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Should people apologize for their opinions?

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Geneviev
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Should people apologize for their opinions?

Postby Geneviev » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:16 pm

Some opinions, including certain religious groups, ethnonationalism, and similar views, are often considered hurtful or dangerous to certain people or society as a whole. People who hold these views can be ostracized from society because their views are considered undesirable.

When people who held extreme opinions change their minds, they may feel as if those ideas were a moral flaw they must atone for by apologizing to the people who may have been affected by their views. However, some people might believe that these apologies do not make up for harm that was potentially caused by these extreme beliefs.

So what do you think, NSG? Would you accept an apology from someone who held extreme beliefs? Should they apologize at all?

Personally, I would support apologizing for ideas that were harmful to people. Although an apology would not undo the damage, it can be the beginning of someone trying to change themselves and should be encouraged. This encouragement would include accepting the apology, even if it is difficult.
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Sundiata
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Postby Sundiata » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:18 pm

Only if they voluntarily choose to.

It's better not to hold any extreme beliefs but to remain balanced, calm, and in the center if one can help it.
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Nouveau Quebecois
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Postby Nouveau Quebecois » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:21 pm

Yes, if their opinions are wrong.
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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:22 pm

Nouveau Quebecois wrote:Yes, if their opinions are wrong.

What would make opinions wrong?
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Nouveau Quebecois
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Nouveau Quebecois » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:26 pm

Geneviev wrote:
Nouveau Quebecois wrote:Yes, if their opinions are wrong.

What would make opinions wrong?

That's for you to decide.
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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:32 pm

Nouveau Quebecois wrote:
Geneviev wrote:What would make opinions wrong?

That's for you to decide.

My opinion of which opinions are wrong is probably very different from what most people would think.
I'm not evangelical anymore.
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Heloin
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Postby Heloin » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:39 pm

If someone had particularly shitty and harmful opinions then probably yes. If someone just had a weird opinion such as liking a bad movie or bad pizza topping then probably not.

Nouveau Quebecois wrote:
Geneviev wrote:What would make opinions wrong?

That's for you to decide.

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Nouveau Quebecois
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Postby Nouveau Quebecois » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:44 pm

Heloin wrote:If someone had particularly shitty and harmful opinions then probably yes. If someone just had a weird opinion such as liking a bad movie or bad pizza topping then probably not.

Nouveau Quebecois wrote:That's for you to decide.

Stellar argument.

That wasn't an argument, it was a plain statement.
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Nouveau Quebecois
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Nouveau Quebecois » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:44 pm

Geneviev wrote:
Nouveau Quebecois wrote:That's for you to decide.

My opinion of which opinions are wrong is probably very different from what most people would think.

Yes, people tend to think differently.
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A theocratic republic dedicated to God himself, seated in the Francophone heart of North America. NS Stats still in the trunk.
"Je me souviens, que né sous le lys, je croîs sous la croix." | "I remember, that born under the lily, I grew under the cross."
 = The Montreal Gazette - Feburary 1995: [...] Armed Student's Unions seizes Saint-Pacôme Municipality and Local Police armouries in day-long uprising. Agreement reached with the National Assembly provided the National Youth Vanguard is recognised as a legitimate political party. Experts predict a new era of nationalistic youth empowerment in Quebec [...] 

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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:46 pm

Nouveau Quebecois wrote:
Geneviev wrote:My opinion of which opinions are wrong is probably very different from what most people would think.

Yes, people tend to think differently.

Which is why saying what your opinion is tends to be much more interesting.
I'm not evangelical anymore.
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Bombadil
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Postby Bombadil » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:47 pm

'Opinions' is way to broad a term here, there are opinions about objective truths, in which case if they're wrong they're factually wrong so really you're asking whether people should apologise for spreading false information. Then there are opinions about subjective views, and I'm not sure where these can be harmful unless you can provide an example. Then there are beliefs, which are more articles of faith than mere opinions.

The earth is flat - objective
Cambridge United are the greatest football team ever - subjective
I am Jesus reincarnated - belief


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Nouveau Quebecois
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Nouveau Quebecois » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:48 pm

Geneviev wrote:
Nouveau Quebecois wrote:Yes, people tend to think differently.

Which is why saying what your opinion is tends to be much more interesting.

I wasn't under the impression of making this thread more interesting, I was just stating my moral compass; apologise when wrong.
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A theocratic republic dedicated to God himself, seated in the Francophone heart of North America. NS Stats still in the trunk.
"Je me souviens, que né sous le lys, je croîs sous la croix." | "I remember, that born under the lily, I grew under the cross."
 = The Montreal Gazette - Feburary 1995: [...] Armed Student's Unions seizes Saint-Pacôme Municipality and Local Police armouries in day-long uprising. Agreement reached with the National Assembly provided the National Youth Vanguard is recognised as a legitimate political party. Experts predict a new era of nationalistic youth empowerment in Quebec [...] 

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Drongonia
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Postby Drongonia » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:52 pm

If they feel the need to apologise, then fine. Personally I don't see extremist views as something to apologise for.
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USS Monitor
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Postby USS Monitor » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:53 pm

If someone is genuinely sorry for holding hateful views, and they apologize, people should give them a chance and let them redeem themselves.

If you completely reject someone's apology, then what incentive is there for other haters to repent?
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Bombadil
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Postby Bombadil » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:55 pm

USS Monitor wrote:If someone is genuinely sorry for holding hateful views, and they apologize, people should give them a chance and let them redeem themselves.

If you completely reject someone's apology, then what incentive is there for other haters to repent?


Sorry about that whole 'Jews are inferior' thing says Adolf, 'that's alright' says USS Monitor, 'let that be a lesson for everyone'.

Yeah I godwinned it, sue me.
Last edited by Bombadil on Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Geneviev
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Postby Geneviev » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:57 pm

Drongonia wrote:If they feel the need to apologise, then fine. Personally I don't see extremist views as something to apologise for.

Why not?
I'm not evangelical anymore.
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Aclion
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Postby Aclion » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:59 pm

Yes, people should apologize for having opinions; disgusting habit.
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USS Monitor
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Postby USS Monitor » Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:59 pm

Bombadil wrote:
USS Monitor wrote:If someone is genuinely sorry for holding hateful views, and they apologize, people should give them a chance and let them redeem themselves.

If you completely reject someone's apology, then what incentive is there for other haters to repent?


Sorry about that whole 'Jews are inferior' thing says Adolf, 'that's alright' says USS Monitor, 'let that be a lesson for everyone'.

Yeah I godwinned it, sue me.


Some things require more work than others to patch up, but you should still give people a chance to try.

Of course, Hitler never apologized cos he was an ass.
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Costa Fierro
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Wed Jan 22, 2020 11:01 pm

I don't think that people should apologise for having opinions. They just get nailed by the state if they say the wrong thing.
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New Paine
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Postby New Paine » Wed Jan 22, 2020 11:02 pm

I would apologize to being a dick to other people but not for past world views and philosophies that I’ve held in the past.
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Nuroblav
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Postby Nuroblav » Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:54 am

If they wish to, but otherwise no. Opinions are opinions.
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Postby Page » Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:44 am

Merely having an opinion or a belief is amoral (meaning it is neither morally right nor wrong), even if the opinion or belief is terrible. Expressing those opinions or beliefs is can sometimes be harmful if by doing so you wield influence that changes others' behaviors.

My philosophy is that if I ever feel uncomfortable openly expressing my opinions, that is an indication that I should reassess that opinion. But certainly does not apply in all cases. A person might think "there is no god" but if they are surrounded by religious extremists who might hurt them for saying that, they are justified in keeping that opinion secret for the sake of their own well-being.

But if you won't tell the truth about who you voted for to a person you're on a date with, that is a case in which your hesitation should cause you to rethink your views.
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Postby Risottia » Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:20 am

Geneviev wrote:So what do you think, NSG? Would you accept an apology from someone who held extreme beliefs? Should they apologize at all?


Why are "extreme" opinions worthy of an apology to begin with? I'd rather say "people who EXPRESSED OFFENSIVE opinions should apologise". "Extreme" doesn't mean "harmful" or "offensive", it means "far from the median". Also, holding an opinion isn't a problem: expressing it or enacting it might be, eventually.
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Salandriagado
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Postby Salandriagado » Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:31 am

If you feel the need to apologise for your beliefs, you should probably just revise your beliefs. Specifically, if you realise that your opinion is shitty enough to need apologising for it, you probably don't actually believe that opinion.
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Dumb Ideologies
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:49 am

If you've not actively "done" anything malicious or long-term harmful to anyone, if your only mistake was to circulate views that you now think to be unpleasant and offensive, there's a very low bar for what you need to do.

Say that you've changed your mind and that the comments don't reflect who you are anymore. Unless you're terribly important and high-profile, or you've gone out assaulting people, the most you'll have done is briefly enmadden people who are likely prone to being enmaddened and who would have been emaddened by someone else if it hadn't been you derping around in the stupid lane. Both arrogance and low self esteem are often based on exaggerating our own importance.

Admit your mistake, that's all that's required of you as a virtuous person. Don't wring your hands over it and continually apologise. People aren't obliged to accept your apology, of course, but going over and over gets in the way of forgiving yourself and self-hatred gets in the way of getting on with the business of being a better person. If people keep giving you hassle once you've apologised they're the ones being unreasonable and you're entitled to tell them to move on or fuck off because they're the ones being the bad people today.
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