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[DRAFT] Baptism By Fire

A place to spoil daily issues for those who haven't had them yet, snigger at typos, and discuss ideas for new ones.
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Forshura
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Founded: Feb 08, 2019
Ex-Nation

[DRAFT] Baptism By Fire

Postby Forshura » Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:16 pm

#1
text: It turned out that the ultra-Orthodox public in general refrained from enlisting in the military. Almost all recruits who are counted as ultra-Orthodox are either young men who have left the ultra-Orthodox community and usually religion as well, or adults who find their livelihood in the military. At the same time, it became clear that the military authorities, maliciously or accidently, skewed the recruitment data, creating false impression that the ultra-Orthodox public was in the process of enlisting in the army.

valid_if: Invalid for nations with high atheism rate.

option: "I do not oppose the recruitment of the ultra-Orthodox to the army, on the contrary, I think that almost every 18-year-old ultra-Orthodox must enlist in the army for full service, just like his secular and religious brothers." pleads @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, an ultra-Orthodox educator and social entrepreneur. "The point here is not the sector you are associated with, but what you do as an individual. If you are an ultra-Orthodox guy who does not sit from morning to night and studies the Bible, not only do you have to enlist, you must do so morally and ethically."
effect: the only people to be exempt from enlisting are true God-fearers.

option: "This is pure poppycock!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, a senior citizen of @@CAPITAL@@. "The real problem is in the economy. I would completely dismiss them from military service in exchange for their full entry into the labor market. Despite the violation in equality, it is a worthwhile deal!"
effect: ultra-Orthodox bartenders can be found all over the place.

option: "The battle to recruit the ultra-Orthodox, even by force, is vital." argues professor @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, a veteran researcher of the ultra-Orthodox. "The current data of the ultra-Orthodox service is not half their demographic growth rates and military exemption growth rates. Considering that already 25 percent of the first-graders in the traditional community are ultra-Orthodox, you understand that the military will have a real problem with the recruitment cycles."
effect: the ultra-Orthodox are constantly trying to evade military service.

#2
text: Recent statistics have shown that the ultra-Orthodox public in general refrained from enlisting in the military. Almost all recruits who are counted as ultra-Orthodox are either young men who have left the ultra-Orthodox community, or adults who find their livelihood in the military. At the same time, a committee appointed by your chief of staff determined that the military authorities, maliciously or accidently, skewed the recruitment data, creating false impression that the ultra-Orthodox public was in the process of enlisting in the military.

valid_if: Invalid for nations with high atheism rate.

option: "I do not oppose the recruitment of the ultra-Orthodox to the army, on the contrary, I think that almost every 18-year-old ultra-Orthodox must enlist in the army for full service, just like his secular and religious brothers." pleads @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, an ultra-Orthodox educator and social entrepreneur. "The point here is not the sector you are associated with, but what you do as an individual. If you are an ultra-Orthodox guy who does not sit from morning to midnight and studies the Holy Book, not only do you have to enlist, you must do so morally and ethically. I'm not talking about those guys, who sit from morning to midnight and study. Such people do not have to learn to kill, or be partners in a system whose big part is to kill the enemy"
effect: the only people to be exempt from enlisting are true God-fearers.

option: "This is pure poppycock!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, a senior citizen of @@CAPITAL@@. "The real problem is in the economy. The ultra-Orthodox consume a lot of services, and give very little. I would completely dismiss them from military service in exchange for their full entry into the labor market. Despite the violation in equality, it is a worthwhile deal!"
effect: ultra-Orthodox bartenders can be found all over the place.

option: "The battle to recruit the ultra-Orthodox, even by force, is vital." argues professor @@RANDOMNAMEMALE@@, a veteran researcher of the ultra-Orthodox. "The current data of the ultra-Orthodox service is not half their demographic growth rates and military exemption growth rates. Considering that already a large part of the first-graders in the traditional community are ultra-Orthodox, you understand that the military will have a real problem with the recruitment cycles. When the ultra-Orthodox enlist, the sense of solidarity and partnership of destiny between the communities will intensify."
effect: the ultra-Orthodox are constantly trying to evade military service.
Last edited by Forshura on Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:32 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Bears Armed
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Postby Bears Armed » Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:55 am

This is based on ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel, right? Where at least some of them believe that the State of Israel should not be considered to exist until the coming of the Messiah?
Bear in mind that in some other religions there are entire ( & better-delineated?) sects that follow explicitly pacifist teachings, e.g. the Quakers in Christianity, which is a different reason for not enlisting in the armed forces.

Also, I would suggest replacing the text's reference to "the Bible" with one to "the holy books" -- or perhaps "the Holy Book" -- for more widespread appropriateness.
Last edited by Bears Armed on Mon Jun 21, 2021 1:54 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Dabarastan
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Postby Dabarastan » Mon Jun 21, 2021 1:19 am

Forshura wrote:text: It turned out that the ultra-Orthodox public in general refrained from enlisting in the military. Almost all recruits who are counted as ultra-Orthodox are either young men who have left the ultra-Orthodox community and usually religion as well, or adults who find their livelihood in the military. At the same time, it became clear that the military authorities, maliciously or accidently, skewed the recruitment data, creating false impression that the ultra-Orthodox public was in the process of enlisting in the army.

Who says? How did this information become clear?
The premise is already long so I don't think you necessarily need to make it longer by adding this information. I think you need to slightly redraft the premise to make the narrative a bit clearer.

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Forshura
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Ex-Nation

Postby Forshura » Mon Jun 21, 2021 2:19 am

Bears Armed wrote:This is based on ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel, right? Where at least some of them believe that the State of Israel should not be considered to exist until the coming of the Messiah?
Bear in mind that in some other religions there are entire ( & better-delineated?) sects that follow explicitly pacifist teachings, e.g. the Quakers in Christianity, which is a different reason for not enlisting in the armed forces.

Also, I would suggest replacing the text's reference to "the Bible" with one to "the holy books" -- or perhaps "the Holy Book" -- for more widespread appropriateness.

Thank you, I will keep that in mind

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:30 am

Why does it matter whether people of a particular religious minority enlist in the army or not, unless your nation has mandatory conscription, in which case we already have an issue about conscientious objection.

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Forshura
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Ex-Nation

Postby Forshura » Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:14 am

Trotterdam wrote:Why does it matter whether people of a particular religious minority enlist in the army or not, unless your nation has mandatory conscription, in which case we already have an issue about conscientious objection.

ok
Last edited by Forshura on Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:17 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:51 am

Please keep all new draft versions in this thread, by putting them under spoilers in the original post of this thread. Don't make a new thread to post a new version of your draft :)
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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:13 am

Forshura wrote:It's not a minority, you can actually see that the issue isn't valid for nation with high atheism rate.
Even in a religious nation, people who identify themselves as "Ultra-Orthodox" are likely to be a minority. Besides, the fact that they even have such a name implies that their views are not perceived as average for the nation.

Besides, it's dangerous to make assumptions about what the tenets of a nation's majority religion is, since that's something nations like to roleplay for themselves (that's what the national religion field is for).

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Forshura
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Founded: Feb 08, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Forshura » Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:26 am

Trotterdam wrote:
Forshura wrote:It's not a minority, you can actually see that the issue isn't valid for nation with high atheism rate.
Even in a religious nation, people who identify themselves as "Ultra-Orthodox" are likely to be a minority. Besides, the fact that they even have such a name implies that their views are not perceived as average for the nation.

Besides, it's dangerous to make assumptions about what the tenets of a nation's majority religion is, since that's something nations like to roleplay for themselves (that's what the national religion field is for).

anyways, ultra-Orthodox in the military can allow society to be much more homogeneous and fair. Decrease in the rate of recruits is also present in the issue. Military service can allow the ultra-Orthodox to work in non-minimum wage jobs.
Last edited by Forshura on Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:42 am

Sedgistan wrote:*** Lizbana / Rachvalskia - DEAT for posting past ban ***

If you try posting past ban on any of your other accounts, those will be deleted too.

You didn't listen. *** Forshura - DEAT for posting past ban ***

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:38 am

...Well, so much for that, I suppose.

I assume the original ban was for something unrelated to issue drafting?

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Etucatia
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Ex-Nation

Postby Etucatia » Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:57 am

Sedgistan wrote:
Sedgistan wrote:*** Lizbana / Rachvalskia - DEAT for posting past ban ***

If you try posting past ban on any of your other accounts, those will be deleted too.

You didn't listen. *** Forshura - DEAT for posting past ban ***

I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want. Rachvalskia is not my nation. It's not associated with my email in any way. If you think I'm lying, here, It's my brother's nation. He did some stupid things and got banned, and so I get banned every time I post something.

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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:55 am

Trotterdam wrote:...Well, so much for that, I suppose.

I assume the original ban was for something unrelated to issue drafting?

Unfortunately not - it was an issue draft entitled "National suck dick day", with content of a similar level of maturity.

I'm locking this now, so the player doesn't feel tempted to lose any more nations.


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