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Suicide attempts by refugees in Manus after Aussie elections

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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Mon May 27, 2019 4:46 pm

Mostrov, I checked the first link you provided. In the very last paragraph it says this:

A "fact check" produced by Australian Broadcasting Corporation News and RMIT concluded that then Attorney-Geneeral George Brandis' claim in November 2017 that Australia runs the most generous refugee program per capita in the world was misleading. Various complexities of the data are examined in the article, which says that Australia's level of refugee recognition is small compared to other wealthy nations (as well as poorer ones).


I also checked the article that was the source for the paragraph above, the relevant parts of which I quote:

Senator Brandis's claim is misleading.

Australia's "offshore" refugee and humanitarian resettlement program — that is, people facing persecution or violence elsewhere who are selected by the Government to come to Australia — is among the most generous in per capita terms, although it is currently not the most generous. That title goes to Canada.

In 2016, Australia resettled 27,626 people from elsewhere, a rate per 1,000 of 1.139, compared with 46,702 people resettled in Canada, a rate of 1.286.

However, this represents only a small part of the global response to the problem of displaced people, which according to the United Nations Refugee Agency has risen to an "unprecedented" level.

In addition to "offshore" resettlement, in 2016, 6,567 people arrived in Australia seeking asylum who were recognised as refugees.

Australia's level of refugee recognition is relatively small compared to other wealthy nations (and also many poorer countries).

In 2016, for example, 443,210 were recognised as refugees in Germany and 532,735 in Uganda.

Sweden and Norway, which both have smaller populations than Australia, recognised 68,090 and 12,147 refugees respectively in 2016.

When figures for refugee recognition at home and resettlement from abroad are combined, Australia slips well down the list in per capita terms.

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Diarcesia
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Postby Diarcesia » Mon May 27, 2019 4:55 pm

I don't really think there's a silver bullet to fix this. The tensions of these ideas have to be considered:

1. On one hand, having refugees accept the hospitality of the nearest country that can accommodate them is fair enough. It demonstrates their temporary nature of staying there.
2. On the other hand, virtually shoving refugees to poor nations is personally in bad taste. Third world nations already have more trouble attending to their citizens than the richer ones do, and as a corollary could have a lower refugee cap. This is assuming that they would have zero economic contribution whatsoever.
3. The rationale of being tough on seeking asylum by boat is reasonable to deter smugglers.

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Farburg
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Postby Farburg » Mon May 27, 2019 9:10 pm

This system does seem counterintuitive.

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Mostrov
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Postby Mostrov » Tue May 28, 2019 12:55 am

Last edited by Mostrov on Fri Mar 15, 2024 2:36 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Costa Fierro
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Postby Costa Fierro » Tue May 28, 2019 1:23 am

Bears Armed wrote:Where do these refugees come from? Couldn't they find "safe" countries closer to their places of origin, instead of heading to Australia?


I remember at one stage quite a few of them were Sri Lankans but these days they're mostly from the Middle East (Iraq, and Syria), Africa (Somalia and Sudan), and Afghanistan. As for safe countries, there's probably two where they could go, but that would assume that they wouldn't simply leave those countries and get to Australia through human traffickers anyhow.
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The Lone Alliance
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Postby The Lone Alliance » Tue May 28, 2019 3:26 pm

Shrillland wrote:Aye, it appears that Manus, Nauru, and Christmas Island will be full of death and misery for years to come. And all because Queensland couldn't do without its damn outdated coal mine.

Because inviting all the migrants on Manus, Nauru, and Christmas Island to Queensland would somehow be better than an outdated Coal Mine?
Last edited by The Lone Alliance on Tue May 28, 2019 3:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Tue May 28, 2019 3:29 pm

The Alma Mater wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Choosy beggars.

And it's nice to know they pick their countries based on how much free shit they can leech from taxpayers.


Wouldn't you ?
Seriously - if your home was destroyed in a war and you were certain that you could not return there for the next 10 years, where would you go with your kids - the country where you will get money and eduation for the kids or the country where you will be forced to play prostitute for scraps ?

If a non-hypocrite you should pick the latter.

Nice appeal to emotion, fam.
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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Tue May 28, 2019 3:29 pm

The Lone Alliance wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Choosy beggars.

And it's nice to know they pick their countries based on how much free shit they can leech from taxpayers.

And Human Smugglers love to lie to these people in order to convince them to pay them large amounts of money to try and sneak them into Australia.

Sometimes in amounts of money Money that they could have actually used to not live so horribly in their own countries. Really the whole system is sick.

Indeed.
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Kowani
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Postby Kowani » Tue May 28, 2019 6:22 pm

The Lone Alliance wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Choosy beggars.

And it's nice to know they pick their countries based on how much free shit they can leech from taxpayers.

And Human Smugglers love to lie to these people in order to convince them to pay them large amounts of money to try and sneak them into Australia.

Sometimes in amounts of money Money that they could have actually used to not live so horribly in their own countries. Really the whole system is sick.

Except for the fact that their home countries are extremely unstable, sure.
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The Lone Alliance
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Postby The Lone Alliance » Tue May 28, 2019 7:54 pm

Kowani wrote:
The Lone Alliance wrote:And Human Smugglers love to lie to these people in order to convince them to pay them large amounts of money to try and sneak them into Australia.

Sometimes in amounts of money Money that they could have actually used to not live so horribly in their own countries. Really the whole system is sick.

Except for the fact that their home countries are extremely unstable, sure.

And they in turn they destabilize the nations they sneak into. It's a circle of instability
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Nakena
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Postby Nakena » Tue May 28, 2019 7:56 pm

Whats needed are international sanctuary zones.

Though I have the feeling they would quickly turn into hives of scum and villainy.

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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Tue May 28, 2019 8:25 pm

The Lone Alliance wrote:
Kowani wrote:Except for the fact that their home countries are extremely unstable, sure.

And they in turn they destabilize the nations they sneak into. It's a circle of instability


This is not a given. Furthermore, this feeds into the image of foreigners as little more than terrorists-in-training, chomping at the bit to destroy their hosts, and upon which anything and everything to utterly destroy them is permissible, whether it be offshore detention facilities, oppressive legislation, or pogroms the way Europe used to make.
Last edited by Duhon on Tue May 28, 2019 8:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Proctopeo
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Postby Proctopeo » Tue May 28, 2019 8:53 pm

Nakena wrote:Whats needed are international sanctuary zones.

Though I have the feeling they would quickly turn into hives of scum and villainy.

I bet they'd have great music though
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Diarcesia
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Postby Diarcesia » Tue May 28, 2019 8:56 pm

Duhon wrote:
The Lone Alliance wrote:And they in turn they destabilize the nations they sneak into. It's a circle of instability


This is not a given. Furthermore, this feeds into the image of foreigners as little more than terrorists-in-training, chomping at the bit to destroy their hosts, and upon which anything and everything to utterly destroy them is permissible, whether it be offshore detention facilities, oppressive legislation, or pogroms the way Europe used to make.


It's a way of telling them they should have git gud in the first place.

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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Tue May 28, 2019 8:59 pm

Diarcesia wrote:
Duhon wrote:
This is not a given. Furthermore, this feeds into the image of foreigners as little more than terrorists-in-training, chomping at the bit to destroy their hosts, and upon which anything and everything to utterly destroy them is permissible, whether it be offshore detention facilities, oppressive legislation, or pogroms the way Europe used to make.


It's a way of telling them they should have git gud in the first place.


What?

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Diarcesia
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Postby Diarcesia » Tue May 28, 2019 9:02 pm

Duhon wrote:
Diarcesia wrote:
It's a way of telling them they should have git gud in the first place.


What?


This, applied in a geopolitical setting.

Well, this is a very sticky situation. There isn't any solution I know yet that will satisfy all parties.

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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Tue May 28, 2019 9:05 pm

Diarcesia wrote:
Duhon wrote:
What?


This, applied in a geopolitical setting.

Well, this is a very sticky situation. There isn't any solution I know yet that will satisfy all parties.


Tell the party who wants the most casualties to go get fucked. Sometimes you don't have to please everyone.

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Turbofolkia
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Postby Turbofolkia » Wed May 29, 2019 2:04 am

Shrillland wrote:Aye, it appears that Manus, Nauru, and Christmas Island will be full of death and misery for years to come. And all because Queensland couldn't do without its damn outdated coal mine.

Not to get too off topic, but this myth that Queensland alone won the election for the Coalition really needs to die. Labor had a realistic path to victory even if you took into account the loss of a seat or two in Queensland, but they underperformed throughout the whole country. They only picked up one seat. I’d argue that Victoria was worse for the ALP than Queensland since they were expected to do so well there, but were left empty handed.
Last edited by Turbofolkia on Wed May 29, 2019 2:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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