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Capitalism Forever?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Do you press the button?

Yes (goodbye capitalism)
141
58%
No (capitalism forever)
102
42%
 
Total votes : 243

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37916
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Capitalism Forever?

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:13 pm

Please consider the following hypothetical:

There is a one-time button you can press, it expires in 24 hours. If you press it, capitalism in the entire world will be overthrown in a timeline ranging from a few months to a whole decades; a new political ideology and economic system will take over. You don’t know how (violently or peacefully), you don’t know how fast, you don’t know how many will die, you don’t know what ideology or system will replace it, you don’t know whether the alternative will work or not.

If you don’t press the button though, then capitalism will be fated to NEVER be overthrown in the entire world. We will have capitalism until the end of human civilization, whenever that is. No matter what systemic pressures emerge, no matter how unsustainable or unworkable it may become, somehow the global capitalist elite will keep holding on to power and keep it running. A permanent world of consumerism, exploitation of labour, profiteering, stock markets, corporations etc…

Do you press the button? Why?

It’s a hard one but I would probably press it. Capitalism is probably not the end stage of political/economic evolution and freezing us there in the alternative would be a mistake. At the same time, I am a bit concerned about what chaos could be unleashed but it may be a necessary risk.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Untecna
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Founded: Jun 02, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Untecna » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:16 pm

I would press it. Despite not knowing how things will happen, its better to hope for the best.
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Haruhi Japan
Envoy
 
Posts: 252
Founded: Sep 17, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Haruhi Japan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:20 pm

Capitalism is based so no.
"No! Everyone will tell you to let it go and move on, but don't! Instead, let it fester and boil inside of you! Take these feelings and lock them away. Let them fuel your actions. Let hate be your ally, and you will be capable of wonderful, horrid things."

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Kerwa
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1179
Founded: Jul 24, 2021
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Kerwa » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:24 pm

It doesn’t matter. People are howling shits with little to no control over their actions. Press it, or not, people will still be foul to each other and make each other miserable.

(If you even can overthrow “capitalism”)

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Jerzylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13221
Founded: Aug 10, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Jerzylvania » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:30 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:Please consider the following hypothetical:

There is a one-time button you can press, it expires in 24 hours. If you press it, capitalism in the entire world will be overthrown in a timeline ranging from a few months to a whole decades; a new political ideology and economic system will take over. You don’t know how (violently or peacefully), you don’t know how fast, you don’t know how many will die, you don’t know what ideology or system will replace it, you don’t know whether the alternative will work or not.

If you don’t press the button though, then capitalism will be fated to NEVER be overthrown in the entire world. We will have capitalism until the end of human civilization, whenever that is. No matter what systemic pressures emerge, no matter how unsustainable or unworkable it may become, somehow the global capitalist elite will keep holding on to power and keep it running. A permanent world of consumerism, exploitation of labour, profiteering, stock markets, corporations etc…

Do you press the button? Why?

It’s a hard one but I would probably press it. Capitalism is probably not the end stage of political/economic evolution and freezing us there in the alternative would be a mistake. At the same time, I am a bit concerned about what chaos could be unleashed but it may be a necessary risk.


Wasn't that damn button removed?
Iirc it was about a week before Thanksgiving in November of 1963 ...in Texas.
Last edited by Jerzylvania on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Jinggangshan
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 129
Founded: Jul 17, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Jinggangshan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:30 pm

Ok, that's just a no-brainer. *whistles internationale*
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Dexterra
Diplomat
 
Posts: 831
Founded: May 05, 2021
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Dexterra » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:31 pm

Let's see. I'm bracing myself to lose health insurance when I most need it, I have few functional or active labor and consumer rights, and in my nearest city, more and more people are quitting their jobs and living in tents. Meanwhile, memelord billionaires have recently been shooting off to space while the Arctic melts and millions starve from one of the largest, most egregiously profiteering extractions of wealth in human history.

I will spam that button like an F7 summerposter until even the mere thought of capitalism is forever extinguished from the Earth.
Last edited by Dexterra on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Deblar
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Founded: Jan 28, 2021
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Deblar » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:33 pm

I'm not just pressing that button, i'm clobbering it with a sledgehammer

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Jinggangshan
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 129
Founded: Jul 17, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Jinggangshan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:34 pm

Hey, let's just rename this one as "The Socialist Thread" 8)

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Last edited by Jinggangshan on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jadi-Gas
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 2
Founded: May 03, 2021
Democratic Socialists

On Capitalism

Postby Jadi-Gas » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:37 pm

This reminds me, I tried making my nation generally with a socialist-based economy and political system, however nationsates seems to only go in extremes. With that, I accidentally turned my country's economy Capitalist, not really willingly though (there's also been other instances where I accidentally made a decision that I don't agree with, however the alternative would've also been extreme. Such as in banning sports, abolishing prisons, having the death penalty, and compulsory organ harvesting after a citizen dies). Some of the prompts here can seem vague, or maybe I just don't know how to read lol.

Also this is my first post, and I don't really know how to word these, but hey, at least I can try I suppose.

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Jinggangshan
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 129
Founded: Jul 17, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Jinggangshan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:40 pm

Jadi-Gas wrote:This reminds me, I tried making my nation generally with a socialist-based economy and political system, however nationsates seems to only go in extremes. With that, I accidentally turned my country's economy Capitalist, not really willingly though (there's also been other instances where I accidentally made a decision that I don't agree with, however the alternative would've also been extreme. Such as in banning sports, abolishing prisons, having the death penalty, and compulsory organ harvesting after a citizen dies). Some of the prompts here can seem vague, or maybe I just don't know how to read lol.

Also this is my first post, and I don't really know how to word these, but hey, at least I can try I suppose.


seems to me the trick is having socialism installed on creation, and then slowly work up the economy as much as you can while maintaining proper policy on economics and civil rights.
中国共产党万岁!
Cives, floreat Europa
Opus magnum vocat vos
Stellae signa sunt in caelo
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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 51309
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:44 pm

Dexterra wrote:Let's see. I'm bracing myself to lose health insurance when I most need it, I have few functional or active labor and consumer rights, and in my nearest city, more and more people are quitting their jobs and living in tents. Meanwhile, memelord billionaires have recently been shooting off to space while the Arctic melts and millions starve from one of the largest, most egregiously profiteering extractions of wealth in human history.

I will spam that button like an F7 summerposter until even the mere thought of capitalism is forever extinguished from the Earth.


This more or less perfectly captures my feelings.

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Hispida
Senator
 
Posts: 4405
Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:46 pm

why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism
Last edited by Hispida on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37916
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:48 pm

Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism


Some people may value stability and worry about what they could lose

Most people my parent’s generation probably wouldn’t press it because they come from a time where capitalism was seen in a better light

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Hispida
Senator
 
Posts: 4405
Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:53 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism


Some people may value stability and worry about what they could lose

Most people my parent’s generation probably wouldn’t press it because they come from a time where capitalism was seen in a better light

to the people who value stability and the status quo i have three words: "cry about it"

the world is rapidly deteriorating and if action is not taken against the status quo now we might not even have a world in a few decades
le epic pomp and circumstance
i now have a basic overview factbook
leninist, revolutionary socialist, non-denominational trinitarian universalist. he/they
"Like a blind puppy sniffing at random first in one direction and then in another"
"Mr. 'Muddleheaded Counsellor'!"
"It sounds just like he were chewing rags in his sleep!"
"Thanks to such a fraud"
"he utterly fails to understand"
"Kautsky has beaten the world record in the liberal distortion of Marx"
"Kautsky... ...inevitably proves to be a lackey of the bourgeoisie."
Victory Day: February 23, 2022

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Hispida
Senator
 
Posts: 4405
Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:53 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism


Some people may value stability and worry about what they could lose

Most people my parent’s generation probably wouldn’t press it because they come from a time where capitalism was seen in a better light

to the people who value stability and the status quo i have three words: "cry about it"

the world is rapidly deteriorating and if action is not taken against the status quo now we might not even have a world in a few decades
le epic pomp and circumstance
i now have a basic overview factbook
leninist, revolutionary socialist, non-denominational trinitarian universalist. he/they
"Like a blind puppy sniffing at random first in one direction and then in another"
"Mr. 'Muddleheaded Counsellor'!"
"It sounds just like he were chewing rags in his sleep!"
"Thanks to such a fraud"
"he utterly fails to understand"
"Kautsky has beaten the world record in the liberal distortion of Marx"
"Kautsky... ...inevitably proves to be a lackey of the bourgeoisie."
Victory Day: February 23, 2022

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Cruciland
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Posts: 4647
Founded: Dec 22, 2011
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby Cruciland » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:53 pm

Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism

Honestly, fascism would be a blessing. It's one of the only alternatives to capitalism that didn't collapse under its own weight- massive foreign intervention was the only way it could end.
Last edited by Cruciland on Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jadi-Gas
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 2
Founded: May 03, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Jadi-Gas » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:54 pm

Jinggangshan wrote:seems to me the trick is having socialism installed on creation, and then slowly work up the economy as much as you can while maintaining proper policy on economics and civil rights.


Yeah, I think I just went too far on the whole thingy with Capitalism. But I generally did the other steps.

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Cannonio
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 45
Founded: Dec 28, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Cannonio » Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:58 pm

Cruciland wrote:
Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism

Honestly, fascism would be a blessing. It's one of the only alternatives to capitalism that didn't collapse under its own weight- massive foreign intervention was the only way it could end.

What about a leaniant monarchy? Monarchies survived for centuries?
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Hispida
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Founded: Jun 21, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Hispida » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:00 pm

Cruciland wrote:
Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism

Honestly, fascism would be a blessing. It's one of the only alternatives to capitalism that didn't collapse under its own weight- massive foreign intervention was the only way it could end.

hahahahaha no

fascism is the ultimate enemy to basic morality and human individuality; it is defined on the elimination of the notion that the citizen and the state are different entities. it will eliminate anything -- anything -- that can be viewed as antithetical to the state: socialism, religion, individuality, feminism, &c.

and even then... yes, fascism did collapse under its own weight
nazi germany was on the brink of economic collapse in 1939 and the production of both italy and japan was extremely low compared to the demands of the state. north korea is only surviving because of chinese support and the PRC is still alive because it has a strange mix of capitalism and corporatism and hasn't fully committed to either, making it a rather unique example of productive fascism; but this is the exception, not the example. a lot of the PRC's production is also rooted in the transitioning-to-capitalism era and the socialist era, not the modern fascist era, making the argument that it's efficient because of fascism pretty redundant
Last edited by Hispida on Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
le epic pomp and circumstance
i now have a basic overview factbook
leninist, revolutionary socialist, non-denominational trinitarian universalist. he/they
"Like a blind puppy sniffing at random first in one direction and then in another"
"Mr. 'Muddleheaded Counsellor'!"
"It sounds just like he were chewing rags in his sleep!"
"Thanks to such a fraud"
"he utterly fails to understand"
"Kautsky has beaten the world record in the liberal distortion of Marx"
"Kautsky... ...inevitably proves to be a lackey of the bourgeoisie."
Victory Day: February 23, 2022

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 51309
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:01 pm

Cruciland wrote:
Hispida wrote:why in the world would you not press it

the only bad thing that can happen is if the new system is like, fascism or something
or God forbid trotskyism

Honestly, fascism would be a blessing. It's one of the only alternatives to capitalism that didn't collapse under its own weight- massive foreign intervention was the only way it could end.


This is really only true of Fascist Italy and that isn't exactly a model to appeal to given its vast array of failures; Germany was on the fast track to total economic collapse because its economics were insanely unsustainable.

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Neanderthaland
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8586
Founded: Sep 10, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Neanderthaland » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:03 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:Please consider the following hypothetical:

There is a one-time button you can press

I press it.

I press the big red button.

I don't care what it does.
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Dominioan
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Founded: Dec 10, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Dominioan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:04 pm

Violently could mean that some random guy is the last person surviving after the world collapses, so technically it means capitalism is overthrown.

I ain't pushing that button. There's way too many reprehensible ideologies in the world.
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Fauzjhia
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Founded: Jul 29, 2014
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fauzjhia » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:08 pm

Yes I do press the button.
Without any doubt.
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Dominioan
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Founded: Dec 10, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Dominioan » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:09 pm

Fauzjhia wrote:Yes I do press the button.
Without any doubt.

So you're willing to accept a high chance of fascism, or totalitarian communism?
Help i'm addicted to pain so I keep coming back to this site
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Cool person

I've read 1984, so I can confirm this is in fact 1984

BOOMER SOONER
CHOP ON

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