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[Draft] Liberate The New Iron Order"

A chamber dedicated to the dissemination of inter-regional peace and goodwill, via force if necessary.
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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

[Draft] Liberate The New Iron Order"

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:20 pm

Looking forward to working on this one with ya'll. :hug:

The Security Council,

Of the opinion that fascism has no place on NationStates.

Confirmed in this opinion by previous Security Council resolutions, including SCR#245, SCR#263 and SCR#298.

Disgusted by The New Iron Order's embrace of the hateful ideologies of fascism.

Concerned by The New Iron Order's alliance with, among others, the Confederation of Corrupt Dictators and Farkasfalka through the newly-founded Interregional Axis (IRX).

Noting the troubled past of The New Iron Order and previous efforts by NationStates to destroy its community.

Aware that The New Iron Order has an active founder, but believing preemptive measures should be taken against all hateful fascist regions for the betterment of NationStates.

Edging one step closer to civility.

Liberates The New Iron Order.

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Lord Dominator
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5627
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Lord Dominator » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:46 pm

At the moment, the region itself is rather small, has an active founder (for now), and isn't particularly notable in recruiting that I'm aware. Thus, no support at the moment.

That said, this is well-written, and I suspect the time in which it will be more useful will be sooner rather than later :)
Dee Vytherov-Skollvaldr | Forest | TBH Major and Council Member | WA Vizier | Ambassador to the WA

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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:26 pm

Lord Dominator wrote:At the moment, the region itself is rather small, has an active founder (for now), and isn't particularly notable in recruiting that I'm aware. Thus, no support at the moment.

That said, this is well-written, and I suspect the time in which it will be more useful will be sooner rather than later :)

From what I understand they have quite a culture. Remember the Iron Confederacy? And then before that the Iron Order? This is an old community that's been around for too long.

They've also joined that new Interregional Axis thing, which doesn't seem too poorly set up. Might be useful in sending them the message that NationStates doesn't want anything to do with that.

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Wayneactia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 897
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:30 pm

Pala Manaliattopia wrote:
Lord Dominator wrote:At the moment, the region itself is rather small, has an active founder (for now), and isn't particularly notable in recruiting that I'm aware. Thus, no support at the moment.

That said, this is well-written, and I suspect the time in which it will be more useful will be sooner rather than later :)

From what I understand they have quite a culture. Remember the Iron Confederacy? And then before that the Iron Order? This is an old community that's been around for too long.

They've also joined that new Interregional Axis thing, which doesn't seem too poorly set up. Might be useful in sending them the message that NationStates doesn't want anything to do with that.

It won't achieve anything.

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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 1:11 am

Wayneactia wrote:
Pala Manaliattopia wrote:From what I understand they have quite a culture. Remember the Iron Confederacy? And then before that the Iron Order? This is an old community that's been around for too long.

They've also joined that new Interregional Axis thing, which doesn't seem too poorly set up. Might be useful in sending them the message that NationStates doesn't want anything to do with that.

It won't achieve anything.

Respectfully, I disagree.

You define achievement as practical. I acknowledge that this is a preemptive strike, but it's entirely justified. We're not so much fighting the region. We're fighting the culture. And the best way to say that the culture isn't welcome on NS is to directly attack it, regardless of the immediate outcome. These communities need to feel like they can't belong here. And in that sense, this liberation will achieve something.

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Wayneactia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 897
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 2:18 am

Pala Manaliattopia wrote:
Wayneactia wrote:It won't achieve anything.

Respectfully, I disagree.

You define achievement as practical. I acknowledge that this is a preemptive strike, but it's entirely justified. We're not so much fighting the region. We're fighting the culture. And the best way to say that the culture isn't welcome on NS is to directly attack it, regardless of the immediate outcome. These communities need to feel like they can't belong here. And in that sense, this liberation will achieve something.

IT WILL NOT ACHIEVE ANYTHING.

If the founder puts a password in place, a liberation will not affect it. All this seems like is a badge hunt. Quit giving them attention.

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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:18 am

Wayneactia wrote:
Pala Manaliattopia wrote:Respectfully, I disagree.

You define achievement as practical. I acknowledge that this is a preemptive strike, but it's entirely justified. We're not so much fighting the region. We're fighting the culture. And the best way to say that the culture isn't welcome on NS is to directly attack it, regardless of the immediate outcome. These communities need to feel like they can't belong here. And in that sense, this liberation will achieve something.

IT WILL NOT ACHIEVE ANYTHING.

If the founder puts a password in place, a liberation will not affect it. All this seems like is a badge hunt. Quit giving them attention.


Oh my god, no.

CCD still has an active founder. As does Kaiserreich. Did you read what I wrote? Your definition of achievement is flawed.

And the whole "Don't give them attention argument" - that's flawed too. You want them to exist quietly ruining the lives of the unknowing? No, definitely not. I resent the idea that these sorts of regions are only a problem for you when they make a fuss. They are absolutely a disgrace to this game. They all deserve to be liberated, regardless of whether or not their founder is active.

The badge hunt slight is just rude and shows your lack of appreciation for this issue. By that standard, you accuse Lord Dominator of also being a badgehunter with SC#263.

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Wayneactia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 897
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:31 am

Pala Manaliattopia wrote:
Wayneactia wrote:IT WILL NOT ACHIEVE ANYTHING.

If the founder puts a password in place, a liberation will not affect it. All this seems like is a badge hunt. Quit giving them attention.


Oh my god, no.

CCD still has an active founder. As does Kaiserreich. Did you read what I wrote? Your definition of achievement is flawed.

And the whole "Don't give them attention argument" - that's flawed too. You want them to exist quietly ruining the lives of the unknowing? No, definitely not. I resent the idea that these sorts of regions are only a problem for you when they make a fuss. They are absolutely a disgrace to this game. They all deserve to be liberated, regardless of whether or not their founder is active.

The badge hunt slight is just rude and shows your lack of appreciation for this issue. By that standard, you accuse Lord Dominator of also being a badgehunter with SC#263.

And both of those liberation's are also pointless. Had Joco not tried to coup the North Pacfic, there was a real good chance Kaboom could have repealed that liberation based upon the fact that as I have already stated, it is pointless. Maybe wait for the region to become founderless, then repeal it. Until then all it does is give them a badge they can gloat over and gives them far more recognition they need and gives them a soapbox to stand on and preach about their shit. Ignore them, let Civil Defense Siren do it's job and isolate them. They will fuck up sooner or later and then we can revisit the issue?

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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:35 am

Wayneactia wrote:
Pala Manaliattopia wrote:
Oh my god, no.

CCD still has an active founder. As does Kaiserreich. Did you read what I wrote? Your definition of achievement is flawed.

And the whole "Don't give them attention argument" - that's flawed too. You want them to exist quietly ruining the lives of the unknowing? No, definitely not. I resent the idea that these sorts of regions are only a problem for you when they make a fuss. They are absolutely a disgrace to this game. They all deserve to be liberated, regardless of whether or not their founder is active.

The badge hunt slight is just rude and shows your lack of appreciation for this issue. By that standard, you accuse Lord Dominator of also being a badgehunter with SC#263.

And both of those liberation's are also pointless. Had Joco not tried to coup the North Pacfic, there was a real good chance Kaboom could have repealed that liberation based upon the fact that as I have already stated, it is pointless. Maybe wait for the region to become founderless, then repeal it. Until then all it does is give them a badge they can gloat over and gives them far more recognition they need and gives them a soapbox to stand on and preach about their shit. Ignore them, let Civil Defense Siren do it's job and isolate them. They will fuck up sooner or later and then we can revisit the issue?

I don't know... If you have a tumour, you don't wait for it to kill you before you cut it out.

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Bhang Bhang Duc
Minister
 
Posts: 2069
Founded: Dec 17, 2003
New York Times Democracy

Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:42 am

The draft is well written, nicely phrased. Legal as far as I can see and thank you for drafting on the forum.

However, I would not support it at the present time as a Founder remains in place - all it will do is give the region unwarranted publicity. Sooner or later these regions run foul of the site rules and Moderation and that’s when they become vulnerable to a Liberation.

If you are determined to push ahead with this, then I would suggest a small change:

Aware that The New Iron Order has an active founder, but believing preemptive measures should be taken against all hateful fascist regions for the betterment of the NationStates community
Last edited by Bhang Bhang Duc on Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
Former Delegate and Guardian of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart

Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

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Pala Manaliattopia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Sep 20, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Pala Manaliattopia » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:01 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:The draft is well written, nicely phrased. Legal as far as I can see and thank you for drafting on the forum.

However, I would not support it at the present time as a Founder remains in place - all it will do is give the region unwarranted publicity. Sooner or later these regions run foul of the site rules and Moderation and that’s when they become vulnerable to a Liberation.

If you are determined to push ahead with this, then I would suggest a small change:

Aware that The New Iron Order has an active founder, but believing preemptive measures should be taken against all hateful fascist regions for the betterment of the NationStates community

I like that change, good call.

Idk I just feel like taking an offensive position on all this.


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