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AUKUS: Is this the start of WWIII?

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Trivalve
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AUKUS: Is this the start of WWIII?

Postby Trivalve » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:59 am

As some people here may know, Australia, United States and the United Kingdom publicly announced that they have created a new military alliance in response to tensions with China. Do you think that by publicly announcing this military alliance, they have lit the spark that will start world war 3? In my opinion, I think that this going to create another cold war because I believe that Russia will decide to support China by creating a new alliance which will result in other communist countries showing their support to China.
Last edited by Trivalve on Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Grave_n_idle » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:14 am

Trivalve wrote:As some people here may know, Australia, United States and the United Kingdom publicly announced that they have created a new military alliance in response to tensions with China. Do you think that by publicly announcing this military alliance, they have lit the spark that will start world war 3? In my opinion, I think that this going to create another cold war because I believe that Russia will decide to support China by creating a new alliance which will result in other communist countries showing their support to China.


World War 3? No.

Cold War 1.5? Maybe.

It's a really bad sign for the UK, though - it only further isolates us in Europe and Pacific Rim politics don't really help us.
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Trivalve
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Postby Trivalve » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:20 am

Grave_n_idle wrote:
Trivalve wrote:As some people here may know, Australia, United States and the United Kingdom publicly announced that they have created a new military alliance in response to tensions with China. Do you think that by publicly announcing this military alliance, they have lit the spark that will start world war 3? In my opinion, I think that this going to create another cold war because I believe that Russia will decide to support China by creating a new alliance which will result in other communist countries showing their support to China.


World War 3? No.

Cold War 1.5? Maybe.

It's a really bad sign for the UK, though - it only further isolates us in Europe and Pacific Rim politics don't really help us.

It can't be too bad. A lot of European countries aren't communists so you may still be supported. Evan with BREXIT I believe that you would be supported. Though I disagree that this should have been publicly announced to the world, I believe that this alliance will further re-enforce our nations bond so you wont be too disadvantaged :)
Last edited by Trivalve on Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Free Metropolitan France
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Postby Free Metropolitan France » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:21 am

I don't think it's the start of WW3 rather the start of the New Cold War in making. World tensions are palpable.

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Sevincia Los Espocedo
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Postby Sevincia Los Espocedo » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:23 am

Guess France will be happy for the billions in contract punishment aus Australiala does not take the conventional subs from them after all.
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Trivalve
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Postby Trivalve » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:28 am

Free Metropolitan France wrote:I don't think it's the start of WW3 rather the start of the New Cold War in making. World tensions are palpable.

Tensions are horrible at the moment. Russia and the US have been looking for an excuse to go at each other for a while now and I am worried that this may be the excuse Russia was looking for.
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Free Metropolitan France
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Postby Free Metropolitan France » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:37 am

Trivalve wrote:
Free Metropolitan France wrote:I don't think it's the start of WW3 rather the start of the New Cold War in making. World tensions are palpable.

Tensions are horrible at the moment. Russia and the US have been looking for an excuse to go at each other for a while now and I am worried that this may be the excuse Russia was looking for.

Oh, I absolutely agree with you. Both sides are looking at something to grab on. Ukrainian border, Taiwan, South China sea you name it.

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Bombadil
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Postby Bombadil » Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:55 am

Taiwan is a clearly stated goal for the CCP, the unification of China is at the heart of CCP ideology. It’s an issue. The world can ignore it or not. On the one side you might argue that it’s the limit of CCP colonial ambitions, to take and integrate an independent democratic nation. You might argue it’s no different to the US using military force to install democracy in Iraq, or overturn democracy in many countries to forestall socialist governments.

We accept Afghanistan falling to the Taliban, Myanmar and Thailand falling to military control, HK losing rights and freedoms of speech.

Does the world accept a relatively modern economy, a relatively, if not advanced, democracy - I’ve shared previously how Taiwan invites hackers to build consensus platforms - a relatively free people, to fall under the direct control of one person - Xi Jinping - and his vision for a hivemind, thought-controlled society.

If China guarantees the freedom of Taiwan to determine its own future, something it promised for HK at least until 2047, and reneged on.. then sure, take no measures.

Yet they don’t and won’t, every day there’s incursions into Taiwan air and sea space.

As my mother always said.. it takes two to tango, China has as much responsibility to de-escalate this situation.

*and yes, I will continue to use CCP, it’s not ‘of China’, it’s CCP first.
Last edited by Bombadil on Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Gigalaxy
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Postby Gigalaxy » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:02 am

Suggestion: it´s the military force behind the Five Eyes (close co-operation between their military and civilian secret services, a.k.a. alphabet agencies).

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Free Metropolitan France
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Postby Free Metropolitan France » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:34 am

Bombadil wrote:Taiwan is a clearly stated goal for the CCP, the unification of China is at the heart of CCP ideology. It’s an issue. The world can ignore it or not. On the one side, you might argue that it’s the limit of CCP colonial ambitions, to take and integrate an independent democratic nation. You might argue it’s no different to the US using military force to install democracy in Iraq or overturn democracy in many countries to forestall socialist governments.

We accept Afghanistan falling to the Taliban, Myanmar and Thailand falling to military control, HK losing rights and freedoms of speech.

Does the world accept a relatively modern economy, a relatively, if not advanced, democracy - I’ve shared previously how Taiwan invites hackers to build consensus platforms - a relatively free people, to fall under the direct control of one person - Xi Jinping - and his vision for a hivemind, thought-controlled society.

If China guarantees the freedom of Taiwan to determine its own future, something it promised for HK at least until 2047 and reneged on.. then sure, take no measures.

Yet they don’t and won’t, every day there are incursions into Taiwan air and sea space.

As my mother always said.. it takes two to tango, China has as much responsibility to de-escalate this situation.

*and yes, I will continue to use CCP, it’s not ‘of China’, it’s CCP first.


I'm in complete agreement with you on some of the points you've made above.
  1. I completely agree with you that China every day violates the airspace of Taiwan every and wants to provoke military action from Taiwan so it can justify an imminent invasion of Taipei.
  2. The same goes for Russia and Ukraine. Russian aggression is immeasurable in East Europe. Recently it hosted joint Russian-Belarus military drills with more than 200,000 troops which speaks volumes for itself. It's not a peanut. It's indirectly and directly a message to NATO and especially Ukraine.
  3. CCP actions are very nasty and are intimidation to Taiwan, Japan, the Philippines and others. South China sea is another big ticking bomb ready to explode at any minute. Even though International laws had clearly stated in 2016 that south china doesn't belong to China but nevertheless China claims sovereignty over it.
  4. Taiwan must be protected at all costs. It's a democracy where people have civil rights as well as political rights it serves as a model to other Asian nations what they can achieve. And I for my whole life has recognised Taiwan as true China not The Regime Of Mao and its successors.

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Diahon
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Postby Diahon » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:48 am

Bombadil wrote:Taiwan is a clearly stated goal for the CCP, the unification of China is at the heart of CCP ideology. It’s an issue. The world can ignore it or not. On the one side you might argue that it’s the limit of CCP colonial ambitions, to take and integrate an independent democratic nation. You might argue it’s no different to the US using military force to install democracy in Iraq, or overturn democracy in many countries to forestall socialist governments.

We accept Afghanistan falling to the Taliban, Myanmar and Thailand falling to military control, HK losing rights and freedoms of speech.

Does the world accept a relatively modern economy, a relatively, if not advanced, democracy - I’ve shared previously how Taiwan invites hackers to build consensus platforms - a relatively free people, to fall under the direct control of one person - Xi Jinping - and his vision for a hivemind, thought-controlled society.

If China guarantees the freedom of Taiwan to determine its own future, something it promised for HK at least until 2047, and reneged on.. then sure, take no measures.

Yet they don’t and won’t, every day there’s incursions into Taiwan air and sea space.

As my mother always said.. it takes two to tango, China has as much responsibility to de-escalate this situation.

*and yes, I will continue to use CCP, it’s not ‘of China’, it’s CCP first.

well said

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Postby Grave_n_idle » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:54 am

Trivalve wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:
World War 3? No.

Cold War 1.5? Maybe.

It's a really bad sign for the UK, though - it only further isolates us in Europe and Pacific Rim politics don't really help us.

It can't be too bad. A lot of European countries aren't communists so you may still be supported. Evan with BREXIT I believe that you would be supported. Though I disagree that this should have been publicly announced to the world, I believe that this alliance will further re-enforce our nations bond so you wont be too disadvantaged :)


We deliberately broke ranks with Europe, even though it's been a terrible idea, terribly executed. Now, we've been party to the French getting screwed out of a lucrative defence contract and we're trying to build political strength with Pacific Rim powers - there's little incentive for Europe to offer us any favours.

What we should probably be thinking about even more are the two questions of whether we're going to see a Sino-Soviet pact, and where Japan is going to throw it's hat in the new Pacific Rim.
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Diahon
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Postby Diahon » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:01 am

any reason to doubt japan and south korea joining up?

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Postby Greatest States Of America » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:02 am

Diahon wrote:any reason to doubt japan and south korea joining up?

Absolutely No or Whatsoever.
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Postby Greatest States Of America » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:03 am

Not to forget North Korea tests of Ballistic and Cruise missiles. No doubt North Korea is boldened by its big brother China.
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Postby Tinhampton » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:04 am

Trivalve wrote:In my opinion, I think that this going to create another cold war because I believe that Russia will decide to support China by creating a new alliance...

The Shanghai Cooperation Organisation exists already.

Trivalve wrote:...which will result in other communist countries showing their support to China.

What - the combined might of North Korea, Vietnam, Laos, and possibly Cuba (all of whom are already allies of PR China)?
Last edited by Tinhampton on Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:06 am

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Postby Greatest States Of America » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:07 am

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:Classic USA

hahaha
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Postby Grave_n_idle » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:08 am

Diahon wrote:any reason to doubt japan and south korea joining up?


Definitely reason to doubt Japan joining us - Trumps' international policy with Pacific Rim nations was just so ridiculously awful that he managed to do the unthinkable and drive China and Japan into pledging deeper ties and trade back in 2018. I don't know if Biden has done enough to change any Pacific Rim opinions. Best case scenario, countries like Japan and South Korea just assume we're unreliable in the long-term but hope it's going to average out better. Worst case, they pick the stability of a next-door neighbor in an increasingly divided marketplace.
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:11 am

Greatest States Of America wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:Classic USA

hahaha
Do not worry, if the United States does not want to start a world war in the world, that war will never happen. Because he is the king of the arms manufacturing market.
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Greatest States Of America
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Postby Greatest States Of America » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:12 am

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Greatest States Of America wrote:hahaha
Do not worry, if the United States does not want to start a world war in the world, that war will never happen. Because he is the king of the arms manufacturing market.

No doubt the US remains 1 arms exporter in the world along with Russia, China, France.
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Postby South Americanastan » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:18 am

Tinhampton wrote:
Trivalve wrote:In my opinion, I think that this going to create another cold war because I believe that Russia will decide to support China by creating a new alliance...

The Shanghai Cooperation Organisation exists already.

Trivalve wrote:...which will result in other communist countries showing their support to China.

What - the combined might of North Korea, Vietnam, Laos, and possibly Cuba (all of whom are already allies of PR China)?

Vietnam nowadays actually falls squarely in the American bloc. The Chinese have invaded them multiple times since the Vietnam War, souring their relations.
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Postby Greatest States Of America » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:24 am

South Americanastan wrote:
Tinhampton wrote:The Shanghai Cooperation Organisation exists already.


What - the combined might of North Korea, Vietnam, Laos, and possibly Cuba (all of whom are already allies of PR China)?

Vietnam nowadays actually falls squarely in the American bloc. The Chinese have invaded them multiple times since the Vietnam War, souring their relations.

Yep, No doubt Kamala Harris further confirms the alliance between the two. Added to the fuel Vietnam is cosy with India which is a rival to China.
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:29 am

Greatest States Of America wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:Do not worry, if the United States does not want to start a world war in the world, that war will never happen. Because he is the king of the arms manufacturing market.

No doubt the US remains 1 arms exporter in the world along with Russia, China, France.
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Diahon
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Postby Diahon » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:36 am

Grave_n_idle wrote:
Diahon wrote:any reason to doubt japan and south korea joining up?


Definitely reason to doubt Japan joining us - Trumps' international policy with Pacific Rim nations was just so ridiculously awful that he managed to do the unthinkable and drive China and Japan into pledging deeper ties and trade back in 2018. I don't know if Biden has done enough to change any Pacific Rim opinions. Best case scenario, countries like Japan and South Korea just assume we're unreliable in the long-term but hope it's going to average out better. Worst case, they pick the stability of a next-door neighbor in an increasingly divided marketplace.

yeah, they should have plenty of reason to doubt the longterm stability of american democracy, what with the republican minority killing off its own to grab power once more

it fucking sucks

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