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[DEFEATED] Condemn The Land of Kings and Emperors

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Wansdyke
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Founded: Apr 14, 2007
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wansdyke » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:37 am

Groot wrote:
Makdon wrote:Disappointed by LKE’s multiple attempts to invade the region of Moldavia, which were repeatedly rebuffed by the brave natives, who rated LKE’s invasions 37/60 and 35/60, respectively

What does this mean and how is this remotely relevant?


Trying to be snarky about a founder return situation which is absolutely routine in military gameplay. Hard to see what was "brave" about reviving a founder and booting out invading forces, its something that happens all the time. In this case the Founder posted some mildly amusing memes which defenders, desperately starved of real military victories against LKE, have decided to idolise here. But essentially the whole thing is a complete non-event, and mentioning it in the Condemnation is merely an underhand ploy to try and mock the power and might of the LKE, in its own condemnation.

Indeed, despite being elevated to the third point, its completely inconsistent with the narrative of the rest of the resolution - which is that the LKE is a menacingly effective and dangerous military force. But no doubt the author just couldn't resist including it because the real motivation here is not to highlight or recompense any possible actual harms done by the LKE, but rather just to attempt to antagonise or denigrate a region which has been a thorn in the side of Defenderism for well over a decade. Whether they ever get their way with this initiative, or competency continues to elude them, what matters is that the Golden Aquila should continue to fly over our enemies for many years to come.

- Wilhelm Somerset, Lord High Steward of the LKE
Last edited by Wansdyke on Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Wilhelm Somerset, Lord High Steward of the LKE

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Refuge Isle
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Founded: Dec 14, 2018
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:31 pm

Wansdyke wrote:Indeed, despite being elevated to the third point, its completely inconsistent with the narrative of the rest of the resolution

I agree that the tone is inconsistent, but I've never read resolution clauses as an ordered hierarchy.
Last edited by Refuge Isle on Sat Sep 26, 2020 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Old Dominion Virginia
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Founded: Jul 12, 2016
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Old Dominion Virginia » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:06 pm

Old Dominion Virginia believes that there has been no proof provided to this body that the LKE is deserving of any condemnation. If anything, the Security Council should consider legislation to Commend the Land of Kings and Emperors. ODV would also like to point out that both Silver Shroud and Consular, the previous nations seeking to condemn LKE, are no longer on NationStates...and thus the motives of these condemnations should be seriously called into question.

We vote nay on this proposal.
Last edited by Old Dominion Virginia on Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Makdon
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Founded: Nov 14, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Makdon » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:33 am

Wansdyke wrote:
Groot wrote:What does this mean and how is this remotely relevant?


Trying to be snarky about a founder return situation which is absolutely routine in military gameplay. Hard to see what was "brave" about reviving a founder and booting out invading forces, its something that happens all the time. In this case the Founder posted some mildly amusing memes which defenders, desperately starved of real military victories against LKE, have decided to idolise here. But essentially the whole thing is a complete non-event, and mentioning it in the Condemnation is merely an underhand ploy to try and mock the power and might of the LKE, in its own condemnation.

Indeed, despite being elevated to the third point, its completely inconsistent with the narrative of the rest of the resolution - which is that the LKE is a menacingly effective and dangerous military force. But no doubt the author just couldn't resist including it because the real motivation here is not to highlight or recompense any possible actual harms done by the LKE, but rather just to attempt to antagonise or denigrate a region which has been a thorn in the side of Defenderism for well over a decade. Whether they ever get their way with this initiative, or competency continues to elude them, what matters is that the Golden Aquila should continue to fly over our enemies for many years to come.

- Wilhelm Somerset, Lord High Steward of the LKE

Glad to see someone from LKE finally showing up. I included this because I thought it was interesting. Not something with much affect on GP politics or such, but it generated a surprising amount of forum activity, and I found it fun. I think the other actions listed in the proposal shows LKE's condemnablity quite clearly, and that this doesn't detract from those at all, only adding a tidbit of history. Also, the order of the clauses is not at all intended to represent some hierarchy of importance. I do like the implication that I've got some sort of evil defender agenda that I'm trying to advance.
Old Dominion Virginia wrote:Old Dominion Virginia believes that there has been no proof provided to this body that the LKE is deserving of any condemnation. If anything, the Security Council should consider legislation to Commend the Land of Kings and Emperors. ODV would also like to point out that both Silver Shroud and Consular, the previous nations seeking to condemn LKE, are no longer on NationStates...and thus the motives of these condemnations should be seriously called into question.

We vote nay on this proposal.

lol at the suggestion LKE deserves a commend, or that the fact previous attempted authors have CTEd is at all relevant.
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Allistair Union
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Allistair Union » Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:36 am

Makdon wrote:lol at the suggestion LKE deserves a commend, or that the fact previous attempted authors have CTEd is at all relevant.


This may be your stance at the suggestion simply because you have not taken the time to properly research and investigate the LKE, you would find that there are a multitude of subjects that are represented and supported by the region quite plainly, that are not recognized by the WA and many of its members including those who have proposed the regions condemnation. You cannot charge a region if you are not willing to read its full story.
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Makdon
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Founded: Nov 14, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Makdon » Mon Sep 28, 2020 10:02 am

Allistair Union wrote:This may be your stance at the suggestion simply because you have not taken the time to properly research and investigate the LKE, you would find that there are a multitude of subjects that are represented and supported by the region quite plainly, that are not recognized by the WA and many of its members including those who have proposed the regions condemnation. You cannot charge a region if you are not willing to read its full story.

So, what great insight can you provide on the LKE that makes it commendable? I'll wait.
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Allistair Union
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Allistair Union » Mon Sep 28, 2020 10:31 am

Makdon wrote:
Allistair Union wrote:This may be your stance at the suggestion simply because you have not taken the time to properly research and investigate the LKE, you would find that there are a multitude of subjects that are represented and supported by the region quite plainly, that are not recognized by the WA and many of its members including those who have proposed the regions condemnation. You cannot charge a region if you are not willing to read its full story.

So, what great insight can you provide on the LKE that makes it commendable? I'll wait.

The LKE is home to many free nations, some of them the greatest nations in the world. The Imperial Government supports democracy and freedom of speech, and it governs a region whose culture flourishes in environmentalism and welfare. This of course is wholly ignored by those who are against the LKE, or, much like you, they aren't even aware because they haven't properly researched.
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Almighty Rulers King Ascanor Wineholt Von Arcadia-Sova and Queen Valorea Ivatollum, Wineholt Von Arcadia-Sova.

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Tinhampton
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Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Tinhampton » Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:59 am

I note that TSP's Office of World Assembly Legislation refers to this Condemnation proposal as "a bigger improvement over the last proposal that was voted on to Condemn Ever-Wandering Souls." Really, I had no idea that Refuge was trying to condemn a former high-ranking LKE figure :blink:
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Wayneactia
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Wayneactia » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:39 pm

Tinhampton wrote:I note that TSP's Office of World Assembly Legislation refers to this Condemnation proposal as "a bigger improvement over the last proposal that was voted on to Condemn Ever-Wandering Souls." Really, I had no idea that Refuge was trying to condemn a former high-ranking LKE figure :blink:

What are you talking about?

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Refuge Isle
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Founded: Dec 14, 2018
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:06 pm

Tinhampton wrote:I note that TSP's Office of World Assembly Legislation refers to this Condemnation proposal as "a bigger improvement over the last proposal that was voted on to Condemn Ever-Wandering Souls." Really, I had no idea that Refuge was trying to condemn a former high-ranking LKE figure :blink:

Although amusingly their voting post did attribute the LKE condemnation text to me at first, the text just refers to the reversal in recommendations. LKE would not view one as a compliment, where Souls obviously would view it as a career capstone.

Both recommendations are intended to frustrate the target.
Last edited by Refuge Isle on Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Daytime to Night
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Founded: Dec 04, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Daytime to Night » Tue Sep 29, 2020 12:02 am

Refuge Isle wrote:LKE would not view one as a compliment, where Souls obviously would view it as a career capstone.

Both recommendations are intended to frustrate the target.


Are you sure about that?
Last edited by Daytime to Night on Tue Sep 29, 2020 12:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Makdon
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Founded: Nov 14, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Makdon » Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:09 pm

Allistair Union wrote:The LKE is home to many free nations, some of them the greatest nations in the world. The Imperial Government supports democracy and freedom of speech, and it governs a region whose culture flourishes in environmentalism and welfare. This of course is wholly ignored by those who are against the LKE, or, much like you, they aren't even aware because they haven't properly researched.

Some of the greatest nations in the world reside in LKE?!? Good heavens, why didn't anyone tell me that? If only they had I'd have never tried to condemn them! Regardless, you're welcome to try, but nothing you've described here is worthy of commendation.

Edit:
Honeydewistania wrote:
Cormac has switched allegiances many, many times. Here is the LKE's statement at the time. https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=15804869&sid=0e85f4cbde225607844785d0d885ff5b#p15804869

Good to know about Cormac, but what about Tim?

Oops, I somehow read this, went away for a while, and when I came back decided it was asking about cormac. As for Tim, I'm not entirely sure. When was Tim delegate? Cause if it was a while after the coup, then it seems reasonable to assume that effects of the coups initial rejection to have worn off.
Last edited by Makdon on Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Refuge Isle
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Founded: Dec 14, 2018
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Tue Sep 29, 2020 9:02 pm

"Condemn The Land of Kings and Emperors" was defeated 9,294 votes to 5,136.
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Honeydewistania
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Capitalist Paradise

Postby Honeydewistania » Tue Sep 29, 2020 9:32 pm

Idea’s there, just needs refining.
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Daytime to Night
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Founded: Dec 04, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Daytime to Night » Wed Sep 30, 2020 1:43 am

Wansdyke wrote:the LKE is a menacingly effective and dangerous military force


:rofl:
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Wansdyke
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Founded: Apr 14, 2007
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wansdyke » Wed Sep 30, 2020 11:38 am

Daytime to Night wrote:
Wansdyke wrote:the LKE is a menacingly effective and dangerous military force


:rofl:


Blatant straw man. I'm not making the proposition, I was just saying "the narrative of the rest of the resolution is that the LKE is a menacingly effective and dangerous military force". Like it, agree with it, or not, thats the narrative it puts across when it talks about the "menaces like LKE", "vile conquering", "vast number of invasions", "cruelly occupying" and "showing the LKE’s continued military activity and strength". You should have took it up with the author not me if you disagreed.
- Wilhelm Somerset, Lord High Steward of the LKE

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