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Dutch Minister resigns over misleading refugee crime stats

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Nakena
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Dutch Minister resigns over misleading refugee crime stats

Postby Nakena » Wed May 22, 2019 8:44 am

DutchNews.nl wrote:Asylum minister Mark Harbers has resigned during a debate with MPs about a report in which figures about the number of refugees suspected of violent crimes were ‘hidden’.

Harbers told MPs that he felt responsible for the report, in which figures about how many refugees were suspected of rape and murder were not explicitly stated. ‘I am not only responsible in terms of the law, but I feel responsible,’ Harbers said.

The figures, which were published last week, included suspicions of rape (4) and murder (31) under the heading ‘other’. Harbers was then accused of attempting to hide the figures.

During Tuesday evening’s debate Harbers said that the ministry had been warned not to come up with a top 10 crimes for which asylum seekers were suspects because that meant serious crime would be hidden. However, civil servants had not taken that advice, Harbers said.

Asked why the ministry again had failed to report the true extent of the potential involvement of asylum seekers in crime, Harbers said civil servants were worried that the figures would lead to confusion.

Fake refugees

Last week’s report showed ‘fake’ asylum seekers who come from so-called safe countries, namely Morocco and Algeria, were responsible for almost half the 4,600 incidents requiring police intervention.

While most cases involved shoplifting or pickpocketing, police also registered cases of physical abuse, threatening behaviour and a further 1,000 incidents listed as ‘other’.

The Telegraaf reported on Thursday morning this total included 79 potential sex crimes, including 47 cases of sexual assault, five allegations of child abuse and four alleged rapes plus a string of other violent offences.

Rutte tweeted saying though he "respected" Harbers' decision to quit, it was "incredibly regrettable that the cabinet must say goodbye to such a talented and committed liberal."


tl;dr dutch migration minister resigns over "fixing" refugee crime statistics.

It shouldn surprise me but it nevertheless does to see how they act exactly as in the memetic way and fill each and every cliche. I am cynically amused by the sheer hyprocrisy coming from those people and that they got (once more?) caught in the act.

Are they really that dumb, stupid and trying to keep the covers over things because their biggest fear is the white elephant in the room, namely the rise of right wing populism?

So much afraid and big their concern that they cover up stats?

Just wow. It's amazing. A delicious gift served on a silver plate to enjoy.

Now what you think NSG, is this methodical or just another, unfortunate and isolated accident? And more importantly, what do you think is their motivation for this? Whats going on in their heads? What are that for people anyways?

Sources:

https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2019/05/a ... me-report/
https://www.dw.com/en/dutch-minister-re ... a-48822640
https://www.france24.com/en/20190521-du ... ime-report
Last edited by Nakena on Wed May 22, 2019 8:48 am, edited 3 times in total.

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The Blaatschapen
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Postby The Blaatschapen » Wed May 22, 2019 9:24 am

Not a minister. A state secretary.
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Window Land
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Postby Window Land » Wed May 22, 2019 10:00 am

I don't get why people skew the stats like this. If you're right, aren't the stats already skewed in your favor? Deceptive and misleading numbers that are technically correct but hide the truth are a big part of the whole fake news thing that is causing everybody large problem.
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Danubia-Slavia
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Postby Danubia-Slavia » Wed May 22, 2019 10:06 am

Look, you can believe whatever you want to believe. You can be pro-immigrant, anti-immigrant, or just be a wimp centrist like me, but whatever you stand for you have to back up with REAL facts. Changing what's real and what's not to fit your agenda just proves that you're wrong. If the minister dude wants more immigrants, why can't he come up with better reasons to have them instead of just """"editing"""" crime statistics to favor them? He's only dragging himself and others down

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Postby Conserative Morality » Wed May 22, 2019 10:12 am

>> when you feel the need to cover up 76 sex crimes from 103,000 people

Jesus, how pathetic can you get?
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Wed May 22, 2019 10:20 am

If you want to provide more fuel to ultranationalist parties, this is how you do it.
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Nakena
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Postby Nakena » Wed May 22, 2019 10:26 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:If you want to provide more fuel to ultranationalist parties, this is how you do it.


This is like an free electoral gift for Geert and the Hair Gel Mafia.

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Postby Danubia-Slavia » Wed May 22, 2019 10:28 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:If you want to provide more fuel to ultranationalist parties, this is how you do it.

Exactly, and they wonder why people are starting to join their political ideals. If you wanna do something right, don't be an idiot and give your enemy ammo.

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Postby Aclion » Wed May 22, 2019 10:30 am

Well it's not the first time European governments have been caught hiding crime to cover for their immigration policies.
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Postby Tybra » Wed May 22, 2019 10:38 am

It was a silly mistake hardly worth resigning over but Dutch liberal secretaries have resigned over less. This will hardly be on anyone's radar after winning the Eurovision Songfestival aside from the usual twitter suspects with their obsessive hatred for prime minister Rutte.
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Nakena
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Postby Nakena » Wed May 22, 2019 10:41 am

Tybra wrote:It was a silly mistake hardly worth resigning over but Dutch liberal secretaries have resigned over less. This will hardly be on anyone's radar after winning the Eurovision Songfestival aside from the usual twitter suspects with their obsessive hatred for prime minister Rutte.


It could have effects on the EU elections.

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Danubia-Slavia
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Postby Danubia-Slavia » Wed May 22, 2019 10:44 am

Tybra wrote:It was a silly mistake hardly worth resigning over but Dutch liberal secretaries have resigned over less. This will hardly be on anyone's radar after winning the Eurovision Songfestival aside from the usual twitter suspects with their obsessive hatred for prime minister Rutte.

I do agree it's not big enough to make him resign over, but I barely believe it was some sort of mistake. Considering the political climate in the EU, this could very likely have been committed simply because of his leanings. But innocent until proven guilty, even if it's basically pointing to statistics fraud

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Dogmeat
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Postby Dogmeat » Wed May 22, 2019 10:45 am

Can you imagine living in a country where a prominent politician resigns over misleading people?

Must be nice.
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Postby HC Eredivisie » Wed May 22, 2019 11:08 am

Yeah, it's really weird one includes 47 out of 1000 in a total of 4600 cases in a category called other. Or does everybody else mark every percent in a chart? :eyebrow:
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Tybra
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Postby Tybra » Wed May 22, 2019 11:09 am

Danubia-Slavia wrote:
Tybra wrote:It was a silly mistake hardly worth resigning over but Dutch liberal secretaries have resigned over less. This will hardly be on anyone's radar after winning the Eurovision Songfestival aside from the usual twitter suspects with their obsessive hatred for prime minister Rutte.

I do agree it's not big enough to make him resign over, but I barely believe it was some sort of mistake. Considering the political climate in the EU, this could very likely have been committed simply because of his leanings. But innocent until proven guilty, even if it's basically pointing to statistics fraud


In his initial defense the Dutch secretary mentioned that the statistics were handed to his ministry in the top 10 format by the police. In reponse the Dutch police almost immediately published the full list of all crimes. There appeared some gross miscommunication within his ministry, and i honestly can't judge whether or not the civil servant who complied the list did so on purpose or because it fitted better within the figure of the report since secretaries and ministers generally take responsibility for the errors made by their civil servants.
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Postby Betelgeuse Alliance » Wed May 22, 2019 11:14 am

I'm looking at this and understand this from both sides, but this still sounds like blatant corruption to me regardless. It's extremely important that everyone is correctly and honestly informed, no matter the consequences it may have. In my eyes this is just one of the sorry cases where information is kept hidden in order to preserve the status quo, and although kinda unlikely, there's a slight chance that this could be a cheap attempt to deliberately make people favor one ideology over the other in order to gain more votes, but I'll let everyone else think about that for themselves. Even though I want to clarify right now that I don't support right-wing populism at all, honesty and transparency of information is much more important to me. If any government keeps information deliberately hidden, it doesn't deserve any trust, simple as that. And this case is especially embarassing, since I'm Dutch myself.
Last edited by Betelgeuse Alliance on Wed May 22, 2019 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Huskar Social Union
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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Wed May 22, 2019 11:17 am

Well you shouldnt do that.

Also covering up such a small number from a population group is just... stupid imo
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Postby Aclion » Wed May 22, 2019 11:17 am

HC Eredivisie wrote:Yeah, it's really weird one includes 47 out of 1000 in a total of 4600 cases in a category called other. Or does everybody else mark every percent in a chart? :eyebrow:

*Attempts to respond but is killed in an @ANIMAL@ attack*
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Postby Saiwania » Wed May 22, 2019 11:17 am

It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.

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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Wed May 22, 2019 11:18 am

Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.

Build a time machine and go back to 1945 and have fun in the ruins of the reichstag for a few hours. Theres your reich for you.
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Postby The Blaatschapen » Wed May 22, 2019 11:29 am

Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.


The Dutch don't build Reichs anyway.
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Postby Danubia-Slavia » Wed May 22, 2019 11:33 am

Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.

I mean, I do think forced multiculturalism is bad, but a bit of multiculturalism isn't that bad when done fine. I just think the far-left isn't doing a very good job at it. Multiculturalism takes time and patience, and doesn't work everywhere. We just have to find the right balance of accepting others and preserving our own ways of life.

Oh! And actually regulating our borders and background checking people would also be a totally common sense thing to do. Immigration is a good thing as long as you literally don't let waves of people overpopulate your country and allow terrorists to throw bombs into your streets.

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Postby Fartsniffage » Wed May 22, 2019 11:34 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.


The Dutch don't build Reichs anyway.


The Dutch are all about building Dykes instead.

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Danubia-Slavia
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Postby Danubia-Slavia » Wed May 22, 2019 11:36 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.


The Dutch don't build Reichs anyway.

Those wooden shoes they have are enough to convince me they're beyond our power sphere anyhow.

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Postby Bear Stearns » Wed May 22, 2019 11:36 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Saiwania wrote:It won't bring about the return of a Reich that I want, but it is in the right direction if people wake up to the fact that multiculturalist immigration is no good for them or their country. It is something to be reversed or undone in due time.


The Dutch don't build Reichs anyway.


You build rijks.
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