Russian seizure of Ukranian Warships

[Sir Cumberbun of Gloucester]

From https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-russian-ship-rams-navy-tugboat-off-crimea-azov/29619665.html

[The Ukrainian Navy says Russian forces opened fire on a group of its ships in the Black Sea off the coast of the Crimean Peninsula late on November 25, striking two warships and wounding two crew members before seizing the vessels along with a Ukrainian Navy tugboat.

The Ukrainian Navy announced the incident on a day of heightened tension after Russia reportedly blocked the three Ukrainian Navy ships from passing from the Black Sea into the Sea of Azov via the Kerch Strait.

As events are developing, it seems like the Ukranians are approaching a war readiness footing. Video of the altercation in question is below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcTSDaCg5xA

Is this the straw that finally breaks the camel's back? Previous aggressive actions by Russia against Ukraine include shooting down a civilian passenger jet, invading and covertly fighting with army forcessupporting "separatists" in eastern Ukraine, and of course taking Crimea in a bloodless invasion.

[Eilodon]

Well reddit is much faster than NS. Been discussing this topic there.
^~^
Really it's a pity what Russia is doing, but I don't believe outside of Ukraine there won't be any repercussions. Trump and NATO will do jack shit.

[Dark Socialism]

I instantly support Russia

[Vassenor]

Well reddit is much faster than NS. Been discussing this topic there.
^~^
Really it's a pity what Russia is doing, but I don't believe outside of Ukraine there won't be any repercussions. Trump and NATO will do jack shit.

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

[Reikoku]

Well reddit is much faster than NS. Been discussing this topic there.
^~^
Really it's a pity what Russia is doing, but I don't believe outside of Ukraine there won't be any repercussions. Trump and NATO will do jack shit.

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

Them being under no obligation doesn't mean they should ignore a blatant act of aggression by an emboldened Russia against an independent nation.

[Eilodon]

Well reddit is much faster than NS. Been discussing this topic there.
^~^
Really it's a pity what Russia is doing, but I don't believe outside of Ukraine there won't be any repercussions. Trump and NATO will do jack shit.

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

NATO was made to curb russias expansion and aggression yes?

[Vassenor]

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

NATO was made to curb russias expansion and aggression yes?

They're not obliged to intervene until a NATO member state gets attacked.

[Proctopeo]

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

NATO was made to curb russias expansion and aggression yes?

Strictly speaking, it was to curb the expansion and aggression of the USSR. No one country is the heir of the Soviet Union, only one of its constituent republics; Russia, specifically, is the heir to the RSFSR.

[The New California Republic]

NATO is under no obligation to intervene right now anyway.

NATO was made to curb russias expansion and aggression yes?

Technically no. On paper it is just a generic mutual defense treaty to defend its members from external threats; Russia isn't explicitly mentioned. Implicitly it was designed to act as a bulwark against Communism.

[Costa Fierro]

LMAO how can you lose naval vessels to the fucking coast guard?

[Semparia]

LMAO how can you lose naval vessels to the fucking coast guard?

To be fair the budget of Russia's coastguard is probably the budget of the Ukrainian navy's considering that its Russia and the other is heccin Urkaine.

[Valrifell]

NATO was made to curb russias expansion and aggression yes?

Strictly speaking, it was to curb the expansion and aggression of the USSR. No one country is the heir of the Soviet Union, only one of its constituent republics; Russia, specifically, is the heir to the RSFSR.

Legal fiction, for all intents and purposes the USSR was dominated by the RSFSR and Russia is the heir to the Soviet Union.

[Dogmeat]

Any guesses as to how Shofercia will come down on this?

[Reikoku]

Any guesses as to how Shofercia will come down on this?

In the words of the greatest philosopher king of the modern age:

"Fake news."

[The Realist Polities]

Why would Russia do this now?

It is clearly a Ukrainian provocation:

1. Elections are approaching and the Ukrainian President would likely lose in the ballot box even after the opposition parties were banned ...which is saying something.

2. Poroshenko immediately declared martial law. So, Russians carry out a provocation on disputed territorial waters and the Ukrainian government imposes martial law on Ukrainians?... What?

Come on, this is obviously a Ukrainian orchestration for domestic reasons as have been the border incidents in recent months.

[The New California Republic]

LMAO how can you lose naval vessels to the fucking coast guard?

The Russians trapped the ships by parking a tanker across the Kerch Strait, and deployed fighters and helicopters to the area:

[The Realist Polities]

Any guesses as to how Shofercia will come down on this?

did any of you bother to read a non-Western source before posting ?

so don't be hypocritical.

[Loben]

Lets see how those useless pansies in the EU react to this

[Costa Fierro]

Any guesses as to how Shofercia will come down on this?

did any of you bother to read a non-Western source before posting ?

so don't be hypocritical.

>Russia
>non-fiction journalism

Pick. One.

[Valrifell]

Lets see how those useless pansies in the EU react to this

The Ukraine isn't in the EU, they are obligated to do nothing.

[Vassenor]

Lets see how those useless pansies in the EU react to this

The EU has no military.

[The New California Republic]

did any of you bother to read a non-Western source before posting ?

so don't be hypocritical.

>Russia
>non-fiction journalism

Pick. One.

I think they want us to get the story from the impartial RT.

[The Realist Polities]

>Russia
>non-fiction journalism

Pick. One.

Fine, then you will remain ignorant for the rest of your days and continue trapped in CNN world.

What a good thing it was that Brexit never won, Trump was never elected, the Arab Spring went well and the illegal migrants brought wonders to Europe.

You don't like RT? ok, pick another source. But if you keep yourselves insulated in a bubble that keeps getting stuff wrong, you will continue to look like fools.
A reasonable person reads multiple sources because not every source is right (or wrong) 100% of the time. You choose to be biased.
Ok, well, good luck.

That is all I can say.

[Valrifell]

>Russia
>non-fiction journalism

Pick. One.

Fine, then you will remain ignorant for the rest of your days and continue trapped in CNN world.

What a good thing it was that Brexit never won, Trump was never elected, the Arab Spring went well and the illegal migrants brought wonders to Europe.

You don't like RT? ok, pick another source. But if you keep yourselves insulated in a bubble that keeps getting stuff wrong, you will continue to look like fools.
A reasonable person reads multiple sources because not every source is right (or wrong) 100% of the time. You chose to be biased.
Ok, well, good luck.

That is all I can say.

Typecasting all Western media sources as "CNN" is so hilarious that I can't really get past it to think of a better response.

[The Realist Polities]

Typecasting all Western media sources as "CNN" is so hilarious that I can't really get past it to think of a better response.

CNN is a good caricature of Western media. Besides, if you live abroad you might understand that much of the 'international news' segments of other countries are bought from CNN.

Even more hilarious is that in the Age of Trump, you think the MSM are distinguishable in journalistic standards.

Further to my point:

https://theintercept.com/2017/12/09/the ... -happened/

Here is just a sample of incredibly inflammatory claims that traveled all over the internet before having to be corrected, walked back, or retracted — often long after the initial false claims spread, and where the corrections receive only a tiny fraction of the attention with which the initial false stories are lavished:

Russia hacked into the U.S. electric grid to deprive Americans of heat during winter (Wash Post)
An anonymous group (PropOrNot) documented how major U.S. political sites are Kremlin agents (Wash Post)
WikiLeaks has a long, documented relationship with Putin (Guardian)
A secret server between Trump and a Russian bank has been discovered (Slate)
RT hacked C-SPAN and caused disruption in its broadcast (Fortune)
Russians hacked into a Ukrainian artillery app (Crowdstrike)
Russians attempted to hack elections systems in 21 states (multiple news outlets, echoing Homeland Security)
Links have been found between Trump ally Anthony Scaramucci and a Russian investment fund under investigation (CNN)