by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:00 am
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:15 am
by Washington Resistance Army » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:16 am
by Indomitable Friendship » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:19 am
Hukhalia wrote:i for one approve of the shafting of "an"caps in the OP
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:20 am
by Uan aa Boa » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:22 am
Jewish Underground State wrote:So to start this thread off. If anarchism calls for no authority does that mean that anarchist groups are breaking their own principles since any organization of a group needs an authority to hold the group together?
by Indomitable Friendship » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:29 am
Hukhalia wrote:Indomitable Friendship wrote:I've always found this sentiment curious. In all forms of Anarchism, you still have authorities over labor, except in some, you're not allowed to use money, which is authoritarian in itself.
it isnt that you aren't allowed to use money, only that the need for money never arises
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:33 am
Indomitable Friendship wrote:Hukhalia wrote:it isnt that you aren't allowed to use money, only that the need for money never arises
I doubt that AnComs would permit it, as they seem rather authoritarian, but you still have authority bodies governing labor & there was already an Anarchist state that tried doing without a monetary system to immediate failure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhnovshchina#Money
Moneyless trade doesn't scale up. It's only feasible for small underdeveloped communities. I'm not actually an AnCap, but the labelling of it as not Anarchism is misplaced when there is authority over labor in every system except for the most rudimentary & simplistic 1's. AnCap is the closest thing we have to modern Anarchism being feasible in the modern world.
by Indomitable Friendship » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:36 am
Hukhalia wrote:Indomitable Friendship wrote:I doubt that AnComs would permit it, as they seem rather authoritarian, but you still have authority bodies governing labor & there was already an Anarchist state that tried doing without a monetary system to immediate failure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhnovshchina#Money
Moneyless trade doesn't scale up. It's only feasible for small underdeveloped communities. I'm not actually an AnCap, but the labelling of it as not Anarchism is misplaced when there is authority over labor in every system except for the most rudimentary & simplistic 1's. AnCap is the closest thing we have to modern Anarchism being feasible in the modern world.
i mean this is all mainly because anarchism is incapable of existing in the first place as authority bodies will always exist, much moreso in warzones
you're looking for the wrong girl to defend anarchism, lol, i'm just outlining the theory
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:40 am
Indomitable Friendship wrote:Hukhalia wrote:it isnt that you aren't allowed to use money, only that the need for money never arises
I doubt that AnComs would permit it, as they seem rather authoritarian, but you still have authority bodies governing labor & there was already an Anarchist state that tried doing without a monetary system to immediate failure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhnovshchina#Money
Moneyless trade doesn't scale up. It's only feasible for small underdeveloped communities. I'm not actually an AnCap, but the labelling of it as not Anarchism is misplaced when there is authority over labor in every system except for the most rudimentary & simplistic 1's. AnCap is the closest thing we have to modern Anarchism being feasible in the modern world.
by Adamede » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:41 am
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:42 am
Adamede wrote:I actually respect anarchists to an extent, I feel like they're probably the revoltuionary group least likely to push me against a wall and shoot me but I also sympathise with the wanting to do away with unjust hierarchies and truly free mankind. However I just find it impractical. Anarchist movements have been crushed by any organized state they ever fought. Tey put up a good fight, but organized armies tend to npt be very anarchist, so you either get a not very anarchist militiant organization which tdefacto ends up becoming a state of some kind, or you get an ineffectual bunch of guerrillas.
E: Also I doubt an anarachist society would be able to sustaine the high tech lifestyles of our current civilizations.
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:43 am
Adamede wrote:I actually respect anarchists to an extent, I feel like they're probably the revoltuionary group least likely to push me against a wall and shoot me but I also sympathise with the wanting to do away with unjust hierarchies and truly free mankind. However I just find it impractical. Anarchist movements have been crushed by any organized state they ever fought. Tey put up a good fight, but organized armies tend to npt be very anarchist, so you either get a not very anarchist militiant organization which tdefacto ends up becoming a state of some kind, or you get an ineffectual bunch of guerrillas.
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:43 am
Jewish Underground State wrote:Adamede wrote:I actually respect anarchists to an extent, I feel like they're probably the revoltuionary group least likely to push me against a wall and shoot me but I also sympathise with the wanting to do away with unjust hierarchies and truly free mankind. However I just find it impractical. Anarchist movements have been crushed by any organized state they ever fought. Tey put up a good fight, but organized armies tend to npt be very anarchist, so you either get a not very anarchist militiant organization which tdefacto ends up becoming a state of some kind, or you get an ineffectual bunch of guerrillas.
The Makhnovists were pretty overconfident in their ability to get new members. The lost to the Soviets since most people would rather have peace over freedom.
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:44 am
by Indomitable Friendship » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:44 am
Jewish Underground State wrote:Indomitable Friendship wrote:I doubt that AnComs would permit it, as they seem rather authoritarian, but you still have authority bodies governing labor & there was already an Anarchist state that tried doing without a monetary system to immediate failure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhnovshchina#Money
Moneyless trade doesn't scale up. It's only feasible for small underdeveloped communities. I'm not actually an AnCap, but the labelling of it as not Anarchism is misplaced when there is authority over labor in every system except for the most rudimentary & simplistic 1's. AnCap is the closest thing we have to modern Anarchism being feasible in the modern world.
We should also look at Catalonia during the spanish civil war
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:44 am
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:46 am
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:48 am
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:48 am
by Hukhalia » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:48 am
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:50 am
Hukhalia wrote:Jewish Underground State wrote:But they helped the soviets at first. Makhno even talked to Lenin and Trotsky. The ussr even made false rumors on how he was committing pogroms when members of Nambat joined his Free Territory.
shrug. he was an obstacle. obstacles get removed. 'tis how war works. makhno wouldn't have been content to sit on top of his hastily-organised house of cards forever.
by Jewish Underground State » Sun Jun 05, 2022 10:51 am
Adamede wrote:I actually respect anarchists to an extent, I feel like they're probably the revoltuionary group least likely to push me against a wall and shoot me but I also sympathise with the wanting to do away with unjust hierarchies and truly free mankind. However I just find it impractical. Anarchist movements have been crushed by any organized state they ever fought. Tey put up a good fight, but organized armies tend to npt be very anarchist, so you either get a not very anarchist militiant organization which tdefacto ends up becoming a state of some kind, or you get an ineffectual bunch of guerrillas.
E: Also I doubt an anarachist society would be able to sustaine the high tech lifestyles of our current civilizations.
by The Blaschy » Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:12 am
Adamede wrote:I actually respect anarchists to an extent, I feel like they're probably the revoltuionary group least likely to push me against a wall and shoot me but I also sympathise with the wanting to do away with unjust hierarchies and truly free mankind. However I just find it impractical. Anarchist movements have been crushed by any organized state they ever fought. Tey put up a good fight, but organized armies tend to npt be very anarchist, so you either get a not very anarchist militiant organization which tdefacto ends up becoming a state of some kind, or you get an ineffectual bunch of guerrillas.
E: Also I doubt an anarachist society would be able to sustaine the high tech lifestyles of our current civilizations.
by Sordhau » Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:40 am
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