by Russian Brotherhood » Tue Dec 03, 2024 3:17 pm
by Elyreia » Tue Dec 03, 2024 4:08 pm
by Russian Brotherhood » Tue Dec 03, 2024 4:17 pm
Elyreia wrote:I.A: You'd need to define what an "established nation" is. Using a real world analogue, the Iroquois Confederation or the Inca Empires could be considered "established nations" in their region, thus making them or their descendants exempted as Indigenious peoples.
I.B: Land Mass is a continent or other large body of land; it is not a delineated territory, which most reservations actually are. You'll need to work this definition to be more accurate.
I.C: Many speciality schools and education systems actually do not have a hard set and fast curriculum. It is erroneous to define it as something that is a requirement for teachers to teach, when it is, in fact, not. More accurately, it is a lesson plan with requirements set by the governing authority for competency and lessons learned, laid out over a year. Teachers in fact often have no control over the curriculum and instead base lesson plans to adhere to them, if they are provided one.
I.D: "Semester" is spelled wrong ("Semster"), and does not necessarily mean an exact half year (after all, summer semesters are a third semester in the year, even if optional).
I.E: "credit" is incorrect. In fact, most college courses are 5 credits for a single semester, not a single credit. Often it's based on how many classes per week for the semester - 3 credit courses meet 3 days a week, 5 credit classes have 5 classes a week, etc. Even this definition is pretty loose, as I had two 3-hour classes at night every week for a year and those classes counted as 5 credits per semester. Also, college credits is a system of American Colleges, not other colleges. UK Colleges loosely base 1 credit on 10 hours of study. I feel like this might run afoul the Real World References rule as-is with assumptions made.
I.F. "Secondary Education" only refers to Grades 9th - 12th in the US, and not if the education system used Junior and Senior High Schools like mine did, where "high school" was 10-12. In the UK, there is no "12th grade" - it's Year 7 through Year 11. Another Real World Reference to American Schooling Systems that aren't even universal in the U.S. and should be removed or defined properly.
I.G: You've defined a "heritage site" as both a location or a heritage event. A site is a physical location; I'd recommend a second definition for heritage [u]events[/i].
II.A: "Early Childhood Education" is generally recognized to end at Grade 3 if you're using the American system, or Year 2 for the UK systems. Your definitions is incorrect and also does not account for species or nations for whom growing up is shorter or longer (some species may take ten years development to reach teenage years).
II:A - II.C: More issues regarding using "grades" as a determining factor. It won't work.
III. A-B: I don't like this section at all. What if a nation has twenty thousand years of indigenous history? 7-8 weeks is acceptable to learn all of the information needed? Really? Can';t we just... leave it up for the nation to determine adequate criteria and lessons to be learned within a time scope? Pretty sure there are people in US schools who spend years getting degrees to teach about indigenous populations, not 7-8 weeks.
IV.A: The grammar here is sloppy and doesn't read well.
All in all the whole thing is a mess not suited for the WA without heavy revision, but I could see some merits if it was properly rewritten.
by Elyreia » Tue Dec 03, 2024 4:22 pm
by Attempted Socialism » Tue Dec 03, 2024 4:37 pm
Represented in the World Assembly by Ambassador Robert Mortimer Pride, called The Regicide Assume OOC unless otherwise indicated. My WA Authorship. | Cui Bono, quod seipsos custodes custodiunt? | Who am I in real life, my opinions and notes My NS career |
by Russian Brotherhood » Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:12 pm
Elyreia wrote:I.A: You'd need to define what an "established nation" is. Using a real world analogue, the Iroquois Confederation or the Inca Empires could be considered "established nations" in their region, thus making them or their descendants exempted as Indigenious peoples.
I.B: Land Mass is a continent or other large body of land; it is not a delineated territory, which most reservations actually are. You'll need to work this definition to be more accurate.
I.C: Many speciality schools and education systems actually do not have a hard set and fast curriculum. It is erroneous to define it as something that is a requirement for teachers to teach, when it is, in fact, not. More accurately, it is a lesson plan with requirements set by the governing authority for competency and lessons learned, laid out over a year. Teachers in fact often have no control over the curriculum and instead base lesson plans to adhere to them, if they are provided one.
I.D: "Semester" is spelled wrong ("Semster"), and does not necessarily mean an exact half year (after all, summer semesters are a third semester in the year, even if optional).
I.E: "credit" is incorrect. In fact, most college courses are 5 credits for a single semester, not a single credit. Often it's based on how many classes per week for the semester - 3 credit courses meet 3 days a week, 5 credit classes have 5 classes a week, etc. Even this definition is pretty loose, as I had two 3-hour classes at night every week for a year and those classes counted as 5 credits per semester. Also, these college credits defined are the American Colleges, not other colleges. UK Colleges loosely base 1 credit on 10 hours of study.
I.F. "Secondary Education" only refers to Grades 9th - 12th in the US, and not if the education system used Junior and Senior High Schools like mine did, where "high school" was 10-12. In the UK, there is no "12th grade" - it's Year 7 through Year 11, and sometimes Year 10-13 are essentially entry level university. A Real World Reference to American Schooling Systems that aren't even universal in the U.S. and should be removed or defined properly.
I.G: You've defined a "heritage site" as both a location or a heritage event. A site is a physical location; I'd recommend a second definition for heritage [u]events[/i].
II.A: "Early Childhood Education" is generally recognized to end at Grade 3 if you're using the American system, or Year 2 for the UK systems. Your definitions is incorrect and also does not account for species or nations for whom growing up is shorter or longer (some species may take ten years development to reach teenage years).
II:A - II.C: More issues regarding using "grades" as a determining factor. It won't work.
III. A-B: I don't like this section at all. What if a nation has twenty thousand years of indigenous history? 7-8 weeks is acceptable to learn all of the information needed? Really? Can't we just... leave it up for the nation to determine adequate criteria and lessons to be learned within a time scope? Pretty sure there are people in US schools who spend years getting degrees to teach about indigenous populations, not 7-8 weeks.
IV.A: The grammar here is sloppy and doesn't read well.
All in all the whole thing is a mess not suited for the WA without heavy revision, but I could see some merits if it was properly rewritten.
by Kostane » Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:19 pm
by Russian Brotherhood » Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:24 pm
Kostane wrote:This seems to be directed towards settler states, as opposed to all nations broadly. However, your definitions apply to natives in every nation. I would include something specifying that applies to indigenous people where other groups later settled.
Also, it assumes all indigenous groups had sustainable practices, which is not necessarily true. You should make it teach about indigenous practices, not necessarily selecting "sustainable" ones.
Definitions should specify that a "full year" refers to an academic period rending the entire academic schedule of a member state so that's it's more congruent with your definition of semester.
I.F looks incomplete.
by Elyreia » Tue Dec 03, 2024 7:22 pm
by Midlona » Thu Dec 05, 2024 9:32 pm
by Russian Brotherhood » Fri Dec 06, 2024 1:53 pm
Midlona wrote:Midlona opposes this resolution in principle and as applied in its draft language.
On the principle issues:
First, as the discussion indicates, what and who counts as "indigenous" is a fluid and subjective question. It is a question often infested with ideological or political considerations best left for local and regional leaders (and educational professionals) to decide and regulate. Midlona does not consider this an international issue. To the extent a majority disagree, a more workable standard would be broad commands such as "educational institutions shall provide instruction on the history of native peoples and communities to the extent deemed appropriate by educational authorities" or similar language that leaves flexibility for member-states to tailor this resolution to the disparate and varied relationships they may have with native communities and history.
Second, Midlona disagrees that there is inherent value in all "indigenous cultures and way of life and identity". Not all cultures, lifestyles, or identifies are equally valid or contain academic or intellectual merit suitable for uniform K-12 educational requirements. Why should member-states be required to teach irrelevant or unproductive material?
On the application issues:
First, not all countries have "indigenous" populations, let alone ones that reside on a reservation-style arrangement. The requirement that all students in every country visit a reservation twice a year would require the creation of reservation-style arrangements in some places. Is that advantageous? Is that an intended consequence of this resolution? Is the field trip optional and contingent on the funding?
Second, the educational requirements related to "indigenous" education would rival or exceed core academic areas, let alone related arts and electives. The testing requirements also amount to a large burden in both time and content. Schools have a finite amount of instructional and testing time, resources, and capacity. Every minute the WA forces schools to teach on "indigenous ways of life" is time not spent teaching other topics (and most other topics, like reading, home economics, science, math, or economics are much more likely to be more relevant and important to the lives, success, and welfare of students and communities).
Third, as others have pointed out, your educational timetable makes presumptions about the organization of class time, progression, and academic calendars that could frustrate implementation across the WA's jurisdiction. Midlonan primary and junior high schools operate on a quarter basis, not a semester basis, for instance.
Alternative Suggestions
First, Midlona supports incorporating native and other community groups into the educational culture of students. Midlona would be open to some encouragement or requirement of funding multi-cultural afterschool clubs, extracurricular activities, or marketing similar activities hosted by third parties or other government organizations.
Second, Midlona would be open to an expansion of protections for native students and their cultural expression in academic spaces, to the extent the author finds existing regulation on the topic lacking (GAR #234;GAR #426; and GAR #696 to name a few).
by Midlona » Fri Dec 06, 2024 3:50 pm
Russian Brotherhood wrote:No, I oppose the idea that afterschool clubs that are required I believe that they would not work so no. But I do support the funding if such groups are made by students and have an active base. I'll look into the optional after-school club for Indigenous stuff and such but I don't know if there would be a reason to have it.
Plus I put lack of Indigenous education I don't think that any of those had Indigenous education in mind.
by Russian Brotherhood » Fri Dec 06, 2024 4:12 pm
Midlona wrote:Russian Brotherhood wrote:No, I oppose the idea that afterschool clubs that are required I believe that they would not work so no. But I do support the funding if such groups are made by students and have an active base. I'll look into the optional after-school club for Indigenous stuff and such but I don't know if there would be a reason to have it.
Plus I put lack of Indigenous education I don't think that any of those had Indigenous education in mind.
I did not mean students would be required to attend or participate in the sponsored programs, merely that they would be offered and funded.
I agree there seems to be little reason to mandate "indigenous" education, hence Midlona's opposition to this resolution as it stands. Take or leave our suggestions; I was trying to find some middle ground.
by Russian Brotherhood » Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:14 pm
by Midlona » Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:25 pm
Russian Brotherhood wrote:I will leave it, if you get rid of the education there no need for a WA proposal
by Russian Brotherhood » Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:28 pm
by Russian Brotherhood » Sat Dec 07, 2024 8:06 am
by Attempted Socialism » Sat Dec 14, 2024 7:53 am
Represented in the World Assembly by Ambassador Robert Mortimer Pride, called The Regicide Assume OOC unless otherwise indicated. My WA Authorship. | Cui Bono, quod seipsos custodes custodiunt? | Who am I in real life, my opinions and notes My NS career |
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