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[Abortion Thread] A Matter of Choice (NEW POLL!)

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

What is your position on State Referenda enshrining Abortion as a constitutional right?

All states should do it! If any states haven't, they damn well need to!
161
54%
The states should raise the standards for passage to 60% or higher, where applicable!
25
8%
The state governments should do all they can to block these referenda!
86
29%
I for one welcome sugary oblivion! Ia! Ia! Cthulhu is a part of my balanced breakfast!
28
9%
 
Total votes : 300

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Godular
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Posts: 12686
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

[Abortion Thread] A Matter of Choice (NEW POLL!)

Postby Godular » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:28 am

So kind of a lot's happened over the last 100 pages. Most notably in this case, a number of states have passed constitutional referenda sanctifying the right to bodily autonomy / abortion in the state constitution. While many 'Blue' states have done this as a matter of course, the real surprise comes in the form of multiple RED states doing this thing even and especially in the face of staunch resistance from republican-controlled state governments.

Indeed, it would seem that while the GOP were sometimes quick to say 'LET THE STATES DECIDE' apparently they did not mean 'LET THE PEOPLE IN THE STATES DECIDE!' as they have engaged in a remarkably wide variety of efforts to counteract and trivialize these referenda, often to their own detriment. It is largely because of the Abortion issue that the midterm election cycle went from being a 'red wave' as it traditionally tends to be in the face of a democrat president to what even conservative networks tend to phrase as 'a massive failure'.

And the GOP continues to fight against it, tooth and nail.

So I ask the folks here:

Do you support constitutional referenda in the states in regards to abortion? Do you think the referendum standards should be more stringent? Do you think governments should do all they can to squash such referenda if it means abortions will continue to be stymied? Does Cthulhu like Cap'n Crunch? IS Cthulhu Cap'n Crunch?Have the Great Old Ones invaded our breakfast table?


What week do you think elective abortions should be allowed till?

0-4: 131 votes (27%)
5-8: 19 votes (4%)
9-12: 29 votes (6%)
13-16: 32 votes (7%)
17-20: 27 votes (6%)
21-24: 58 votes (12%)
25-28: 27 votes (6%)
29-32: 5 votes (1%)
33-36: 8 votes (2%)
37 till birth: 144 votes (30%)


Which statement do you most identify with?

I think Abortion is bad, but that's just me. 7%
I think Abortion is bad, but necessary to keep available. 20%
I think Abortion is bad, but sometimes medically necessary. 18%
I think Abortion is bad. No qualifier. 11%
I think Abortion is good, because dammit there are too many people around! 7%
I think Abortion is good, but needs some restrictions on access. 4%
I think Abortion is good, but we ought to encourage keeping pregnancies. 11%
I think Abortion is good. No qualifier. 22%
I think Abortion is meh. 0%


How do you feel about Mifepristone?

It should be freely available! 47%
Prescription Only! 13%
It needs more testing before approval! 7%
Ban it! 23%
Let the States decide! 5%
SATAN-PENGUINS 2024!!! 5%





https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/24/politics/dobbs-mississippi-supreme-court-abortion-roe-wade/index.html

Today the supreme court of the united states released the ruling overturning the landmark case Roe v Wade revoking the constitutional right to an abortion. In a 6-3 vote.


Jan Hoffman in The New York Times wrote:Friday’s historic opinion, written by Justice Alito and joined by the Supreme Court's conservative bloc, overturns almost 50 years of precedent. Justice Alito's guiding principle is that a right to an abortion cannot be found in the Constitution. He adheres to a legal philosophy known as “original intent,” which involves scrutinizing the founding document's language to derive direction on contemporary issues.
Last edited by Godular on Wed Dec 13, 2023 7:28 pm, edited 13 times in total.
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Outer Bratorke
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Postby Outer Bratorke » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:35 am

Conservatives working there ass off to make this country more and more dystopian. This is just more proof massive change is need to the supreme court.
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Kanadorika
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Postby Kanadorika » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:36 am

The government wants to own the bodies of both men and women. Nobody gets past.
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Diuhon
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Postby Diuhon » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:37 am

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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Hispida
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Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:37 am

unilateral support for rioters once they kick off
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Libertyvilla
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Ex-Nation

Postby Libertyvilla » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:38 am

i dont see a problem
this doesnt ban abortion
it just returns the right to the states
no big deal
i dont wanna die in a terrible nuclear war, so lets just end the war in ukraine and end this cold war and all be peaceful

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Eros Prime
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Founded: Jun 22, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Eros Prime » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:38 am

Now THIS is based. I am so incredibly happy rn. This was loooong overdue
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My post was in the top 10 first for the Roe V. Wade getting overturned thread
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Diuhon
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Diuhon » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:39 am

thomas mentioned obergefell, lawrence, and griswold as next on the chopping block

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:40 am

I mean, I support abortion rights...

but I think it makes sense that the Supreme Court shouldn't pretend that there's always been some constitutional message that forces all levels of governments to recognise abortion flowing from the days of the Founding Fathers. No one can in good faith say, "Yeah those Founding Fathers when they wrote that constitution, they totally intended for abortion to be a right" given the societal viewpoints of the day. In the 1700s, abortion just wasn't tolerated.

If the whole country later decided as a group, "we're going to constitutionalize this right" then go ahead. But otherwise, it seems like Roe v Wade was politics entering the judiciary.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Land of the Ephyral
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Democratic Socialists

Postby The Land of the Ephyral » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:40 am

That's pretty neat.

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Hispida
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Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:40 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:I mean, I support abortion rights...

but I think it makes sense that the Supreme Court shouldn't pretend that there's always been some constitutional message that forces all levels of governments to recognise abortion flowing from the days of the Founding Fathers. No one can in good faith say, "Yeah those Founding Fathers when they wrote that constitution, they totally intended for abortion to be a right" given the societal viewpoints of the day.

If the whole country later decided as a group, "we're going to constitutionalize this right" then go ahead. But otherwise, it seems like Roe v Wade was politics entering the judiciary.

politics and the judiciary are the same thing IM
they always have been
you can't pretend like they're separate anymore
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Diuhon
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Diuhon » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:41 am

Libertyvilla wrote:i dont see a problem
this doesnt ban abortion
it just returns the right to the states
no big deal

would anyone like to see who you can marry retvrn to the states? that means ditching obergefell and loving

or how about overturning brown with that logic? but of course you would, you republicans have the power now

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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Infected Mushroom
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:42 am

Hispida wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:I mean, I support abortion rights...

but I think it makes sense that the Supreme Court shouldn't pretend that there's always been some constitutional message that forces all levels of governments to recognise abortion flowing from the days of the Founding Fathers. No one can in good faith say, "Yeah those Founding Fathers when they wrote that constitution, they totally intended for abortion to be a right" given the societal viewpoints of the day.

If the whole country later decided as a group, "we're going to constitutionalize this right" then go ahead. But otherwise, it seems like Roe v Wade was politics entering the judiciary.

politics and the judiciary are the same thing IM
they always have been
you can't pretend like they're separate anymore


It's the same level of nonsense as the Supreme Court saying "2nd Amendment as written in the 1700s"... it clearly gives effect to permanent gun ownership rights including fully automatic weapons and firearms with repeating fire capability.

These things should be decided by the governments and legislated out, not interpreted and ruled by the courts.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Hispida
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Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:42 am

Libertyvilla wrote:i dont see a problem
this doesnt ban abortion
it just returns the right to the states
no big deal

more than half the country will now ban abortion

yeah "not a big deal" my ass
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Thomasi
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Founded: Jun 23, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Thomasi » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:43 am

Roe v Wade used the non existent right to privacy.

I support this because I am pro life progressive.

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Soviet cat
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 11
Founded: Jun 19, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Soviet cat » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:43 am

This is why I think Conservativism is Crap

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Libertyvilla
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Posts: 179
Founded: Aug 24, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Libertyvilla » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:44 am

Diuhon wrote:
Libertyvilla wrote:i dont see a problem
this doesnt ban abortion
it just returns the right to the states
no big deal

would anyone like to see who you can marry retvrn to the states? that means ditching obergefell and loving

or how about overturning brown with that logic? but of course you would, you republicans have the power now

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

yes actually
im all about states rights
in fact every state should be independent and decide
i dont wanna die in a terrible nuclear war, so lets just end the war in ukraine and end this cold war and all be peaceful

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Hispida
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Posts: 8397
Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:44 am

protestors are apparently gathering outside of the supreme court. hope they start rioting!!!

Thomasi wrote:Roe v Wade used the non existent right to privacy.

I support this because I am pro life progressive.

glad to know you support the murders of millions of women
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Loeje
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Founded: Feb 02, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Loeje » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:44 am

Diuhon wrote:thomas mentioned obergefell, lawrence, and griswold as next on the chopping block

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Obergefell? Really? If they overturn Obergefell, I don't think there's any hope anymore. But maybe that's selfish.
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Infected Mushroom
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Posts: 39236
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:44 am

You're a confident democracy right?

Then trust the people to vote out the correct responses state by state to abortion.

It's completely disingenuous to say "yeah the Constitution as it was written in the 1700s was always meant to include and protect abortion rights." I mean, that's basically a lie.

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Libertyvilla
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 179
Founded: Aug 24, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Libertyvilla » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:44 am

Hispida wrote:
Libertyvilla wrote:i dont see a problem
this doesnt ban abortion
it just returns the right to the states
no big deal

more than half the country will now ban abortion

yeah "not a big deal" my ass

okay and?
go to another state
maybe if biden lowered the gas prices it wouldnt be so expensice
or better yet learn to use a condon
i dont wanna die in a terrible nuclear war, so lets just end the war in ukraine and end this cold war and all be peaceful

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Hispida
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Posts: 8397
Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:45 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:You're a confident democracy right?

we're not a democracy period

never have been and never intended to be
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:45 am

Libertyvilla wrote:
Hispida wrote:more than half the country will now ban abortion

yeah "not a big deal" my ass

okay and?
go to another state
maybe if biden lowered the gas prices it wouldnt be so expensice
or better yet learn to use a condon

Liberty is non-negotiable.

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Soviet cat
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Posts: 11
Founded: Jun 19, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Soviet cat » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:46 am

I can't wait to see the Riot!

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Hispida
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Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:46 am

Libertyvilla wrote:
Hispida wrote:more than half the country will now ban abortion

yeah "not a big deal" my ass

okay and?
go to another state
maybe if biden lowered the gas prices it wouldnt be so expensice
or better yet learn to use a condon

condoms don't always work and a few states are actually working to make traveling to free states illegal too. plus the president can't affect gas prices but i digress

freedom is non-negotiable. this ruling violates the 14th amendment; "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws" and all that
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