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The Third Israel-Arab Peace Deal

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Shamhnan Insir
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The Third Israel-Arab Peace Deal

Postby Shamhnan Insir » Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:35 am

In a joint statement Israel President Ben Netanyahu, Abu Dhabi Crown Prince Mohammed Al Nahyan and US President Trump have announced the brokering of what will be only the third Israel - Arab peace deal since Israel's declaration of independence.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-53770859

Whilst a historic moment, the real shaking of hands (or not due to corona risk) is still to take place as will a great deal more discussions and signing of treaties. However as a rather positive sign at this stage it appears Israel will suspend its planned annexation of large bits of the Occupied West Bank. Whether or not the gesture is purely out of good will or not remains to be seen as other sources suggest the real motive for the suspension is potentially more related to the pandemic which has drastically flared in Israel in the past month.
It is believed that shared feelings of unease about the situation and actions of Iran have brought the UAE and Israel together into this discussion and so naturally many are looking at how far the US is extending its hand into this.


What says you NSG members? Considering the tangled, bloody history and heavily entrenched feelings over this matter do you think a new page can truly be turned and the ink of history will mark this as the beginning of real change? Or perhaps this may go as things have before, rather sideways culminating in further, bitter strife?

I spent some time in Israel earlier this year and did a good bit of poking around this subject. Certainly there are clear advocates for more annexation and pushing Israeli territory further and further, however I did find a real sense of unease on the matter, with several voices questioning the rationale behind pushing for more. What was there to gain?
Personally I'd hope this "sticks" in the sense of creating a baseline for things to settle upon, however there are many nagging questions and snags on the borders there which I don't think will go away too soon, treaty or not.
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-Ra-
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Postby -Ra- » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:22 am

Knowing how hostile that corner of the world is, I'd say that this is a good sign. Good on Trump and Prince Al Nahyan for starting the process at least. I don't have much faith that it will go anywhere, given that both the Israeli and Arab governments are obstinate in their demands.
Last edited by -Ra- on Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Major-Tom
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Postby Major-Tom » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:29 am

I can kind of see the purpose of this deal, Israel is one of those countries that needs allies on the basis of it being kind of isolated politically from its' neighbors, though I would hope they can also use their newfound political sway to incentivize reforms in the UAE. I mean, if you think the Saudi government is bad, look at the UAE, it's just as bad a mess, just overshadowed by it's significantly louder, larger neighbor.
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Shamhnan Insir
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Postby Shamhnan Insir » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:31 am

-Ra- wrote:Knowing how hostile that corner of the world is, I'd say that this is a good sign. Good on Trump and Prince Al Nahyan for starting the process at least. I don't have much faith that it will go anywhere, given that both the Israeli and Arab governments are obstinate in their demands.

As I said the motive for the halting of annexation plans is somewhat dubious in nature, however it is a pretty big show of positive interaction. My concerns lie with the reactions of the neighbouring nations.
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North German Realm
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Postby North German Realm » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:32 am

Pretty good news. Not only does it sign that more Arab states are finally learning that no matter how much they whine and pout, Israel isn't just going to either lose a war to them or up and leave, it also might mean a regional coalition against the IR, which is always a good thing imo. With that in mind, I do wonder if this will work for or against Trump's popularity in the US.
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Postby Heloin » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:34 am

Major-Tom wrote:I can kind of see the purpose of this deal, Israel is one of those countries that needs allies on the basis of it being kind of isolated politically from its' neighbors, though I would hope they can also use their newfound political sway to incentivize reforms in the UAE. I mean, if you think the Saudi government is bad, look at the UAE, it's just as bad a mess, just overshadowed by it's significantly louder, larger neighbor.

Who doesn't love the UAE? The slave state with big buildings not much else positive going for it.
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West green Israel
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Postby West green Israel » Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:46 am

North German Realm wrote:Pretty good news. Not only does it sign that more Arab states are finally learning that no matter how much they whine and pout, Israel isn't just going to either lose a war to them or up and leave, it also might mean a regional coalition against the IR, which is always a good thing imo. With that in mind, I do wonder if this will work for or against Trump's popularity in the US.

It won't affect Trump. the opinion about him are already baked in, and barely moved by other events with much more relevancy to the average American.

I hope it will be a start for more states to follow UAE, and make peace with Israel.

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Postby Salus Maior » Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:06 am

Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?
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Postby Kowani » Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:07 am

Peace is good.
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Cordel One
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Postby Cordel One » Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:08 am

Salus Maior wrote:Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?

Absolutely not, royals are always so disconnected from the needs and opinions of the general population. only a Palestinian can speak for a Palestinian,
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North German Realm
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Postby North German Realm » Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:09 am

Cordel One wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?

Absolutely not, royals are always so disconnected from the needs and opinions of the general population. only a Palestinian can speak for a Palestinian,

The Prince of Abu Dhabi is... also... not a Palestinian. Like. He lives across the peninsula and all that. With that in mind, I don't really think the opinion of Palestinians really matters (at all, much less) where UAE-Israeli relations are concerned.
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:21 am

Salus Maior wrote:Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?


No, but he does not have to. This is about UAE/Israeli recognitions. He simply has to decide what he wants to give Israel recognition.

It is not a final solution of the Palestinian issue at all, rather something like when Jordan and Egypt agreed to recognize Israel.

But it should improve stability. By recognizing Israel the UAE gets some leverage.
By refusing to recognize Israel’s right to exist, the other Arab states lose leverage over Israel, why would Israel care what someone who says it should be destroyed thinks?

This is a good thing. The more Arab countries that recognize Israel the more secure Israel feels, and less likely it is to act recklessly on the Palestinian and other issues.
Last edited by Novus America on Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Thu Aug 13, 2020 1:41 pm

Gaza Strip must be left to Israel, a free state must be established in Jerusalem. Israel should abandon its expansion policy Golan Heights belong to the Syrian people !!
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 1:45 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:Gaza Strip must be left to Israel, a free state must be established in Jerusalem. Israel should abandon its expansion policy Golan Heights belong to the Syrian people !!


Ermm, why would the UAE really care about the Golan Heights?
And no, Israel is not giving up West Jerusalem, nobody seriously thinks that is even a remotely plausible idea.

Not sure what you are saying about Gaza, Israel does not want it.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

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Melkanaan
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Postby Melkanaan » Thu Aug 13, 2020 1:50 pm

Not to sound cynical, but it almost reads as if the UAE have been allowed to lease the West Bank in perpetuity, which is why Israel has canned all other plans for the region. And further discussions are about how the UAE are gonna pay Israel, after which hands will be shook / shaken / fistbumped/ whatever Corona allows.

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Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Thu Aug 13, 2020 1:50 pm

Saudi Arabia is more than willing to sell out the Palestinians, and the US is not an unbiased moderator. What's new?
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Novus America
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 2:01 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Saudi Arabia is more than willing to sell out the Palestinians, and the US is not an unbiased moderator. What's new?


The UAE recognizing Israel is new.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:33 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Saudi Arabia is more than willing to sell out the Palestinians, and the US is not an unbiased moderator. What's new?
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Postby Aureumterra » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:34 pm

:clap:

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Postby Aureumterra » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:35 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Saudi Arabia is more than willing to sell out the Palestinians, and the US is not an unbiased moderator. What's new?

This was the Prince of Abu Dhabi, not Saudi Arabia
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Postby Salus Maior » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:37 pm

Cordel One wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?

Absolutely not, royals are always so disconnected from the needs and opinions of the general population. only a Palestinian can speak for a Palestinian,


Not actually true, but I suppose I can't expect you to post anything other than parroting leftist talking points.

If the Palestinians gave the prince their consent to speak for them is what I'm asking, or whether Palestinians are just completely disenfranchised from this decision.
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:38 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Borderlands of Rojava wrote:Saudi Arabia is more than willing to sell out the Palestinians, and the US is not an unbiased moderator. What's new?
America has it wherever there is oil. the hypocrisy of political Islam
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Actually no, there are several places with oil we have little influence at all.
The US is also the worlds biggest oil producer and net imports make up a mere 1% of US oil consumption.

We used to be more concerned about oil, but that is not the case anymore.

Also the US gets no oil from Israel and very little from the UAE.
Neither are important oil supplier to the US, especially Israel which supplies none.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
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Postby Salus Maior » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:38 pm

Novus America wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:Does the crown prince of Abu Dhabi speak for Palestinians?


No, but he does not have to. This is about UAE/Israeli recognitions. He simply has to decide what he wants to give Israel recognition.

It is not a final solution of the Palestinian issue at all, rather something like when Jordan and Egypt agreed to recognize Israel.

But it should improve stability. By recognizing Israel the UAE gets some leverage.
By refusing to recognize Israel’s right to exist, the other Arab states lose leverage over Israel, why would Israel care what someone who says it should be destroyed thinks?

This is a good thing. The more Arab countries that recognize Israel the more secure Israel feels, and less likely it is to act recklessly on the Palestinian and other issues.


Then I would suggest that the title is misleading.
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Novus America
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:39 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Cordel One wrote:Absolutely not, royals are always so disconnected from the needs and opinions of the general population. only a Palestinian can speak for a Palestinian,


Not actually true, but I suppose I can't expect you to post anything other than parroting leftist talking points.

If the Palestinians gave the prince their consent to speak for them is what I'm asking, or whether Palestinians are just completely disenfranchised from this decision.


Why would the Palestinians have a right to determine UAE federal policy though?
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

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Novus America
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Postby Novus America » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:42 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Novus America wrote:
No, but he does not have to. This is about UAE/Israeli recognitions. He simply has to decide what he wants to give Israel recognition.

It is not a final solution of the Palestinian issue at all, rather something like when Jordan and Egypt agreed to recognize Israel.

But it should improve stability. By recognizing Israel the UAE gets some leverage.
By refusing to recognize Israel’s right to exist, the other Arab states lose leverage over Israel, why would Israel care what someone who says it should be destroyed thinks?

This is a good thing. The more Arab countries that recognize Israel the more secure Israel feels, and less likely it is to act recklessly on the Palestinian and other issues.


Then I would suggest that the title is misleading.


The title refers to the fact that two Arab countries made peace with Israel before this I believe.
It is not saying all Arabs did, because they never did before.

But maybe it should say specifically Israel and UAE.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

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