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[R]Nation sharing thread on gameplay

Who needs it, who got it, who hands it out and why.
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Raionitu
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[R]Nation sharing thread on gameplay

Postby Raionitu » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:26 am

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=468413
I believe these are normally frowned upon
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Luna Amore
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Postby Luna Amore » Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:43 am

Closed.
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Greater vakolicci haven
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Founded: May 09, 2014
Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:12 am

Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

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The Marsupial Illuminati
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Founded: Jul 24, 2016
Tyranny by Majority

Postby The Marsupial Illuminati » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:24 am

Greater vakolicci haven wrote:Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

There are cases when more than one person having access to an account is useful. I'm part of a region where the founder is very inactive, so another player has access to the founder account to prevent CTE and utilize executive authority when the actual founder is not around. It wouldn't be great news for our region if NS banned the practice of sharing accounts for everyone due to some inexperienced players not making good decisions.
Last edited by The Marsupial Illuminati on Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:35 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Greater vakolicci haven
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Founded: May 09, 2014
Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:43 am

The Marsupial Illuminati wrote:
Greater vakolicci haven wrote:Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

There are cases when more than one person having access to an account is useful. I'm part of a region where the founder is very inactive, so another player has access to the founder account to prevent CTE and utilize executive authority when the actual founder is not around. It wouldn't be great news for our region if NS banned the practice of sharing accounts for everyone due to some inexperienced players not making good decisions.

To clarify, I meant the creation of threads on the subject rather than sharing itself.

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Farnhamia
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Posts: 100210
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:45 am

Greater vakolicci haven wrote:Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

The Marsupial Illuminati wrote:
Greater vakolicci haven wrote:Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

There are cases when more than one person having access to an account is useful. I'm part of a region where the founder is very inactive, so another player has access to the founder account to prevent CTE and utilize executive authority when the actual founder is not around. It wouldn't be great news for our region if NS banned the practice of sharing accounts for everyone due to some inexperienced players not making good decisions.

Here's what the OSRS says about sharing accounts:
Regarding Sharing Accounts
What is "sharing accounts"?
As far as moderation is concerned, a nation account is shared if more than one person has accessed it. Whether a nation is being used by a group of players, or a nation is given permanently from Player A to Player B, both instances are shared.

Is sharing nations among multiple players allowed?
It is allowed, but moderation's stance on the act is to avoid it as an unnecessary risk.

What are the risks?
  • WA warnings - If you're sharing around a WA member nation while one or more people with access to it also maintain WA accounts, you run a greater risk of getting caught on the WA cheatscanner.
  • Warning history - If you share a nation that has a moderation warning history, you risk having that history associated with you.
  • Bans/DEATs/DOSes - Sharing nations around muddies the moderation trail and increases the risk of one or more players being at risk for moderation enforcement they didn't actually earn. Although moderation will do what we can to avoid this confusion, if players share nations around enough, it truly becomes almost impossible to definitively tell who has control of what.
  • Nation theft - Fact is, the more people have access to a nation, the less secure it is. If one of the owners hijacks that shared account, there will be nothing moderation can do to help the others recover it.
  • Outright malice - If one person with access to shared account goes on a rulebreaking rampage, everyone with access to that account risks having disciplinary actions levied against them, as the system will have trouble telling Player A from Player B when they both login to Nation X regularly.
So why don't you ban it?
Enforcing such a ban would be impractical at best. Hence it falls under the same general umbrella of "player responsibility" as things like your password security, caution about sharing computers or using publicly accessible ones, and so on. Players can share, and will share, and thus they accept the risks that go with it.

Basically, if you create an account and allow other people to use it, you are on the hook for anything that is done with that account. "Yeah, but it was a shared account!" is not going to cut you much slack, if any. It's right up there with "It was my brother!" Yes, inexperienced players make poor decisions but so do experienced players.
Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

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Greater vakolicci haven
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Posts: 12298
Founded: May 09, 2014
Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:46 am

Farnhamia wrote:
Greater vakolicci haven wrote:Hope this is being helpful rather than spamming, but since these are reported semi-regularly, might it be worth modifying the OSRS to say they're not allowed? Because nothing in there says it's not.

The Marsupial Illuminati wrote:There are cases when more than one person having access to an account is useful. I'm part of a region where the founder is very inactive, so another player has access to the founder account to prevent CTE and utilize executive authority when the actual founder is not around. It wouldn't be great news for our region if NS banned the practice of sharing accounts for everyone due to some inexperienced players not making good decisions.

Here's what the OSRS says about sharing accounts:
Regarding Sharing Accounts
What is "sharing accounts"?
As far as moderation is concerned, a nation account is shared if more than one person has accessed it. Whether a nation is being used by a group of players, or a nation is given permanently from Player A to Player B, both instances are shared.

Is sharing nations among multiple players allowed?
It is allowed, but moderation's stance on the act is to avoid it as an unnecessary risk.

What are the risks?
  • WA warnings - If you're sharing around a WA member nation while one or more people with access to it also maintain WA accounts, you run a greater risk of getting caught on the WA cheatscanner.
  • Warning history - If you share a nation that has a moderation warning history, you risk having that history associated with you.
  • Bans/DEATs/DOSes - Sharing nations around muddies the moderation trail and increases the risk of one or more players being at risk for moderation enforcement they didn't actually earn. Although moderation will do what we can to avoid this confusion, if players share nations around enough, it truly becomes almost impossible to definitively tell who has control of what.
  • Nation theft - Fact is, the more people have access to a nation, the less secure it is. If one of the owners hijacks that shared account, there will be nothing moderation can do to help the others recover it.
  • Outright malice - If one person with access to shared account goes on a rulebreaking rampage, everyone with access to that account risks having disciplinary actions levied against them, as the system will have trouble telling Player A from Player B when they both login to Nation X regularly.
So why don't you ban it?
Enforcing such a ban would be impractical at best. Hence it falls under the same general umbrella of "player responsibility" as things like your password security, caution about sharing computers or using publicly accessible ones, and so on. Players can share, and will share, and thus they accept the risks that go with it.

Basically, if you create an account and allow other people to use it, you are on the hook for anything that is done with that account. "Yeah, but it was a shared account!" is not going to cut you much slack, if any. It's right up there with "It was my brother!" Yes, inexperienced players make poor decisions but so do experienced players.

I was referring to the prohibition on threads on the subject. It isn't advertised.

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Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 100210
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:48 am

Greater vakolicci haven wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:
Here's what the OSRS says about sharing accounts:

Basically, if you create an account and allow other people to use it, you are on the hook for anything that is done with that account. "Yeah, but it was a shared account!" is not going to cut you much slack, if any. It's right up there with "It was my brother!" Yes, inexperienced players make poor decisions but so do experienced players.

I was referring to the prohibition on threads on the subject. It isn't advertised.

And how would we stop people from making threads sharing accounts? That's as hard or harder than stopping the actual sharing.
Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

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Greater vakolicci haven
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12298
Founded: May 09, 2014
Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:51 am

Farnhamia wrote:
Greater vakolicci haven wrote:I was referring to the prohibition on threads on the subject. It isn't advertised.

And how would we stop people from making threads sharing accounts? That's as hard or harder than stopping the actual sharing.


What I'm referring to is the prohibition of making threads regarding nation sharing. 'Does anyone want my puppet' type stuff: they used to be very common years and years ago with well-known people trading them for rp money, however they're now not allowed. It might be a good idea to put that they're not allowed in the OSRS

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Farnhamia
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 100210
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:07 pm

Greater vakolicci haven wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:And how would we stop people from making threads sharing accounts? That's as hard or harder than stopping the actual sharing.


What I'm referring to is the prohibition of making threads regarding nation sharing. 'Does anyone want my puppet' type stuff: they used to be very common years and years ago with well-known people trading them for rp money, however they're now not allowed. It might be a good idea to put that they're not allowed in the OSRS

They're assumed under the nation selling and nation sharing rules.
Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo


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