Libertarianism: how did the term get co-opted?

[Western Theram]

originally this was to be about capitalist thought specifically as the term actually originated from socialist theorists. A number of right “libertarians” hold self-interventionist rightwing government views. For example: banning abortion and being readily influenced by religion and tradition. People will label themselves paleolibertarian which seems like a contradiction as paleoconservatives want the government to be stronger and hold a tighter grip and eye on its citizens in the name of tradition and safety. This contradicts the ideals of small government.

How did the term go from anti-authoritarian socialists to ultra traditional conservative capitalism?
Im the son of a capitalist libertarian and he’s told me that he’s not one for “this kind of capitalism” and has some pretty liberal social views. He’s even read some Chomsky and other leftist writers. it’s not the capitalist part that I feel betrays the term as much but the odd tie to right-wing social politics

[Port Carverton]

originally this was to be about capitalist thought specifically as the term actually originated from socialist theorists. A number of right “libertarians” hold self-interventionist rightwing government views. For example: banning abortion and being readily influenced by religion and tradition. People will label themselves paleolibertarian which seems like a contradiction as paleoconservatives want the government to be stronger and hold a tighter grip and eye on its citizens in the name of tradition and safety. This contradicts the ideals of small government.

How did the term go from anti-authoritarian socialists to ultra traditional conservative capitalism?
Im the son of a capitalist libertarian and he’s told me that he’s not one for “this kind of capitalism” and has some pretty liberal social views. He’s even read some Chomsky and other leftist writers. it’s not the capitalist part that I feel betrays the term as much but the odd tie to right-wing social politics

Social liberals are to blame. They monopolized the term 'liberal' in the United States, leaving other kinds of liberals without a term to define themselves until they found 'libertarianism'.

[Tangatarehua]

I blame FDR.

He tried to rebrand social democracy as "modern liberalism" which meant that actual liberals needed to rebrand themselves as "libertarians" to differentiate thenselves from both conservatives and social democrats.

[Western Theram]

I blame FDR.

He tried to rebrand social democracy as "modern liberalism" which meant that actual liberals needed to rebrand themselves as "libertarians" to differentiate thenselves from both conservatives and social democrats.

Did he really have a choice in a country with only two parties? I mean I’m sure he would’ve been part of a social Democratic Party if he had the option. But what happened to all the left libertarians? It seems like they just went *poof* and they’re gone.
I blame conservative talk shows. From the radio 80’s and 90’s to now with podcasts like joe Rogan or Alex Jones. They’ll have so called libertarian guests but it’s really just to push their culture war narrative by saying that the “woke left” has become oppressive by implementing public services and how its damaging the nation’s economy because now libertarians are market fetishists

[Valles Marineris Mining co]

Libertarianism is a very broad ideology. Libertarians can be conservative, progressive, capitalist, socialist, etc.

[Western Theram]

Libertarianism is a very broad ideology. Libertarians can be conservative, progressive, capitalist, socialist, etc.

It’s about small government. intervening in your citizens lives, violating their privacy and deciding if they’re worthy enough to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or arresting them for drug use/possession is not small government no matter how you slice it. I get where regular capitalist libertarians come from but I don’t get the conservative part as that actively takes part in interfering with your citizens to suit traditional values which libertarians were originally trying to let go of

[Ifreann]

originally this was to be about capitalist thought specifically as the term actually originated from socialist theorists. A number of right “libertarians” hold self-interventionist rightwing government views. For example: banning abortion and being readily influenced by religion and tradition. People will label themselves paleolibertarian which seems like a contradiction as paleoconservatives want the government to be stronger and hold a tighter grip and eye on its citizens in the name of tradition and safety. This contradicts the ideals of small government.

How did the term go from anti-authoritarian socialists to ultra traditional conservative capitalism?
Im the son of a capitalist libertarian and he’s told me that he’s not one for “this kind of capitalism” and has some pretty liberal social views. He’s even read some Chomsky and other leftist writers. it’s not the capitalist part that I feel betrays the term as much but the odd tie to right-wing social politics

Murray Rothbard stole the term from the left because it sounds freedomy.

[Glorious Freedonia]

Libertarianism is a very broad ideology. Libertarians can be conservative, progressive, capitalist, socialist, etc.

It’s about small government. intervening in your citizens lives, violating their privacy and deciding if they’re worthy enough to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or arresting them for drug use/possession is not small government no matter how you slice it. I get where regular capitalist libertarians come from but I don’t get the conservative part as that actively takes part in interfering with your citizens to suit traditional values which libertarians were originally trying to let go of

Conservatism is about seeking a reasonably small government. Libertarianism is conservatism. Everything else is not conservatism, it is liberalism.

[Libertarian Negev]

There are plenty of Libertarians that don’t have Right-Wing social views but some who do. The reason I think that “Paleolibertarians” are so prevalent in the USA is because the GOP constantly talks about “limited government” yet does the exact opposite and those Conservatives that actually believe in limited government end up being attracted to Libertarian ideas.

[Glorious Freedonia]

There are plenty of Libertarians that don’t have Right-Wing social views but some who do. The reason I think that “Paleolibertarians” are so prevalent in the USA is because the GOP constantly talks about “limited government” yet does the exact opposite and those Conservatives that actually believe in limited government end up being attracted to Libertarian ideas.

You are right. The GOP are liberals who falsely claim to be seeking smaller government. Although they may sometimes use libertarian speech, their emphasis is on more affordable government and not more liberty.

Libertarianism is the conservative use of governmental power because government power comes at the expense of liberty in a zero sum game. Liberalism seeks the liberal use of government power to make the world a better place and this is always at the expense of liberty. To me liberalism is synonymous with conservatism. I am a conservative because I am a libertarian. However, all libertarians will draw the line a bit differently of what size of governmental power is appropriate. I think an added bonus to small government is that it is less expensive but if you love the cost savings and like extra freedom you are in line with the GOP and if you love freedom and like the cost savings then you are a libertarian.

[Phobos Drilling and Manufacturing]

Libertarianism is a very broad ideology. Libertarians can be conservative, progressive, capitalist, socialist, etc.

It’s about small government. intervening in your citizens lives, violating their privacy and deciding if they’re worthy enough to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or arresting them for drug use/possession is not small government no matter how you slice it. I get where regular capitalist libertarians come from but I don’t get the conservative part as that actively takes part in interfering with your citizens to suit traditional values which libertarians were originally trying to let go of

Culturally conservative libertarians want their conservative cultural worldviews to be recommended and highly suggested, but not enforced. In a conservative libertarian society conformity would not be enforced by the govt but enforced by social pressures of the citizens.

I would describe myself as a centrist libertarian. Welfare is needed but should be highly streamlined and simplified. I think there should be elements of capitalism with elements of Georgism, where people should be taxed on land that they refuse to use or build anything on. Also I think workplace democracies would be ideal where the workers should be allowed to vote in their CEO/Boss. Law enforcement should be reduced and surveillance should be abolished. Also drugs such as weed or shrooms should be legalized. Also border enforcement is stupid, borders aren’t real.

[Galmat]

It's because most modern-day "Libertarians" have a very surface understanding of freedom and liberty. We can have a small government and plenty of political freedoms, but if we barely have the economic resources to live the lifestyles we want to pursue (within reason) this freedom means nothing. This isn't to say that a centralized large government should provide these needs for the people, but rather individuals coming together as a community to provide for their fellow individuals who so happen to be a part of the community (mutualism). It is a good mix of individualism and community where true libertarianism thrives.

[The Apollonian Systems]

It’s about small government. intervening in your citizens lives, violating their privacy and deciding if they’re worthy enough to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or arresting them for drug use/possession is not small government no matter how you slice it. I get where regular capitalist libertarians come from but I don’t get the conservative part as that actively takes part in interfering with your citizens to suit traditional values which libertarians were originally trying to let go of

Conservatism is about seeking a reasonably small government. Libertarianism is conservatism. Everything else is not conservatism, it is liberalism.

That’s not at all what conservatism is. And no libertarianism, not even right libertarianism, isn’t the same thing as conservatism.

[Kerwa]

Really it works as follows: reactionaries want to repeat past mistakes; conservatives want keep making the same ones; and progressives want to make new mistakes.

It doesn’t really matter what you label yourself outside that.

[El Lazaro]

There are plenty of Libertarians that don’t have Right-Wing social views but some who do. The reason I think that “Paleolibertarians” are so prevalent in the USA is because the GOP constantly talks about “limited government” yet does the exact opposite and those Conservatives that actually believe in limited government end up being attracted to Libertarian ideas.

You are right. The GOP are liberals who falsely claim to be seeking smaller government. Although they may sometimes use libertarian speech, their emphasis is on more affordable government and not more liberty.

Libertarianism is the conservative use of governmental power because government power comes at the expense of liberty in a zero sum game. Liberalism seeks the liberal use of government power to make the world a better place and this is always at the expense of liberty. To me liberalism is synonymous with conservatism. I am a conservative because I am a libertarian. However, all libertarians will draw the line a bit differently of what size of governmental power is appropriate. I think an added bonus to small government is that it is less expensive but if you love the cost savings and like extra freedom you are in line with the GOP and if you love freedom and like the cost savings then you are a libertarian.

Right-wing “libertarians” redefine every political term as incoherently as possible so they don’t have to talk about their shitty policies when advocating for their ideology