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[DEFEATED] - On Catherine Gratwick

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[DEFEATED] - On Catherine Gratwick

Postby Simone Republic » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:46 am

Background - what is the Secretary-General?

OK, I wrote the resolution first before writing the background, so apologies for the confusion.
It is not very commonly known to newer players, but every four years back in 2016 and 2020, there was an election for Secretary-General of the World Assembly. This occurred around 1 April and was a NationStates mini-game. (The mini-game is not explained in the resolution for obvious fourth wall reasons, so I simply treat the election as canon for the purpose of the declaration just as "SC exists" and "WA exists", even though the recognition is one way).

https://www.nationstates.net/page=election

The 2020 election was won by Kuriko, with vice secretary general being The Salaxalans, succeeding Caelapes, which won the 2016 election.

Here are Max Barry's announcements:
https://www.nationstates.net/page=news/ ... index.html
https://www.nationstates.net/page=news/ ... index.html

Both Kuriko and The Salaxalans still carry the tag "WA Secretary-General" (and vice) on their page. This is also reflected in the cards. The Salaxalans' commend (SC#313) explicitly mentions the role of vice WA SecGen in the commend. Kuriko's commend (SC#328) does not.

The cards:
https://www.nationstates.net/page=deck/card=2356376
https://www.nationstates.net/page=deck/card=55306

2024

To quote Sedgistan, the newly elected Secretary-General will have some powers that he will determine.

Sedgistan wrote:The coding priority for Violet's time this year is likely to be related to Accounts, but she has indicated it may be possible to implement Sec-Gen changes this year, though not guaranteed.

We are likely to run one Sec-Gen election this year regardless, to tie in with the US election cycle, as seems to have become our habit. Ideally, this would be with its new powers, whatever those are.


Sedgistan wrote:Summary of change:
The "April Fool's" Secretary-General elections become a proper part of NationStates, with elections scheduled every 6 months. Elections work the same way as they did in the previous election, and include a Vice Secretary-General running-mate.



About Gratwick

In theory, Catherine Gratwick has been in the continuity of RP (especially GA RP) as the secretary general prior to the introduction of elections in 2016. (Ms Gratwick is also NSUN Secretary-General prior to the destruction of that body). So the declaration references her as a former secretary general who haunts the halls of the Security Council, rather than the current actual Secretary General, since both have their commendations and Kuriko is still officially Secretary General. There is also a long-running RP (that's more GA) that she never gave up her position (or that she's drawing a salary anyway).

Gratwick is also recycled in numerous issues, hence there is a reference to her constant appearances in the affairs of nations, at 17, the most according to the counts kept over at Got Issues - #100, #101, #124, #158, #173, #188, #197, #200, #206, #232, #499, #501, #752, #855, #1065, #1122, #1475. Although in that version she appears to be used by the Issues Editors as a much younger character than the Sec-Gen version since she is for example referred to once as a film star.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=488462

Draft 3

Category: Declaration

The Security Council,

Appalled that Her Infinite Terribleness, Queen of Gnomes, Keeper of the Unmentionable Records, the Wrathful Secretary-General Catherine Gratwick has haunted the hallowed halls of this esteemed organ since antiquity as the one true Secretary-General holding a lifetime appointment, despite the complete lack of evidence on her appointment in the first place, thus making her status as Secretary-General of anything highly dubious at best and a complete usurper at worst;

Shocked that the iconic Catherine Gratwick received the gift of immortality and youth from mysterious forces beyond the comprehension of the multiverse, allowing her to appear in the shape and age of every sapient species, and her ability to time travel giving her (allegedly) a sheer malignant and capricious role in every conceivable atrocious crime against humanity, such as wars, famines, pandemics, and the serial comma;

Perturbed that Catherine Gratwick’s time travel ability lets her (and her ancestors, including Elizabeth Gratwick) permeate every aspect of the government of member nations (as well as that of millions of non-members), in such areas as acting as the occasional menacing leader of neighboring nations, contributing to cancer research, championing women’s suffrage, driving trucks mounted with grenade launchers firing at anyone who trespasses on her vast holdings of properties, selling miracle diets, winning national dance offs, as well as gaining worldwide renown as a best-selling author, celebrated model, film star, pageant aficionado, and painter of trains, among a wide variety of other prominent roles;

Terrified that the "colossal fireball of extra-dimensional inanity" described that destroyed previous incarnations of certain organs for global power was (again, allegedly) the concoction of none other than Gratwick herself, who sought to gain power over the entire multiverse no matter what the cost, and that her antics continue to this day with constant hamster uprisings, some of which having only been put down recently with the death of trillions of hamsters;

Dismayed that Gratwick has apparently been on paid leave since time immemorial despite her giant colossus standing tall over parts of the multiverse, and is somehow still on the payroll (to emphasize, allegedly) despite the presence of democratically-elected leaders, thus succeeding in drawing away vast treasures from this prestigious organ into her bank vaults without doing any actual work, nor having any work for starters given that the Secretary-General was a post with absolutely no powers, a nightmare to the taxpayers of member nations but a euphoric dream for the ministers, ambassadors, diplomats, and assorted hangers-on of this revered organ;

Pleading to Gratwick in the firm believe the Security Council (and its neighbor) suffer from such atrocious and decadent behavior as to merit another bigger fireball of extra-dimensional inanity to be launched against them, in order to provide the sweet release required by many of the ambassadors to this esteemed organ;

The SC hereby declares the member nations’ undying loyalty and fealty, or dreadful contempt and vile hatred of Catherine Gratwick.


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Last edited by Refuge Isle on Thu May 30, 2024 9:48 pm, edited 42 times in total.
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Postby West Barack and East Obama » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:50 am

We don't need more GA declarations, thanks. How about recognising some other RP characters/threads/incidents?
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Postby Sporaltryus » Thu Jan 11, 2024 7:34 am

Who the hell is Catherine Gratwick?
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Postby Reventus Koth » Thu Jan 11, 2024 7:36 am

Can we have a declaration against meaningless dreck?
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Thu Jan 11, 2024 7:38 am

Reventus Koth wrote:Can we have a declaration against meaningless dreck?

I wish.

As far as Declarations go this has scraped through the bottom of the barrel.
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Postby The Seven levels of Heaven » Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:21 pm

While not horribly written, this is another example declaration with a whole bunch of fluff and not enough description as to why we need to have such a declaration beyond...I think her being Secretary General (which must be some IC/regional thing since she aint one of the folks in pink here)? If there's any other things in there, it's hard to pick out beyond the useless fluff that tries to make it sound intense, but instead makes it sound vague and hollow.

Also, once again I'll echo the "who?" comments.

Though, given this is set for April Fool's day of an undetermined year, I'll just assume this was a bad attempt at a joke resolution.
Last edited by The Seven levels of Heaven on Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby Sedgistan » Thu Jan 11, 2024 1:48 pm

I think that chronicling NationStates lore in an accessible way is a positive thing.

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Postby August Imperium » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:04 pm

Sedgistan wrote:I think that chronicling NationStates lore in an accessible way is a positive thing.

I agree- but this hardly counts as "accessible", unless by "accessible" you mean "public". I only know the context behind this because of the WA Discord; a true newcomer would have a hard time understanding any of this, and there's confusion from veterans too. The SC, after all, is not one big inside joke for the GA. Not exactly accessible.
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Postby Bormiar » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:12 pm

August Imperium wrote:
Sedgistan wrote:I think that chronicling NationStates lore in an accessible way is a positive thing.

I agree- but this hardly counts as "accessible", unless by "accessible" you mean "public". I only know the context behind this because of the WA Discord; a true newcomer would have a hard time understanding any of this, and there's confusion from veterans too. The SC, after all, is not one big inside joke for the GA. Not exactly accessible.


Essentially this.

Would you please explain this nominee to the uninitiated? Who controls Catherine Gratwick and is this meant to take the place of a C&C? This might be a very creative and worthwhile proposal, but those of us who don't participate in the GA can't know until you provide more information.

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Postby Astrobolt » Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:51 pm

Currently disinclined to support this. I know this is part of a bunch of GA related memes, but I’m not convinced its worthy of a declaration. Could be swayed with more info.
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Postby Refuge Isle » Thu Jan 11, 2024 3:11 pm

West Barack and East Obama wrote:We don't need more GA declarations, thanks. How about recognising some other RP characters/threads/incidents?

Astrobolt wrote:Currently disinclined to support this. I know this is part of a bunch of GA related memes, but I’m not convinced its worthy of a declaration. Could be swayed with more info.

Catherine Gratwick is a often-referenced character in NationStates lore, canonically the first Secretary-General of the World Assembly who has since taken on a variety of other occupations in issues over the years. She is not an RP character from International Incidents, but one from NationStates itself. Unfortunately knowledge of that requires answering issues, and players in MilGP who most closely attend to the Security Council's happenings will not have that exposure, which makes a declaration in this area more difficult than it could be.

Tentative support.
Last edited by Refuge Isle on Thu Jan 11, 2024 3:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Untecna » Thu Jan 11, 2024 3:15 pm

Support
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Postby West Barack and East Obama » Thu Jan 11, 2024 3:52 pm

Refuge Isle wrote:
West Barack and East Obama wrote:We don't need more GA declarations, thanks. How about recognising some other RP characters/threads/incidents?

Astrobolt wrote:Currently disinclined to support this. I know this is part of a bunch of GA related memes, but I’m not convinced its worthy of a declaration. Could be swayed with more info.

Catherine Gratwick is a often-referenced character in NationStates lore, canonically the first Secretary-General of the World Assembly who has since taken on a variety of other occupations in issues over the years. She is not an RP character from International Incidents, but one from NationStates itself. Unfortunately knowledge of that requires answering issues, and players in MilGP who most closely attend to the Security Council's happenings will not have that exposure, which makes a declaration in this area more difficult than it could be.

Tentative support.


Except that none of this is "NationStates lore". Almost all of the content here is based on roleplays of the character in the General Assembly. I couldn't even find canonical information that she was a Secretary General of the WA, though I may have missed it while searching just now.

I'd say that a declaration based on the uniqueness of her character in the issues canon, as a mysterious character somehow holding a wealth of unusual positions ranging from teenage mother to foreign leader to suffragette leader to homeowner's rights advocate, tying into the immortal cells she possibly inherited could make a very interesting and funny declaration on the actual NS lore. Maybe the esoteric Stranger's Bar references could be added as a cherry on top, to make the declaration whole, but making it the focus seems like the wrong approach.
Last edited by West Barack and East Obama on Thu Jan 11, 2024 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Outer Sparta » Fri Jan 12, 2024 1:11 am

Why is this relevant to the SC? I fail to see how this is relevant.
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Postby Unibot III » Fri Jan 12, 2024 7:49 am

Ambassador Vidal rubbed the sleep from her eyes and slumped back in her chair, groaning at the proposal draft. “Spare us, please!” she said.

“The SC should be suing Ms. Gratwick for time theft, not spending its resources to ‘recognize’ them,” said Miriam. “It’s time that the WA SC asserted itself and took page from the GA’s book: ignore them entirely. We should be repealing SC#359 - not adding to the madness!”
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Postby Bilancorn » Fri Jan 12, 2024 7:51 am

Sporaltryus wrote:Who the hell is Catherine Gratwick?

that was my exact same thought/reaction, lol.
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Postby Elahiim » Fri Jan 12, 2024 12:06 pm

Sporaltryus wrote:Who the hell is Catherine Gratwick?

Im with you on that one , Who is she and who does she think she is ?

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Postby Comfed » Fri Jan 12, 2024 4:25 pm

Full support.

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Postby Simone Republic » Fri Jan 12, 2024 6:30 pm

West Barack and East Obama wrote:We don't need more GA declarations, thanks. How about recognising some other RP characters/threads/incidents?


Outer Sparta wrote:Why is this relevant to the SC? I fail to see how this is relevant.


Technically Kuriko's tag is "WA Secretary-General", not merely GA. So I assume Kuriko's powers extend both to SC and GA.

Bilancorn wrote:
Sporaltryus wrote:Who the hell is Catherine Gratwick?

that was my exact same thought/reaction, lol.


Bormiar wrote:
August Imperium wrote:I agree- but this hardly counts as "accessible", unless by "accessible" you mean "public". I only know the context behind this because of the WA Discord; a true newcomer would have a hard time understanding any of this, and there's confusion from veterans too. The SC, after all, is not one big inside joke for the GA. Not exactly accessible.


Essentially this.

Would you please explain this nominee to the uninitiated? Who controls Catherine Gratwick and is this meant to take the place of a C&C? This might be a very creative and worthwhile proposal, but those of us who don't participate in the GA can't know until you provide more information.


This is from the 2016/2020 NationStates Election April Fool's Day mini-game, so it's quite old. Apologies I didn't explain the mini-games first. Refer to Max Barry's messages above for the mini-game. Very technically it's WA/SC (Kuriko's tag says "WA SecGen" not just "GA SecGen").

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Though, given this is set for April Fool's day of an undetermined year, I'll just assume this was a bad attempt at a joke resolution.


It depends a lot on whether we get another NationStates Election mini-game in 2024.

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Reventus Koth wrote:Can we have a declaration against meaningless dreck?

I wish.

As far as Declarations go this has scraped through the bottom of the barrel.


Thank you.
Last edited by Simone Republic on Fri Jan 12, 2024 6:37 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Postby The Ice States » Fri Jan 12, 2024 7:58 pm

For what it's worth, I would support this declaration as written.
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Postby Simone Republic » Sat Jan 13, 2024 12:37 am

Sedgistan wrote:I think that chronicling NationStates lore in an accessible way is a positive thing.


The Ice States wrote:For what it's worth, I would support this declaration as written.


I have no plans to submit this until after 1 April 2024 in case the mini-game comes back and a new secretary general is elected.

As per Sedge above, it will take place this year, so there will be a new SecGen.

Outer Sparta wrote:Why is this relevant to the SC? I fail to see how this is relevant.


By April, when the new Sec-Gen is elected and they have new powers, it should be more relevant. Sedgistan has already confirmed on the technical forum that the new Sec-Gen has actual powers, unlike previous Sec-Gens.
Last edited by Simone Republic on Sun Jan 14, 2024 5:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby August Imperium » Sat Jan 13, 2024 3:16 am

Simone Republic wrote:
West Barack and East Obama wrote:We don't need more GA declarations, thanks. How about recognising some other RP characters/threads/incidents?


Outer Sparta wrote:Why is this relevant to the SC? I fail to see how this is relevant.


Technically Kuriko's tag is "WA Secretary-General", not merely GA. So I assume Kuriko's powers extend both to SC and GA.

This is a superfluous distinction. You do not need to look at a piece of paper and think "They must be relevant to the SC because it says so here!"- you can look at the stream of confused posts and realise that, despite the de jure situation, de facto this is a purely GA reference.

This is from the 2016/2020 NationStates Election April Fool's Day mini-game, so it's quite old. Apologies I didn't explain the mini-games first. Refer to Max Barry's messages above for the mini-game. Very technically it's WA/SC (Kuriko's tag says "WA SecGen" not just "GA SecGen").

Then commend Kuriko, not Gratwick. Nobody's heard of Gratwick- but the nation, at least, is easier to recognise. If you decided to go with the ambassador (which is entirely a GA thing) rather than the nation (more of a WA thing), it is easy to see how you intended this to be a reference to GA and not WA/SC lore.
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Postby Wallenburg » Sat Jan 13, 2024 4:17 am

Gratwick goes back, and I mean back, as Secretary-General. She orchestrated the destruction of the UNmentionable organization as its first and last Secretary-General, and has since been the undisputed chief administrator for the World Assembly. It is a common mistake to think that the "Secretary-General" award passed between a few member states actually corresponds to the office. If it did, Gratwick would have long since repeated her '08 show and, still worse, published her damning photographs of Max Barry in a variety of extremely compromising positions.
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Postby Refuge Isle » Sat Jan 13, 2024 11:04 am

To clarify, there is no such thing as a GA SecGen. The GA has secretariats (GenSec) that rule on legality and proceedural policy, but this is unrelated to the Secretary-General. I've been trying to figure out why you guys keep saying it's a GA issue and now realise it's a misunderstanding of game terms and mechanics.

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