NATION

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"Steak is NOT Beef... it is NOT Beef"

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Is this a Dealbreaker?

Yes
26
24%
No
83
76%
 
Total votes : 109

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Infected Mushroom
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"Steak is NOT Beef... it is NOT Beef"

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:03 pm

Please consider this very short and very simple hypothetical:

You are on a date, at a nice restaurant. The date is going well, then the steaks arrive (served with fine wine). You both went with a New Zealand cut of medium rare.

Your date then says:

"Did you know? Steak is NOT beef. Ground beef is beef. Steak is NOT beef..."

You're a bit surprised so you gently say, "... So what animal is it from then?"

Your date stares at you and thinks about it for 7-8 seconds. "Hmmmm...." they say eventually. "I don't know. I just know its not Beef."

The rest of the date goes on as normal.

...

The discussion question is very simple:

Assume this strange conversation happened to you,

1. Would this be a Dealbreaker for you personally? Why or why not? (if it is a Dealbreaker, it means that a second+ date is off limits now)
2. What is your standard with respect to "Intelligence/Knowledge" in a partner in general?

Assume your date is otherwise quite physically attractive, interesting, entertaining and has many interests in common with you.

Please explain and discuss.

... ... ... After a great deal of thought, its not QUITE a dealbreaker but it is very close. I mean, its not like they said Africa was a country and Egypt was the capital or something THAT awful. But yes I do have standards, I don't know if they are particularly high or not. Assuming they are otherwise fine, the dates could continue. That's my tentative answer.
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Heloin
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Postby Heloin » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:09 pm

Why should someone not knowing that Beef just means meat from a cow be a relationship deal breaker? My previous girlfriend didn't realise only girl cattle were actually called cows.
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Loben
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Postby Loben » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:10 pm

Dealbreaker.

Steak comes from cow, there for, it is beef.

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Infected Mushroom
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:23 pm

Heloin wrote:Why should someone not knowing that Beef just means meat from a cow be a relationship deal breaker? My previous girlfriend didn't realise only girl cattle were actually called cows.


I don't know.

I mean, its just an emotional response from me. It makes me want to shout out loud:

"HOW COULD YOU NOT KNOW THIS?!!!!!! ... HOW??????????!!!!!!!!"

I wouldn't because I am bound by certain rules of conduct, but I'd be so tempted.

I mean, its not so much that they don't know that steak comes from cattle... its the fact that WHILE they didn't know this, it has never occurred to them to wonder and look up the answer. This can't be the first time they've eaten steak so then... .... ... the fact that can't name another animal is problematic. Had they even said, "it comes from pigs/pork" I would have been shocked but not nearly as shell-shocked as the total lack of answer.

I understand that there is variance between what is "common sense/common knowledge" across different people. I mean just the other day I myself looked pretty bad not knowing that a "bomber" was a type of jacket or that "John Deere" was an agricultural company. But this is on a fairly universal level I feel...

Is it not universal knowledge that New Zealand cuts come from cattle?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Victorious Decepticons
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Postby Victorious Decepticons » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:27 pm

Instant dealbreaker. I despise idiots. I would cut him off right upon the first detection of the idiocy.

2. What is your standard with respect to "Intelligence/Knowledge" in a partner in general?
He has to be at least as intelligent as me, and definitely know "common knowledge" things like this. He preferably also has at least as much education as I do, and of a similar quality, though it's okay if it's in a different area of study. That is assuming, of course, that the "area of study" isn't some kind of baloney degree along the lines of underwater basket weaving or Madonnaology.

School degrees aren't necessarily required, especially in this age of the internet where it's fairly easy to learn things without sitting in a room and having them spoon-fed to you. The important thing is that he has gotten a good education SOMEHOW, whether it's from Professor Google or Harvard.

However, I will not spend any time with someone who argues with me about simple basic facts while being wrong! That's infuriating as hell. I'd probably get up immediately, tell him that I don't associate with obstinately wrong fools, and storm out of the restaurant.

Assume your date is otherwise quite physically attractive, interesting, entertaining and has many interests in common with you.

Idiots are neither interesting nor entertaining. He'd be wrong about all of the common interests, so doing anything with him would be a drag instead of any kind of fun. And this one is not only wrong, but ARGUES from his point of wrongness! It'd be like being near a little kid who needs to be taught everything, but actively resists getting any lessons. That's 100% pure argh.

Dropped like a hot rock.
Last edited by Victorious Decepticons on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Chan Island
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Postby Chan Island » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:27 pm

I have dated people who believed stupider things. That little misconception can be eased with a gentle correction later. Not a deal breaker.

That said, it would depend on if this is the ONLY incident like this. If it turns out that there are other simple mistakes like this being made, then I can probably quite safely assume I am dealing with somebody who is very much... an intellectually concerning specimen.

Think of this as a yellow flag.
Last edited by Chan Island on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.

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USS Monitor
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Postby USS Monitor » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:30 pm

If that's the only stupid or ignorant thing they said, it's a bit of a turn off, but definitely not a deal breaker.

Lots of people have quirky beliefs or random gaps in their knowledge. I had a long-term relationship with a guy that believed in mermaids.

When he tried to tell me the NS Sports forum was a den of sexual predators, that was more of a problem than the mermaids because it was pretty evident that he had never actually visited NS, he wasn't listening to what I told him about the site, and he wasn't respecting my judgement. That was near the end of our relationship, and it was one more nail in the coffin.
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Wallenburg
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Postby Wallenburg » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:31 pm

I am very confused. Do you know anyone who actually considers steak not to be beef? This is perhaps the most pointless, obscure thread of the year.
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Heloin
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Postby Heloin » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:32 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Heloin wrote:Why should someone not knowing that Beef just means meat from a cow be a relationship deal breaker? My previous girlfriend didn't realise only girl cattle were actually called cows.


I don't know.

I mean, its just an emotional response from me. It makes me want to shout out loud:

"HOW COULD YOU KNOW THIS?!!!!!! ... HOW??????????!!!!!!!!"

I wouldn't because I am bound by certain rules of conduct, but I'd be so tempted.

I mean, its not so much that they don't know that steak comes from cattle... its the fact that WHILE they didn't know this, it has never occurred to them to wonder and look up the answer. This can't be the first time they've eaten steak so then... .... ... the fact that can't name another animal is problematic. Had they even said, "it comes from pigs/pork" I would have been shocked but not nearly as shell-shocked as the total lack of answer.

I understand that there is variance between what is "common sense/common knowledge" across different people. I mean just the other day I myself looked pretty bad not knowing that a "bomber" was a type of jacket or that "John Deere" was an agricultural company. But this is on a fairly universal level I feel...

Is it not universal knowledge that New Zealand cuts come from cattle?

Think about it this way. Unless you spend far to much time reading wikipedia(or your encyclopedia of choice) there are many many things that you no nothing about. I grew up in farming communities, cattle, John Deere, and tobacco are common sense to me. Nothing is universally know. I only just learned of the existence of a song called Baby by Justin Beiber, which was apparently shocking to my normal NS home the rate music thread.
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Astoriya
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Postby Astoriya » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:35 pm

Not a deal breaker - if just a small (and bizarre) statement turns you off, you need to look elsewhere
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Chan Island
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Postby Chan Island » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:35 pm

Wallenburg wrote:I am very confused. Do you know anyone who actually considers steak not to be beef? This is perhaps the most pointless, obscure thread of the year.


Eh, people often have random little things that they don't know. We all have them. Speaking for myself, I for example believed that the French word for Tuesday was the one for Thursday and vice-versa. For years. In a French speaking country. And nobody told me until I was in my 20s...
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.

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Infected Mushroom
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:35 pm

Wallenburg wrote:I am very confused. Do you know anyone who actually considers steak not to be beef? This is perhaps the most pointless, obscure thread of the year.


I'll leave that to your judgement =)

Its presented as a hypothetical

Every thread of mine has at least some basis in reality, the exact context is usually altered to facilitate discussion
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Infected Mushroom
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:40 pm

Heloin wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
I don't know.

I mean, its just an emotional response from me. It makes me want to shout out loud:

"HOW COULD YOU KNOW THIS?!!!!!! ... HOW??????????!!!!!!!!"

I wouldn't because I am bound by certain rules of conduct, but I'd be so tempted.

I mean, its not so much that they don't know that steak comes from cattle... its the fact that WHILE they didn't know this, it has never occurred to them to wonder and look up the answer. This can't be the first time they've eaten steak so then... .... ... the fact that can't name another animal is problematic. Had they even said, "it comes from pigs/pork" I would have been shocked but not nearly as shell-shocked as the total lack of answer.

I understand that there is variance between what is "common sense/common knowledge" across different people. I mean just the other day I myself looked pretty bad not knowing that a "bomber" was a type of jacket or that "John Deere" was an agricultural company. But this is on a fairly universal level I feel...

Is it not universal knowledge that New Zealand cuts come from cattle?

Think about it this way. Unless you spend far to much time reading wikipedia(or your encyclopedia of choice) there are many many things that you no nothing about. I grew up in farming communities, cattle, John Deere, and tobacco are common sense to me. Nothing is universally know. I only just learned of the existence of a song called Baby by Justin Beiber, which was apparently shocking to my normal NS home the rate music thread.


This is true.

I am woefully ignorant about pop culture, technology, company names, and as a I found out to my cost the other day, terminology regarding clothes.

But let's say this exchange happened:

...

A: "How are we going to approach this discussion with the British?"

B: "Its simple. We go to the Queen and give her our proposal. We'll make it 100% hard-hitting and its a Go."

A: "... ... the Queen?"

B: "Sup?"

A: "The Queen is the ceremonial head of state. She's not the head of government."

B: "Oh? Then who is the head of government?"

A: "The Prime Minister."

B: "... ... okay."
...

Would you not be concerned? =)
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The Free Joy State
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Postby The Free Joy State » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:42 pm

Believing one/two random stupid thing/s (like steak and beef were from different animals) would not be a deal-breaker; gaps in knowledge can be filled-in with an encyclopaedia or a web-search. Ditto, quirks aren't a deal-breaker; you can get used to someone's quirks.

Someone who's so mind-numbingly stupid that it's impossible to have a decent conversation with them would be a deal-beaker.

Then again, it can also work the other way. People who are highly intelligent and know they're intelligent and who feel the need to constantly remind you of the width and breadth of the wonder that is their intellect aren't necessarily great for a long-term-relationship, either.
Last edited by The Free Joy State on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Chan Island
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Postby Chan Island » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:46 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Heloin wrote:Think about it this way. Unless you spend far to much time reading wikipedia(or your encyclopedia of choice) there are many many things that you no nothing about. I grew up in farming communities, cattle, John Deere, and tobacco are common sense to me. Nothing is universally know. I only just learned of the existence of a song called Baby by Justin Beiber, which was apparently shocking to my normal NS home the rate music thread.


This is true.

I am woefully ignorant about pop culture, technology, company names, and as a I found out to my cost the other day, terminology regarding clothes.

But let's say this exchange happened:

...

A: "How are we going to approach this discussion with the British?"

B: "Its simple. We go to the Queen and give her our proposal. We'll make it 100% hard-hitting and its a Go."

A: "... ... the Queen?"

B: "Sup?"

A: "The Queen is the ceremonial head of state. She's not the head of government."

B: "Oh? Then who is the head of government?"

A: "The Prime Minister."

B: "... ... okay."
...

Would you not be concerned? =)


If it's with the same person as in the previous one (and assuming this person is living in Britain), then by now I'll have lots of mental alarm bells going. Still not a complete deal breaker yet but I'll have plans in place to go if this ignorance continues.

That said, otherwise it wouldn't be much of a concern. Same answer as before.


Also relevant now. :p
Last edited by Chan Island on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.

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Heloin
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Postby Heloin » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:47 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Heloin wrote:Think about it this way. Unless you spend far to much time reading wikipedia(or your encyclopedia of choice) there are many many things that you no nothing about. I grew up in farming communities, cattle, John Deere, and tobacco are common sense to me. Nothing is universally know. I only just learned of the existence of a song called Baby by Justin Beiber, which was apparently shocking to my normal NS home the rate music thread.


This is true.

I am woefully ignorant about pop culture, technology, company names, and as a I found out to my cost the other day, terminology regarding clothes.

But let's say this exchange happened:

...

A: "How are we going to approach this discussion with the British?"

B: "Its simple. We go to the Queen and give her our proposal. We'll make it 100% hard-hitting and its a Go."

A: "... ... the Queen?"

B: "Sup?"

A: "The Queen is the ceremonial head of state. She's not the head of government."

B: "Oh? Then who is the head of government?"

A: "The Prime Minister."

B: "... ... okay."
...

Would you not be concerned? =)

Seeing as I've know people (a person) from the UK who didn't know they lived in a monarchy, no not really. I'd be surprised but gaps in knowledge can always be corrected.
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Right wing humour squad
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Postby Right wing humour squad » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:47 pm

The hell am I doing on a date in the first place?
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The Monza Isles
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Postby The Monza Isles » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:48 pm

Right wing humour squad wrote:The hell am I doing on a date in the first place?

Yeah what this person said.
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Valentine Z
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Postby Valentine Z » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:48 pm

It is not a dealbreaker in any way, shape or form. As many others have said, it's not an intelligence test and rather, it's just a cultural or regional difference.

With that said, I have no reason to dictate how others perceive steak as beef or not. There are many other things that breaks the deal, such as rudeness towards everyone around, especially servers.
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:48 pm

Chan Island wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
This is true.

I am woefully ignorant about pop culture, technology, company names, and as a I found out to my cost the other day, terminology regarding clothes.

But let's say this exchange happened:

...

A: "How are we going to approach this discussion with the British?"

B: "Its simple. We go to the Queen and give her our proposal. We'll make it 100% hard-hitting and its a Go."

A: "... ... the Queen?"

B: "Sup?"

A: "The Queen is the ceremonial head of state. She's not the head of government."

B: "Oh? Then who is the head of government?"

A: "The Prime Minister."

B: "... ... okay."
...

Would you not be concerned? =)


If it's with the same person as in the previous one (and assuming this person is living in Britain), then by now I'll have lots of mental alarm bells going. Still not a complete deal breaker yet but I'll have plans in place to go if this ignorance continues.

That said, otherwise it wouldn't be much of a concern. Same answer as before.


I was thinking they were American/Canadian/Australian, someone in the western Anglosphere but not living in the UK

would you be concerned; is this a reasonable mistake? Is it not common knowledge that the UK's "boss" is the Prime Minister and not the Queen?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Chan Island
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Postby Chan Island » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:50 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Chan Island wrote:
If it's with the same person as in the previous one (and assuming this person is living in Britain), then by now I'll have lots of mental alarm bells going. Still not a complete deal breaker yet but I'll have plans in place to go if this ignorance continues.

That said, otherwise it wouldn't be much of a concern. Same answer as before.


I was thinking they were American/Canadian/Australian, someone in the western Anglosphere but not living in the UK

would you be concerned; is this a reasonable mistake? Is it not common knowledge that the UK's "boss" is the Prime Minister and not the Queen?


Well it is in the UK, where I happen to live.
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.

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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:50 pm

Heloin wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
This is true.

I am woefully ignorant about pop culture, technology, company names, and as a I found out to my cost the other day, terminology regarding clothes.

But let's say this exchange happened:

...

A: "How are we going to approach this discussion with the British?"

B: "Its simple. We go to the Queen and give her our proposal. We'll make it 100% hard-hitting and its a Go."

A: "... ... the Queen?"

B: "Sup?"

A: "The Queen is the ceremonial head of state. She's not the head of government."

B: "Oh? Then who is the head of government?"

A: "The Prime Minister."

B: "... ... okay."
...

Would you not be concerned? =)

Seeing as I've know people (a person) from the UK who didn't know they lived in a monarchy, no not really. I'd be surprised but gaps in knowledge can always be corrected.


hmmmmm.....

I see...
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:52 pm

Valentine Z wrote:It is not a dealbreaker in any way, shape or form. As many others have said, it's not an intelligence test and rather, it's just a cultural or regional difference.

With that said, I have no reason to dictate how others perceive steak as beef or not. There are many other things that breaks the deal, such as rudeness towards everyone around, especially servers.


so for instance, if said person were to snap their delicate fingers at the waiters and then complain (very aggressively) about how drinks are not re-filled pronto and then actually threaten a reduction in the tip?
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:54 pm

Victorious Decepticons wrote:Instant dealbreaker. I despise idiots. I would cut him off right upon the first detection of the idiocy.

2. What is your standard with respect to "Intelligence/Knowledge" in a partner in general?
He has to be at least as intelligent as me, and definitely know "common knowledge" things like this. He preferably also has at least as much education as I do, and of a similar quality, though it's okay if it's in a different area of study. That is assuming, of course, that the "area of study" isn't some kind of baloney degree along the lines of underwater basket weaving or Madonnaology.

School degrees aren't necessarily required, especially in this age of the internet where it's fairly easy to learn things without sitting in a room and having them spoon-fed to you. The important thing is that he has gotten a good education SOMEHOW, whether it's from Professor Google or Harvard.

However, I will not spend any time with someone who argues with me about simple basic facts while being wrong! That's infuriating as hell. I'd probably get up immediately, tell him that I don't associate with obstinately wrong fools, and storm out of the restaurant.

...


But... but...

wouldn't you break their soft hearts and hurt them?

=(
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Valentine Z » Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:56 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Valentine Z wrote:It is not a dealbreaker in any way, shape or form. As many others have said, it's not an intelligence test and rather, it's just a cultural or regional difference.

With that said, I have no reason to dictate how others perceive steak as beef or not. There are many other things that breaks the deal, such as rudeness towards everyone around, especially servers.


so for instance, if said person were to snap their delicate fingers at the waiters and then complain (very aggressively) about how drinks are not re-filled pronto and then actually threaten a reduction in the tip?


Yeeep, all of that. It's okay to expect a good service, but when you have too many people in the restaurant or the servers/waiters are working round-the-clock to satisfy everyone, being considerate should be it.
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