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Goddess vs Mortal Hypothetical

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

What should be done? (Please also state what your PR approach would be)

Help Artemis (with or without conditions), Reward Ostro
9
33%
Help Artemis (with or without conditions), Sanction Ostro
3
11%
Non-Intervention
7
26%
Leave Artemis, Reward Ostro
6
22%
Regulate Artemis, Sanction Ostro
2
7%
Other
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 27

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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Goddess vs Mortal Hypothetical

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:22 am

Please consider the following hypothetical:

You are an immortal on the council of Zeus, King of the Gods.

The following series of events comes to your attention (please consider the scenario in its entirety so that you may reach a reasonable conclusion):

Ostro is a skilled hunter from a village. The word spreads throughout the city-states that he is “the greatest hunter to ever live.”

Artemis, Goddess of the Hunt, is slighted by this.

She arranges for Ostro to be abducted to a magical island where he is unfairly sentenced to death (Ostro is horrified because he has worshipped Artemis all his life and followed her code of honor, which apparently she herself doesn’t follow). To turn his execution into a sport, Artemis allows Ostro a 10 minute head start… after which she and her three huntresses will hunt him down and kill him.

Artemis unleashes the three huntresses first while she hangs back.

However, despite being a “mere mortal,”Ostro turns out extremely skilled, resourceful, crafty, and determined to survive and prevail at all cost. After a three-four hour long back and forth of battles and mind games between Ostro and the three huntresses, Ostro defeats all three of them. Not only this but he persuades them to switch over to his team.

While he’s hiding, Artemis shows up in the vicinity and starts to threaten him with death using her magically magnified voice. She then starts spamming magical arrows (she has unlimited ammo) all over the forest, casually obliterating entire forests and mountains to smoke him out of hiding.

As she advances, a few of Ostro’s death traps go off against her but they are all cancelled by some kind of super shield power. Ostro steps out and shoots an arrow at her but it is also blocked by magic.

He then sprints across the forest as Artemis turns around and devastates the landscape with more OP arrows. He keeps crawling until he reaches a field of flowers.

Instead of killing him from range, Artemis decides to add “a personal touch.” She shows up and starts beating him around with her super strength. This proves to be a tactical mistake because Ostro has enchanted said flower field with a Suggestion Spell he learned from the island’s oppressed natives. He rolls out of the field and says the activate command. After Artemis gets sprayed with a whole field’s worth of the magical powder (which her shield doesn’t protect her from), Ostro forces her to destroy her own OP magical bow and to dance around continuously like an idiot while he runs off gleefully.

The spell wears off and furious Artemis catches up to him, knife in hand. However, before she can close the gap Mother Nature senses a lapse in her power and takes opportunity to move in to collect a “magical debt” for centuries of wanton destruction of the environment and the animals… a vine grabs Artemis and drags her away from Ostro and throughout the forest for a painful ride across the earth. Along the way she takes tons and tons of damage from piles of sharp plants and mobs of vengeful animals. She heals from all damage but her powers are very over-taxed. It takes her a long time to get away.

She then shows up, knife in hand to try to kill Ostro AGAIN. There is a chance for her to stab him but he manages to avoid her and trip her. Then he turns and runs into a cave.

She follows him inside, only for the trap door to seal and cut her off from the moonlight (which gives her strength) near total darkness. Since Artemis’ body glows with a feeble light, the mortal is able to see her and not the other way around. A final battle takes place where Ostro continually attacks her with a long stick and several crafted weapons, moving back and forth like Batman and fully utilizing the darkness. Artemis runs around in total darkness and keeps trying to stab him but is unable to keep up or accurately judge where he is. She takes more and more and more hits and is eventually disarmed.

Finally, after all these screw ups and with some magical help from the disloyal huntresses, Artemis’ divine powers reject her… finding her “unworthy,” they reconstitute themselves unto Ostro, making him the new God of the Hunt while Artemis becomes a simple, de-powered immortal. Artemis is then made to apologize for trying to hunt and kill him and to recognize him as the greatest hunter.

It only gets worse:

Ostro: What should we do with her now?
Huntress 1: You should remove her low tier immortality. Cast and exile her into the mortal realm.
Huntress 2: She can dance for a living. Then we could come and watch.
Ostro: I can remove her immortality?! I can do that?! (Whistles*)

Artemis: Please don’t do that. Not the mortal realm PLEASE! I’ll do anything! Just not that! I can’t be a mortal, I can’t. I’ll be RUINED.

Ostro: Well. There was this other option I had in mind but it’s a bit extreme. You’ll have to… hmm well-

Artemis: What? TELL ME.

Ostro: You’ll have to become my servant.

Artemis: YOUR WHAT?!

Ostro: Yup. There’s a long list of mortals and immortals you’ve ruined and harmed over the centuries. You have to atone for that too. This is what I came up with.

Artemis: I‘ll never degrade myself to such a fate. Pick something else.

Ostro: This is your only choice. Become my servant and keep your immortality, or live out your life as a mortal woman. Either way, you’ll learn some humility and get some real character building.

Artemis: Oh please be more generous! I’m already disgraced enough!

Ostro: Sure I’ll throw you a bone. If you prove yourself reformed, say maybe in a few hundred years, and pass a few tests, then I’ll consider promoting you to the status of… huntress.

Artemis: H-HUNTRESS?!

Ostro: Best I can do I’m afraid. Yeah I didn’t think you’d go for it. It looks like your mind is all set. Nothing wrong with your choice. Here, let me just take away your immort-

Artemis: ALRIGHT! I’ll do it! I’ll be your servant!


Upon their relocation to a mansion, Artemis is thrust into a nightmare world that stands in sharp contrast to the idyllic, colorful, heavenly beauty of the surroundings. The three gleeful huntresses are put in charge and they dress her up “like a little doll” and affix her with a slave collar. Then she is worked endlessly from dawn to dusk like a common servant while watched by the happy huntresses. The former Goddess of the Hunt is made to clean, cook, sweep, build new structures, work the crops in the field, move stacks of hay from barn to barn, do all the gardening, and care for the filthy livestock all using her hands and only with the tools of mortals.

From time to time other immortals (and even a few Olympians) come by the mansion to fraternize with the new God of the Hunt. At such times Artemis is made to serve the food and drinks to the guests while trying not to die from the burn because everyone knew her from her better days. The tales of her incredulous fall from the status of goddess spread far and wide, and since she had previously slighted so many people, lots of immortals would find excuses to travel by the mansion just to try and get a glimpse of the once-great, unbearably haughty Artemis in her new role.


While all of this was happening, Zeus and the other main Olympians were away on a celestial conference. Now that they’ve returned, there’s a bit of a PR disaster.

Not because of the slavery/servant thing (many Olympians have slaves) but because this sort of thing… may upset the status quo between gods and mortals.

The poets have begun to spread this tale and it’s already become a big deal in the mortal realm. Some say it’s too late to control the story now.

Upon hearing the tale, some gods are annoyed and say we need to rectify the situation and restore Artemis’ status because as unlikable as she is, we can’t have a story of a mortal stealing divine powers and having a happy ending. Ostro can be rewarded or punished, just incentivize him not to spread this madness and put a cap on the poets spreading this tale (censor it).

Zeus, however, just cheerfully laughs about it in a booming voice and seems generally okay with Ostro becoming the new god, even thinking it’s kind of cool and well-earned. He even met up with Ostro a few times and seems chill about it.

A meeting is held with all the main Olympians and you, as an immortal council member get to participate. Everyone must contribute their opinion on what to do (though Zeus has the ultimate say, he’s good-natured enough to hear what everyone has to say).

The related discussion questions are:

1. Should the gods intervene to help Artemis? Her powers could theoretically be restored. What should be done about her generally?Or do we leave her in this situation because it’s what is deserved?

2. Should Ostro be allowed to keep his God of the Hunt status? Was it stolen or earned? What should be done about him generally? Is he a hero or a villain here?

3. In light of what you recommend for the above, and assuming the story has now spread far and wide, how do we handle the PR? Do we confirm the story, say nothing about the story, try to emphasize “correct morals” in the story through selective emphasis, or do we write and push a new story? What’s best for the mortals? What’s best for Olympus?


Remember, right now, Ostro is very popular, not just with mortals but with the low tier immortals too. He gets along with the other deities. And he’s already using his new powers to benevolently help the people. At the same time, Olympus has to manage the fallout.

Here’s what I think. I may change my mind, especially about 3.

1. The gods should restore Artemis’ goddess status but on conditions of good behavior and responsible use (so no more murdering of mortals). Her image has taken a hit that will take centuries to repair but we’ve still got something to work with. Since a few months have elapsed and she now understands what some mortals go through as a slave, hopefully she will have learned a few lessons.

2. Ostro doesn’t get to keep the God of the Hunt status because it would invite/encourage mortals to change the status quo. However, he has displayed extraordinary courage, resourcefulness, and ability so should be massively rewarded (and I mean massively rewarded) in some other suitable way; so long as he keeps his mouth shut and doesn’t stir up trouble between Olympus-mortal-realm relations.

3. It’s too late to completely contain and roll back the story in its entirety but instead of Artemis losing disgracefully the ending could be re-emphasized and rewritten so that she’s “impressed” with his resourcefulness and rewards him instead. The huntresses can maybe take the fall for the story and become the villainesses instead who try to ruin Ostro and create the conflict to their own political gain. That’s one idea, I don’t know if it would work.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:25 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Esternial
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Postby Esternial » Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:47 am

If Artemis' divine power rejected her and chose Ostro I don't see how interfering with the divine power's will is going to do any good.

Clearly the God's divine power has a will of its own, so I wouldn't want to upset these forces any further by actively working against them for petty obsessions with public perceptions. Gods should be above all that drivel.

Non-interference.
Last edited by Esternial on Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Wormfodder Delivery » Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:53 am

Tbh, Ostro is a lot more lenient on her than he could be.
That version of Artemis had it coming IMO.
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Postby The Blaatschapen » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:13 am

1. No. But I contact her in secret, I need an ally for when I overthrow Zeus.
2. Yes, for now. See 1.
3. I don't handle the PR. I'll withdraw from openly meddling with that. But might inspire a few poets to spread the word further. I'll need it for my plan to overthrow Zeus.
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:19 am

Wormfodder Delivery wrote:Tbh, Ostro is a lot more lenient on her than he could be.
That version of Artemis had it coming IMO.


You mean you would have removed her immortality?

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Postby Wormfodder Delivery » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:25 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Wormfodder Delivery wrote:Tbh, Ostro is a lot more lenient on her than he could be.
That version of Artemis had it coming IMO.


You mean you would have removed her immortality?

Didn't she keep it in exchange for servitude?

Ah, I get what you meant. I mean, he only makes her do chores and and rather tame stuff, which mostly is an attack on her pride.
He could treat her a lot worse, is what I'm saying. And let's leave it at that.
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Postby Unified Communist Councils » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:48 am

The humiliation of a goddess is something that has to be covered up. Ostro is to be sanctioned to squash any notion that mortals can usurp the position of godhood but imprisoned rather than executed. Alas, Artemis's foolishness should not go without reprimand. The best action to take is for the goddess to redeem herself of her foolishness. As the gods decide morality, the interests of deities outweigh those of mere mortals.
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Postby Picairn » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:54 am

Is this Ostro guy related to Hercules by any chance? Or is he one of Zeus's sons?
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Postby Unstoppable Empire of Doom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 3:46 am

The morty mortal may keep his power under the condition that he slays the rick huntress in a fair hunt. These means they will both be mortals and no gods, godesses, men or women may intervene. Winner will gain immortality and loser dies.

Keeping both alive invites future hypotheticals.
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Postby Munkcestrian RepubIic » Fri Sep 10, 2021 3:52 am

What does Ostroeuropa have to do with this? :eyebrow:
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 4:05 am

Picairn wrote:Is this Ostro guy related to Hercules by any chance? Or is he one of Zeus's sons?


He has no relation to the demigod. 100 percent mortal.

Does this affect your answer?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Sep 10, 2021 4:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 4:06 am

Munkcestrian RepubIic wrote:What does Ostroeuropa have to do with this? :eyebrow:


Eh?

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Postby Dakini » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:03 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Munkcestrian RepubIic wrote:What does Ostroeuropa have to do with this? :eyebrow:


Eh?

Your protagonist has a name that is quite similar to that of a NS poster. Did this not occur to you before you wrote the post?

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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:11 am

Dakini wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
Eh?

Your protagonist has a name that is quite similar to that of a NS poster. Did this not occur to you before you wrote the post?


I was looking for a decent enough name for a Greek hero type character.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostro

However, now that you mention it, it would be kind of cool if the character were an incarnation/alternate universe version of Ostroeuropa. =) Kind of like how an alternate version of me was in one of the recent hypotheticals.

I actually like that direction.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Wormfodder Delivery » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:11 am

Well, the probably smartest thing for the olympians is to just make him sign a NDA and pretend like Artemis is still the goddess of the Hunt, with whatever happened there just having been a play that got a bit too popular.

After all, this "god force" is kinda implying that "gods" are replacable, a knowledge which probably should be kept secret from the mortals.
Getting this Ostro on their good side while having it appear that nothing has changed would be the most optimal outcome for them.
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:12 am

Wormfodder Delivery wrote:Well, the probably smartest thing for the olympians is to just make him sign a NDA and pretend like Artemis is still the goddess of the Hunt, with whatever happened there just having been a play that got a bit too popular.

After all, this "god force" is kinda implying that "gods" are replacable, a knowledge which probably should be kept secret from the mortals.
Getting this Ostro on their good side while having it appear that nothing has changed would be the most optimal outcome for them.


This reminds me of The Boys when Vaught tried to get one of the protagonists to sign an NDA. =)

And would he get massively rewarded? What would you think would do the trick?

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Postby Ifreann » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:13 am

Disregard Olympian politics.

Party with Dionysus.
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:14 am

Ifreann wrote:Disregard Olympian politics.

Party with Dionysus.


You don't like Olympian politics? How come?

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Postby Dakini » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:16 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Dakini wrote:Your protagonist has a name that is quite similar to that of a NS poster. Did this not occur to you before you wrote the post?


I was looking for a decent enough name for a Greek hero type character.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostro

However, now that you mention it, it would be kind of cool if the character were an incarnation/alternate universe version of Ostroeuropa. =) Kind of like how an alternate version of me was in one of the recent hypotheticals.

I actually like that direction.

In that case, all the gods should support Artemis and eliminate Ostro because he absolutely deserves it.

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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:16 am

Dakini wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
I was looking for a decent enough name for a Greek hero type character.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostro

However, now that you mention it, it would be kind of cool if the character were an incarnation/alternate universe version of Ostroeuropa. =) Kind of like how an alternate version of me was in one of the recent hypotheticals.

I actually like that direction.

In that case, all the gods should support Artemis and eliminate Ostro because he absolutely deserves it.


how so?

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Postby The New California Republic » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:19 am

Can I be Dionysus, so I can just get pissed and pretend I'm doing something?
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Wormfodder Delivery
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Postby Wormfodder Delivery » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:22 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Wormfodder Delivery wrote:Well, the probably smartest thing for the olympians is to just make him sign a NDA and pretend like Artemis is still the goddess of the Hunt, with whatever happened there just having been a play that got a bit too popular.

After all, this "god force" is kinda implying that "gods" are replacable, a knowledge which probably should be kept secret from the mortals.
Getting this Ostro on their good side while having it appear that nothing has changed would be the most optimal outcome for them.


This reminds me of The Boys when Vaught tried to get one of the protagonists to sign an NDA. =)

And would he get massively rewarded? What would you think would do the trick?

I mean, he already has his reward.
Godhood, immortality and the former goddess and her huntresses as his underlings.
Acknowledging his status fully with maybe some bribes should do the trick, maybe Hephaistos forges him a new bow or something.

The play would probably seen as a classical comedy explaining why Artemis was a goddess in older Sagas but a servant in later ones. Probably with some revisionism to claim he was a son of a god that got his birthright robbed by her.
Last edited by Wormfodder Delivery on Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36154
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:24 am

Wormfodder Delivery wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
This reminds me of The Boys when Vaught tried to get one of the protagonists to sign an NDA. =)

And would he get massively rewarded? What would you think would do the trick?

I mean, he already has his reward.
Godhood, immortality and the former goddess and her huntresses as his underlings.
Acknowledging his status fully with maybe some bribes should do the trick, maybe Hephaistos forges him a new bow or something.

The play would probably seen as a classical comedy explaining why Artemis was a goddess in older Sagas but a servant in later ones.


but in the mortal realm Artemis would remain, seen as a powerful goddess of the hunt? It's just that in Olympus and the mortal real "the truth" is known?

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36154
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:25 am

The New California Republic wrote:Can I be Dionysus, so I can just get pissed and pretend I'm doing something?


Eh? I was thinking that you were a ranking immortal but not a named god/goddess but I'm not sure it changes the scenario too much

Why would you want to be Dionysus? Why is he such a popular god here?

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Wormfodder Delivery
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 398
Founded: Feb 14, 2021
Corporate Police State

Postby Wormfodder Delivery » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:27 am

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Wormfodder Delivery wrote:I mean, he already has his reward.
Godhood, immortality and the former goddess and her huntresses as his underlings.
Acknowledging his status fully with maybe some bribes should do the trick, maybe Hephaistos forges him a new bow or something.

The play would probably seen as a classical comedy explaining why Artemis was a goddess in older Sagas but a servant in later ones.


but in the mortal realm Artemis would remain, seen as a powerful goddess of the hunt? It's just that in Olympus and the mortal real "the truth" is known?

Hmm... Thinking a bit more about it, the NDA would actually be about the fact that gods can be realistically replaced if one is smart enough.
Maybe Artemis as a god would even be mythologically merged into Ostro, with her stories getting retrofitted into fit Ostro instead.
Question though if it is the mythological Artemis before or after her merging with the Moon Goddess Selene.
NS Stats do not count, unless it is funny.
The Transcripts canonically do not exist and merely serve to make the garbled Wormsspeak readable.
Canon Policies.
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Powerlevel of 4,5 according to this classification
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Zero tolerance for godmodders and no effortposters are nearing that too.
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