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by Izadi » Sat Jun 19, 2021 5:44 am
by Wallenburg » Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:57 am
Araraukar wrote:The Hazar Amisnery wrote:Why is everyone against this? I don't see anything wrong with it.
Maybe they'll post their reasoning here later? EDIT: At least I hope they do. Hard to improve on it if they don't. FURTHER EDIT: Some of the delegates voting against are ones who approved it to go to vote, so I'd be really interested on their reasoning especially.
by Araraukar » Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:03 am
Greater Cesnica wrote:General Assembly Vote Recommendation of The North Pacific for "Safety Regulations for Trade Route Canals"
Izadi wrote:Izadi is against this bill due to its vagueness in the number of boats allowed at a time.
This bill lends a lot of power to the canal authorities.
I thought governments were in charge of trade not CANAL AUTHORITIES!
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Greater Cesnica » Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:36 am
Araraukar wrote:Greater Cesnica wrote:General Assembly Vote Recommendation of The North Pacific for "Safety Regulations for Trade Route Canals"
OOC: And since you're one of the ones mentioned there as having something to do with the recommendation, can you explain which bits are "unpersuasive", how you totally forgot (or just skipped to purposefully lie to people, I'm not sure which is worse) the underlined part from "any possible fees for the use of canals" and whether you were simply unaware of there being other resolutions that come under the heading of "maritime laws"? Because honestly I'm confused about what proposal version that recommendation is based on, as it's definitely not the one we submitted.
Requires that all canals have the necessary emergency services available in case of an accident,
Requires shipping companies to provide appropriate compensation to canal authorities if their ships due to error or deliberate action of their crews hold up traffic unnecessarily,
Additionally clarifies that though this resolution does not further legislate on them, any possible fees for the use of canals count as canal operation requirements,
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San Lumen wrote:You are ridiculous.George Orwell wrote:“That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.”
by Araraukar » Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:46 am
Greater Cesnica wrote:necessary emergency services
appropriate compensation
Wallenburg wrote:The argument I've seen go around is that it's too much micromanagement, which I quite frankly don't see. I'm not sure how TNP specifically juggles micromanagement and vague mandates simultaneously. Presumably vague clauses would be incapable of micromanagement, or at least would not lend themselves to it well.
Greater Cesnica wrote:These clauses were found to be exceptionally micromanaging and without adequate justification.
As for the part regarding "maritime laws", the Ministry found that additional clarification should have been provided as to which maritime laws were being referred to.
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Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Greater Cesnica » Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:52 am
Araraukar wrote:OOC: I also don't really get the complaints about "necessary", "unnecessary" and "appropriate".
Araraukar wrote:Your ministry needs someone who has a better grasp of GA. Or better grasp of Enligsh. What did you think "maritime laws" meant?
Araraukar wrote:I don't do offsite forums.
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San Lumen wrote:You are ridiculous.George Orwell wrote:“That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.”
by Araraukar » Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:03 am
I didn't write this IFV directly, you can direct those concerns towards Cretox and Boston Castle.
In the past, you've talked about how you don't want to use IA's InfoEurope utility since you didn't trust it for whatever reason.
What's the problem with Xenforo forum boards?
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Slandiltopia » Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:39 am
by South Olpen » Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:11 am
Walfo wrote:
The World Assembly,
Aware of the importance of canals acting as shortcuts on important trade routes,
Seeking to prevent congestion of traffic through such canals while also making transit through these canals safe,
Wishing to encourage nations in charge of such canals to continue allowing their use for international trade and to consider improvements on their infrastructure if necessary,
Hereby,
1. For the purposes of this resolution, defines:
- a "canal" as an artificial waterway built along important shipping routes to allow for the transit of commercial vessels, and creating a shortcut between two large bodies of water, or a large body of water and an international port,
- "canal authorities" as personnel authorized to allow or deny the transit of ships through the canal, whether on-site or remotely,
- a "ship" as a commercial civilian vessel transporting trade goods or passengers;
2. Requires that all canals:
- be monitored by the canal authorities assigned to them at all times,
- have on-call pilots and tugboats to assist ships to pass through the canal safely,
- have their infrastructure inspected regularly and upgraded when necessary,
- have the necessary emergency services available in case of an accident, and
- be equipped with weather monitoring with communication capability to warn ships of adverse weather conditions;
3. Also requires that canal authorities:
- do not deny the transit of a ship through the canal based on any reason not to do with canal operation requirements, safety, national security, or unless otherwise required by another General Assembly resolution,
- remain aware of how many vessels and of which size are within the boundaries of the canal at any one time,
- do not allow more ships to begin the transit through the canal than is safe,
- keep in contact with all ships within their area of control, and
- react to changing conditions and emerging hazards by quickly alerting the ships in transit and those waiting to enter the canal;
4. Mandates that the crews of all ships wishing to pass through the canal:
- are able to abide by maritime laws and local regulations,
- are able to understand and follow the instructions of canal authorities,
- have made sure that their ship is capable of traveling through the canal in its current condition and the current weather conditions,
- facilitate any possible border control and customs inspections to take place on their ship prior to entering a canal,
- have competent personnel in control of the ship, at all times when within the canal,
- request help from canal authorities to enable safe transit, when necessary,
- take necessary measures to minimize the spread of invasive species,
- stay aware of traffic around them and inform canal authorities of any accidents they witness or of any hazards they encounter that they were not already made aware of, and
- have personal safety equipment for all members of the crew and in the case of passenger ships for all passengers as well;
5. Requires shipping companies to provide appropriate compensation to canal authorities if their ships:
- due to error or deliberate action of their crews,
- damage the canal's infrastructure,
- endanger or damage other ships within the canal,
- hold up traffic unnecessarily,
- or their crews fail any of the duties in clause 4;
6. Additionally clarifies that though this resolution does not further legislate on them,
- any possible fees for the use of canals count as canal operation requirements, and
- unless restricted from doing so by another General Assembly resolution, nations are free to conduct border control checks of cargo, crew and passengers prior to letting a ship enter a canal.
Co-authored by Araraukar
Draft XVI
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by South Olpen » Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:14 am
Izadi wrote:Izadi is against this bill due to its vagueness in the number of boats allowed at a time. This bill lends a lot of power to the canal authorities. I thought governments were in charge of trade not CANAL AUTHORITIES!
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by Araraukar » Sat Jun 19, 2021 4:27 pm
Slandiltopia wrote:I'm not a fan of this one specifically because of provision 3a. ('[This motion] requires that canal authorities do not deny the transit of a ship through the canal based on any reason not to do with canal operation requirements, safety, national security, or unless otherwise required by another General Assembly resolution.') I think most people are unwilling to surrender autonomy - I want to be able to refuse canal access to certain vessels or nations for reasons other than national security or safety. I'm not going to allow a fascist dictatorship to use my canal, for example - That's not a safety issue, I just don't want that kind of nation to be supported by services I control.
South Olpen wrote:Are you seriously telling me that no aid is given for upholding canals? You discouraging International trade. Also, as far as I see, you have to let fascist, Nazi, communist, and enemy ships through your waters. I would leave the WA if this bill passed.
South Olpen wrote:OOC: Canal authorities are usually part of a nations government, either military in the case of the US, or economic agencies.
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Coronational Chechyans and affiliates » Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:45 pm
by Tinhampton » Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:16 pm
by Walfo » Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:24 pm
Tinhampton wrote:Walfo is redrafting this. He has said in his redraft thread that "I am relieved this version is not going to pass." Why? It's only 4,000 votes down
by Araraukar » Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:18 pm
Walfo wrote:I actually understand the thinking of those who are opposed. The necessaries are well, unnecessarily! lol. It has some problems, and they deserve to be fixed.
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Outer Sparta » Tue Jun 22, 2021 1:47 pm
Araraukar wrote:Walfo wrote:I actually understand the thinking of those who are opposed. The necessaries are well, unnecessarily! lol. It has some problems, and they deserve to be fixed.
OOC: We disagree on some things, including that one. Which will be sorted with proper redrafting, not hasty resubmittal.
Walfo, calm down. Failing to pass a proposal on your first try is normal. Go on your vacation, we'll redraft when you get back. Rushing resubmittal is not the right course of action, especially when you're missing the bigger issue.
by Tinhampton » Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:00 pm
by Imperium Anglorum » Wed Jun 23, 2021 4:36 am
by Walfo » Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:28 pm
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