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#babyforsale

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

It's my baby I..

..should definitely not be able to sell it
73
55%
..should certainly not be able to sell it on social media
9
7%
..have every right to sell it if I want
15
11%
..eBaby.. did you really just do this OP for that ending..?
10
8%
..want to buy all David Hasselhoff's babies
5
4%
..want to click a poll
20
15%
 
Total votes : 132

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Bombadil
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

#babyforsale

Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:56 pm

So apparently people were buying and selling babies on Instagram in Indonesia..

Mangera said police had foiled a planned transaction in the city of Surabaya on 3 October during which the 22-year-old mother was planning to sell her baby for 15 million rupiah (£743).


That doesn't sound like a lot for a whole baby.. and what are the buyers using it for?

Still active as of Thursday, the Instagram account presents itself as promoting “family welfare” and providing solutions to family problems.


Well.. technically, there was a problem.. and a solution.. want a baby, buy a baby..

Featuring scores of photos of women in masks alongside other anonymous photographs, the account positioned itself as a platform for counselling or “consultation”, especially for young, unmarried and pregnant women – a social taboo in largely Muslim Indonesia.

The account also includes stories of women choosing to put their unborn babies up for adoption financial reasons.

With more than 700 followers, the account appears to have been active for just over one year.

The most recent post, dated 15 September, features a grainy black and white photo of a baby named “C86”.

The post lists the infant as a male, one-month-old, Muslim from central Java. Interested Instagram users are advised to contact the administrators via WhatsApp number.

Mangera told the Guardian he believed at least three babies had been sold via the page.


So.. is there any argument that parents should have the right to sell their baby over social media? It's their baby so they can do what they want until a certain age no?

Or is selling babies on social media a bad idea?

eBaby?
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Pasong Tirad
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Postby Pasong Tirad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:58 pm

Bombadil wrote:So.. is there any argument that parents should have the right to sell their baby over social media? It's their baby so they can do what they want until a certain age no?

Or is selling babies on social media a bad idea?

eBaby?

I hate this pun. I just hate it so much.

And no, people aren't property and therefore shouldn't be sold. At any age.
"If there is no friendship with [the poor] and no sharing of the life of the poor, then there is no authentic commitment to liberation, because love exists only among equals." - Gustavo Gutierrez



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Bombadil
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:59 pm

Pasong Tirad wrote:
Bombadil wrote:So.. is there any argument that parents should have the right to sell their baby over social media? It's their baby so they can do what they want until a certain age no?

Or is selling babies on social media a bad idea?

eBaby?

I hate this pun. I just hate it so much.

And no, people aren't property and therefore shouldn't be sold. At any age.


What about the China version.. Alibaby..
Eldest, that's what I am...Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn...he knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless — before the Dark Lord came from Outside..

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Uxupox
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Uxupox » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:00 pm

Bombadil wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:I hate this pun. I just hate it so much.

And no, people aren't property and therefore shouldn't be sold. At any age.


What about the China version.. Alibaby..


need a minimum of 100 babies orders to initiate purchase.
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Bombadil
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:01 pm

Uxupox wrote:
Bombadil wrote:
What about the China version.. Alibaby..


need a minimum of 100 babies orders to initiate purchase.


Ri-ight... they have a B2C version called Taobao and baobao is a perfectly good moniker for a baby in Chinese so.. Taobaobao..
Last edited by Bombadil on Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Uxupox
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Uxupox » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:03 pm

Bombadil wrote:
Uxupox wrote:
need a minimum of 100 babies orders to initiate purchase.


Ri-ight... they have a B2C version called Taobao and baobao is a perfectly good moniker for a baby in Chinese so.. Taobaobao..


no coincidence.
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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:04 pm

I find the idea of selling living people abhorrent, and I wish we could abolish it.

Heck, even in my country, what is allowable for “Birth Mother Expenses” in a lot of states is a barely disguised sham for paying the mother off.
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Dahon
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Postby Dahon » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:04 pm

While I know nothing of Indonesian societal dynamics with regards to having kids out of wedlock, I'm gonna assume there's stigma enough against single mothers, enough to force them to discreetly sell their kids as soon as they give birth, if at all possible. It's not like there ain't a market for babies anyway -- childless couples, pedophiles, really unethical hospitals who need fresh neonatal organs...

... yeah, it's depressing.

EDIT: Read rest of post, seems like I was right. O God who won't make me drunk...
Last edited by Dahon on Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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NERVUN
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Postby NERVUN » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:06 pm

I'm gonna go with no.

This is an easy one.
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Kowani
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Postby Kowani » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:11 pm

Y’kown, this thread makes me sad. Why do we live in a world where shit like this happens? (First person to blame capitalism gets a poisonous cookie.) Quick, easy answer: Ohh hell no!
Long answer. Abso-fuckin’-lutly not.
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Pasong Tirad
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Postby Pasong Tirad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:11 pm

Bombadil wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:I hate this pun. I just hate it so much.

And no, people aren't property and therefore shouldn't be sold. At any age.


What about the China version.. Alibaby..

I... I just...

I need a moment. You did this, Bom. You did this to me.
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Valrifell
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Postby Valrifell » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:12 pm

Kowani wrote:Y’kown, this thread makes me sad. Why do we live in a world where shit like this happens? (First person to blame capitalism gets a poisonous cookie.) Quick, easy answer: Ohh hell no!
Long answer. Abso-fuckin’-lutly not.


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Kannap
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Postby Kannap » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:13 pm

I thought most of the world came to agree that selling human beings was wrong years ago
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Bombadil
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Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:13 pm

Dahon wrote:While I know nothing of Indonesian societal dynamics with regards to having kids out of wedlock, I'm gonna assume there's stigma enough against single mothers, enough to force them to discreetly sell their kids as soon as they give birth, if at all possible. It's not like there ain't a market for babies anyway -- childless couples, pedophiles, really unethical hospitals who need fresh neonatal organs...

... yeah, it's depressing.

EDIT: Read rest of post, seems like I was right. O God who won't make me drunk...


Basically it's pretty bad, and a rate of some 10-15% deaths with illegal abortions.. it's legally banned and culturally banned by religion, where the legal system and religious edicts kind of sit side by side though the first is technically primary but the second can be culturally primary.

..and yeah, I can fully understand the selling, it's the buying I'm mostly perturbed about.
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Dahon
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Postby Dahon » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:14 pm

Bombadil wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:I hate this pun. I just hate it so much.

And no, people aren't property and therefore shouldn't be sold. At any age.


What about the China version.. Alibaby..


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Valentine Z
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Postby Valentine Z » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:14 pm

I can understand adoption, but breeding babies for selling them... is just wrong, man.
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Uxupox
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Postby Uxupox » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:15 pm

Kannap wrote:I thought most of the world came to agree that selling human beings was wrong years ago


not in its entirety.

Image
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NERVUN
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Postby NERVUN » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:16 pm

Bombadil wrote:
Dahon wrote:While I know nothing of Indonesian societal dynamics with regards to having kids out of wedlock, I'm gonna assume there's stigma enough against single mothers, enough to force them to discreetly sell their kids as soon as they give birth, if at all possible. It's not like there ain't a market for babies anyway -- childless couples, pedophiles, really unethical hospitals who need fresh neonatal organs...

... yeah, it's depressing.

EDIT: Read rest of post, seems like I was right. O God who won't make me drunk...


Basically it's pretty bad, and a rate of some 10-15% deaths with illegal abortions.. it's legally banned and culturally banned by religion, where the legal system and religious edicts kind of sit side by side though the first is technically primary but the second can be culturally primary.

..and yeah, I can fully understand the selling, it's the buying I'm mostly perturbed about.

Unfortunately, I get the buying. Childless couples. Couples without males (Especially in Asian cultures), etc.

Then it gets dark.
To those who feel, life is a tragedy. To those who think, it's a comedy.
"Men, today you'll be issued small trees. Do what you can for the emperor's glory." -Daistallia 2104 on bonsai charges in WWII
Science may provide the means while religion provides the motivation but humanity and humanity alone provides the vehicle -DaWoad

One-Stop Rules Shop, read it, love it, live by it. Getting Help Mod email: nervun@nationstates.net NSG Glossary
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Bombadil
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:18 pm

Valentine Z wrote:I can understand adoption, but breeding babies for selling them... is just wrong, man.


I don't think it's like chickens, it's babies out of wedlock the mother needs to hide.. the risk or even knowledge of an abortion is not an option so next best thing is to sell it, pretend the whole thing never happened.

I remember something about Nepal, which has loose adoption laws but there's some system whereby an excuse is provided for the mother to go to, say, Kathmandu, and have the baby and put up for adoption - in that they tell their family/village they have a 6 month job in Kathmandu then they go, food and board is taken from the adoption price, they have the baby and return home with no one technically the wiser.
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Right wing humour squad
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Postby Right wing humour squad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:19 pm

People are not property and should not be sold. I’m ok with surrogacy though. I would be double ok if we found a way other than women to grow our children.
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Pasong Tirad
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Pasong Tirad » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:20 pm

NERVUN wrote:
Bombadil wrote:
Basically it's pretty bad, and a rate of some 10-15% deaths with illegal abortions.. it's legally banned and culturally banned by religion, where the legal system and religious edicts kind of sit side by side though the first is technically primary but the second can be culturally primary.

..and yeah, I can fully understand the selling, it's the buying I'm mostly perturbed about.

Unfortunately, I get the buying. Childless couples. Couples without males (Especially in Asian cultures), etc.

Then it gets dark.

Childless couples maybe. Couples without males? Not entirely sure it's as likely. I personally think it's more likely people buy the babies to, well, turn into slaves. Sex slavery or slave labor of some kind.
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Kannap
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Postby Kannap » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:21 pm

Uxupox wrote:
Kannap wrote:I thought most of the world came to agree that selling human beings was wrong years ago


not in its entirety.

Image


I figured certain parts of the world still engaged in slavery, just didn't know it was this big still.
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FelrikTheDeleted
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Postby FelrikTheDeleted » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:21 pm

This is pretty disgusting.

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Bombadil
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Postby Bombadil » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:24 pm

FelrikTheDeleted wrote:This is pretty disgusting.


Where does the disgust sit?

The mother.. who faces severe consequences for being a mother with child out of wedlock
The buyer.. god knows for what reason..
The middle man.. taken advantage of desperation
The society.. for creating this issue in the first place
Last edited by Bombadil on Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kowani
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Kowani » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:25 pm

Kannap wrote:
Uxupox wrote:
not in its entirety.

Image


I figured certain parts of the world still engaged in slavery, just didn't know it was this big still.

Holy fucksticks...
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