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Mors Vincit Omnia [Fantasy-Antiquity|OOC|Open]

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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Mors Vincit Omnia [Fantasy-Antiquity|OOC|Open]

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 9:24 am


Mors Vincit Omnia

OOC Thread

An Antiquity Fantasy Roleplay







Image

“No 'scaping death” proclaims the year, that speeds
This sweet spring day.
Frosts yield to zephyrs; Summer drives out Spring,
To vanish, when
Rich Autumn sheds his fruits; round wheels the ring,—
Winter again!
Yet the swift moons repair Heaven's detriment:
We, soon as thrust
Where good Aeneas, Tullus, Ancus went,
What are we? dust.”

–Q. Horatius Flaccus





We write the year 701 from the founding of the City, the Kalendae of May, and a shock wave is passing through the civilized world. A death that is shaking the foundations of even the most powerful nations and gaining the attention of even the smallest god.
Gaius Julius Caesar, consul, dictator in perpetuity, conqueror, greatest son of Rome, died at the hands of his own people. Struck down by 60 daggers on the Ides of March he fell, betrayed by the Senate of Rome. Yet where the Senators sought to preserve their idea of Rome, they have instead torn it to pieces.
The Roman Republic and her empire have been torn apart between the Senate and the Supporters of the Republic on one side and the Followers of Caesar on the other. And in the conflict and this time of instability, others make their play. Secessionists and Opportunists abound in all corners of the Empire and beyond its borders the enemies of Rome lick their lips. Proud and ancient peoples, once brought to their knees by Roman blades, are rising up again in rebellion, seeing the light of freedom, rise up to reclaim their old realms. In Africa, sacrifices are once again made in the name of Baal, god of a destroyed city, while in Greece, the Pythia of Delphi proclaims that the freedom of the Greeks will come again. Rumors of war come from over the river frontiers, of dark magic and tribes ready to ride until death. From the largest city to the smallest farm, slaves hide weapons in the night, whispering the name of Spartacus as a prayer for freedom. Tensions between the humans and non-humans are rising, and monsters, once thought of as vanquished, appeared again to terrorize the mortals, with no heroes left to fight them.
The Mediterranean Sea runs red with blood as war comes to all that live along its shores. Will the Roman Republic persevere? Will an Empire rise from its ashes? Or will Rome find itself crushed by the barbarians in its moment of weakness? Only the Gods may know...for they are the ones moving the pieces.



Welcome to Mors Vincit Omnia, a fantasy roleplay that begins on the 1st of May 44 BC to be more specific. The Roman Republic is fractured, as the death of Caesar brought with it civil war, and it seems, the anger of the very gods among the people of the civilized world. In this roleplay, you can take control of nations, factions and characters, both in Roman lands and beyond. Whether you wish to be a Roman governor aiming for kingship, a Roman senator trying to keep the Republic together, a non-Roman rising for freedom, a barbarian tribe ready to cross the Danube, or an empire waiting near Rome's borders, the possibilities are almost endless. History, fiction, and fantasy are all mixed up in this roleplay, and humans, non-humans, demigods and gods themselves, heroes and monsters, will all fight in this ravaged world.



General Rules

  • 1. The OP reserves the right to be subjective and will have the final world in all matters.
  • 2. The Co-OP will enjoy the same prerogatives in the absence of the OP.
  • 3. All site-wide rules apply.
  • 4. No OOC writing in the IC.
  • 5. No godmodding, metagaming, or other similar actions
  • 6. No flaming, trolling, or harassment in the OOC or in the IC


Roleplay Rules

  • 1. Since this is a fantasy roleplay before all, we're not that concerned with full, historical accuracy. The overarching history of Rome, her expansion, and the actions of Julius Caesar which culminated in his assassination need to remain broadly the same for the premise to work, but we can give a lot of leeway to specific ideas. As an example, the lines of the Diadochi kings, the Seleucids, Antigonids, Antipatrids and Lysimachids which died before this time, could still have survived. Peoples which historically were in no position to rebel against Rome, like the Carthaginians, could be ready to strike. Political factions within Rome itself will likely be even more splintered than in real life. And since this is a historical fantasy, a realistic depiction of cultures and lifestyles isn't absolutely necessary - people can add things based on the rule of cool.
  • 2. Non-human races have existed alongside humanity since the Age of the Gods, but they are much smaller in numbers, even if they usually have longer lifespans. Humans are the clear majority in most of the lands of the Roman Republic, but non-humans can form the majority in some regions. Mythological beings, from all the important ancient civilizations (Roman, Greek, Egyptian, Persian), also do exist, from dryads in Greece, to Sphinxes in Egypt.
  • 3. Divine beings, and their progeny, also exist in this world. Most important human leaders tend to claim descent from a divine being - Caesar and Octavian claim descent from Venus as members of the gens Julii, Cleopatra as pharaoh is both a living deity and as a Ptolemaic ruler claims descent from many Ptolemaic gods and from the divine line of the Argeads, and so on. Actual demigods, direct children of a deity and a mortal, are also present in the world, but in smaller numbers, and usually try to hide their heritage. The Gods themselves walk the Earth from time to time, but they have to keep their powers in check while on mortal lands, since the various pantheons have not yet decided whether to intervene in mortal affairs or not.
  • 4. People can apply for nations, factions, and characters however they would like. You do not need to apply for a nation or a faction in order to play as a character, since characters can have no allegiance or they can start supporting a certain faction while in the IC. People willing to apply for factions can take part in the various political struggles within the Roman Republic, and of course, people can also apply for all three. In terms of characters, there's also no restriction on race - but the stronger the character is, the more oversight the app will receive - because we can't really have Jupiter Optimus Maximus walking around and throwing lightning bolts into cities without justification.
  • 5. Magic has similarly existed since the Age of the Gods, and in its most simple definition, it is the manipulation of the magical energy of the world, known as aether or as quintessence, to change the material world or to interact with the spiritual one. The use of magic depends on one's ability to hold and manipulate aether, which is an inherited quality. Few people, compared to the entire living population, can use magic, and even fewer can use it easily. Non-human races like the Elves are much more naturally attuned to the use of aether, but humans have pushed the use of magic forward through their developments of spells. Generally speaking, most people believe that being able to use magic is a gift from the Gods - and magic can be used and within certain limits also be bestowed by deities.
  • 6. The reservation form only needs to be used by those applying for nations or by those applying for factions which have control over a certain territory. The map is an estimation and may not be constantly updated, make sure to also check the list and do a cursory search of the OOC before reserving.


Nation Application

Code: Select all
[align=center][size=150][u]Nation Application[/u][/size][/align]
[b](You should read the OP completely prior to filling this out)
(Fill it out as requested.)
(Erase all words in rounded brackets before posting the app)[/b]

[b]Nation Name:[/b]

[b]National Symbols:[/b]

[b]Capital:[/b]

[b]Territory:[/b]

[b]Form of Government:[/b]

[b]Head of State:[/b]

[b]Population:[/b]

[b]Population Description:[/b]

[b]Religion:[/b]

[b]Patron Deity:[/b]

[b]Magic Description:[/b]

[b]Military Description:[/b]

[b]Goals:[/b]


[b]History:[/b]

#ODQHVVF (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)



Faction Application

Code: Select all
[align=center][size=150][u]Organization Application[/u][/size][/align]
[b](You should read the OP completely prior to filling this out)
(Fill it out as requested.)
(Erase all words in rounded brackets before posting the app)[/b]

[b]Full Name:[/b]

[b]Symbols:[/b]

[b]Base of Operations:[/b]

[b]Territory:[/b] (if it controls any)

[b]Form of Organization:[/b]

[b]Leader:[/b]

[b]Ideology:[/b]

[b]Member Numbers:[/b]

[b]Magic Description:[/b] (if applicable)

[b]Military Description:[/b] (if applicable)

[b]Goals:[/b]


[b]History:[/b]
 
#ODQHVVF (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)



Character Application

Code: Select all
[align=center][size=150][u]Character Application[/u][/size][/align]
[b](You should read the OP completely prior to filling this out)
(Fill it out as requested.)
(Erase all words in rounded brackets before posting the app)[/b]

[b]Name:[/b]
[b]Age:[/b]
[b]Gender:[/b]
[b]Race:[/b]
[b]Bloodline:[/b]
[b]Appearance:[/b]
[b]Position/Status/Affiliation:[/b]
[b]Skills/Powers//Magic:[/b]
[b]Personality:[/b]
[b]Biography:[/b]
[b]Goals:[/b]
 
#ODQHVVF (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)



Reservations

Code: Select all
[align=middle][size=140][u]Reservation[/u][/size][/align]
[b]Nation Name:[/b]
[b]Territory:[/b]
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.
Last edited by Tracian Empire on Fri May 31, 2024 12:29 pm, edited 11 times in total.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 9:25 am

Last edited by Tracian Empire on Fri May 31, 2024 12:40 pm, edited 10 times in total.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 9:29 am

Reservation

Nation Name: Kingdom of the Seleucids (Βασιλεία τῶν Σελευκιδῶν - Basileía tōn Seleukidōn)/Βασίλειον της Συρίας (Basileion tēs Syrias):
Territory: Syria, Coele-Syria, Cilicia, parts of Mesopotamia
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Remnants of Exilvania
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Posts: 11235
Founded: Mar 29, 2015
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Postby Remnants of Exilvania » Sat May 18, 2024 9:37 am

Reservation

Nation Name: Germanic Confederation
Territory: Southern Germany and Bohemia
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.
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REST IN PEACE HERZOG FRIEDRICH VON WÜRTTEMBERG! † 9. May 2018
Furchtlos und Treu dem Hause Württemberg für alle Ewigkeit!

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Orostan
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Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sat May 18, 2024 10:29 am

Reservation

Nation Name: Res publica Romana
Territory: Historical late Roman Republic
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

If multiple people want to play as different Romans I am willing to work with them. I'd like to claim Marc Antony though.
Last edited by Orostan on Sat May 18, 2024 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
Z

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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 10:50 am

Orostan wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: Res publica Romana
Territory: Historical late Roman Republic
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

If multiple people want to play as different Romans I am willing to work with them. I'd like to claim Marc Antony though.

Yeah, since the Roman Republic would theoretically encompass most of the map around the world, the intention is for it to be divided between multiple claimants and factions, particularly since the conflict between the various political factions (most importantly the Senate and the Liberatores to begin with), would be a focal point of the RP.

If you want Mark Antony that works well, you should probably also choose a specific area of the Republic where his power base would lie, or you could instead just claim Mark Antony and a faction of his loyalists and have them gain a power base in the IC.

Historically, Mark Antony got Gaul and Cisalipine Gaul in 43 BC with the Second Triumvirate, and while that's still a year in the future, you could make it so that he establishes his power base there earlier. Alternatively, you could make it so that Mark Antony is in de facto control of the Senate and of Italy.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Rygondria
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6441
Founded: Nov 12, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Rygondria » Sat May 18, 2024 11:08 am

Reservation

Nation Name: The Okganit Kingdom, Also known as the Okganit Horde to the Orcish people, but to the romans the area is still called Scythia
Territory: Scythia and Crimea, including the former greek colonies with a border on Thrace
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

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Sao Nova Europa
Minister
 
Posts: 3493
Founded: Apr 20, 2019
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Sao Nova Europa » Sat May 18, 2024 11:25 am

Reservation

Nation Name: India (still debating name + concept)
Territory: Southern and Central India
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.
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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 11:35 am

Rygondria wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: The Okganit Kingdom, Also known as the Okganit Horde to the Orcish people, but to the romans the area is still called Scythia
Territory: Scythia and Crimea, including the former greek colonies with a border on Thrace
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Reservation accepted! But I really want to see a WIP app from you relatively soon.

Sao Nova Europa wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: India (still debating name + concept)
Territory: Southern and Central India
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Accepted!
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Reverend Norv
Senator
 
Posts: 3871
Founded: Jun 20, 2014
New York Times Democracy

Postby Reverend Norv » Sat May 18, 2024 11:36 am

If divine beings are real, then there could scarcely be a more interesting option in this world than Judaism in the first century BC.

Reservation

Nation Name: The Hasmonean Kingdom (Kingdom of Israel, Kingdom of Judea)
Territory: Palestine (including Samaria), southern Phoenecia as far as the Litani River, and the former Nabatean Kingdom (Sinai, Dumatha, Petra, etc.) Basically, the kingdom's firm boundaries are the Isthmus of Suez (with Egypt) and an east-west line roughly following the line of the Litani (with the Seleucids). To the east and south, the kingdom just kind of gradually dissolves into the vast deserts of Arabia.
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)
For really, I think that the poorest he that is in England hath a life to live as the greatest he. And therefore truly, Sir, I think it's clear that every man that is to live under a Government ought first by his own consent to put himself under that Government. And I do think that the poorest man in England is not at all bound in a strict sense to that Government that he hath not had a voice to put himself under.
Col. Thomas Rainsborough, Putney Debates, 1647

A God who let us prove His existence would be an idol.
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Reverend Norv
Senator
 
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Founded: Jun 20, 2014
New York Times Democracy

Postby Reverend Norv » Sat May 18, 2024 11:46 am

Alternatively, I would also be happy to take up the hardline Senatorial/Republican faction in Rome: an uneasy coalition of Cato, Brutus, and Cicero that agrees on little except the need to break from the last century of civil war and military coups. They would have to confront both their internal divisions - what is the role of the New Men? How much compromise with the plebeians can be allowed before the soul of the Republic is lost? - and the perpetual challenge of civilian leaders in a time of military crisis: how do you convince the average soldier to feel more loyalty to the Roman constitution than to his own general?
For really, I think that the poorest he that is in England hath a life to live as the greatest he. And therefore truly, Sir, I think it's clear that every man that is to live under a Government ought first by his own consent to put himself under that Government. And I do think that the poorest man in England is not at all bound in a strict sense to that Government that he hath not had a voice to put himself under.
Col. Thomas Rainsborough, Putney Debates, 1647

A God who let us prove His existence would be an idol.
Dietrich Bonhoeffer

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Ovstylap
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Founded: Jun 26, 2018
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Postby Ovstylap » Sat May 18, 2024 11:57 am

Now this looks set to attract many of the finest of P2TM. I for one shall lurk and ponder and regret not finishing my academic work sooner (next two weeks are intense for me), but I may look at how things develop to see where I might fit in. I won't make a reservation although I am indeed very interested in this! I shall certainly join the discord as and when it arises.

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Rygondria
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6441
Founded: Nov 12, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Rygondria » Sat May 18, 2024 11:58 am

Tracian Empire wrote:
Rygondria wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: The Okganit Kingdom, Also known as the Okganit Horde to the Orcish people, but to the romans the area is still called Scythia
Territory: Scythia and Crimea, including the former greek colonies with a border on Thrace
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Reservation accepted! But I really want to see a WIP app from you relatively soon.

Sao Nova Europa wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: India (still debating name + concept)
Territory: Southern and Central India
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Accepted!

Fair enough. With the Orcs i am aiming to basically have them be in a rather odd...transition phase between nomadism and a proper sedentary empire, especially with the seizure of the Bosphorian Kingdom and Crimea. Yet the Warchief/King seems also poised to make a move into Thracia and maybe even Greece while the romans are distracted.

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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6786
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sat May 18, 2024 12:12 pm

Tracian Empire wrote:
Orostan wrote:
Reservation

Nation Name: Res publica Romana
Territory: Historical late Roman Republic
#ODQHVVF (Do not delete this, it is used to keep track of the apps)

*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

If multiple people want to play as different Romans I am willing to work with them. I'd like to claim Marc Antony though.

Yeah, since the Roman Republic would theoretically encompass most of the map around the world, the intention is for it to be divided between multiple claimants and factions, particularly since the conflict between the various political factions (most importantly the Senate and the Liberatores to begin with), would be a focal point of the RP.

If you want Mark Antony that works well, you should probably also choose a specific area of the Republic where his power base would lie, or you could instead just claim Mark Antony and a faction of his loyalists and have them gain a power base in the IC.

Historically, Mark Antony got Gaul and Cisalipine Gaul in 43 BC with the Second Triumvirate, and while that's still a year in the future, you could make it so that he establishes his power base there earlier. Alternatively, you could make it so that Mark Antony is in de facto control of the Senate and of Italy.

The war against Caesar's assassins is going to change that immediately but in the long term I'd like most of the eastern Roman provinces and Egypt so I can properly play as Antony in the fight against Octavian.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
Z

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Tracian Empire
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 12:13 pm

Reverend Norv wrote:Alternatively, I would also be happy to take up the hardline Senatorial/Republican faction in Rome: an uneasy coalition of Cato, Brutus, and Cicero that agrees on little except the need to break from the last century of civil war and military coups. They would have to confront both their internal divisions - what is the role of the New Men? How much compromise with the plebeians can be allowed before the soul of the Republic is lost? - and the perpetual challenge of civilian leaders in a time of military crisis: how do you convince the average soldier to feel more loyalty to the Roman constitution than to his own general?

Hmm, this is a difficult choice. But options are admittedly interesting.

The Hasmoneans are in a very interesting position, having been influenced by the Roman civil war and having even been briefly autonomous or independent with Parthian support if memory serves me right, and they would also be clearly in the very tense of position of being bordered by a Ptolemaic Egypt with Cleopatra's great ambitions, and by a revival of the Seleucids to their north.

Obviously Rome and the civil war is also in a very complicated position, and we already have a potential Mark Antony to oppose this hardline Republican faction.

I'd say that you should go with whatever option you personally like most - later on, depending on many players we have, I'll be more than willing to relax the rules and allow people to play both a nation and a faction.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6786
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sat May 18, 2024 12:15 pm

Reverend Norv wrote:Alternatively, I would also be happy to take up the hardline Senatorial/Republican faction in Rome: an uneasy coalition of Cato, Brutus, and Cicero that agrees on little except the need to break from the last century of civil war and military coups. They would have to confront both their internal divisions - what is the role of the New Men? How much compromise with the plebeians can be allowed before the soul of the Republic is lost? - and the perpetual challenge of civilian leaders in a time of military crisis: how do you convince the average soldier to feel more loyalty to the Roman constitution than to his own general?

This sounds fun but Cicero and Brutus are a bit short lived and Cato the younger is already dead. If you want to be a senatorial hold out why don't you play as the Roman senate itself rather than any specific player? That way you can conspire against or with every Roman player.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
Z

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Lunas Legion
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31207
Founded: Jan 21, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Lunas Legion » Sat May 18, 2024 12:16 pm

Orostan wrote:
Reverend Norv wrote:Alternatively, I would also be happy to take up the hardline Senatorial/Republican faction in Rome: an uneasy coalition of Cato, Brutus, and Cicero that agrees on little except the need to break from the last century of civil war and military coups. They would have to confront both their internal divisions - what is the role of the New Men? How much compromise with the plebeians can be allowed before the soul of the Republic is lost? - and the perpetual challenge of civilian leaders in a time of military crisis: how do you convince the average soldier to feel more loyalty to the Roman constitution than to his own general?

This sounds fun but Cicero and Brutus are a bit short lived and Cato the younger is already dead. If you want to be a senatorial hold out why don't you play as the Roman senate itself rather than any specific player? That way you can conspire against or with every Roman player.


You are assuming that Brutus and Cicero will both die when they did IRL, which might not be the case here.
Last edited by William Slim Wed Dec 14 1970 10:35 pm, edited 35 times in total.

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Reverend Norv
Senator
 
Posts: 3871
Founded: Jun 20, 2014
New York Times Democracy

Postby Reverend Norv » Sat May 18, 2024 12:17 pm

Lunas Legion wrote:
Orostan wrote:This sounds fun but Cicero and Brutus are a bit short lived and Cato the younger is already dead. If you want to be a senatorial hold out why don't you play as the Roman senate itself rather than any specific player? That way you can conspire against or with every Roman player.


You are assuming that Brutus and Cicero will both die when they did IRL, which might not be the case here.


Exactly. The OP tells us that the events that led us to this point are open to considerable modification.
For really, I think that the poorest he that is in England hath a life to live as the greatest he. And therefore truly, Sir, I think it's clear that every man that is to live under a Government ought first by his own consent to put himself under that Government. And I do think that the poorest man in England is not at all bound in a strict sense to that Government that he hath not had a voice to put himself under.
Col. Thomas Rainsborough, Putney Debates, 1647

A God who let us prove His existence would be an idol.
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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 12:20 pm

Orostan wrote:
Tracian Empire wrote:Yeah, since the Roman Republic would theoretically encompass most of the map around the world, the intention is for it to be divided between multiple claimants and factions, particularly since the conflict between the various political factions (most importantly the Senate and the Liberatores to begin with), would be a focal point of the RP.

If you want Mark Antony that works well, you should probably also choose a specific area of the Republic where his power base would lie, or you could instead just claim Mark Antony and a faction of his loyalists and have them gain a power base in the IC.

Historically, Mark Antony got Gaul and Cisalipine Gaul in 43 BC with the Second Triumvirate, and while that's still a year in the future, you could make it so that he establishes his power base there earlier. Alternatively, you could make it so that Mark Antony is in de facto control of the Senate and of Italy.

The war against Caesar's assassins is going to change that immediately but in the long term I'd like most of the eastern Roman provinces and Egypt so I can properly play as Antony in the fight against Octavian.

As of right now, historically speaking, Brutus and Cassius had most of the Roman East, but you can certainly change the history to make it so that Mark Antony has its power base there if that's what you want. Greece and Western Anatolia would be free (Roman Provinces of Asia and Bithynia), although Greece itself would probably be on the verge of revolt. Cilicia and Syria are taken by the Seleucids, who would have been a small Roman client state in Antioch before having revolted and having expanded.

Egypt I feel should still be its own thing, but Antony could certainly start courting Cleopatra like he did in real life eventually.

Other than that, like Lunas says, from the start of the RP - everything is possible, so the defeat of the Liberatores is not set in stone, so Mark Antony might have to face them instead of Octavian.

And yes, events can be changed, so Cato's could have avoided suicide.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Reverend Norv
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Posts: 3871
Founded: Jun 20, 2014
New York Times Democracy

Postby Reverend Norv » Sat May 18, 2024 12:29 pm

Tracian Empire wrote:
Reverend Norv wrote:Alternatively, I would also be happy to take up the hardline Senatorial/Republican faction in Rome: an uneasy coalition of Cato, Brutus, and Cicero that agrees on little except the need to break from the last century of civil war and military coups. They would have to confront both their internal divisions - what is the role of the New Men? How much compromise with the plebeians can be allowed before the soul of the Republic is lost? - and the perpetual challenge of civilian leaders in a time of military crisis: how do you convince the average soldier to feel more loyalty to the Roman constitution than to his own general?

Hmm, this is a difficult choice. But options are admittedly interesting.

The Hasmoneans are in a very interesting position, having been influenced by the Roman civil war and having even been briefly autonomous or independent with Parthian support if memory serves me right, and they would also be clearly in the very tense of position of being bordered by a Ptolemaic Egypt with Cleopatra's great ambitions, and by a revival of the Seleucids to their north.

Obviously Rome and the civil war is also in a very complicated position, and we already have a potential Mark Antony to oppose this hardline Republican faction.

I'd say that you should go with whatever option you personally like most - later on, depending on many players we have, I'll be more than willing to relax the rules and allow people to play both a nation and a faction.


Thanks - I will ponder it. My idea for the Hasmonaeans leans on them having been independent ever since the Maccabean Revolt, rather than having regained independence amid Rome's civil wars - but I think that can be justified. This being Judaea, perhaps the Hasmonean Civil War ended before Pompey could intervene, thanks to literal divine intervention on behalf of the rightful king and high priest, Hyrcanus. Because the war is nipped in the bud, Pompey never takes Jerusalem, and the Hasmonaeans remain Roman allies rather than Roman puppets. Or something like that; there are a lot of explanations for why the Hasmonaean situation in 44 BC would be more like that of Cleopatra than like that of Herod.

On the other hand, the Senatorial faction is emphatically an interesting possibility. However, I would want to feel very comfortable telling a collaborative story with the players for the other Roman factions. There are strong pressures in this context to focus on "winning," rather than telling the best possible story; and before I jump in, I'd want to be sure that we are all committed to avoiding that dynamic.
For really, I think that the poorest he that is in England hath a life to live as the greatest he. And therefore truly, Sir, I think it's clear that every man that is to live under a Government ought first by his own consent to put himself under that Government. And I do think that the poorest man in England is not at all bound in a strict sense to that Government that he hath not had a voice to put himself under.
Col. Thomas Rainsborough, Putney Debates, 1647

A God who let us prove His existence would be an idol.
Dietrich Bonhoeffer

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Orostan
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Posts: 6786
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sat May 18, 2024 12:29 pm

Organization Application


Full Name: Populares (Marcus Antonius)

Symbols: SPQR

Base of Operations: Rome

Territory: Roman provinces east of Dalmatia.

Form of Organization: Roman political faction

Leader: Marcus Antonius

Ideology: Caesarian populism and economic reform

Member Numbers: 180,000 Roman legionaries, allies including Ptolemaic Egypt, Armenia, and supportive Roman client states.

Magic Description: Traditional Roman magic as well as Greek, Syrian, and Anatolian magic.

Military Description: Traditional Roman military organization not separate from their Roman state.

Goals:

-Restoration of Roman Republic under the control of Marcus Antonius and allies.
-Avenge the Battle of Carrhae and campaign against Persian Empire.
-Complete Caesarian economic and political reform program.
History:

Historical up to the death of Julius Caesar. Changes after that WIP with other potential Roman players.

#ODQHVVF (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)
Last edited by Orostan on Sat May 18, 2024 2:18 pm, edited 3 times in total.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

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Lunas Legion
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Posts: 31207
Founded: Jan 21, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Lunas Legion » Sat May 18, 2024 12:31 pm

Reverend Norv wrote:
Tracian Empire wrote:Hmm, this is a difficult choice. But options are admittedly interesting.

The Hasmoneans are in a very interesting position, having been influenced by the Roman civil war and having even been briefly autonomous or independent with Parthian support if memory serves me right, and they would also be clearly in the very tense of position of being bordered by a Ptolemaic Egypt with Cleopatra's great ambitions, and by a revival of the Seleucids to their north.

Obviously Rome and the civil war is also in a very complicated position, and we already have a potential Mark Antony to oppose this hardline Republican faction.

I'd say that you should go with whatever option you personally like most - later on, depending on many players we have, I'll be more than willing to relax the rules and allow people to play both a nation and a faction.


Thanks - I will ponder it. My idea for the Hasmonaeans leans on them having been independent ever since the Maccabean Revolt, rather than having regained independence amid Rome's civil wars - but I think that can be justified. This being Judaea, perhaps the Hasmonean Civil War ended before Pompey could intervene, thanks to literal divine intervention on behalf of the rightful king and high priest, Hyrcanus. Because the war is nipped in the bud, Pompey never takes Jerusalem, and the Hasmonaeans remain Roman allies rather than Roman puppets. Or something like that; there are a lot of explanations for why the Hasmonaean situation in 44 BC would be more like that of Cleopatra than like that of Herod.

On the other hand, the Senatorial faction is emphatically an interesting possibility. However, I would want to feel very comfortable telling a collaborative story with the players for the other Roman factions. There are strong pressures in this context to focus on "winning," rather than telling the best possible story; and before I jump in, I'd want to be sure that we are all committed to avoiding that dynamic.


I was debating taking Sextus Pompey, so I would very much be up for avoiding the win at all costs dynamic.
Last edited by William Slim Wed Dec 14 1970 10:35 pm, edited 35 times in total.

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Tracian Empire
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Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 12:35 pm

Reverend Norv wrote:
Tracian Empire wrote:Hmm, this is a difficult choice. But options are admittedly interesting.

The Hasmoneans are in a very interesting position, having been influenced by the Roman civil war and having even been briefly autonomous or independent with Parthian support if memory serves me right, and they would also be clearly in the very tense of position of being bordered by a Ptolemaic Egypt with Cleopatra's great ambitions, and by a revival of the Seleucids to their north.

Obviously Rome and the civil war is also in a very complicated position, and we already have a potential Mark Antony to oppose this hardline Republican faction.

I'd say that you should go with whatever option you personally like most - later on, depending on many players we have, I'll be more than willing to relax the rules and allow people to play both a nation and a faction.


Thanks - I will ponder it. My idea for the Hasmonaeans leans on them having been independent ever since the Maccabean Revolt, rather than having regained independence amid Rome's civil wars - but I think that can be justified. This being Judaea, perhaps the Hasmonean Civil War ended before Pompey could intervene, thanks to literal divine intervention on behalf of the rightful king and high priest, Hyrcanus. Because the war is nipped in the bud, Pompey never takes Jerusalem, and the Hasmonaeans remain Roman allies rather than Roman puppets. Or something like that; there are a lot of explanations for why the Hasmonaean situation in 44 BC would be more like that of Cleopatra than like that of Herod.

On the other hand, the Senatorial faction is emphatically an interesting possibility. However, I would want to feel very comfortable telling a collaborative story with the players for the other Roman factions. There are strong pressures in this context to focus on "winning," rather than telling the best possible story; and before I jump in, I'd want to be sure that we are all committed to avoiding that dynamic.

They certainly could have been independent since the Maccabean Revolut, the history can be changed to suit what you want, as long as it's properly explained.

As for the internal Roman affairs, I'm very much also in favor of focusing on the story. That's part of why I chose the name of the RP to begin with - like obviously, not to downplay the titanic struggle for power going on all across the civilized world - but in the end, it's death that always wins.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6786
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sat May 18, 2024 12:36 pm

Tracian Empire wrote:
Orostan wrote:The war against Caesar's assassins is going to change that immediately but in the long term I'd like most of the eastern Roman provinces and Egypt so I can properly play as Antony in the fight against Octavian.

As of right now, historically speaking, Brutus and Cassius had most of the Roman East, but you can certainly change the history to make it so that Mark Antony has its power base there if that's what you want. Greece and Western Anatolia would be free (Roman Provinces of Asia and Bithynia), although Greece itself would probably be on the verge of revolt. Cilicia and Syria are taken by the Seleucids, who would have been a small Roman client state in Antioch before having revolted and having expanded.

Egypt I feel should still be its own thing, but Antony could certainly start courting Cleopatra like he did in real life eventually.

Other than that, like Lunas says, from the start of the RP - everything is possible, so the defeat of the Liberatores is not set in stone, so Mark Antony might have to face them instead of Octavian.

And yes, events can be changed, so Cato's could have avoided suicide.

If we are going to alter history a great deal than I can set up a civil war with any other Roman players or work out a plan to do it myself and involve other non-Roman players as much as I practically can.

Reverend Norv wrote:
Tracian Empire wrote:Hmm, this is a difficult choice. But options are admittedly interesting.

The Hasmoneans are in a very interesting position, having been influenced by the Roman civil war and having even been briefly autonomous or independent with Parthian support if memory serves me right, and they would also be clearly in the very tense of position of being bordered by a Ptolemaic Egypt with Cleopatra's great ambitions, and by a revival of the Seleucids to their north.

Obviously Rome and the civil war is also in a very complicated position, and we already have a potential Mark Antony to oppose this hardline Republican faction.

I'd say that you should go with whatever option you personally like most - later on, depending on many players we have, I'll be more than willing to relax the rules and allow people to play both a nation and a faction.


Thanks - I will ponder it. My idea for the Hasmonaeans leans on them having been independent ever since the Maccabean Revolt, rather than having regained independence amid Rome's civil wars - but I think that can be justified. This being Judaea, perhaps the Hasmonean Civil War ended before Pompey could intervene, thanks to literal divine intervention on behalf of the rightful king and high priest, Hyrcanus. Because the war is nipped in the bud, Pompey never takes Jerusalem, and the Hasmonaeans remain Roman allies rather than Roman puppets. Or something like that; there are a lot of explanations for why the Hasmonaean situation in 44 BC would be more like that of Cleopatra than like that of Herod.

On the other hand, the Senatorial faction is emphatically an interesting possibility. However, I would want to feel very comfortable telling a collaborative story with the players for the other Roman factions. There are strong pressures in this context to focus on "winning," rather than telling the best possible story; and before I jump in, I'd want to be sure that we are all committed to avoiding that dynamic.

The problem is that a civil war necessarily means knocking people out of the game or marginalizing them, which is why I suggested that you play as the senate itself rather than a specific faction. That means that neither of us would have to be knocked out at any point and both of us could contribute something different to the game.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
Z

User avatar
Tracian Empire
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27021
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tracian Empire » Sat May 18, 2024 12:38 pm

Orostan wrote:
Nation Application


Nation Name: Res publica Romana

National Symbols: SPQR

Capital: Rome

Territory: Historical 44 BC Roman Republic, to be updated with changes due to historical circumstance.

Organization Application


Full Name: Populares (Marcus Antonius)

Symbols: Not Applicable

Base of Operations: Rome

Territory: Not applicable

Form of Organization: Roman political faction

Leader: Marcus Antonius

Ideology: Caesarian populism and economic reform

Member Numbers: Not really applicable

Magic Description: Traditional Roman magic as well as Gallic druidic magic.

Military Description: Traditional Roman military organization not separate from the Roman state.

Goals:

-Restoration of Roman Republic under the control of Marcus Antonius and allies.
-Avenge the Battle of Carrhae and campaign against Persian Empire.
-Complete Caesarian economic and political reform program.
History:

Historical up to the death of Julius Caesar. Changes after that WIP.

#ODQHVVF (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)

Like I said to your initial reservation, you can't claim all of the Roman Republic as a single nation. So in that case I'd recommend just keeping the faction app.

Other than that, I'd recommend discussing the initial situation in Rome with the other interested players - because while the broad outlook of the Caesarians could be the same as IRL, including Mark Antony's career, there's certainly going to be some changes introduced by the others.
I'm a Romanian, a vampire, an anime enthusiast and a roleplayer.
Hello there! I am Tracian Empire! You can call me Tracian, Thrace, Thracian, Thracr, Thracc or whatever you want. Really.

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