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PASSWORD

Re: You are omnipotent, You are God

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

What would you do as a deity?

There would be evil and suffering, there would be a system involving eternal damnation
28
27%
There would be evil and suffering, there would NOT be a system involving eternal damnation
41
40%
There would NOT be evil and suffering, there would be a system involving eternal damnation
9
9%
There would NOT be evil and suffering, there would NOT be a system involving eternal damnation
25
24%
 
Total votes : 103

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Infected Mushroom
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Posts: 38575
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Re: You are omnipotent, You are God

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:00 pm

Please consider the following hypothetical:

You are an omnipotent deity. You can alter reality at all levels.

You must decide many things but here are two big issues:




1. Will there be evil and suffering?

You can end human suffering and evil immediately (using whatever way you see fit). Do you do it?

On the one hand, you could make the world a better place. On the other hand, you wouldn’t be able to test the morality of your subjects. Also, if people have no option to be evil and can’t cause any destruction, then it follows that free will has been removed (sort of) and it may be more important that people have that choice than their safety in this life and the next being protected.

2. Will there be a system of eternal damnation?

After the people die, will some individuals who didn’t play by your rules go to hell for all time to come? Will that be a thing?

On the one hand, it’s a violation of human rights and defies all notions of proportionality and fairness. But from another perspective, if they don’t believe in you, don’t love you as they should, and make this temporary phase of existence unbearable/unsustainable for others, shouldn’t there be infinite consequences?




Think about this and get back to me. I’d like reasons and justifications. With great power comes great responsibility. What would you do and why?

I would allow the world as it currently exists but send 100 percent of all people to eternal happiness after. This world would serve as a temporary story-creation palette so people have things to chat about when they all inevitably get to heaven. Whenever eternal bliss gets boring, I’d allow those in the afterlife to have another round on Earth with temporarily altered memories. This is a win win for all.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:03 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Space Squid
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Ex-Nation

Postby Space Squid » Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:05 pm

There will be suffering. There will be hell.

The damned shall endure an eternity of inane hypotheticals.
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Heloin
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Heloin » Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:54 pm

I'd make trains run on time.
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Page
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Page » Wed Jun 08, 2022 12:06 am

I'd make a world without suffering and with free will that Christian apologists think is impossible.

The rules of the universe:

If you steal something from somebody that they don't want to give up, an exact copy of that thing manifests so that both people can have the thing.

People have internal forcefields that activate whenever they're touched in a way they don't want to be touched, so there is no battery or rape or murder.

People can go through a metamorphosis just by willing it, changing their body type or biological sex or giving them wings as they please.

People can erase memories at will so that they can have novel experiences over and over.

Plants grow that are drugs that can provide euphoria or transcendental experiences that have no unwanted effects.

Sentient animals are invincible but there are also zombified versions of those animals that have no subjective experience so it isn't unethical to kill or eat them.

Otherwise it's like this world, you still have a million choices you can make, life just doesn't suck anymore.
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Nevertopia
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Nevertopia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 1:53 am

If I was really omnipotent arguably I'd be able to create a world without evil but still having free will. And I won't have to stone gay people to do it either.
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Arpasia
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Ex-Nation

Postby Arpasia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:01 am

Nope, I would not even think about creating a place of eternal purgatory for sinners, I'll just make the dead souls reside in "a beautiful place" before they would be reincarnated again. And furthermore, I will never end the universe through a quick and sudden death, I would let the universe succumb to heat death, and I would also have the cycle of the universe being created and dying be eternal.
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Nationalist Northumbria
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Postby Nationalist Northumbria » Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:04 am

Altering reality at all levels? I'll alter it to go back to my current life.

Maybe with some changes first though...
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Gopnikea
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Gopnikea » Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:11 am

If I was God, evil and suffering would exist. However, all of my subjects would feel pain of different sorts 24/7. But, the pain would also feel good so that they'll want more of the pain thus blurring the lines between pain and pleasure.
Furthermore, I will also enhance the feeling of pain by 10x everywhere, and increase the pain receptors of all living creatures.
Other than that, I would make it possible to replay memories so that they can relive their favourite events over and over again when they sleep.
In addition to all of that, anyone can change their appearance at will, so if they are unhappy with their current appearance they can easily morph into their desired form at any given moment. It also includes the ability to grow, modify or remove certain unwanted body parts which may make some people turn into abominations as they choose.
There is no hell or heaven, there is no death because everyone will live forever in pain and pleasure. Also, murder is legal.
And finally, I would also want to join in the fun as their god, so I would manifest different forms and walk among my subjects at will.
Also, everyone worships me at their own decision.

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Thermodolia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:14 am

If people don’t believe in me I don’t really give a shit, so there’s really no reason for an eternal punishment.

In fact eternal paradise wouldn’t be a thing either, as people would constantly reincarnate

And yes you can have free will without also having suffering as Page pointed out.
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The Selkie
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Selkie » Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:21 am

What would be good without evil? What would be salvation without damnation? What would light be without shadow?
No, neither would I depose of "Evil", a very foggy and vague term anyway, nor would I abolish a system of eternal damnation, though I would make it both look like the version described by Dante in the Divine Comedy and I'd make sure, that there is a way to attain eternal happiness, too (though not in the Dante-Way).
Higher on my list of priorities would be ending world hunger (and thirst, for that matter), snapping away climate change as if Q was my middle name and making sure, that there is a way for humans to achieve FTL-Travel. After that, plagues and sicknesses, especially the fucking common cold.

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Ostroeuropa
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ostroeuropa » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:08 am

I'd definitely have evil. The afterlife would probably be along the lines of allowing people to be lesser gods of their own planets and deciding their own rules, save for the fact that all sapient life gets the same deal (As well as some safeguards like; "Oh it turns out if you design creatures who live longer than 1000 years there's an ability to self-terminate at will, one of those fundamental rules that nobody wrote. Nobody.").

I wouldn't tell anyone this while they were alive.

Other than that "Meta-rule", i'd run my planet as normal. Maybe even pretend to the other "lesser gods" as they start emerging that i'm just one of them. I'd have a scattering of aliens too just to keep the pretense, maybe a few artificially made lesser gods so the first person to die doesn't meet me and put 2+2 together.

The primary planet i'd probably toy with over time to keep myself entertained. Change rules here and there, spice things up. I would probably listen to prayers but they're likely to catch on i'm working on pactverse rules. That is, you have to make it interesting if you want an intervention. It's less about good and evil and whether you're managing to be interesting narratively. If you pray to me for some twisted fucked up shit but it's sufficiently cool i'll do it.

I'd probably pretend to be certain gods the people made up and act it out as that god a bit, including evil ones. Manifesting occasionally and being like "Tis I, Cthulhu!" and granting various requests in battles with myself as other gods and their followers. Give the folks what they want, in a way.

Presumably i'd get fond of certain people and have to angst over whether allowing them to die and get their own planet or extending their lives as my champions. As a deity I can presumably mind wipe them so I could just be straightforward with those individuals and ask their preference and then remove their memory of the conversation. Probably open with;

"I have a very important thing to ask you but if I ask you, I will have to wipe your memory of the question once you answer it. Is that alright?". I could also just divine their preference I suppose but that's a little invasive if I actually do like them.

Such champions would probably end up as demi-gods within the primary planet rather than lesser gods with their own one elsewhere.

Chiefly i'd be motivated by being entertained. I don't think eternal suffering is all that entertaining.

The people would probably figure this out about me eventually. They'd notice that things like "Well a new continent with dragons and elves and an evil wizard just appeared. God must be bored again.".

If anybody manages to piece together the whole system, I wouldn't confirm or deny it. Even to them. Unless I was very, very, fond of them, and trusted them to keep it to themselves.

It's possible we see some interesting results from that kind of deity, for example, persecution of fiction writers. "Don't. Give. Him. Ideas. We do not need a continent full of shoggoths.". I'd have to intervene in that case as it would defeat the purpose a bit.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:35 am, edited 18 times in total.
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Catalonia 2070 RP
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Catalonia 2070 RP » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:13 am

Without suffering, joy is meaningless. Removing suffering removes the excitement of being. On the other hand, I also don't like hell cause its messed up. So...

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Amerysia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Amerysia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:32 am

It would be a very boring kind of paradise. There would be no evil, no suffering, and no hell. So, perhaps paradoxically, it would be torment for many people.

There would be no STDs or HIV. There would be no prudery or anything of that nature. There would be no marriage in the way that we define it these days, either. Profiteering would be gone, too. Human civilization would be nothing but a bunch of hippie-like communes.
Last edited by Amerysia on Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Northern Seleucia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Northern Seleucia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:35 am

I'd have a hell and there will be suffering, tbh. Can't even lie.
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Amerysia
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Founded: Nov 09, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Amerysia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:39 am

Northern Seleucia wrote:I'd have a hell and there will be suffering, tbh. Can't even lie.


Why?
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Merconitonitopia
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Merconitonitopia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:40 am

I would fill the cosmos with hedonium.
No suffering, no evil; nothing but an endless well of eternal, maximal bliss, forever!

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Catalonia 2070 RP
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Catalonia 2070 RP » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:42 am

The devil in option 3 would be unemployed. Why have a hell but no evil? It's like having belts, but no trousers.

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Ethel mermania
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Ethel mermania » Wed Jun 08, 2022 5:27 am

No evil, with eternal dammnation.


You litter, abuse animals, or push people in front of subway trains, you burn in hell.

Cause I am petty that way.
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Amerysia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Amerysia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 5:30 am

Ethel mermania wrote:No evil, with eternal dammnation.


You litter, abuse animals, or push people in front of subway trains, you burn in hell.

Cause I am petty that way.


I wouldn't send anyone to Hell, but if one pulled into the crosswalk and blocked off pedestrians, they would be struck by a sudden bolt of lightning.
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Exxosia
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Anarchy

Postby Exxosia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 5:38 am

Evil and suffering is not something that an omnipotent god can fix. Humans are just miserable and make their own. Omnipotence does not mean I won't get bored of cleaning up their latest misery party and just leave them to it.

There would not be eternal afterlife suffering, they die, the other dead exact their torments upon them, eventually the number of dead that hold a grudge let it go.

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Kannap
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Wed Jun 08, 2022 5:48 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:Please consider the following hypothetical:


hell no

Infected Mushroom wrote:You are an omnipotent deity. You can alter reality at all levels.


Oh hell yeah, cool!

Infected Mushroom wrote:You must decide many things but here are two big issues:




1. Will there be evil and suffering?

You can end human suffering and evil immediately (using whatever way you see fit). Do you do it?

On the one hand, you could make the world a better place. On the other hand, you wouldn’t be able to test the morality of your subjects. Also, if people have no option to be evil and can’t cause any destruction, then it follows that free will has been removed (sort of) and it may be more important that people have that choice than their safety in this life and the next being protected.


Of course I end human suffering and evil immediately. I'm not some weird sicko freak who thrives on human suffering and evil.

Infected Mushroom wrote:2. Will there be a system of eternal damnation?

After the people die, will some individuals who didn’t play by your rules go to hell for all time to come? Will that be a thing?


Of course there will be no eternal damnation. If I've made sure there's no human suffering or evil in the world during their lifetimes, why would I suddenly make them suffer and act evilly in their magical eternal afterlife?

Infected Mushroom wrote:But from another perspective, if they don’t believe in you, don’t love you as they should, and make this temporary phase of existence unbearable/unsustainable for others, shouldn’t there be infinite consequences?


Who cares if they don't believe in me or love me? They don't deserve eternal suffering.
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Kannap
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Wed Jun 08, 2022 6:10 am

Heloin wrote:I'd make trains run on time.


finally, a god I can get behind.

Gallia- wrote:I'd make anime real.


and of course there must be a devil.
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Kannap
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Wed Jun 08, 2022 6:11 am

Nevertopia wrote:If I was really omnipotent arguably I'd be able to create a world without evil but still having free will. And I won't have to stone gay people to do it either.


It's certainly a weird worldview to hold that removing the ability to perform evil would revoke somebody's free will, as if there aren't a bajillion ways to live without harming people.
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Countesia
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Countesia » Wed Jun 08, 2022 6:21 am

If I was omnipotent then that means I know someone's future with 100% accuracy. I would connect myself to a computer that would allow some sort of Minority Report style police force to know what crimes are about to committed with exact knowledge of the time, location, victims and perpetrators, with an emphasis on violent crimes. I would not take away free will but I will end all murder, rape, paedophilia ect.

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