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[DRAFT] The Uranium is Always Greener

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Jutsa
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[DRAFT] The Uranium is Always Greener

Postby Jutsa » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:01 am

So here's the first of an issue pair I thought up last night. I think it could still use a touch of humor, but I kinda wanted to get everyone's opinions
on the concept itself and the options laid out, Hopefully it's an interesting enough one. (And yes, I did take #890 and #23 into consideration.)

I also hoped that in doing this, I could build up the lore of one of our existing nationstates. I think I came up with a good one, and made it into something not-so-good. :)
(made sure to suggest vat-grown citizens without flatout saying it)

Also, option 2 was originally one option, but it crossed my mind that unless you're an autarky, then you're probably already trading for Uranium.
It's very hard to word it though, and I insist this remain more flexible. Most nations have open borders, but this seems like an even bigger issue for nations with autarky.

Title: The Uranium is Always Greener
The Issue: The lack of a prominent uranium industry has left @@NAME@@ between a rock and a hard place. With a limited supply and a nuclear power shortage a looming threat, the answer seems to be in Aldoustan, a merchant nation with a somewhat murky relationship with @@NAME@@. However, there are a few caveats...
Validity: Nuclear Power, Low Mining Industry

Option 1: "Have you seen how much they want to charge us?" cries logistician @@RANDOMNAME@@, clenching @@HIS@@ fists while crunching the numbers. "It's bad enough they use narcotics to control their motherless peasants, not to mention their widescale rainforest destruction. That's three strikes, we're out. We may also run out of power, but as long as we limit energy consumption and use of uranium, we should be able to last a while longer until we build some windmills or find a sustainable deposit. Hopefully."
[effect] mining for fuel is deemed too large a strain on the energy supply

Validity: Noautarky
Option 2a: "Shipping fees, World Assembly regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says a monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson with the assigned name GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nation, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply following the law of supply and demand. You need more energy, we need more money. A lot. Don't think of it as ransom — think of it as a business negotiation. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs an arm and a leg

Validity: Autarky
Option 2b: "Shipping fees, World Assembly regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says a monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson with the assigned name GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nation, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply looking for the highest bidders. You need energy, we need money. A lot. What your people don't know about our practices won't hurt them. Open your market's borders to us and your impending energy crisis will melt away. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs an arm and a leg

Option 3: "Why pay for all of that when we could use that money to create an explosion in the uranium mining business?" inquires lucrative Nukes4U spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@. "Let us scour the earth from border to border for uranium deposits and other rare-earth metals, and deregulate forest protection while you're at it. And I'm not saying we should have a slave force, but it would definitely help if we had some unsuspecting unpaid interns, maybe from other countries, to do the dirty work. The fate of @@NAME@@ depends on it!"
[effect] landscapes are so green they're practically glowing

Validity: has WMDs
Option 4: "Wait, what if the situation didn't have to look so bleak?" asks @@RANDOMNAME@@, ardent radiophobe and author of Nuclear Bomb: The Day After. "What if we decommission all of our nuclear warheads for uranium? That should give us enough time to transition towards renewable energy and achieve a nation free of Big Nuclear all-together. It would leave a massive hole in our defenses, sure, but it'll be worth it for a world free of total apocalypse."
[effect] nuclear launch codes are now used to turn on windmills


Title: The Uranium is Always Greener
The Issue: The lack of a prominent uranium industry has left @@NAME@@ between a rock and a hard place. With a limited supply and a nuclear power shortage a looming threat, the answer seems to be in Aldoustan, a merchant nation with a somewhat murky relationship with @@NAME@@. However, there are a few caviats...
Validity: Nuclear Power, Low Uranium Mining Industry

Option 1: "Have you seen how much they want to charge us?" cries logistician @@RANDOMNAME@@, crunching @@HIS@@ fists while crunching the numbers. "It's bad enough they use narcotics to control their motherless peasants, not to mention their widescale rainforest destruction. That's three strikes, we're out. We may also run out of power, but as long as we limit energy consumption and use of uranium, we should be able to last a while longer until we build some windmills or find a sustainable deposit. Hopefully."
[effect] uranium mining equipment has been deemed too large a drain on the energy supply to be in use

Validity: Noautarky
Option 2a: "Shipping fees, World Assembly regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson with the assigned name GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nationstate, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply following the law of supply and demand. You need more energy, we need more money. A lot. Don't think of it as ransom — think of it as a business negotiation. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs an arm and a leg

Validity: Autarky
Option 2b: "Shipping fees, World Assembly regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson with the assigned name GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nationstate, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply looking for the highest bidders. You need energy, we need money. A lot. And what your people don't know about our practices won't hurt them. Open your market's borders to us and your impending energy crisis will melt away. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs an arm and a leg

Option 3: "Why pay for all of that when we could use that money to create an explosion in the uranium mining business?" inquires lucrative Nukes4U spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@. "Let us scour the earth from border to border for uranium deposits and other rare-earth metals, and deregulate forest protection while you're at it. And I'm not saying we should have a slave force, but it would definitely help if we had some unsuspecting unpaid interns, maybe from other countries, to do the dirty work. The fate of @@NAME@@ depends on it!"
[effect] landscapes are so green they're practically glowing

Validity: has WMDs
Option 4: "Wait, what if the situation didn't have to look so bleak?" asks @@RANDOMNAME@@, ardent nuclearphobe and author of Nuclear Bomb: The Day After. "What if we decommission all of our nuclear warheads for uranium? That should give us enough time to transition towards renewable energy and achieve a nation free of Big Nuclear all-together. It would leave a massive whole in our defenses, for sure, but won't it be worth it for a world free of total apocalypse?"
[effect] nuclear launch codes are now used to turn on windmills
Last edited by Jutsa on Wed Jul 15, 2020 8:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Sun Jul 05, 2020 4:28 pm

Why would anyone choose anything but option 2a?
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Postby Oneid » Sun Jul 05, 2020 4:32 pm

Australian rePublic wrote:Why would anyone choose anything but option 2a?

Option 3 looks good.
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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sun Jul 05, 2020 4:43 pm

Jutsa wrote:
Title: The Uranium is Always Greener
The Issue: The lack of a prominent uranium industry has left @@NAME@@ between a rock and a hard place. With a limited supply and a nuclear power shortage a looming threat, the answer seems to be in Aldoustan, a merchant nation with a somewhat murky relationship with @@NAME@@. However, there are a few caveats...

Validity: Nuclear Power, Low Uranium Mining Industry

Option 1: "Have you seen how much they want to charge us?" Cries logistician @@RANDOMNAME@@, clenching @@HIS@@ fists while crunching the numbers. (This joke doesn't seem to work very well.) "It's bad enough they use narcotics to control their motherless peasants, not to mention their widescale rainforest destruction. That's three strikes, we're out. We may also run out of power, but as long as we limit energy consumption and use of uranium, we should be able to last a while longer until we build some windmills or find a sustainable deposit. Hopefully."
[effect] @@NATION@@'s tools can't get the energy needed to mine energy (This effect line, both the previous one and the one I edited it to be, are iffy. Do you have another one in mind?)

Validity: Noautarky
Option 2a: "Shipping fees, @@REGION@@ regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says a monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson, designated GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nation, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply following the law of supply and demand. You need more energy, we need more money. A lot. Don't think of it as ransom — think of it as a business negotiation. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs an arm and a leg

Validity: Autarky
Option 2b: "Shipping fees, @@REGION@@ regulation fees, worker and worker production fees; these things cost money," says a monotone and frankly monochrome Aldoustanian uranium market spokesperson, designated GM4321000, drinking soured milk. "We sit on the largest uranium deposit of any nation, and have our choice of anyone to trade with. We're simply looking for the highest bidders. You need energy, we need money. A lot. What your people don't know about our practices won't hurt them. (FYI, don't use 'and' as your first word in a sentence.) Open your market's borders to us and your impending energy crisis will melt away. Hmm, hmm, hmm." You're pretty sure that was supposed to be a laugh.
[effect] it's said nuclear power costs three arms and four legs

Option 3: "Why pay for all of that when we could use that money to create an explosion in the uranium mining business?" Inquires lucrative Nukes4U spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@. "Let us scour the earth from border to border for uranium deposits and other rare-earth metals, and deregulate forest protection while you're at it - and I'm not saying we should have a slave force, but it would definitely help if we had some unsuspecting unpaid interns, maybe from other countries, to do the dirty work. The fate of @@NAME@@ depends on it!"
[effect] landscapes are so green they're practically glowing

Validity: has WMDs
Option 4: "Wait, what if the situation didn't have to look so bleak?" Asks @@RANDOMNAME@@, ardent radiophobe (Radiophobia is the fear of ionizing radiation; it seems to fit better.) and author of Nuclear Bomb: The Day After. "What if we decommission all of our nuclear warheads for uranium? That should give us enough time to transition towards renewable energy and achieve a nation free of Big Nuclear all-together. It would leave a massive hole in our defenses, sure, but it'll it be worth it for a world free of total apocalypse!"
[effect] nuclear launch codes are now used to turn on windmills


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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:24 am

There's no Uranium Mining Industry to check against any more. I think that the stat that was Uranium Mining has just been Industry: Mining for years, since before I started playing this game.

References to the Uranium Mining stat might have remained in places perhaps, but there's no such stat any more, for sure.
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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:20 am

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:References to the Uranium Mining stat might have remained in places perhaps,
It continues to be called that in the economy breakdown on your main nation page, and the rarely-used @@MAJORINDUSTRY@@ macro.

"Industry: Mining" is just the name of a World Census score, which I consider to be less of a primary source.

As I've pointed out before, the World Census is inconsistent in how it handles industries: one industry (Tourism) isn't properly measured at all (the displayed Tourism stat is on a different scale, and measures actual number of tourists which doesn't always correspond to the profit by the tourism industry), agriculture is listed as "Sector: Agriculture" rather than "Industry:" despite still being one industry as far as the game is concerned, but the similar-sounding "Sector: Manufacturing" is just an agglomeration of several industries (Automobile Manufacturing, Arms Manufacturing, Basket Weaving) that are also scored separately. World Census handling of government sectors is even worse.

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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:02 am

Sure, but statwise, the underlying stat is treated as being mining industries in general not uranium mining.

The generated text should be seen as a way of delivering flavour, rather than serious analyses of a nation's breakdown, I think. They're generated from the nation's numbers, and will often end up with all sorts of fun and internally contradictory phrasings, but that's just part of the fun of it. Also, of course, the programming that generates those descriptions has never been updated, whereas the way those stats are used has.

For example, the stat that was beef-based agriculture is now explicitly all agriculture in the game design notes, but that front page text generation has never been changed.

In numerical terms with the primary stats, there is no backstage stat for uranium mining.

For now, just accept that uranium mining is not something we can validity check against.
Last edited by Candlewhisper Archive on Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:22 am

Well, a nation without any mining industry at all would obviously also not have uranium mining.

I guess it's possible for a nation with decent uranium mining but no other mining whatsoever to appear to "average out" to poor mining industry overall, but that's an improbable edge case.

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Jutsa
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Postby Jutsa » Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:01 am

That was kinda why I abandoned my other draft, because mining vs. uranium mining;
but yeah, again, if you have no mining whatsoever, I think it's safe to assume you don't have uranium.

A case could also be made for coal, but, like, coal power's something I'm confident there have never been checks for. :)

I suppose a case could be made for any sort of mining (hence the existence of #890) or any other product for that matter
(including #301's outsourcing of electricity to Maxtopia), but I kinda feel like uranium is something special:
it's difficult to transport and rich yet necessary for machinery.

That said... I suppose I could make it about oil, though then again we have several issues about that already (though nothing exactly like this),
and it would be kinda nice to play around with both mining and nuclear power stats some more. :P
Last edited by Jutsa on Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:16 am

Jutsa wrote:A case could also be made for coal, but, like, coal power's something I'm confident there have never been checks for. :)
Coal is also mined.

Well, there's charcoal, but I doubt that's viable as a nationwide power source.

Jutsa wrote:I suppose a case could be made for any sort of mining (hence the existence of #890) or any other product for that matter
(including #301's outsourcing of electricity to Maxtopia), but I kinda feel like uranium is something special:
it's difficult to transport and rich yet necessary for machinery.
Eh, not that difficult. It's a metallic solid, which means it's a lot less likely to slip out of control than a liquid such as petroleum, a gas such as... umm, "natural gas", or even a more powdery solid like coal. (Coal dust inhalation causes more mining-related cancer incidents than uranium radiation.)

The high energy density of uranium means that you only need relatively small amounts of it, also making it easier to transport than something you need to fill entire ships with.

You do probably want some shielding, but that's not even essential. The radiation from natural uranium is pretty mild unless you're stupid enough to eat the stuff.

Legal issues might be more of a problem with transport, since governments are generally pretty cautious about not wanting uranium to fall into the wrong hands, what with it being used to make nuclear weapons.
Last edited by Trotterdam on Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Jutsa
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Postby Jutsa » Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:24 am

Yeah, legally definitely...

in fact, actually, that could be an interesting issue too: something something uranium transportation being sabotaged.

@Coal: True, but I mean to say coal power is not checked for to my knowledge. :P
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Jutsa
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Postby Jutsa » Wed Jul 15, 2020 8:02 pm

Bump~ Completely missed Atheris's suggestions! Sorry about that <:D

Don't 100% agree with all of them, but I believe I've fixed all of the actual grammar and spelling errors. :)

Not gonna lie, looking my drafts over, it seems that creating a simple, three-option no-variants issue draft is borderline impossible for me. :lol:
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>List of missing issues/options
>List of accepted issues~
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Minskiev
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Postby Minskiev » Wed Jul 15, 2020 11:18 pm

An alternative title could be “Uranium is now Myanium” or something like that.

Other than that, looks good! Pretty unique, gotta say.
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Drasnia
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Postby Drasnia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:59 pm

Jutsa wrote:The Issue: The lack of a prominent uranium industry has left @@NAME@@ between a rock and a hard place. With a limited supply and a nuclear power shortage a looming threat, the answer seems to be in Aldoustan, a merchant nation with a somewhat murky relationship with @@NAME@@. However, there are a few caveats...

So I know I often tell you to split long sentences apart, but I think this is one of the less common times where your opening sentence needs a bit more to it in order to make full logical sense. You need to have both the growing nuclear power industry and the shortage of domestic uranium together for the whole "rock and a hard place" to actually work. Consider how much better the following is:

With a growing nuclear power sector and dwindling uranium supply, @@NAME@@ is faced with a looming energy crisis. Yadda yadda yadda...


I did like the little stinger there at the end to lead into the options. Gives it a bit more oomph I feel.

Jutsa wrote:cries logistician @@RANDOMNAME@@, clenching @@HIS@@ fists while crunching the numbers.

I like the idea of the joke but you need to establish what the actual thing is in order for it to really work.

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Thu Jul 16, 2020 7:09 pm

Jutsa wrote:"It's bad enough they use narcotics to control their motherless peasants, not to mention their widescale rainforest destruction."
Come to think of it, it's entirely possible for the player nation to be doing all of these things.

In fact, doing even one would invalidate the "That's three strikes, we're out." argument.


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