San Francisco may rename school named for Washington

[The Black Forrest]

The rename effort is canceled. Seems the more pressing need is reopening the schools.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/sa ... e-n1258649

[Umeria]

The rename effort is canceled. Seems the more pressing need is reopening the schools.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/sa ... e-n1258649

Delayed, not canceled.

[The Black Forrest]

The rename effort is canceled. Seems the more pressing need is reopening the schools.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/sa ... e-n1258649

Delayed, not canceled.

Delayed is a nice way to say canceled without having to admit anything.

[Umeria]

Delayed, not canceled.

Delayed is a nice way to say canceled without having to admit anything.

Do you think the names won't be changed?

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

Delayed, not canceled.

Delayed is a nice way to say canceled without having to admit anything.

No. If they had genuinely cancelled it, it would be best for them to admit it right away. Their supporters would think "damn we lost that one" and be in no doubt they will find plenty of opponents to blame before turning on the council. And their opponents would stop hammering them, because it's better to let it rest then bring it up when elections are due.

Delayed means delayed. Put on indefinite hold. They so plainly lost that they're retreating. But for some reason they think it's worth trying again.

If I was really opposed to their renaming program, I wouldn't be complacent now. Among the schools there are probably a few named after more obscure scumbags (locals most likely) and if they can build a better case, even for just one or two, they might rename a school after Martin Luther King or Rodney King (LA not SF, but you get the idea). Measured by schools renamed that's in no way a victory, but symbolically it would be.

[Umeria]

But for some reason they think it's worth trying again.

Of course it is, when the pandemic's over. That's their whole argument. People in SF would support changing the names if it weren't for more pressing matters.

If I was really opposed to their renaming program, I wouldn't be complacent now. Among the schools there are probably a few named after more obscure scumbags (locals most likely) and if they can build a better case, even for just one or two, they might rename a school after Martin Luther King or Rodney King (LA not SF, but you get the idea). Measured by schools renamed that's in no way a victory, but symbolically it would be.

A victory for what? The secret anti-name agenda?

There's no conspiracy here. The name changes were a minor procedural matter that the board used to stall for time. It's like if they spent a bunch of time on repainting the buildings. It's irresponsible to prioritize it during a pandemic, but that doesn't mean the repainting itself is bad.

[The Islands of Versilia]

George Washington was more important to the United States than anyone else and renaming schools that are named after him is nothing short of anti-patriotism and pathetic guilt for the life of a 18th century man.

Granted, this is California, so anti-patriotism and white guilt is guaranteed.

I don’t really care though, I’m not American so whatever.

[Umeria]

George Washington was more important to the United States than anyone else and renaming schools that are named after him is nothing short of anti-patriotism and pathetic guilt for the life of a 18th century man.

What if the new name was Ben Franklin, would it still be anti-patriotic

Granted, this is California, so anti-patriotism and white guilt is guaranteed.

I don’t really care though, I’m not American so whatever.

It really sucks that this ridiculous narrative about California has become so widespread.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

But for some reason they think it's worth trying again.

Of course it is, when the pandemic's over. That's their whole argument. People in SF would support changing the names if it weren't for more pressing matters.

If I was really opposed to their renaming program, I wouldn't be complacent now. Among the schools there are probably a few named after more obscure scumbags (locals most likely) and if they can build a better case, even for just one or two, they might rename a school after Martin Luther King or Rodney King (LA not SF, but you get the idea). Measured by schools renamed that's in no way a victory, but symbolically it would be.

A victory for what? The secret anti-name agenda?

There's no conspiracy here. The name changes were a minor procedural matter that the board used to stall for time. It's like if they spent a bunch of time on repainting the buildings. It's irresponsible to prioritize it during a pandemic, but that doesn't mean the repainting itself is bad.

Repainting the buildings while students aren't there would make sense, actually.

My point is that renaming 2 buildings (that had particularly bad names) would still be success. Just not very successful compared to the 44 they tried to rename ... the first time.

And that's why they're "delaying" instead of "cancelling".

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

George Washington was more important to the United States than anyone else and renaming schools that are named after him is nothing short of anti-patriotism and pathetic guilt for the life of a 18th century man. <snip>

Say you had 44 schools under your personal jurisdiction. And in their wisdom, whoever held your job 30 years ago named all 44 of the schools George Washington (Primary/Middle/High) School.

Why would they do that? It doesn't matter. People in the past named schools, and you don't have a time machine, so there's nowt you can do about history.

Are you going to rename any of the schools? Or allow patriotism so hyperbolic that nobody in the city can tell the schools apart by name, stand? People out there are calling schools "the yellow school" or "the old school" or even some play on Washington's name, because people all using the same name for 44 different things isn't going to work.

If people won't actually use the names, doesn't it seem time to change some names so that at least some of them have that quality which words sometimes have, of referring to a specific singular thing or person?

Also, does or does not naming every school in a city after Washington, actually seem a bit disrespectful to his memory? A bit North Korea-like?

[The Islands of Versilia]

George Washington was more important to the United States than anyone else and renaming schools that are named after him is nothing short of anti-patriotism and pathetic guilt for the life of a 18th century man.

What if the new name was Ben Franklin, would it still be anti-patriotic

Ben Franklin is a step down from the nigh legendary icon that is George Washington, but Franklin is a preferable choice to anyone of a lesser status and importance to American history and national identity.

Granted, this is California, so anti-patriotism and white guilt is guaranteed.

I don’t really care though, I’m not American so whatever.

It really sucks that this ridiculous narrative about California has become so widespread.

Blame California for creating it.

[The Islands of Versilia]

George Washington was more important to the United States than anyone else and renaming schools that are named after him is nothing short of anti-patriotism and pathetic guilt for the life of a 18th century man. <snip>

Say you had 44 schools under your personal jurisdiction. And in their wisdom, whoever held your job 30 years ago named all 44 of the schools George Washington (Primary/Middle/High) School.

Why would they do that? It doesn't matter. People in the past named schools, and you don't have a time machine, so there's nowt you can do about history.

Are you going to rename any of the schools? Or allow patriotism so hyperbolic that nobody in the city can tell the schools apart by name, stand? People out there are calling schools "the yellow school" or "the old school" or even some play on Washington's name, because people all using the same name for 44 different things isn't going to work.

If people won't actually use the names, doesn't it seem time to change some names so that at least some of them have that quality which words sometimes have, of referring to a specific singular thing or person?

Also, does or does not naming every school in a city after Washington, actually seem a bit disrespectful to his memory? A bit North Korea-like?

Renaming schools for practicality is perfectly fine in my book. I’d personally rename each school after someone of great importance to my nation’s history and culture, so that they don’t get mixed up - but only with the support of the students and staff. Renaming schools for ideological reasons I do not support.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

What if the new name was Ben Franklin, would it still be anti-patriotic

Ben Franklin is a step down from the nigh legendary icon that is George Washington, but Franklin is a preferable choice to anyone of a lesser status and importance to American history and national identity.

Sez you.

Washington became famous by directing the killing of a bunch of Brits. He was also one of the lesser Founding Fathers. But after that he was a timid President who arguably wasn't validly elected either time (essentially no opposition) and the most patriotic act of his life was to decline the third term which would also have been handed to him for nothing. Then he lived on his farm with his hundred-odd slaves and died richer than any other President in history (including Trump, considering inflation).

Whereas Ben Franklin liked to get drunk and stoned, he invented the pot-belly stove and the cow-catcher, he never owned slaves, and was all-round a top bloke.

If it was up to me, there would be MORE things named after the goofy inventor and gentle intellectual influencer, than named after the slave-owning billionaire who rose to fame by mongering a war!




(Not entirely serious, but I do think we should take marks of anyone who "won" a war.)

[The Islands of Versilia]

Ben Franklin is a step down from the nigh legendary icon that is George Washington, but Franklin is a preferable choice to anyone of a lesser status and importance to American history and national identity.

Sez you.

Washington became famous by directing the killing of a bunch of Brits. He was also one of the lesser Founding Fathers. But after that he was a timid President who arguably wasn't validly elected either time (essentially no opposition) and the most patriotic act of his life was to decline the third term which would also have been handed to him for nothing. Then he lived on his farm with his hundred-odd slaves and died richer than any other President in history (including Trump, considering inflation).

Whereas Ben Franklin liked to get drunk and stoned, he invented the pot-belly stove and the cow-catcher, he never owned slaves, and was all-round a top bloke.

If it was up to me, there would be MORE things named after the goofy inventor and gentle intellectual influencer, than named after the slave-owning billionaire who rose to fame by mongering a war!




(Not entirely serious, but I do think we should take marks of anyone who "won" a war.)

Slave owning war leader or not, George Washington is still the greatest icon of the United States. It wouldn’t be my concern whether or not people get upset at the fact he wasn’t a man of the modern United States and had a few skeletons in his closet.

[A-Series-Of-Tubes]

Say you had 44 schools under your personal jurisdiction. And in their wisdom, whoever held your job 30 years ago named all 44 of the schools George Washington (Primary/Middle/High) School.

Why would they do that? It doesn't matter. People in the past named schools, and you don't have a time machine, so there's nowt you can do about history.

Are you going to rename any of the schools? Or allow patriotism so hyperbolic that nobody in the city can tell the schools apart by name, stand? People out there are calling schools "the yellow school" or "the old school" or even some play on Washington's name, because people all using the same name for 44 different things isn't going to work.

If people won't actually use the names, doesn't it seem time to change some names so that at least some of them have that quality which words sometimes have, of referring to a specific singular thing or person?

Also, does or does not naming every school in a city after Washington, actually seem a bit disrespectful to his memory? A bit North Korea-like?

Renaming schools for practicality is perfectly fine in my book. I’d personally rename each school after someone of great importance to my nation’s history and culture, so that they don’t get mixed up - but only with the support of the students and staff. Renaming schools for ideological reasons I do not support.

Well that's almost perfectly my position! Except I'd avoid the "every town is the same" vibe by only naming the most important things after national heroes. Everything else would be named after local (maybe State) heroes. So they never hit the world stage, they don't get things named after them in any other town, but they did something for the history of people who live here. I think that matters.

Support of the students and staff is also very important. Some students are going to be too young, or uninterested, so mom or dad vote for them. Yeah, vote, but let's not disagree on that.

A student's reason is an ideological reason. It's maybe too vague or confused to be organized ideology, but we've all got ideology. Semantics perhaps, I know what you mean. I doubt the people who elected the board were thinking of mass renaming as the only achievement in a term; some ideology has obviously been added to what the voters wanted.

[Umeria]

Repainting the buildings while students aren't there would make sense, actually.

My point is that renaming 2 buildings (that had particularly bad names) would still be success. Just not very successful compared to the 44 they tried to rename ... the first time.

And that's why they're "delaying" instead of "cancelling".

What do you mean by "success"? It's not like they're keeping score. Also they will likely rename all 44, or perhaps 39 or 40 out of those 44.

It really sucks that this ridiculous narrative about California has become so widespread.

Blame California for creating it.

The right created it, out of thin air I might add.

[The Black Forrest]

Delayed is a nice way to say canceled without having to admit anything.

Do you think the names won't be changed?

They have in the past. It’s just a priority thing. There are bigger issues to handle.

[Western Fardelshufflestein]

Ben Franklin is a step down from the nigh legendary icon that is George Washington, but Franklin is a preferable choice to anyone of a lesser status and importance to American history and national identity.

Sez you.

Washington became famous by directing the killing of a bunch of Brits. He was also one of the lesser Founding Fathers. But after that he was a timid President who arguably wasn't validly elected either time (essentially no opposition) and the most patriotic act of his life was to decline the third term which would also have been handed to him for nothing. Then he lived on his farm with his hundred-odd slaves and died richer than any other President in history (including Trump, considering inflation).

Whereas Ben Franklin liked to get drunk and stoned, he invented the pot-belly stove and the cow-catcher, he never owned slaves, and was all-round a top bloke.

If it was up to me, there would be MORE things named after the goofy inventor and gentle intellectual influencer, than named after the slave-owning billionaire who rose to fame by mongering a war!




(Not entirely serious, but I do think we should take marks of anyone who "won" a war.)

GW wasn't a billionare, and he didn't start the war. Unfortunately, he owned slaves, which I do not and will never defend--but he wasn't 100% bad.

Slavery is a disgusting practice, and shouldn't be condoned, but I'm just saying that GW wasn't all horrible.

[Kowani]

Sez you.

Washington became famous by directing the killing of a bunch of Brits. He was also one of the lesser Founding Fathers. But after that he was a timid President who arguably wasn't validly elected either time (essentially no opposition) and the most patriotic act of his life was to decline the third term which would also have been handed to him for nothing. Then he lived on his farm with his hundred-odd slaves and died richer than any other President in history (including Trump, considering inflation).

Whereas Ben Franklin liked to get drunk and stoned, he invented the pot-belly stove and the cow-catcher, he never owned slaves, and was all-round a top bloke.

If it was up to me, there would be MORE things named after the goofy inventor and gentle intellectual influencer, than named after the slave-owning billionaire who rose to fame by mongering a war!




(Not entirely serious, but I do think we should take marks of anyone who "won" a war.)

GW wasn't a billionare, and he didn't start the war. Unfortunately, he owned slaves, which I do not and will never defend--but he wasn't 100% bad.

Slavery is a disgusting practice, and shouldn't be condoned, but I'm just saying that GW wasn't all horrible.

I mean
By all accounts, he helped kick off the French & Indian War (though you could make an argument that it was part of a longer trend and the individual commander wasn’t responsible)

[Western Fardelshufflestein]

GW wasn't a billionare, and he didn't start the war. Unfortunately, he owned slaves, which I do not and will never defend--but he wasn't 100% bad.

Slavery is a disgusting practice, and shouldn't be condoned, but I'm just saying that GW wasn't all horrible.

I mean
By all accounts, he helped kick off the French & Indian War (though you could make an argument that it was part of a longer trend and the individual commander wasn’t responsible)

I have heard that before. He probably did have a role in it, but I'd need to do some investigating.

[The Black Forrest]

Sez you.

Washington became famous by directing the killing of a bunch of Brits. He was also one of the lesser Founding Fathers. But after that he was a timid President who arguably wasn't validly elected either time (essentially no opposition) and the most patriotic act of his life was to decline the third term which would also have been handed to him for nothing. Then he lived on his farm with his hundred-odd slaves and died richer than any other President in history (including Trump, considering inflation).

Whereas Ben Franklin liked to get drunk and stoned, he invented the pot-belly stove and the cow-catcher, he never owned slaves, and was all-round a top bloke.

If it was up to me, there would be MORE things named after the goofy inventor and gentle intellectual influencer, than named after the slave-owning billionaire who rose to fame by mongering a war!




(Not entirely serious, but I do think we should take marks of anyone who "won" a war.)

GW wasn't a billionare, and he didn't start the war. Unfortunately, he owned slaves, which I do not and will never defend--but he wasn't 100% bad.

Slavery is a disgusting practice, and shouldn't be condoned, but I'm just saying that GW wasn't all horrible.

Indeed. He inherited 11 from his father and had 35ish by the time of his marriage. Martha brought the majority.

It’s fascinating the outrage over beliefs of over 200 years ago which we would not accept today....well at least in servant form. Financial slaves is another discussion.

You would think more emphasis in bettering black America would be the better effort. Employment, education, sentencing laws, police brutality....

I guess we can get concerned if GW’s images start showing up at alt-right protests.....

[Kowani]

I mean
By all accounts, he helped kick off the French & Indian War (though you could make an argument that it was part of a longer trend and the individual commander wasn’t responsible)

I have heard that before. He probably did have a role in it, but I'd need to do some investigating.

He literally led the military expedition that kicked off the war lmao

[Umeria]

I guess we can get concerned if GW’s images start showing up at alt-right protests.....

In my opinion that isn't the main concern. The problem isn't that Washington was some fringe hardliner; quite the opposite. It's the fact that Washington's views on slavery were normal, mainstream beliefs at the time. An entire society that accepts the idea of slavery is much worse than just one person doing so.

[New Jeromia]

Sorry for bumping an old thread here, but I recently found out about this through YouTube recommendations I believe (which are always late). I wanted to point out Feinstein's "crime" here because it's actually quite ridiculous. Basically, in the 80s, somebody vandalized a part of a city building dedicated to southern heritage, and defiled the Confederate flag. Feinstein, hearing about this, wanted the flag to be replaced, which was ultimately forgotten about and never happened. Because of this mishap, her name is being removed from schools. Yes, because she wanted to clean the flag 40 years ago. I guess the cancellers are cancelling themselves now, because she's definitely liberal.

I live in Columbus, Ohio, and our school district is doing a similar thing, but we're renaming any sort of mascot which might represent a group of people. This of course includes Native American names, which I'm fine with removing, but also is extended to names like vikings and Scots, which nobody has an issue with. It's sad to see both of these school districts waste taxpayer money on the little things, when both have not been open to most kids for a year. Couldn't the money be better spent on air filtration systems and cleaning supplies?

[Umeria]

I guess the cancellers are cancelling themselves now, because she's definitely liberal.

No? Feinstein voted for the Iraq war, the Patriot Act, and the Bush tax cuts. She opposes single payer healthcare and the green new deal. She's quite conservative.

Couldn't the money be better spent on air filtration systems and cleaning supplies?

It is; they recently decided to prioritize a safe reopening.