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[Draft] Hunting Limits

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Fachumonn
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[Draft] Hunting Limits

Postby Fachumonn » Wed Apr 03, 2024 11:15 am

Hunting Limits

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Category: Moral Decency | Strength: Mild | Proposed by: Fachumonn


This is a replacement. Check out the repeal here.

The General Assembly,

Disturbed that unregulated hunting causes many animal species to be threatened and endangered, while also disrupting ecosystems,

Desiring to protect animals from unsustainable hunting,

Hereby enacts as follows,

  1. "Hunting" in this resolution refers to the act of deliberately attempting to kill, maim, or capture wild animals, except where absolutely necessary for ecological conservation, the prevention of serious harm to persons or property thereof, the removal of specific animals posing a significant danger to environmental or sapient health, or to provide assistance to a specific animal's welfare or health. An act is absolutely necessary for a purpose if there exists no other practical measure which would achieve said purpose without causing manifestly greater harm to the environment or animal welfare.

  2. Each member nation must prohibit hunting of any species classified as endangered or at risk by the WA Endangered Species Committee (WAESC), or by a relevant agency of that member nation. Further, a member nation must restrict hunting under its jurisdiction sufficiently to reasonably prevent hunted species from becoming endangered or at risk as a result of such hunting.

  3. Each member nation must outlaw the sale or purchase of illegally-hunted species. Hunted animals, parts thereof or products derived therefrom may not be traded, or transported for the purposes of trade, in any member nation unless:

    1. the relevant hunting occurred prior to the enactment of this resolution;

    2. the hunting was conducted legally according to any applicable law, including this resolution; or

    3. the transport is for the purposes of law enforcement, repatriating existing animal stocks, or releasing the relevant animals from captivity into their natural environment.
  4. Each member nation must track hunting under its jurisdiction to estimate its frequency, determine its nature and location, and identify species that are the targets of hunting in that member nation. This data must be routinely published, with appropriate redactions for personal privacy and national security, and sent in its unredacted form to the Endangered Species Database Institution.

  5. Each member-nation shall report to the WAESC any known instances under its jurisdiction of the killing or capture of wild animals where it does not constitute hunting under Section 1.

  6. Member nations are strongly encouraged to:

    1. develop quotas so as to allow priority to communities that may be more reliant on hunting; and

    2. educate the public on the dangers and risks of hunting.
  7. Nothing in the above sections addresses hunting in a member nation of species given by the WAESC as invasive in that member nation. The ability of the WAESC to classify species as invasive, endangered, or at risk is given and asserted, to the extent not already classified by existing World Assembly law.



Co-authored with The Ice States and Tigrisia.
Last edited by Fachumonn on Thu May 30, 2024 5:52 pm, edited 26 times in total.
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Postby Fachumonn » Wed Apr 03, 2024 11:18 am

Reserved.
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Postby Fachumonn » Sat Apr 06, 2024 4:30 am

Bump.
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Postby Simone Republic » Sun Apr 07, 2024 1:50 am

How is this an improvement on the old one?
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Postby Tinhampton » Sun Apr 07, 2024 1:58 am

What is the relationship between this act and GA#662 "Public Endangered Species Table"? This proposal talks quite a lot about how species hunting is related to the endangerment of the species, but I can't clearly draw a link.

Anyway, opposed for the blatant privacy violation in Article 3 which not even the personal privacy exception can save. Hunters cannot be expected to report all of their hunting to their government, and I am certain they would not appreciate it if the government did their handiwork for them. Can you imagine the outcry if the WA required that details of all abortions be reported to WA Choice Plus? Less rhetorically, what is the public policy reason for hunting to be tracked and reported en-masse?
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Postby Fachumonn » Sun Apr 07, 2024 4:55 am

Simone Republic wrote:How is this an improvement on the old one?

OOC: It doesn't necessarily need to be. The problem with the target is that it allows hunting for sport. But also, see the 3rd section. It might need reworks but the intent is to better track hunting. The statistics are also sent to the Endangered Species Database Institution so it can better track who is at threat to endangerment and that type of stuff. You may also want to check the last 2 arguments in the repeal.

Tinhampton wrote:What is the relationship between this act and GA#662 "Public Endangered Species Table"? This proposal talks quite a lot about how species hunting is related to the endangerment of the species, but I can't clearly draw a link.

Thanks for the response. There is a clear link in that this proposal doesn't allow the hunting of endangered species, so as to not endanger them further. :) Also I count 1 mention of the word, unless you are talking about the committee, in which there are 2 mentions. Not really "talks quite a lot" as you say.
Tinhampton wrote:Anyway, opposed for the blatant privacy violation in Article 3 which not even the personal privacy exception can save. Hunters cannot be expected to report all of their hunting to their government, and I am certain they would not appreciate it if the government did their handiwork for them. Can you imagine the outcry if the WA required that details of all abortions be reported to WA Choice Plus? Less rhetorically, what is the public policy reason for hunting to be tracked and reported en-masse?

I understand this concern.
Last edited by Fachumonn on Sun Apr 07, 2024 5:00 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby Fachumonn » Wed Apr 10, 2024 4:45 pm

Bumpers.
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Postby Imperium Anglorum » Wed Apr 10, 2024 4:53 pm

Opposed.

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Postby Polomon Islands » Wed Apr 10, 2024 5:03 pm

Feel as if this resolution just isn't much better than GA#662 :meh:
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Postby Fachumonn » Wed Apr 10, 2024 5:07 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Opposed.

Based on previous threads I am not entirely surprised by this viewpoint. Is it due to a flaw of this resolution? :)
Polomon Islands wrote:Feel as if this resolution just isn't much better than GA#662 :meh:

This is not what the resolution is trying to do, the resolutions aren't really comparable.
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Postby Polomon Islands » Wed Apr 10, 2024 5:21 pm

Fachumonn wrote:
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Opposed.

Based on previous threads I am not entirely surprised by this viewpoint. Is it due to a flaw of this resolution? :)
Polomon Islands wrote:Feel as if this resolution just isn't much better than GA#662 :meh:

This is not what the resolution is trying to do, the resolutions aren't really comparable.

They are sorta similar in a way
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Postby Fachumonn » Wed Apr 10, 2024 5:22 pm

Polomon Islands wrote:
Fachumonn wrote:Based on previous threads I am not entirely surprised by this viewpoint. Is it due to a flaw of this resolution? :)
This is not what the resolution is trying to do, the resolutions aren't really comparable.

They are sorta similar in a way

Yes but this comment is redundant because this is not an intended replacement for #662.
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Postby Simone Republic » Wed Apr 10, 2024 8:20 pm

Also opposed. I really don't see any improvements over the existing (if awkward) 267/693 arrangement.
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Postby Fachumonn » Thu Apr 11, 2024 4:08 am

Simone Republic wrote:Also opposed. I really don't see any improvements over the existing (if awkward) 267/693 arrangement.

Honestly, to repeal it and replace with a basically identical resolution would be an improvement due to the ban of sports hunting.
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Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:07 am

I don't get this sudden moral crusade against sport hunting. The intention of a legal hunt does not matter. Getting entertainment from hunting which also furthers some ecological goal – eg culling overpopulation of deer – is better in trutil than not getting it.
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Postby The Ice States » Thu Apr 11, 2024 11:41 am

Imperium Anglorum wrote:I don't get this sudden moral crusade against sport hunting. The intention of a legal hunt does not matter. Getting entertainment from hunting which also furthers some ecological goal – eg culling overpopulation of deer – is better in trutil than not getting it.

I don't think this is an issue; the proposal prohibits only hunting of endangered species, and even so when they are not invasive in the relevant member nation. This proposal also doesn't make a distinction between sport hunting and hunting for food; it is only relevant to the repeal, opposing replacement would not reinstate the blocker in that regard.
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Postby The Ice States » Sun Apr 14, 2024 12:57 pm

Bump!
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Postby Tigrisia » Tue Apr 16, 2024 4:24 am

In the current form, the delegation of the Federal Republic of Tigrisia cannot support this resolution.

It is both too unflexible and should also be broader and not only cover endangered animals (OOC: hence, animals covered under CITES). A comprehensive resolution on hunting should also enforce bag limits and closed seasons. It also does not cover parts of animals or products made out of this animal. For example, a shampoo that uses fat from certain whales. Also, it only covers hunting and not other forms of animal trade.

Also, there may be reasons to hunt down an individual of a specific endangered species. For example, if an individual becomes a threat to humans or other sapient species, one should be able to remove it. This may be a clash with 518, reducing decease vectors. One possible scenario might be a rabies infected bear (OOC: which are covered by CITES). Another reason might be to actually enhance the survival of this species by extracting individual animals to reduce inbreeding.

Futhermore, the resolution does not allow the transport of the illegally hunted animal for forensic or law enforcement purposes. That means that the physical seizure of the illegally hunted animals is made impossible.

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Postby The Ice States » Tue Apr 16, 2024 2:52 pm

Tigrisia wrote:In the current form, the delegation of the Federal Republic of Tigrisia cannot support this resolution.

It is both too unflexible and should also be broader and not only cover endangered animals (OOC: hence, animals covered under CITES). A comprehensive resolution on hunting should also enforce bag limits and closed seasons. It also does not cover parts of animals or products made out of this animal. For example, a shampoo that uses fat from certain whales. Also, it only covers hunting and not other forms of animal trade.

"Thank you for the commentary, Ambassador. These points are well-taken; we had already contacted the Fachumonnian mission with wording recommendations to address some of these issues. However, we did not include a recommendation as to trade of parts of animals and products derived therefrom. These indeed ought to be addressed and we encourage the mission of Fachumonn to include these items under Section 2."

"Would the Tigrisian mission accept wording along the lines of, 'Any transport of hunted animals, parts thereof or products derived therefrom' introducing the second sentence of Section 2?"

Also, there may be reasons to hunt down an individual of a specific endangered species. For example, if an individual becomes a threat to humans or other sapient species, one should be able to remove it. This may be a clash with 518, reducing decease vectors. One possible scenario might be a rabies infected bear (OOC: which are covered by CITES). Another reason might be to actually enhance the survival of this species by extracting individual animals to reduce inbreeding.

"We do not see any provision of #518 which would contradict this resolution. This is also argued in the repeal associated with this draft, but it seems a rather inappropriate means of reducing disease spread to allow unrestricted hunting of disease vectors or, using your example, rabid bears. Self-defense, or a general population culling effort to remove diseased animals, is not hunting in the conventional sense of the word. If one were to actually engage in hunting, as it is commonly understood, of diseased animals, then that is likely to include the consumption or storage of the hunted animal. These would both contribute to, rather than halt, the spread of diseases."

"In general, take the example of a specific rabid animal. If a member nation, for example, dispatches a team to kill that animal, or remove them from the wild, we do not see how that would fall under this resolution. Professional measures such as these are more efficient, effective, and safe than lifting restrictions on hunting disease vectors. Under reasonable nation theory, it is unlikely that a member nation would class this as 'hunting' for the purposes of this resolution; that is a self-detrimental measure which can be avoided by applying a more appropriate definition of 'hunting'."

Futhermore, the resolution does not allow the transport of the illegally hunted animal for forensic or law enforcement purposes. That means that the physical seizure of the illegally hunted animals is made impossible.

"This is indeed well-taken; we would encourage the authoring mission to address this issue."

~Robert Desak,
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Last edited by The Ice States on Tue Apr 16, 2024 2:58 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Postby Tigrisia » Tue Apr 16, 2024 4:57 pm

The Ice States wrote:"Would the Tigrisian mission accept wording along the lines of, 'Any transport of hunted animals, parts thereof or products derived therefrom' introducing the second sentence of Section 2?"


Yes. That would be a good wording. Thank you for your formulation.

The Ice States wrote:Self-defense
or a general population culling effort to remove diseased animals


OOC: I did not mean "self-defense" but rather the killing of problematic animals in advance. See, for a real-live example Article 16 (1) (b) of EU Regulation 92/43/EWG (https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... 31992L0043). This rule is the basis for the hunting laws of members of the European Union.

The Ice States wrote:If one were to actually engage in hunting, as it is commonly understood, of diseased animals, then that is likely to include the consumption or storage of the hunted animal. These would both contribute to, rather than halt, the spread of diseases."


Then, sport hunting wouldn't be hunting if the animal is left to rot (which is at least partially the case).
Varmint Hunting, which is the killing of vermin through the use of hunting techniques, is also hunting despite not for food or storage.
OOC: Hunting is, per Wikipedia: "Hunting is the human practice of seeking, pursuing, capturing, or killing wildlife or feral animals. The most common reasons for humans to hunt are to exploit the animal's body for meat and useful animal products (fur/hide, bone/tusks, horn/antler, etc.), for recreation/taxidermy (see trophy hunting), although it may also be done for non-exploitative reasons such as removing predators dangerous to humans or domestic animals (e.g. wolf hunting), to eliminate pests and nuisance animals that damage crops/livestock/poultry or spread diseases (see varminting), for trade/tourism (see safari), or for ecological conservation against overpopulation and invasive species. "

Futhermore, the resolution does not allow the transport of the illegally hunted animal for forensic or law enforcement purposes. That means that the physical seizure of the illegally hunted animals is made impossible.

"This is indeed well-taken; we would encourage the authoring mission to address this issue."

For the delegation of the Federal Republic of Tigrisia at the World Assembly
Ambassador Thomas Salazar
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Postby Simone Republic » Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:58 pm

and the transport is for scientific or academic research


(2)(b) conflicts with 403. GA403 clause 2 doesn't have an exemption for academic research for international trade nor timeline restriction.
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Postby Fachumonn » Mon Apr 22, 2024 3:00 am

Sorry I’ve been in a place where I cannot really use the internet a lot so I will get back to this in like 2 days.

Also that’s why I’m non contactable offsite atm.
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Postby The Ice States » Thu Apr 25, 2024 11:37 pm

Simone Republic wrote:
and the transport is for scientific or academic research


(2)(b) conflicts with 403. GA403 clause 2 doesn't have an exemption for academic research for international trade nor timeline restriction.

I read the clause in this proposal as prohibiting trade unless either of the conditions are met, so further restriction is still possible and therefore it wouldn't contradict.
-----
Tigrisia wrote:OOC: I did not mean "self-defense" but rather the killing of problematic animals in advance. See, for a real-live example Article 16 (1) (b) of EU Regulation 92/43/EWG (https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... 31992L0043). This rule is the basis for the hunting laws of members of the European Union.

The Ice States wrote:If one were to actually engage in hunting, as it is commonly understood, of diseased animals, then that is likely to include the consumption or storage of the hunted animal. These would both contribute to, rather than halt, the spread of diseases."


Then, sport hunting wouldn't be hunting if the animal is left to rot (which is at least partially the case).
Varmint Hunting, which is the killing of vermin through the use of hunting techniques, is also hunting despite not for food or storage.
OOC: Hunting is, per Wikipedia: "Hunting is the human practice of seeking, pursuing, capturing, or killing wildlife or feral animals. The most common reasons for humans to hunt are to exploit the animal's body for meat and useful animal products (fur/hide, bone/tusks, horn/antler, etc.), for recreation/taxidermy (see trophy hunting), although it may also be done for non-exploitative reasons such as removing predators dangerous to humans or domestic animals (e.g. wolf hunting), to eliminate pests and nuisance animals that damage crops/livestock/poultry or spread diseases (see varminting), for trade/tourism (see safari), or for ecological conservation against overpopulation and invasive species. "

"Would your concerns be addressed through the implementation of a definition of 'hunting', for example as follows?"

In this resolution, "hunting" refers to the activity of attempting to capture or kill wild animals, either for the participant's recreation or to obtain a product from the said animals. The capture of a live animal for the purposes of breeding or conservation is not a form of hunting.


~Robert Desak,
World Assembly Ambassador,
The Eternal Union of Devonia and the Ice States.
Last edited by The Ice States on Thu Apr 25, 2024 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Simone Republic
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Postby Simone Republic » Fri Apr 26, 2024 12:12 am

The Ice States wrote:
Simone Republic wrote:
(2)(b) conflicts with 403. GA403 clause 2 doesn't have an exemption for academic research for international trade nor timeline restriction.

I read the clause in this proposal as prohibiting trade unless either of the conditions are met, so further restriction is still possible and therefore it wouldn't contradict.


That's not what GA403 says. The "or" exemption for goods older than 3.15576 billion seconds (as you called it in DMs) plainly contradicts 403, especially 2(c) due to the use of the "and... the transport is... for"
Last edited by Simone Republic on Fri Apr 26, 2024 12:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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