affirmative care saves and improves lives and averts lifelong harm. That is unambiguous in the literature, including in well-controlled meta-analyses. The Cass Review was little more than a highly cherry-picked verbal analysis, and nothing about it was scientific.

P.S. weren't you just outed by moderation as someone DEATed twice for trolling (per moderation) LGBTQ+ players? Maybe you're not the best person to speak on this, hm?
Last edited by The Overmind on Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:23 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby The Error Onion » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:20 am

Second Sovereignty wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:[snip]

OOC:
Please save us all the time time and just say you're a fascist up front next time; you can go now.

OOC:
Yeah, no. I ain't a fascist. Ya'll forget fascists are racists, right? I ain't no racist. Plus, it advocates for a hierarchy like capitalism does, which I am totally against. You can call me all the names you want, but a fascist is just an old insult thrown around too loosely nowadays, look at its definition again before making assumptions. Now, a "bigot" would be more accurate. Now, this will be the last post where I talk OOC. Don't want to derail things. Back to the proposal!
The Overmind wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.

You're too young to entrench yourself in positions that you don't have evidence for and to reject the scientific enterprise and to other large swaths of the population because they've been introduced to you as your enemy. I work for the NIH, and scientists there do not receive funding contingent on their findings. In fact, that's not how it works pretty much anywhere that grants are involved.

More to the point, it is well-established that affirmative care saves lives and prevents the need for more invasive forms of affirmative care later in life. The same cannot be said for withholding affirmative care, the effects of which, by contrast, are permanent without such invasive forms of care later in life (and, even then, some things cannot be reversed).

Too young to choose religion over science? I have the right to question things, not just take everything as fact like the government wants me to! Now, for the proposal, I have another problem with it. I have to PAY for the trans care? Heck no! That was the last straw for me! I have a military to uphold, and this proposal threatens to cut a giant portion of the military spending! Plus, I am forced to legalize and pay for abortions too! My Wallet, My Choice! So I shall stand against this proposal to keep my wallet intact! Thank you very much!
Last edited by The Error Onion on Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Overmind
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Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:22 am

The Error Onion wrote:Too young to choose religion over science?

Too young, it seems, to understand that they are not mutually exclusive. I am a religious scientist.
The Error Onion wrote:I have the right to question things

I wish you would question things, instead of just dismissing them.
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Postby General TN » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:25 am

Simone Republic wrote:
[*]If a WA state is unable to provide the said treatment in that state for any reason, Choice Plus is required to provide treatment at its own facilities located in the said WA state free of charge to the end user. Choice Plus is also responsible for providing treatment at all territories administered by the WA.
[*]All treatment shall be available to anyone who requests it and who is legally competent in that WA state, or deemed legally competent by a committee of the WA. Any WA state that seeks to deny treatment to anyone on the grounds of legal competence (including not attaining the age of maturity) must positively show proof that either (I) such treatment is significantly detrimental to the inhabitant seeking such treatment (and that the harm significantly outweighs the positive benefits) or that (II) the individual requesting such treatment lacks sufficient maturity, before such treatment can be denied.
[*]Anyone who denies or impedes anyone from seeking treatment commits an offence. Anyone who compels or induces (for monetary gains or otherwise) anyone to not seek treatment commits an offence.[/list]

[*]Funding.
  1. This resolution does not govern the funding of treatment in each WA state through indirect means on its entire population, such as taxes, depending on the health care systems applicable. However, no WA state may require its health insurers (if it has such a system) from charging any co-payments or vary its premiums offered due to the insured requesting the use of the said treatment, or has a different gender identity than that at birth, or does not have a gender identity.
  2. Each WA is required to fully indemnify Choice Plus for all expenses associated with its services in that state. If Choice Plus determines that the WA state is unable to fully indemnify Choice Plus for such services due to genuine hardship, Choice Plus shall be reimbursed for its expenses through other sources, such as direct funding from the WA.

Noting this... as this nation has no funding at all to public healthcare... leaving it all to corporations... which presumably means.... this is legislating... that this government.... force corporations to administer this for free.... is what I am getting here.... I have really no care one my citizens.... and what they do... so the legality part of allowing the actual surgery is.. not a problem for me.... but the aspect of forcing it to be free.... which would for this state... imply having to raise our taxes to make a branch.... or force our corporations... to administer it for free.... is something I refuse to endorse... as I do not support.... forcing any administration on corporations... or the free market.... unless I were to pay either... for the surgery... or this Choice Plus... out of my own large pockets.... either way..... I stand against the forceful restrictions on business.... or forcing the government to fund things out of its own budget.... I stand against solely on these statements I pointed out...
(OOC: While I fully support this in every way being trans myself, due to some IC aspects of this nation in related to putting restrictions on businesses and raising taxes I have to tentatively put my stance against. In no way to I OOC push against trans surgery, as I know its important to help me and others feel better and send my best love to those who need it to gain access IRL <3)
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Corporate Police State

Postby Vastiuq » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:28 am

Against, the country should not be responsible to pay for the care. Not to mention that would piss off a lot of religious nations such as myself
Last edited by Vastiuq on Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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General TN
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Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby General TN » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:28 am

The Error Onion wrote:Too young to choose religion over science?

But which religion?.... te..he... those pesky "real world" ones... or your nations?... either way... just look at this nation... it is religious... and scientific.... so your argument... falls flat... te...he ....
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The Overmind
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Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:29 am

Vastiuq wrote:Against, the country should not be responsible to pay for the care. Not to mention that would piss off a lot of religious nations such as myself

Only specific religious nations, clearly.
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Elyreia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Elyreia » Mon Jan 06, 2025 11:00 am

The Error Onion wrote:
The Overmind wrote:My reasons for supporting a resolution protecting affirmative care in principle are, by comparison, very simple: I prefer kids alive.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35212746/

I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.


A leftist lies and my taxes increase by 0.10¢ per thousand dollars taxable income, with a net loss of $6.00 a year and the issue they said was important wasn't that important, but someone still gets help.

A rightist lies and a law is maliciously enforced resulting in the oppression or death of a vulnerable person who just wanted help living a normal life.

These two are not the same and as a former Conservative voter myself when I was younger, I will take the leftist lie over the rightist lie every time.

Because they both lie to you. Constantly. All the time. The greatest lie the right ever told you was that the left lies more.

Also, strange hill for you to die on but at least you'll be dead (influence and politically speaking; this is not a threat and should not be construed as one).
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The New Age Empire
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The New Age Empire » Mon Jan 06, 2025 11:06 am

The Error Onion wrote:
Second Sovereignty wrote:OOC:
Please save us all the time time and just say you're a fascist up front next time; you can go now.

OOC:
Yeah, no. I ain't a fascist. Ya'll forget fascists are racists, right? I ain't no racist. Plus, it advocates for a hierarchy like capitalism does, which I am totally against. You can call me all the names you want, but a fascist is just an old insult thrown around too loosely nowadays, look at its definition again before making assumptions. Now, a "bigot" would be more accurate. Now, this will be the last post where I talk OOC. Don't want to derail things. Back to the proposal!
The Overmind wrote:You're too young to entrench yourself in positions that you don't have evidence for and to reject the scientific enterprise and to other large swaths of the population because they've been introduced to you as your enemy. I work for the NIH, and scientists there do not receive funding contingent on their findings. In fact, that's not how it works pretty much anywhere that grants are involved.

More to the point, it is well-established that affirmative care saves lives and prevents the need for more invasive forms of affirmative care later in life. The same cannot be said for withholding affirmative care, the effects of which, by contrast, are permanent without such invasive forms of care later in life (and, even then, some things cannot be reversed).

Too young to choose religion over science? I have the right to question things, not just take everything as fact like the government wants me to! Now, for the proposal, I have another problem with it. I have to PAY for the trans care? Heck no! That was the last straw for me! I have a military to uphold, and this proposal threatens to cut a giant portion of the military spending! Plus, I am forced to legalize and pay for abortions too! My Wallet, My Choice! So I shall stand against this proposal to keep my wallet intact! Thank you very much!


Fascism =/= racism man this guy is a ****** almost makes me want to vote agree if this ever got approved just because of this statement, at least I don't believe in a sand nomad religion fostered by literal magicians from egypt lmaoo is every teenager on here who is religious just braindead or what??
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Alkzine
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Alkzine » Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:03 pm

The Overmind wrote:
Vastiuq wrote:Against, the country should not be responsible to pay for the care. Not to mention that would piss off a lot of religious nations such as myself

Only specific religious nations, clearly.

The Overmind has been against resolutions strongly supported by Islamic, Jewish, and Christian nations on multiple occasions; at this point, if the Dominion’s psychotic dictatorship is for something—it’s a pretty good indicator that the rest of the religious nations will be against it.
Last edited by Alkzine on Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:06 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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The Overmind
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Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 3:07 pm

Alkzine wrote:
The Overmind wrote:Only specific religious nations, clearly.

The Overmind has been against resolutions strongly supported by Islamic, Jewish, and Christian nations on multiple occasions; at this point, if the Dominion’s psychotic dictatorship is for something—it’s a pretty good indicator that the rest of the religious nations will be against it.

Every single one of my posts ever has been OOC. I stand against things that I find immoral, irrespective of their ostensible ties to religion. I ask again, are you really the right person to be commenting on this?
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The Error Onion
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Founded: Nov 20, 2022
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby The Error Onion » Mon Jan 06, 2025 4:47 pm

The New Age Empire wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:OOC:
Yeah, no. I ain't a fascist. Ya'll forget fascists are racists, right? I ain't no racist. Plus, it advocates for a hierarchy like capitalism does, which I am totally against. You can call me all the names you want, but a fascist is just an old insult thrown around too loosely nowadays, look at its definition again before making assumptions. Now, a "bigot" would be more accurate. Now, this will be the last post where I talk OOC. Don't want to derail things. Back to the proposal!

Too young to choose religion over science? I have the right to question things, not just take everything as fact like the government wants me to! Now, for the proposal, I have another problem with it. I have to PAY for the trans care? Heck no! That was the last straw for me! I have a military to uphold, and this proposal threatens to cut a giant portion of the military spending! Plus, I am forced to legalize and pay for abortions too! My Wallet, My Choice! So I shall stand against this proposal to keep my wallet intact! Thank you very much!


Fascism =/= racism man this guy is a ****** almost makes me want to vote agree if this ever got approved just because of this statement, at least I don't believe in a sand nomad religion fostered by literal magicians from egypt lmaoo is every teenager on here who is religious just braindead or what??

OOC:

Just researched what fascism was after your post. And I deeply owe an apology, although I do not expect forgiveness. I was wrong. My bad. I made a hypocritical statement for I was also assuming the way I hated how others assumed. Although, the point I ain’t a fascist still remains. Just making this clear. Glad your stance on the proposal didn’t change despite my comment. And be more creative when insulting my religion. That looks like you pulled it out of nowhere, pal. And brain dead? Well… you ain’t wrong. I was only trying to say how I stood on this resolution, and when debating with the others, I assumed wrong about your ideology because I made the mistake of judging only by what happened in the past. Maybe I should watch what I say more often. May God bless your day, good sir.


I know last post I said was the last OOC, but now I swear this is gonna be the last one!
Elyreia wrote:
The Error Onion wrote:I have seen stuff like that. But even though I am a teenager, I have already made the decision I will literally DIE with my current position. So therefore, you are talking to a fool. A self aware one. But I am sure that just maybe, just maybe, I will be right in the end. Thus, my stance on this proposal does not change. I do not trust random research institutes looking for money, and I never did. I hate capitalism, and I hate leftist lies. This proposal embodies the leftist lies, so that is my reasoning less simplified but simplified nonetheless why I will not support this proposal.

Plus, I will not believe stuff like that is the only way to prevent suicide. It ain't. I will stay with waiting until adulthood. Even if it KILLS me.


A leftist lies and my taxes increase by 0.10¢ per thousand dollars taxable income, with a net loss of $6.00 a year and the issue they said was important wasn't that important, but someone still gets help.

A rightist lies and a law is maliciously enforced resulting in the oppression or death of a vulnerable person who just wanted help living a normal life.

These two are not the same and as a former Conservative voter myself when I was younger, I will take the leftist lie over the rightist lie every time.

Because they both lie to you. Constantly. All the time. The greatest lie the right ever told you was that the left lies more.

Also, strange hill for you to die on but at least you'll be dead (influence and politically speaking; this is not a threat and should not be construed as one).

Haven’t I made it very clear I have lost all concern for the consequences of who I support if who I support supports God? No? You need to learn how far one’s faith can go. I only support the right because they seem to be the last people standing for God, not really much beyond that. In the end, I support God, nothing more truly matters to me than what the Bible says. If you don’t like it, oh well. If we lived in a world where people had to put other people before God in morals and concerns or else they would die, I would have been a dead man a long time ago. This brings me back to why I am against this resolution, religious reasons. Not saying I do not value life though, I am a big fan of no kill rule heroes for a reason. And the Bible did say “Thou Shalt Not Kill”. Just not wanting to lose good MILITARY money! I wouldn’t mind supporting other resolutions helping with GAP that didn’t include giving minors puberty blockers and taking me money. To be honest. This proposal too extreme for me.
Last edited by The Error Onion on Mon Jan 06, 2025 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Boo! I am a conservative socialist! Oooo, so scary!

Did you feel cringe? Good.

Oh, fun fact, I am a TOTAL IDIOT! Like bottom of the barrel stupid! If I ever beat you in an argument, assume your whole career is over and that you will need to take an IQ test to make sure!

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The Overmind
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Founded: Dec 12, 2022
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Overmind » Mon Jan 06, 2025 5:09 pm

The Error Onion wrote:Haven’t I made it very clear I have lost all concern for the consequences of who I support if who I support supports God? No? You need to learn how far one’s faith can go. I only support the right because they seem to be the last people standing for God, not really much beyond that. In the end, I support God, nothing more truly matters to me than what the Bible says. If you don’t like it, oh well. If we lived in a world where people had to put other people before God in morals and concerns or else they would die, I would have been a dead man a long time ago. This brings me back to why I am against this resolution, religious reasons. Not saying I do not value life though, I am a big fan of no kill rule heroes for a reason. And the Bible did say “Thou Shalt Not Kill”. Just not wanting to lose good MILITARY money! I wouldn’t mind supporting other resolutions helping with GAP that didn’t include giving minors puberty blockers and taking me money. To be honest. This proposal too extreme for me.

So vis-à-vis the legislation, you're against killing people, but not.
Last edited by The Overmind on Mon Jan 06, 2025 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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