NATION

PASSWORD

Democratic Socialism in the U.S and How to Pay for It?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Democratic Socialism in the U.S and How to Pay for It?

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:52 pm

With the blue-tide that is currently sweeping through America and the ever-growing popularity of democratic socialists and their ideals such as Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, I notice that while they go in-depth about their programs and how it will benefit America, they don't go in-depth about how to implement and sustain them.

This article/op-ed by Vox I think sums up a major issue that most moderates are concerned about;
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/8 ... cits-taxes

The major points are for those who can't be bothered to read it is that a single-payer healthcare system, social security expansion, free colleges, paid-family leave, guaranteed $15 an hour job with benefits, $1 trillion infrastructure program and repaying of student loan debts, all major issues and programs for Democratic Socialists, would cost $42.5 trillion over the next decade and put down a $12.4 trillion deficit immediately and current plans such as raising taxes and lowering the defense budget would not cover the debt unless Americans and corporations are willing to shell out 100% of their income and/or a 87% VAT.

So what are your ideas for paying for all of this? I especially want to know from a democratic socialists POV since most of the time when finances are bought up in debate about socialism it occurs in right-leaning threads and it turns into a screaming match that the mods eventually have to get involved in.

Edit 1: Due to the demands of some people, I am putting this here that these people call themselves "Democratic Socialist" and the article aforementioned also describes them by that. If you have an issue with them being called that, tough luck. This ain't a thread about what to call these people.
Last edited by Militant Costco on Wed Aug 08, 2018 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
New haven america
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28016
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby New haven america » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:56 pm

We could just take out a little bit of the Military's $600+ billion budget and put it into social systems and programs.

Even if we take $100 billion from them, we'd still be the highest spender bar none.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Hammer Britannia
Senator
 
Posts: 3627
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Hammer Britannia » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:58 pm

It ain't socialism though

That's just a bigger tax burdon
Am I still alive?
Buy my Chemical Weapons pls.
People ask "could", but nobody asks "should"
Offical blow me Hammer Britannia discord sever. Mostly because I wanted a discord server in my sig.
Unironic Greek Pagan, thanks WRA

User avatar
Die PreuBen Kaiserreich
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 123
Founded: Jan 27, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Die PreuBen Kaiserreich » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:00 pm

New haven america wrote:We could just take out a little bit of the Military's $600+ billion budget and put it into social systems and programs.

Even if we take $100 billion from them, we'd still be the highest spender bar none.

I agree. We spend way too much on the military and we're not the strongest in the world. We might have the largest navy and be the sole superpower and have bases everywhere and basically be an empire but we're not the strongest country in the world. I think that is a viable option to pay for this. It doesn't cover the entire cost, but it's a strong start.
Last edited by Die PreuBen Kaiserreich on Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
    Preußen✙Nachrichten:
  • ✙ Königliches Familien-Update ✙ : ✙ Kaiser Hans III returns from the PRC, touches down in Koenigsberg ✙
  • Fußball-Ergebnisse: BBNM moves on to international stadium
  • Weltnachrichten: n/a
✙ CURRENTLY: June, 1959✙
The capital B was made as a replacement to the German letter ß, and is pronounced like "ss".
#PewdiepieDoArtilleryOnly
✙ Current Kaiser: Kaiser Hans Wolfe III, 49 ✙
RP POPULATION: 204 Million
A 16.8 civilization, according to this index.
National Anthem

User avatar
Telconi
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19238
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:03 pm

Hammer Britannia wrote:It ain't socialism though

That's just a bigger tax burdon


This is 2018, words don't have meanings.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:05 pm

New haven america wrote:We could just take out a little bit of the Military's $600+ billion budget and put it into social systems and programs.

Even if we take $100 billion from them, we'd still be the highest spender bar none.

The budget proposal most Dem Soc's propose is a 2% military expenditure, the minimum requirement as requested by NATO, which would only cover $1.9 trillion of the $12.4 trillion the U.S will need and $42.5 trillion down the road. So its not enough. Not to mention any more than that and we're effectively cutting our military in half, which will require lots of planning and care if we don't want another Truman-era military catastrophe.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Arlenton
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8145
Founded: Dec 16, 2012
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Arlenton » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:06 pm

You don't pay for it, because it doesn't happen. Worse case scenario is Democratic waves in 2018 and 2020 followed by some watered down program, like the ACA, that overall sucks followed by a GOP wave in 2022 then gridlock.

User avatar
New haven america
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28016
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby New haven america » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:08 pm

Militant Costco wrote:
New haven america wrote:We could just take out a little bit of the Military's $600+ billion budget and put it into social systems and programs.

Even if we take $100 billion from them, we'd still be the highest spender bar none.

The budget proposal most Dem Soc's propose is a 2% military expenditure, the minimum requirement as requested by NATO, which would only cover $1.9 trillion of the $12.4 trillion the U.S will need and $42.5 trillion down the road. So its not enough. Not to mention any more than that and we're effectively cutting our military in half, which will require lots of planning and care if we don't want another Truman-era military catastrophe.

Yeah, but I'm not going by their proposal, I'm going by my proposal.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:09 pm

New haven america wrote:
Militant Costco wrote:The budget proposal most Dem Soc's propose is a 2% military expenditure, the minimum requirement as requested by NATO, which would only cover $1.9 trillion of the $12.4 trillion the U.S will need and $42.5 trillion down the road. So its not enough. Not to mention any more than that and we're effectively cutting our military in half, which will require lots of planning and care if we don't want another Truman-era military catastrophe.

Yeah, but I'm not going by their proposal, I'm going by my proposal.

You proposal is even less than Dem Socs so I don't see how it solves the issue.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Xadufell
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1181
Founded: Mar 10, 2016
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Xadufell » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:09 pm

Militant Costco wrote:With the blue-tide that is currently sweeping through America and the ever-growing popularity of democratic socialists and their ideals such as Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, I notice that while they go in-depth about their programs and how it will benefit America, they don't go in-depth about how to implement and sustain them.

This article/op-ed by Vox I think sums up a major issue that most moderates are concerned about;
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/8 ... cits-taxes

The major points are for those who can't be bothered to read it is that a single-payer healthcare system, social security expansion, free colleges, paid-family leave, guaranteed $15 an hour job with benefits, $1 trillion infrastructure program and repaying of student loan debts, all major issues and programs for Democratic Socialists, would cost $42.5 trillion over the next decade and put down a $12.4 trillion deficit immediately and current plans such as raising taxes and lowering the defense budget would not cover the debt unless Americans and corporations are willing to shell out 100% of their income and/or a 87% VAT.

So what are your ideas for paying for all of this? I especially want to know from a democratic socialists POV since most of the time when finances are bought up in debate about socialism it occurs in right-leaning threads and it turns into a screaming match that the mods eventually have to get involved in.


Blue tide, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

With Americans being Americans, you're not likely to see anything with any relation to Socialism being standard. You're also not going to have it paid for. With the current American debt, only extreme measures can be taken to pay for any of the aforementioned policies and most Americans are not going to like it.
28 Year old autistic twat.
!!!WE MADE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!!!
Pro: Right Wing, Israel, The Donald, Guns, Free Speech, Capitalism, Switzerland, Germany, Britain leaving the EU, TEMPORARY ban on Muslims until everything gets sorted out, Republicans, Russia.
Anti: Hillary, Sanders, Democrats, Radical Islam, ISIS, Illegal Immigration, BLM (Because they obviously do.), Obama, MSNBC, Left Wing, Radical Anything (Virtually), Turkey, Trump Protesters who have no valid points.

Grinning Dragon wrote:Why would anyone waste a good bullet on the likes of CNN anyway? I don't understand why anyone would get that worked up over a bunch of dipshits, christ if their shit show is getting you that worked up, just turn the damn thing off and go for a walk/run/ride.

User avatar
Strength and Order
Diplomat
 
Posts: 526
Founded: May 13, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Strength and Order » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:12 pm

How about we don't do that because America is already going to shit and there's no need to make it worse?
Are YOU an enemy of HYDRA?
Pro & Anti
This is an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE HYDRA; It was not the Nazi science division nor does it worship Hive, who does not exist in this universe. Please read the factbooks before making ignorant comments chocking it down to "Nazi Cultists".


8 1 9 12 8 25 4 18 1

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:13 pm

Xadufell wrote:
Militant Costco wrote:With the blue-tide that is currently sweeping through America and the ever-growing popularity of democratic socialists and their ideals such as Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, I notice that while they go in-depth about their programs and how it will benefit America, they don't go in-depth about how to implement and sustain them.

This article/op-ed by Vox I think sums up a major issue that most moderates are concerned about;
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/8 ... cits-taxes

The major points are for those who can't be bothered to read it is that a single-payer healthcare system, social security expansion, free colleges, paid-family leave, guaranteed $15 an hour job with benefits, $1 trillion infrastructure program and repaying of student loan debts, all major issues and programs for Democratic Socialists, would cost $42.5 trillion over the next decade and put down a $12.4 trillion deficit immediately and current plans such as raising taxes and lowering the defense budget would not cover the debt unless Americans and corporations are willing to shell out 100% of their income and/or a 87% VAT.

So what are your ideas for paying for all of this? I especially want to know from a democratic socialists POV since most of the time when finances are bought up in debate about socialism it occurs in right-leaning threads and it turns into a screaming match that the mods eventually have to get involved in.


Blue tide, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

With Americans being Americans, you're not likely to see anything with any relation to Socialism being standard. You're also not going to have it paid for. With the current American debt, only extreme measures can be taken to pay for any of the aforementioned policies and most Americans are not going to like it.

Like it or not, most states are predicted to shift towards the left, including the ones that were key to Trump's victory, while the Dems are unlikely to lose any major states, if any.

If you are a Dem Soc, it helps discussing about this since it only strengthens your position if it has a solution.

If you aren't a Dem Soc, it still helps discussing about it since most of these programs might get adopted by moderate Dems.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Valrifell
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15484
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:14 pm

Telconi wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:It ain't socialism though

That's just a bigger tax burdon


This is 2018, words don't have meanings.


Dem Socialism (or Social Democracy I dont recall) has never been anything but upfront about not actually wanting to seize the means of production.

Except the DSA.
Where have you gone, Joe DiMaggio
Our nation turns its lonely eyes to you

Proud self-made Lord Irrelevancy and sole inhabiter of Aurora Invictus

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:15 pm

Arlenton wrote:You don't pay for it, because it doesn't happen. Worse case scenario is Democratic waves in 2018 and 2020 followed by some watered down program, like the ACA, that overall sucks followed by a GOP wave in 2022 then gridlock.

Unbelievably, these are actually the watered-down versions and the estimates come from nonpartisan or left-leaning sources. So it could be even worse.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Valrifell
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15484
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:16 pm

Hey let's raise taxes.

Okay sorry I'll leave.
Where have you gone, Joe DiMaggio
Our nation turns its lonely eyes to you

Proud self-made Lord Irrelevancy and sole inhabiter of Aurora Invictus

User avatar
New haven america
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28016
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby New haven america » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:18 pm

Xadufell wrote:
Militant Costco wrote:With the blue-tide that is currently sweeping through America and the ever-growing popularity of democratic socialists and their ideals such as Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, I notice that while they go in-depth about their programs and how it will benefit America, they don't go in-depth about how to implement and sustain them.

This article/op-ed by Vox I think sums up a major issue that most moderates are concerned about;
https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/8 ... cits-taxes

The major points are for those who can't be bothered to read it is that a single-payer healthcare system, social security expansion, free colleges, paid-family leave, guaranteed $15 an hour job with benefits, $1 trillion infrastructure program and repaying of student loan debts, all major issues and programs for Democratic Socialists, would cost $42.5 trillion over the next decade and put down a $12.4 trillion deficit immediately and current plans such as raising taxes and lowering the defense budget would not cover the debt unless Americans and corporations are willing to shell out 100% of their income and/or a 87% VAT.

So what are your ideas for paying for all of this? I especially want to know from a democratic socialists POV since most of the time when finances are bought up in debate about socialism it occurs in right-leaning threads and it turns into a screaming match that the mods eventually have to get involved in.


Blue tide, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

With Americans being Americans, you're not likely to see anything with any relation to Socialism being standard. You're also not going to have it paid for. With the current American debt, only extreme measures can be taken to pay for any of the aforementioned policies and most Americans are not going to like it.

Someone doesn't know how national debt works...
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:18 pm

Valrifell wrote:Hey let's raise taxes.

Okay sorry I'll leave.

Here are the proposals the nonpartisain Congressional Budget Office offered;

1. Raising the final $34 trillion would require seizing roughly 100 percent of all corporate profits as well as 100 percent of all family wage income and pass-through business income above the thresholds of $90,000 (single) or $150,000 (married), and absurdly assuming they all continue working. (This calculation refers to individual income, not investment income.)

2. How about a European-style value-added tax (VAT), which is basically a national sales tax? A rate of 87 percent would be needed to collect $34 trillion under the American tax base.

3. What about payroll taxes? Lawmakers would need to create a new 37 percent payroll tax, on top of the existing 15.3 percent payroll tax, in order to collect $34 trillion.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Rhein-Hesse
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Aug 08, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Rhein-Hesse » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:19 pm

I think that on one hand, yes this is a pressing issue for many Dem Socs. However, I'd argue relatively few are asking for every single thing you mentioned in the OP. For some healthcare, is the issue, for others, it's college tuition and for some, it's a multitude. But for obvious reasons very few people are asking for all 42.5 trillion $ worth of reform.
Pro EU

User avatar
Impaled Nazarene
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6274
Founded: Aug 09, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Impaled Nazarene » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:20 pm

They ain't democratic socialism that's liberal social democracy. Wake me up when Sanders is campaigning for the collectivization of the economy and has Bezos imprisoned for life.
Non-binary Aromantic Asexual Asperger's Syndrome
Kiaculta wrote:Oh, Kar, you silly sack of shit.
Soviet Haaregrad wrote:Bickering ist krieg.
Infected Mushroom wrote:isn't this a bit extreme?
Finland SSR wrote:"Many dictatorships are oligarchies.
Many democracies are oligarchies.
Therefore, many dictatorships are democracies."

-said no one ever. I made these words up.
Genivaria wrote:"WHY!? Why do this!? Thousands of planets and trillions of innocent lives gone! For what!?"
"It seemed like fun at the time."

User avatar
Strength and Order
Diplomat
 
Posts: 526
Founded: May 13, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Strength and Order » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:20 pm

It seems a lot of people are confusing Social Democracy for Democratic Socialism in this thread.
Are YOU an enemy of HYDRA?
Pro & Anti
This is an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE HYDRA; It was not the Nazi science division nor does it worship Hive, who does not exist in this universe. Please read the factbooks before making ignorant comments chocking it down to "Nazi Cultists".


8 1 9 12 8 25 4 18 1

User avatar
Rhein-Hesse
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Aug 08, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Rhein-Hesse » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:22 pm

Strength and Order wrote:It seems a lot of people are confusing Social Democracy for Democratic Socialism in this thread.

Correct me if I'm wrong but democratic socialism is equivalent to 'the Nordic model', so an emphasis on welfare, universal health care, maintaining a mixed economy and private enterprise. Whilst social democracy is just socialism with democratic processes?
Last edited by Rhein-Hesse on Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Pro EU

User avatar
Strength and Order
Diplomat
 
Posts: 526
Founded: May 13, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Strength and Order » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:23 pm

Rhein-Hesse wrote:
Strength and Order wrote:It seems a lot of people are confusing Social Democracy for Democratic Socialism in this thread.

Correct me if I'm wrong but democratic socialism is equivalent to 'the Nordic model', so an emphasis on welfare, universal health care, maintaining a mixed economy and private enterprise. Whilst social democracy is just socialism with democratic processes?


No, you got that backwards. Which actually proves my point.
Last edited by Strength and Order on Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Are YOU an enemy of HYDRA?
Pro & Anti
This is an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE HYDRA; It was not the Nazi science division nor does it worship Hive, who does not exist in this universe. Please read the factbooks before making ignorant comments chocking it down to "Nazi Cultists".


8 1 9 12 8 25 4 18 1

User avatar
Militant Costco
Diplomat
 
Posts: 816
Founded: Feb 06, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Militant Costco » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:23 pm

Rhein-Hesse wrote:I think that on one hand, yes this is a pressing issue for many Dem Socs. However, I'd argue relatively few are asking for every single thing you mentioned in the OP. For some healthcare, is the issue, for others, it's college tuition and for some, it's a multitude. But for obvious reasons very few people are asking for all 42.5 trillion $ worth of reform.

These are actually the biggest issues the Dem Socs want to fix or implement however, including their candidates.

Also single-payer healthcare, which is probably the most common and popular of the Dem Socs plan, alone costs $32 trillion. To be honest, a Dem Soc without single-payer healthcare is kinda just a normal Dem.
Costco Wholesale
NSG Puppet

Nothing says democracy like 2 packs of 48 rolls of toilet paper!

User avatar
Rhein-Hesse
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Aug 08, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Rhein-Hesse » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:24 pm

Strength and Order wrote:
Rhein-Hesse wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong but democratic socialism is equivalent to 'the Nordic model', so an emphasis on welfare, universal health care, maintaining a mixed economy and private enterprise. Whilst social democracy is just socialism with democratic processes?


No, you got that backwards.

Makes a lot of sense. Thanks.

Wow, this entire thread is basically wrong now because of this one mistake.
Last edited by Rhein-Hesse on Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Pro EU

User avatar
Impaled Nazarene
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6274
Founded: Aug 09, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Impaled Nazarene » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:25 pm

Rhein-Hesse wrote:
Strength and Order wrote:It seems a lot of people are confusing Social Democracy for Democratic Socialism in this thread.

Correct me if I'm wrong but democratic socialism is equivalent to 'the Nordic model', so an emphasis on welfare, universal health care, maintaining a mixed economy and private enterprise. Whilst social democracy is just socialism with democratic processes?

Wrong. That's Liberal Social Democracy. Democratic Socialism is actually socialism with a more democratic version of liberal democracy or in some systems the democracy is rebuilt entirely. But considering Democratic Socialism really isn't a form of government with much behind it, it ends up being just a broad term for people who aren't Marxist-Leninists and aren't Anarchists but still solidly left.
Non-binary Aromantic Asexual Asperger's Syndrome
Kiaculta wrote:Oh, Kar, you silly sack of shit.
Soviet Haaregrad wrote:Bickering ist krieg.
Infected Mushroom wrote:isn't this a bit extreme?
Finland SSR wrote:"Many dictatorships are oligarchies.
Many democracies are oligarchies.
Therefore, many dictatorships are democracies."

-said no one ever. I made these words up.
Genivaria wrote:"WHY!? Why do this!? Thousands of planets and trillions of innocent lives gone! For what!?"
"It seemed like fun at the time."

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Chestaan, Diopolis, Escondia, Freezic Vast, Greater Pretoria, Idzequitch, Kovira, Majestic-12 [Bot], Platypus Bureaucracy, Prolific Sherpaposting, The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp, The Snazzylands, The United Parliament, United Provinces of Atlantica, Vassenor, Western Vale Confederacy, Wunderstrafanstalt

Advertisement

Remove ads