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Treatment of Uyghurs in China

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Can the treatment of Uyghurs be Justified?

No
103
79%
Yes
9
7%
It can be justified, but not as of now
9
7%
Blah blah blah. All everyone care about is Uyghurs. What about the people in Syria?
5
4%
Other. (Pls post on thread)
4
3%
 
Total votes : 130

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Dowaesk
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Treatment of Uyghurs in China

Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 10:46 am

The Uyghurs are native to the Xinjiang Province in China. It is thought that there are about 13 million Uyghurs in Xinjiang. The Uyghur Community is also predominantly muslim. Although China does not count them when they count their religious populations.
Since 2015 it has been estimated that over a million Uyghurs have been detained in concentration camps. China often uses attacks done by East Turkestan Independence Movement" as justification for its actions.
Critics of China have often referred to this as genocide.
Heres a link to the wikipedia site.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide
Now to my question. Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified? And how do you suppose this will go in the future? Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene? Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?
Last edited by Dowaesk on Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:41 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Dowaesk
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Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 10:49 am

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Islamic Holy Sites
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Postby Islamic Holy Sites » Sat Apr 17, 2021 10:56 am

Dowaesk wrote:The Uyghurs are native to the Xinjiang Province in China. It is thought that there are about 13 million Uyghurs in Xinjiang. The Uyghur Community is also predominantly muslim. Although China does not count them when they count their religious populations.
Since 2015 it has been estimated that over a million Uyghurs have been detained in concentration camps. China often uses attacks done by East Turkestan Independence Movement" as justification for its actions.
Critics of China have often referred to this as genocide.
Heres a link to the wikipedia site.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide
Now to my question. Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified? And how do you suppose this will go in the future? Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene? Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?

The treatment of the Uyghurs cannot and can never be justified.
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Dowaesk
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Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 10:59 am

Islamic Holy Sites wrote:
Dowaesk wrote:The Uyghurs are native to the Xinjiang Province in China. It is thought that there are about 13 million Uyghurs in Xinjiang. The Uyghur Community is also predominantly muslim. Although China does not count them when they count their religious populations.
Since 2015 it has been estimated that over a million Uyghurs have been detained in concentration camps. China often uses attacks done by East Turkestan Independence Movement" as justification for its actions.
Critics of China have often referred to this as genocide.
Heres a link to the wikipedia site.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide
Now to my question. Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified? And how do you suppose this will go in the future? Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene? Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?

The treatment of the Uyghurs cannot and can never be justified.

I agree. But the Chinese dont seem to even think about this. US on the other hand seems more worried about Hong Kong rather than the genocide happening in Northwest of China
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Islamic Holy Sites
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Postby Islamic Holy Sites » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:01 am

Dowaesk wrote:
Islamic Holy Sites wrote:The treatment of the Uyghurs cannot and can never be justified.

I agree. But the Chinese dont seem to even think about this. US on the other hand seems more worried about Hong Kong rather than the genocide happening in Northwest of China

Sadly.
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Monsone
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Postby Monsone » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:16 am

Dowaesk wrote:Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified?

And how do you suppose this will go in the future?

Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene?

Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?


1. Unfortunately yes, with a good enough excuse, you can justify just about anything. That doesn't make it morally or legally correct, but it has been justified to the standards set out by the perpetrator.

2. In the future? No clue, that is something that's pretty much unknown. If I had to choose, I would say that the current status quo is the norm and will remain so for the foreseeable future.

3. Intervene how? This is an extremely broad statement that can range from sanctions to military action with troops on the ground. Considering military intervention is a no-go, only economic pressure through sanctions is possible, and even that is a pretty useless option as no nation is willing to sanction China like they sanction North Korea, Venezuela, Russia, etc. And China's economic clout is going to keep much of the world silent on the issue anyway.

4. No, no, and no. China is likely to call it a day when they have completely erased Uyghur culture and replaced it with (Han) Chinese culture. Once every last Uyghur is assimilated into Han culture and obedient, subservient, and loyal to the Chinese Government, then the concentration camps will cease to have a primary role (but will continue to exist as places whete dissidents are taken to). China's goal is cultural errasure and replacement by any means necessary, including those that border on genocide.

Uyghurs how follow their traditions will become a tiny minority, but realistically, people counted as ethnically Uyghur probably won't since China is mere decades away from a demographic crisis of epic proportions (but this isn't a thread on demographics so I digress).
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Free Ravensburg
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Postby Free Ravensburg » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:21 am

Is the treatment of Uyghurs by China acceptable: No

Did we basically do the same thing to indigenous peoples: Yes

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Dowaesk
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Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:22 am

Monsone wrote:
Dowaesk wrote:Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified?

And how do you suppose this will go in the future?

Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene?

Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?


1. Unfortunately yes, with a good enough excuse, you can justify just about anything. That doesn't make it morally or legally correct, but it has been justified to the standards set out by the perpetrator.

2. In the future? No clue, that is something that's pretty much unknown. If I had to choose, I would say that the current status quo is the norm and will remain so for the foreseeable future.

3. Intervene how? This is an extremely broad statement that can range from sanctions to military action with troops on the ground. Considering military intervention is a no-go, only economic pressure through sanctions is possible, and even that is a pretty useless option as no nation is willing to sanction China like they sanction North Korea, Venezuela, Russia, etc. And China's economic clout is going to keep much of the world silent on the issue anyway.

4. No, no, and no. China is likely to call it a day when they have completely erased Uyghur culture and replaced it with (Han) Chinese culture. Once every last Uyghur is assimilated into Han culture and obedient, subservient, and loyal to the Chinese Government, then the concentration camps will cease to have a primary role (but will continue to exist as places whete dissidents are taken to). China's goal is cultural errasure and replacement by any means necessary, including those that border on genocide.

Uyghurs how follow their traditions will become a tiny minority, but realistically, people counted as ethnically Uyghur probably won't since China is mere decades away from a demographic crisis of epic proportions (but this isn't a thread on demographics so I digress).

Demographics are welcome as one of the questions is related to it. Uyghurs becoming a minority.
In my personal opinion. I would say it wont happen. If China were to keep going on with their processes, Uyghur fighters might also step up their game. In such a case, I will be rooting for them as they fight back. Like they should.
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:36 am

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Postby Free Ravensburg » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:44 am

Petition to have the autonomous regions in China (with the exception of Inner Mongolia, which is to be given to Mongolia to reunite the two Mongolias again) released as independent sovereign nations protected by the United Nations from China and Russia (Russia almost ruled Uyghurstan, then Sinkiang/Xinjiang during the interwar period)? All in favor say “aye”
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Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:47 am

Free Ravensburg wrote:Petition to have the autonomous regions in China (with the exception of Inner Mongolia, which is to be given to Mongolia to reunite the two Mongolias again) released as independent sovereign nations protected by the United Nations from China and Russia (Russia almost ruled Uyghurstan, then Sinkiang/Xinjiang during the interwar period)? All in favor say “aye”

aye
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Postby Monsone » Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:52 am

Dowaesk wrote:Demographics are welcome as one of the questions is related to it. Uyghurs becoming a minority.
In my personal opinion. I would say it wont happen. If China were to keep going on with their processes, Uyghur fighters might also step up their game. In such a case, I will be rooting for them as they fight back. Like they should.


Ah well, I was referring to the One Child Policy and how it allgoes wed ethnic minorities like the Uyghurs to have two children, while Han Chinese where limited to one. Considering Han Chinese make up the vast majority of China's population and the fact that they where most affected by the policy means China's demographic crisis is mainly fueled by demographic issues in the Han population.

Honestly, I don't think the Uyghur fighters really have a chance even in the long run because of China's highly authoritarian police state nature as well as the strength of the PLA. What's more likely is China's central government is forced to give concessions to Uyghurs and Xinjiang as a whole because of declining birth rates that mean a more tenuous grip on power and less military manpower.
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:03 pm

The CCP does shitty things to people. Winnie the pooh is truely an evil person.

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Postby Free Ravensburg » Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:10 pm

Petition by the Uyghurstan Republican Party on Change.org. I have signed, as it really is an occupied nation, along with Tibet, Macau, Hong Kong, Yunnan (for some reason it is “autonomous”), and Ningxia.

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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:10 pm

There are Uyghur Turks in East Turkistan Republic sent to collection containers.political Islamists in Turkey continue to play the three monkeys. Turkish Political Islamists ignore the Uyghur people, just as they ignore the Turks killed in Cyprus, Azerbaijan, Germany and Mesopotamia.
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Postby -Ocelot- » Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:40 pm

Dowaesk wrote:Now to my question. Can the treatment towards Uyghurs be justified? And how do you suppose this will go in the future? Will the UN or some other organisation or country intervene? Or will this continue until Uyghur becomes a minority in their own region?


Can't be justified, nothing will happen unless if China is severely weakened in the near future and the UN bows to the Chinese Communist Party. Uyghurs will most likely be genocided through forced marriages, sterilization and executions. The nationality may survive through Uyghurs abroad, but the ones in China will most likely be eradicated.

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Postby Mannixa Prime » Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:44 pm

This is text book genocide and it disgusts me that so many will throw the “well ACKTULLY” card around. China is committing genocide pure and simple.

But nothing will be done because people love their cheap goods and it’s easier to scream at white racists on twitter...

I hope the situation improves but I am not optimistic.
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Postby Glorious Hong Kong » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:28 pm

Can their barbaric treatment at the hands of communist fascists be justified? Fuck no 100x over. Note that Uighurs are being singled out for being Uighurs, not for being Muslims. The ethnic Hui Muslims haven't been subjected to nearly the same kind of degrading treatment. It's about race, language and culture to these racist, fascist communists, not religion per se.

The Chinese should be expelled from East Turkestan by force in an Israeli-style war of independence. Non-indigenous Han Chinese settlers who now outnumber the indigenous Uighurs and are directly complicit in the erosion of traditional Uighur language, culture, and identity should be treated as persona non grata and asked to leave. At the very least, they should be denied full citizenship in this new ethnostate. Muslim Uighurs will be able to regain and maintain their demographic majority in their own homeland and citizens of China proper won't have to worry about Islamist extremism. If East Turkestan ends up being a failed Islamist state, then that's the Uighurs' problem and not anyone else's.

The same goes for Hong Kong, Tibet, and Inner Mongolia.

Mannixa Prime wrote:This is text book genocide and it disgusts me that so many will throw the “well ACKTULLY” card around. China is committing genocide pure and simple.

But nothing will be done because people love their cheap goods and it’s easier to scream at white racists on twitter...

I hope the situation improves but I am not optimistic.


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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:47 pm

Its disgraceful whats happening to those people, but i doubt the world will end up doing anything substantial about it. But every nation that condemns or goes for sanctions is at least trying to do... something i guess.

Also GHK: "Communist fascists"

thats... not how that works.
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Postby National Capitalist United States » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:29 pm

The Huskar Social Union wrote:Its disgraceful whats happening to those people, but i doubt the world will end up doing anything substantial about it. But every nation that condemns or goes for sanctions is at least trying to do... something i guess.

Also GHK: "Communist fascists"

thats... not how that works.

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Postby The Greater Ohio Valley » Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:33 pm

China is 100% one of the evils of our time. If the world wasn’t so economically dependent on them we might actually be able to do something.

National Capitalist United States wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Its disgraceful whats happening to those people, but i doubt the world will end up doing anything substantial about it. But every nation that condemns or goes for sanctions is at least trying to do... something i guess.

Also GHK: "Communist fascists"

thats... not how that works.

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Dowaesk
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Postby Dowaesk » Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:41 pm

Mannixa Prime wrote:This is text book genocide and it disgusts me that so many will throw the “well ACKTULLY” card around. China is committing genocide pure and simple.

But nothing will be done because people love their cheap goods and it’s easier to scream at white racists on twitter...

I hope the situation improves but I am not optimistic.

Neither am I to be honest. But Im hoping for the best. There are about 13 million people suffering. Very unsure what future awaits for them. As much as I would like an East Turkestan. Its very unlikely.
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Postby Trollzyn the Infinite » Sat Apr 17, 2021 6:00 pm

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Postby New haven america » Sat Apr 17, 2021 6:07 pm

I do wonder why a lot of Chinese nationalists use the excuse "If you're against the CCP/PRC" then you're just buying into CIA propaganda. (This is a common argument used when talking about the Uyghur Genocide)

Like, ok, dearies. If the CIA wanted to deal with China, they wouldn't use homegrown propaganda. They'd go into China and depose your current dictator and you'd be none the wiser until like, 10-20 years down the line.
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Postby Muzehnaya » Sat Apr 17, 2021 6:49 pm

New haven america wrote:I do wonder why a lot of Chinese nationalists use the excuse "If you're against the CCP/PRC" then you're just buying into CIA propaganda. (This is a common argument used when talking about the Uyghur Genocide)

Like, ok, dearies. If the CIA wanted to deal with China, they wouldn't use homegrown propaganda. They'd go into China and depose your current dictator and you'd be none the wiser until like, 10-20 years down the line.

This, and other denialist arguments about how birth rates in the region are just dropping naturally, and how there are actually "so many mosques in Xinjiang!!!"
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