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[ABANDONED] Allowing Jury Nullification for WA Resolutions

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Middle Barael
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 108
Founded: Apr 24, 2020
Liberal Democratic Socialists

[ABANDONED] Allowing Jury Nullification for WA Resolutions

Postby Middle Barael » Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:53 am

The author of this resolution has decided no longer to pursue this, as this resolution was only meant to apply IC and not OOC, but that is not possible.
Last edited by Middle Barael on Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Pro: Environmentalism, fighting climate change, social democracy, police reform, LGBTQ rights, abortions, separation of church and state, democracy, assault weapon ban, proportional representation, multi-party states, Two-State Solution, Israel AND Palestine, pacifism, immigration, Anti-Racism, Jacinda Ardern-type Politics, NHS-type Healthcare, culture, science

Anti: Environmental destruction, fossil fuels, Trump, Laissez-faire economy, communism, far-right, homophobia, “Pro-Life”, dictatorships, one/two-party systems, guns, Netanyahu, Israeli settlements/annexation, Hamas, Hezbollah, Palestinian terrorists, war, racism, anti-immigration, nationalism, fascism,
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Tinfect
Senator
 
Posts: 4972
Founded: Jul 04, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tinfect » Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:55 am

"You foreigners allow random civilians to simply invalidate your laws? How do you people run governments at all?"
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Separatist Peoples
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 15282
Founded: Feb 17, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Separatist Peoples » Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:56 am

Ooc: I'm pretty sure this would constitute a Game mechanics violation. Resolutions have automatic statistical effects. No nullification would bar those effects.

I also suspect it would violate WAJA, since nullification constructively contradicts the obligations therein, but I'm less sure about that without a copy in front of me.

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Separatist Peoples should RESIGN!

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Middle Barael
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 108
Founded: Apr 24, 2020
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Middle Barael » Thu Jul 09, 2020 11:58 am

Tinfect wrote:"You foreigners allow random civilians to simply invalidate your laws? How do you people run governments at all?"

We allow juries to nullify laws, but the law can be reinstated if half of our parliament votes to reinstate it. In addition, if at least a third of our populace signs a specific petition, a referendum can be held, and if a majority of citizens votes to repeal it, then it is repealed and can only be reinstated by another referendum, or by a parliamentary vote at least 10 years later.
Pro: Environmentalism, fighting climate change, social democracy, police reform, LGBTQ rights, abortions, separation of church and state, democracy, assault weapon ban, proportional representation, multi-party states, Two-State Solution, Israel AND Palestine, pacifism, immigration, Anti-Racism, Jacinda Ardern-type Politics, NHS-type Healthcare, culture, science

Anti: Environmental destruction, fossil fuels, Trump, Laissez-faire economy, communism, far-right, homophobia, “Pro-Life”, dictatorships, one/two-party systems, guns, Netanyahu, Israeli settlements/annexation, Hamas, Hezbollah, Palestinian terrorists, war, racism, anti-immigration, nationalism, fascism,
A 15.4285714 civilization, according to this form

Political Compass:
Economic: -3.88
Social: -4.46

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Middle Barael
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 108
Founded: Apr 24, 2020
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Middle Barael » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:00 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: I'm pretty sure this would constitute a Game mechanics violation. Resolutions have automatic statistical effects. No nullification would bar those effects.

I also suspect it would violate WAJA, since nullification constructively contradicts the obligations therein, but I'm less sure about that without a copy in front of me.

OOC: This would be purely for "lore", not affecting game mechanics. It simply allows nations to write in their lore that a certain resolution has been nullified.
Pro: Environmentalism, fighting climate change, social democracy, police reform, LGBTQ rights, abortions, separation of church and state, democracy, assault weapon ban, proportional representation, multi-party states, Two-State Solution, Israel AND Palestine, pacifism, immigration, Anti-Racism, Jacinda Ardern-type Politics, NHS-type Healthcare, culture, science

Anti: Environmental destruction, fossil fuels, Trump, Laissez-faire economy, communism, far-right, homophobia, “Pro-Life”, dictatorships, one/two-party systems, guns, Netanyahu, Israeli settlements/annexation, Hamas, Hezbollah, Palestinian terrorists, war, racism, anti-immigration, nationalism, fascism,
A 15.4285714 civilization, according to this form

Political Compass:
Economic: -3.88
Social: -4.46

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Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9604
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:03 pm

Middle Barael wrote:We allow juries to nullify laws, but the law can be reinstated if half of our parliament votes to reinstate it. In addition, if at least a third of our populace signs a specific petition, a referendum can be held, and if a majority of citizens votes to repeal it, then it is repealed and can only be reinstated by another referendum, or by a parliamentary vote at least 10 years later.

So basically you have no laws. Because juries come and go and there are lots of them, composed of small numbers of people, all the time.

Author: 1 SC and 34 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
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Union of Sovereign States and Republics
Diplomat
 
Posts: 601
Founded: Nov 16, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Union of Sovereign States and Republics » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:04 pm

OOC: I believe this has a game mechanics problem.

IC: "Ambassador, with all due respect, this law is simply unfair. If you allow one group of nations to not follow WA resolutions and force one group to follow them, then that sets a dangerous precedent! The USSR does not have juries. This law allows nations with juries to simply not follow the World Assembly resolutions they do not want, while forcing nations like the USSR to follow them."
Current IC Year: 2027
The Union of Sovereign States and Republics; USSR
In 1991, a plane carrying would-be conspirators of an armed coup crashed in the Crimean Peninsula. Without the coup, the Union of Sovereign States treaty was signed; and the USSR survived... NS states are not canon.
Current Ruling Party: CENTER-LEFT COALITION; SDPSU, CPSU, APSU
News: BICS overtakes combined GDP of G7; Carbon sequestration underway in USA, USSR, Germany; France announces successful test of nuclear weaponry

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Separatist Peoples
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 15282
Founded: Feb 17, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Separatist Peoples » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:05 pm

Middle Barael wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: I'm pretty sure this would constitute a Game mechanics violation. Resolutions have automatic statistical effects. No nullification would bar those effects.

I also suspect it would violate WAJA, since nullification constructively contradicts the obligations therein, but I'm less sure about that without a copy in front of me.

OOC: This would be purely for "lore", not affecting game mechanics. It simply allows nations to write in their lore that a certain resolution has been nullified.

Ooc: not how the game works. Lore or not, it must square with the rules. It doesnt. Fundamentally.

His Worshipfulness Lord GA Secretariat, Authority on All Existence, Arbiter of Right, Toxic Globalist Dog, Dark Psychic Vampire, and Chief Populist Elitist!
Separatist Peoples should RESIGN!

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Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9604
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:05 pm

I struggle to see how this squares with a requirement that say, "Member nations must do X".

Author: 1 SC and 34 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Toxic villainous globalist kittehs
Delegate for Europe
Elsie Mortimer Wellesley (EMW); OOC unless otherwise indicated
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Middle Barael
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 108
Founded: Apr 24, 2020
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Middle Barael » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:09 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
Middle Barael wrote:OOC: This would be purely for "lore", not affecting game mechanics. It simply allows nations to write in their lore that a certain resolution has been nullified.

Ooc: not how the game works. Lore or not, it must square with the rules. It doesnt. Fundamentally.

Oh. Oops. I guess IC nations can just nullify the laws, and they don't need this resolution. I was intending for this resolution to only apply IC, but since it has to apply both IC and OOC, please consider this resolution as retracted.
Pro: Environmentalism, fighting climate change, social democracy, police reform, LGBTQ rights, abortions, separation of church and state, democracy, assault weapon ban, proportional representation, multi-party states, Two-State Solution, Israel AND Palestine, pacifism, immigration, Anti-Racism, Jacinda Ardern-type Politics, NHS-type Healthcare, culture, science

Anti: Environmental destruction, fossil fuels, Trump, Laissez-faire economy, communism, far-right, homophobia, “Pro-Life”, dictatorships, one/two-party systems, guns, Netanyahu, Israeli settlements/annexation, Hamas, Hezbollah, Palestinian terrorists, war, racism, anti-immigration, nationalism, fascism,
A 15.4285714 civilization, according to this form

Political Compass:
Economic: -3.88
Social: -4.46

User avatar
Union of Sovereign States and Republics
Diplomat
 
Posts: 601
Founded: Nov 16, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Union of Sovereign States and Republics » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:11 pm

Middle Barael wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: not how the game works. Lore or not, it must square with the rules. It doesnt. Fundamentally.

Oh. Oops. I guess IC nations can just nullify the laws, and they don't need this resolution. I was intending for this resolution to only apply IC, but since it has to apply both IC and OOC, please consider this resolution as retracted.

You may want to change the title from "Draft" to "Abandoned", then.
Current IC Year: 2027
The Union of Sovereign States and Republics; USSR
In 1991, a plane carrying would-be conspirators of an armed coup crashed in the Crimean Peninsula. Without the coup, the Union of Sovereign States treaty was signed; and the USSR survived... NS states are not canon.
Current Ruling Party: CENTER-LEFT COALITION; SDPSU, CPSU, APSU
News: BICS overtakes combined GDP of G7; Carbon sequestration underway in USA, USSR, Germany; France announces successful test of nuclear weaponry

User avatar
Separatist Peoples
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 15282
Founded: Feb 17, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Separatist Peoples » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:13 pm

Middle Barael wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: not how the game works. Lore or not, it must square with the rules. It doesnt. Fundamentally.

Oh. Oops. I guess IC nations can just nullify the laws, and they don't need this resolution. I was intending for this resolution to only apply IC, but since it has to apply both IC and OOC, please consider this resolution as retracted.

Ooc: if you mean cant, then yes. Noncompliance without addressing the enforcement mechanisms in the GA is considered godmodding here.

His Worshipfulness Lord GA Secretariat, Authority on All Existence, Arbiter of Right, Toxic Globalist Dog, Dark Psychic Vampire, and Chief Populist Elitist!
Separatist Peoples should RESIGN!

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Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20771
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Wallenburg » Thu Jul 09, 2020 9:49 pm

For future reference, nuking your OP is considered bad form.
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