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Is True Communism Possible?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Who was the closet to getting to a true communist society

Lenin
38
29%
Ho chi minh
6
5%
Che Guevara
2
2%
Castro
15
11%
Tito
10
8%
Other
61
46%
 
Total votes : 132

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Jewish Underground State
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Is True Communism Possible?

Postby Jewish Underground State » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:16 pm

Some communists say that states like the USSR and China were not "True Communist" Societies. So why don't we have a true communist society?

But what is True Communism? True communism is the belief that workers must unite to overthrow the capitalist government in their nation. They would turn their state into a society with no social classes, no private property and everyone was equal. The government would own all property and control the economy to ensure that everyone was equal.

So why hasn't this vision of a society ever been carried out successfully? Their have been attempts to carry out this vision but why haven't they worked?
Last edited by Jewish Underground State on Wed Jul 27, 2022 7:38 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Araznan
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Postby Araznan » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:18 pm

Probably the threat of Democratic Nations like USA pressing them to not Become ''Full Communist''

There Communist Nations That Are Basically Modern Russian Communism. Cuba, Vietnam, Laos
Last edited by Araznan on Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:31 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:18 pm

Not currently, at our current rate of technological development it might be in a century or two, assuming climate change just stops and nothing happens on that front so the hypothetical can work.

It's also worth pointing out that neither the USSR nor PRC claim to be communist societies. Both were and are in the process of working towards communism, at least on paper.
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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:18 pm

-doublepost-
Last edited by Washington Resistance Army on Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jewish Underground State
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Postby Jewish Underground State » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:19 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not currently, at our current rate of technological development it might be in a century or two, assuming climate change just stops and nothing happens on that front so the hypothetical can work.

It's also worth pointing out that neither the USSR nor PRC claim to be communist societies. Both were and are in the process of working towards communism, at least on paper.

Yes but many communists claim they weren't due to their dictatorships

(Mainly Trotskyites)
Last edited by Jewish Underground State on Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The United Penguin Commonwealth
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Democratic Socialists

Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:23 pm

there have been socialist communes that have shown success, but whether such a system could function on a large scale is hard to tell. it would probably require a lack of foreign intervention.

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Jewish Underground State
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Postby Jewish Underground State » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:24 pm

The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:there have been socialist communes that have shown success, but whether such a system could function on a large scale is hard to tell. it would probably require a lack of foreign intervention.

So in a country like russia there would be too many threats to the vision so the vision would fail due to the state's size?
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Prima Scriptura
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Postby Prima Scriptura » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:29 pm

No.
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Nimzonia
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Postby Nimzonia » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:43 pm

I don't think actual communism is possible unless you're talking about a post-scarcity world where the concept of personal property has effectively become meaningless because anyone can obtain any product or resource at any time. That is hundreds of years away at the very least.

However, some form of socialism will become necessary in the relatively nearer future when most labour becomes automated and it is literally no longer possible for the majority of the population to work because there isn't any work left for them to do. I can't see how capitalism would be sustainable at that point as there will be hardly anyone left who can actually buy anything. When we reach that stage, either we nationalise the means of production or we eventually reach a world where Elon Musk owns everything and everyone else is his plaything.

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Santa Claus the Gift Giver
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Postby Santa Claus the Gift Giver » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:44 pm

Umm..Umm...*looks back at child* So about that super intelligent AI you wanted to create....

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Santa Claus the Gift Giver
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Postby Santa Claus the Gift Giver » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:47 pm

Santa Claus the Gift Giver wrote:Umm..Umm...*looks back at child* So about that super intelligent AI you wanted to create....

If you don't understand, the answer is a simple no. Don't push me into giving more details even though I can.

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The Orwell Society
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Postby The Orwell Society » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:49 pm

True communism is not possible in today's society. Socialism itself is failing countries such as Venezuela, and communism would only enhance the effects of socialism's many downsides.
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Meadowfields
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Postby Meadowfields » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:49 pm

Araznan wrote:Probably the threat of Democratic Nations like USA pressing them to not Become ''Full Communist''

There Communist Nations That Are Basically Modern Russian Communism. Cuba, Vietnam, Laos

The thing is that "Modern Russian Communism" is not communism. And communism can be democratic, it isn't necessarily authoritarian as an ideology. It's only just that almost all the societies that have claimed to be communist, with the exception of some short-lived anarchic communes, have been authoritarian.
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Technoscience Leftwing
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Postby Technoscience Leftwing » Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:01 pm

> So why do we not have a real communist state?

Marx writes that communism can arise only if there is a material and technical base. Nimzonia correctly writes that this base means universal automation, when all the routine, hard work is done by machines controlled by artificial intelligence, and this technosphere maintains and repairs itself without human intervention. Something like Arthur Clarke in the book "The City and the Stars" - there the city supports itself, and people are busy with creativity or entertainment. In the 20th century, such a base was not created, and therefore communism did not arise.

> The government will own all property and control the economy to ensure equality for all.

Equality can only be guaranteed in receiving a decent and satisfying social package, equal protection from poverty, homelessness, disease, boredom and illiteracy. It is possible to achieve the growth of this social package, expanding the variability of its range, as technologies develop. But at the same time, goods from rare materials, labor-intensive, luxury goods will remain, and there will be paid access in this sector. With the development of technology and the development of space resources, it will become easier to produce goods, a smaller proportion of goods will be labor intensive, an increasing proportion of goods will be available in the free sector. The gradual movement from paid to free of charge of an increasing number of goods, and there is a movement towards communism.

Is this development inevitable? I think Marx was too much of an optimist. Other paths of development are quite possible: a world war between the imperialists, which will destroy all of humanity; or an ecological catastrophe with the same result; or the emergence of totalitarian regimes dominated by monopolies and bureaucracy (under the guise of socialism, such as Orwell's 1984, or under the flag of capitalism and religion, as in Jack London's Iron Heel). But these are very tragic scenarios, and in an effort to avoid them, people hope for the feasibility of a humanistic version of communism.
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Postby Bear Stearns » Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:09 pm

give it a try and let us know what happens
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The Islands of Versilia
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Postby The Islands of Versilia » Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:11 pm

Communism is the very definition of failure.
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Ethel mermania
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Postby Ethel mermania » Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:21 pm

No
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Postby New haven america » Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:38 pm

yes
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Willtime
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Postby Willtime » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:22 pm

Possible,but not now.
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Rusticus I Damianus
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Postby Rusticus I Damianus » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:23 pm

Short answer: No.

Long answer: No.

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The Jamesian Republic
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Postby The Jamesian Republic » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:25 pm

Not on a large scale. Maybe if your nation was like a village or suburb or a loose confederation of them.

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Saralonia
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Postby Saralonia » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:25 pm

Que viva el Ejercito Zapatista de Liberación Nacional.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:43 pm

Communism is inevitable.
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Adamede
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Postby Adamede » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:52 pm

Maybe in a anarcho-primitivist-commune sure, otherwise no.
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Adamede
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Postby Adamede » Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:52 pm

Ifreann wrote:Communism is inevitable.

Russia and China sure are taking a strange path towards it then.
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