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Gender Ideology and its consequences

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Zarate-Campana
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Gender Ideology and its consequences

Postby Zarate-Campana » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:30 am

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/argenti ... tina.phtml


A 5-years old kid homicide shocks Argentina. The kid's mother Magdalena Esposito Valenti, together with her "girlfriend" hit Lucio many times until they achieved their goal: "death to the masculine gender".

Lucio's homicide would be an alleged revenge by the mother against her ex-fiancé, father of the boy.

Nowadays, under Argentine law, the accused would be sentenced to life imprisonment.

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Neu California
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Postby Neu California » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:53 am

One isolated incident, which can't be used to create a broader picture without further evidence showing it's normalized.

Also, I wonder if undiagnosed mental illness was involved.
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Postby New Anarchisticstan » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:59 am

Christians, gays, fascists, liberals... All kinds of people can murder someone. It's stupid hating a group just because one of them did something bad. You do not imprison a school because a student stole a radio.
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:07 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/argentina/gruesome-killing-of-five-year-old-lucio-dupuy-shocks-argentina.phtml


A 5-years old kid homicide shocks Argentina. The kid's mother Magdalena Esposito Valenti, together with her "girlfriend" hit Lucio many times until they achieved their goal: "death to the masculine gender".

Lucio's homicide would be an alleged revenge by the mother against her ex-fiancé, father of the boy.

Nowadays, under Argentine law, the accused would be sentenced to life imprisonment.

Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.
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Zarate-Campana
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Postby Zarate-Campana » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:11 am

Ifreann wrote:
Zarate-Campana wrote:https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/argentina/gruesome-killing-of-five-year-old-lucio-dupuy-shocks-argentina.phtml

A 5-years old kid homicide shocks Argentina. The kid's mother Magdalena Esposito Valenti, together with her "girlfriend" hit Lucio many times until they achieved their goal: "death to the masculine gender".

Lucio's homicide would be an alleged revenge by the mother against her ex-fiancé, father of the boy.

Nowadays, under Argentine law, the accused would be sentenced to life imprisonment.

Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.


Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.

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DeMoNiC SaTaN
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Postby DeMoNiC SaTaN » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:14 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.

evidence please?
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Neu California
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Postby Neu California » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:15 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.


Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.

Then you need a separate source to establish that, because the source you linked says jack squat about that.
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Adreabhal
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Postby Adreabhal » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:15 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.


Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.

If you're trying to frame an isolated tragedy in the context of a greater social reality, you're going to have to try harder than that. Radicals exist and do terrible things; we know this. Regardless, the point still remains that there is little link to "gender ideology" in this case. Speaking of, would you mind defining what exactly you think gender ideology is? At this point it seems like something of a blanket term and I don't know how to interact with a term that could mean a wide variety of things depending on the speaker.

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:25 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.


Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.

Are they? The article you have linked offers only the motivation of personal hatred of the poor boy's father. Perhaps this is common knowledge in Argentina, but I don't think many of us in these parts tend to hear a lot of Argentinian news.
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Juansonia
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Postby Juansonia » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:29 am

Zarate-Campana wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Exactly what is the link to so-called "gender ideology" here? The linked article does not contain the text you quoted.


Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.
So the issue at hand was (probably Solanist) misandry, a subset of the mis(ogyn/andr)y bullshit. Don't call them ultra-feminists, call them what they are - misandrists, probably of a Solanist nature.
edit: the above is assuming that this was anything more than two sadists punishing their son for the father's actions. Source please.

Back to what I originally said before this edit:

The term "Gender Ideology" is usually used by the american right (and others) to refer to the idea that gender and sex are distinct concepts. It usually is used to imply that transfolk and enbies are the root of all evil, hence why nobody takes the term seriously.

Perhaps it would have been better to title your thread "Misandrists commit hate crime against their own son." or something that would better reflect the true nature of this hate crime.

Also, I noticed that you put the word girlfriend in "scare quotes", which further discredits your point.
Last edited by Juansonia on Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:38 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby PhilTech » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:38 am

I am sure you guys already know that OP is just spreading unnecessary or otherwise hateful gossip in an already heartbreaking news, so there is no point of discussing this at all. Just a waste of time.

But well, I can only react to it I guess--

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Postby Stellar Colonies » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:41 am

In 2017, there was an incident in Chicago when four black individuals, two male and two female, kidnapped a white boy with ASD and filmed themselves torturing him on Facebook Live whilst hurling anti-white abusive language at him.

For this specific brutality, is there evidence of a similar motive of hate directed at a wider group, in this case male as opposed to white in the example, instead of this being an isolated incident?
Last edited by Stellar Colonies on Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ketri » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:47 am

This is somehow one of the less dumb forum threads I've seen
It's still dumb though

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Postby -Astoria- » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:53 am

Juansonia wrote:Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.
So the issue at hand was (probably Solanist) misandry, a subset of the mis(ogyn/andr)y bullshit.[/quote]
What are they exactly? A search couldn't turn up anything on them.
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Postby Great Britain eke Northern Ireland » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:55 am

Stellar Colonies wrote:In 2017, there was an incident in Chicago when four black individuals, two male and two female, kidnapped a white boy with ASD and filmed themselves torturing him on Facebook Live whilst hurling anti-white abusive language at him.

For this specific brutality, is there evidence of a similar motive of hate directed at a wider group, in this case male as opposed to white in the example, instead of this being an isolated incident?


I suspect that such incidents against men at large are much rarer, for a couple of core reasons. Firstly, anti-man ideology rarely becomes exhibited in physical violence and abuse like that, and in this case, as it’s mostly expressed vocally or online rather than physically; and secondly, abuse by women tends to be much more psychological, mental and emotional than physical, as we can see in how some woman in relationships abuse their partners and how they exploit them, which is predominantly through those methods.
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Postby Adreabhal » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:55 am

-Astoria- wrote:
Juansonia wrote:Excuse me, the murderers were linked with hatred groups, many of them were ultra-feminists groups that call for the complete eradication of the masculine gender.
What are they exactly? A search couldn't turn up anything on them.

If I'm not mistaken, I think they were referring to Valerie Solanas-style misandry, though I could be wrong in that regard.
Last edited by Adreabhal on Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Juansonia
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Postby Juansonia » Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:06 am

Adreabhal wrote:
-Astoria- wrote:What are they exactly? A search couldn't turn up anything on them.

If I'm not mistaken, I think they were referring to Valerie Solanas-style misandry, though I could be wrong in that regard.

I was. The abbreviation SCUM, while a better-known name for the flavor of misandry, is also associated with being a general scumbag (people use all-caps too often).
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Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.

Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.

It's not equitable at all
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Nilokeras
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Postby Nilokeras » Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:58 am

Surprisingly, there isn't much to this whole claim about a tie to 'gender ideology':

A lawyer representing Lucio’s father has also asked that the aggravating factor of "gender hatred" be included, alleging that the accused have "a clear aversion to the whole male stereotype." Public prosecutors do not support this last allegation.

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The United Penguin Commonwealth
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Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Wed Feb 01, 2023 3:40 pm

someone’s untreated health problems drive them to seek revenge and commit murder. this happens often, but it’s somehow only news when they say something politically relevant while doing it.
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Postby Port Caverton » Wed Feb 01, 2023 4:14 pm

The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:someone’s untreated health problems drive them to seek revenge and commit murder. this happens often, but it’s somehow only news when they say something politically relevant while doing it.

Is there any sign that they were ill?
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Juansonia
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Postby Juansonia » Wed Feb 01, 2023 4:34 pm

Port Caverton wrote:
The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:someone’s untreated health problems drive them to seek revenge and commit murder. this happens often, but it’s somehow only news when they say something politically relevant while doing it.
Is there any sign that they were ill?
Would a sane person believe that killing a five-year-old could possibly be justified by the actions of a father who has left long ago?

I'm confident that NSG posters aren't mental health professionals, so nobody here will take the effort to use actual mental health terminology or follow the Goldwater rule.
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Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.

Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.

It's not equitable at all
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Postby The Second Order of Life » Wed Feb 01, 2023 4:43 pm

Zarate-Campana wrote:https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/argentina/gruesome-killing-of-five-year-old-lucio-dupuy-shocks-argentina.phtml


A 5-years old kid homicide shocks Argentina. The kid's mother Magdalena Esposito Valenti, together with her "girlfriend" hit Lucio many times until they achieved their goal: "death to the masculine gender".

Lucio's homicide would be an alleged revenge by the mother against her ex-fiancé, father of the boy.

Nowadays, under Argentine law, the accused would be sentenced to life imprisonment.


The article doesn't say anything that you repeated. Do you mind linking something else? Given that you have yet to provide evidence to support the claims you've made in relation to this incident, despite other people questioning this every fact, I'd assume you don't really have any.

Nevertheless, even if that was the case, the actions of an individual who claims to be part of a movement do not taint the movement as a whole unless there is a very clear link with the ideology of the movement in question and the reasoning behind the actions. Untreated mental health problems or unresolved psychological issues (or just plain psychopathy) don't demerit any ideology, at least not necessarily. Further linking needs to be done.
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The United Penguin Commonwealth
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Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:18 pm

Port Caverton wrote:
The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:someone’s untreated health problems drive them to seek revenge and commit murder. this happens often, but it’s somehow only news when they say something politically relevant while doing it.

Is there any sign that they were ill?


sane people don’t beat their own children to death out of spite.
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Port Caverton
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Postby Port Caverton » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:22 pm

The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:
Port Caverton wrote:Is there any sign that they were ill?


sane people don’t beat their own children to death out of spite.

True.
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Postby Floofybit » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:35 pm

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