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New Mexico militia's detaining migrants.

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Do you support militias detaining illegal immigrants at the border?

Yes, they are legally justified, and are doing the right thing.
96
32%
Yes, I'm unsure as to the legality, but it is necessary.
43
14%
Unsure or undecided.
17
6%
No, this is illegal.
41
14%
No, legality doesn't matter, it's immoral.
41
14%
No, this is illegal, and immoral.
65
21%
 
Total votes : 303

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Medwind
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New Mexico militia's detaining migrants.

Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:28 pm

New Mexico's militias are detaining migrants at the border, while awaiting border patrol to arrest them. The ACLU of New Mexico has denounced them as fascist white supremacists, and petitioned NM. government officials to stop them. Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham has attacked them, saying there will be an investigation, and that regular citizens don't have the power to arrest anyone. However, unless I'm mistaken, this is untrue, due to the presence of citizens arrest laws. Illegal immigrant = criminal, however I don't know if citizen arrest laws apply to them, however, it should imo. It should be noted that a majority of the militia are prior service, and therefore trained, and in reality, they are just detaining them until border patrol arrives, not actually throwing them in jail or such. What do you think of this issue NS? Are these patriotic citizens doing their civic duty in the face of a crises of mass illegal immigration, or are they neo nazi's? Are they justified from a legal standpoint?
Full article here:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/no-au ... spartanntp

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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:30 pm

Are militias composed of citizens permitted by law to detain illegal immigrants, at all?
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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:31 pm

Surprised it took this long to make it here.

I am curious to what our resident militia person thinks.
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Medwind
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Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:32 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:Are militias composed of citizens permitted by law to detain illegal immigrants, at all?

I believe so, although I may be mistaken, the gov. of NM disagrees with me it seems.

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Aureumterra
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Postby Aureumterra » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:32 pm

In the absence of government action, people resort to vigilante justice
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Gagium
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Postby Gagium » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:33 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:Are militias composed of citizens permitted by law to detain illegal immigrants, at all?

Citizens’ arrest? Should be legal
Last edited by Gagium on Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
E

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The Republic of Fore
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Postby The Republic of Fore » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:33 pm

Yeah no, this isn't okay. Regardless of how I feel about immigration, this should be handled by law enforcement. These gentlemen are free to apply to become border patrol agents.

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Pannerstone
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Postby Pannerstone » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:33 pm

Protected under the constitution, i mean it literally says that we can bear arms and form militias for security purposes.
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Medwind
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Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:33 pm

Aureumterra wrote:In the absence of government action, people resort to vigilante justice

Very true, it is necessary imo.

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Pannerstone
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Postby Pannerstone » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:34 pm

The Republic of Fore wrote:Yeah no, this isn't okay. Regardless of how I feel about immigration, this should be handled by law enforcement. These gentlemen are free to apply to become border patrol agents.


When it becomes apparent that the law fails to protect, the people will step in.
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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:34 pm

Medwind wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:Are militias composed of citizens permitted by law to detain illegal immigrants, at all?

I believe so, although I may be mistaken, the gov. of NM disagrees with me it seems.


In which case they more than likely shouldn’t be doing this. They should probably limit themselves to reporting to the pertinent authorities.
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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:34 pm

Pannerstone wrote:Protected under the constitution, i mean it literally says that we can bear arms and form militias for security purposes.


Security is one thing; imprisoning others is another.
*I am a master proofreader after I click Submit.
* There is actually a War on Christmas. But Christmas started it, with it's unparalleled aggression against the Thanksgiving Holiday, and now Christmas has seized much Lebensraum in November, and are pushing into October. The rest of us seek to repel these invaders, and push them back to the status quo ante bellum Black Friday border. -Trotskylvania
* Silence Is Golden But Duct Tape Is Silver.
* I felt like Ayn Rand cornered me at a party, and three minutes in I found my first objection to what she was saying, but she kept talking without interruption for ten more days. - Max Barry talking about Atlas Shrugged

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Medwind
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Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:34 pm

Pannerstone wrote:Protected under the constitution, i mean it literally says that we can bear arms and form militias for security purposes.

Yes, I agree on that, however the question is whether said militias can detain people. I believe so under the citizens arrest laws, but I guess NM governor & leftist organizations haven't heard of that.
Last edited by Medwind on Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Gagium
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Postby Gagium » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:35 pm

The Black Forrest wrote:
Pannerstone wrote:Protected under the constitution, i mean it literally says that we can bear arms and form militias for security purposes.


Security is one thing; imprisoning others is another.

Pretty sure they were only detaining them until Border Patrol would arrest them, and then they’d take it from there. Not really imprisoning
E

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Pannerstone
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Postby Pannerstone » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:36 pm

Medwind wrote:
Pannerstone wrote:Protected under the constitution, i mean it literally says that we can bear arms and form militias for security purposes.

Yes, I agree on that, however the question is whether said militias can detain people. I believe so under the citizens arrest laws, but I guess NM governor & leftist organizations haven't heard of that.


I mean it comes with the territory of security, if you can't detain then how can you secure?
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:37 pm

Seeking asylum in the US is not a crime. Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

Detaining people without valid cause and brandishing guns to intimidate them? Those are crimes.
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Democratic Exodian Territories
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Postby Democratic Exodian Territories » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:38 pm

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Medwind
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Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:38 pm

Pannerstone wrote:
Medwind wrote:Yes, I agree on that, however the question is whether said militias can detain people. I believe so under the citizens arrest laws, but I guess NM governor & leftist organizations haven't heard of that.


I mean it comes with the territory of security, if you can't detain then how can you secure?

I agree, I don't know for 100% certainty that the law does though. It differs state to state I believe, and I don't know if it includes illegal immigration, although it definitely should, if it doesn't.

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Gagium
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Postby Gagium » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:38 pm

Ifreann wrote: Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

By using the word illegal, you acknowledged that it is a crime. How can you claim it isn’t if it’s illegal?
E

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Pannerstone
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Postby Pannerstone » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:38 pm

Ifreann wrote:Seeking asylum in the US is not a crime. Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

Detaining people without valid cause and brandishing guns to intimidate them? Those are crimes.


Even if we went with this ridiculous logic, the 2nd amendment says "security of a free state"

They are performing a security function.
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Medwind
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Postby Medwind » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:39 pm

Ifreann wrote:Seeking asylum in the US is not a crime. Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

Detaining people without valid cause and brandishing guns to intimidate them? Those are crimes.

Illegally immigrating here in violation of our laws is a crime subject to deportation. Also detainment by border patrol, for potentially a long period of time. A citizens arrest is not a crime.

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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:39 pm

Gagium wrote:
Ifreann wrote: Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

By using the word illegal, you acknowledged that it is a crime. How can you claim it isn’t if it’s illegal?

It's a civil offense, not a criminal one.
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Pannerstone
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Postby Pannerstone » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:40 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Gagium wrote:By using the word illegal, you acknowledged that it is a crime. How can you claim it isn’t if it’s illegal?

It's a civil offense, not a criminal one.


still an offense and still a matter of security
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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:40 pm

Pannerstone wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Seeking asylum in the US is not a crime. Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

Detaining people without valid cause and brandishing guns to intimidate them? Those are crimes.


Even if we went with this ridiculous logic, the 2nd amendment says "security of a free state"

They are performing a security function.


NM’s government laws seem to disagree with that take however. If they aren’t endowed with the authority to detain immigrants, they are risking getting in trouble themselves.
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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:41 pm

Pannerstone wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Seeking asylum in the US is not a crime. Being in the US illegally isn't a crime either.

Detaining people without valid cause and brandishing guns to intimidate them? Those are crimes.


Even if we went with this ridiculous logic, the 2nd amendment says "security of a free state"

They are performing a security function.


They weren't requested by the state to do it.
*I am a master proofreader after I click Submit.
* There is actually a War on Christmas. But Christmas started it, with it's unparalleled aggression against the Thanksgiving Holiday, and now Christmas has seized much Lebensraum in November, and are pushing into October. The rest of us seek to repel these invaders, and push them back to the status quo ante bellum Black Friday border. -Trotskylvania
* Silence Is Golden But Duct Tape Is Silver.
* I felt like Ayn Rand cornered me at a party, and three minutes in I found my first objection to what she was saying, but she kept talking without interruption for ten more days. - Max Barry talking about Atlas Shrugged

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