NATION

PASSWORD

Porn-bashing responses to Stormy Daniels?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
Senator
 
Posts: 4364
Founded: Apr 05, 2017
Ex-Nation

Porn-bashing responses to Stormy Daniels?

Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:23 am

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44418519

It's time to talk about pornography - and specifically whether women who work as porn stars can be also be dignified. I raise this issue only because the president of the United States has just said he doesn't believe they can.

He was agreeing with the assertion of his personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, the former New York mayor and now resident White House flame thrower. In a speech in Tel Aviv this week, Giuliani said Stormy Daniels, the woman who claims she had an affair with Mr Trump in 2006, lacks credibility, simply because of her profession.

"If you're going to sell your body for money, you just don't have a reputation. I may be old fashioned, I dunno," said the thrice-married lawyer. Asked about those comments on his way to the G7 summit today, Trump says he didn't disagree with his lawyer.

Giuliani didn't address the obvious question of whether selling your body for money could potentially include fashion models, of which Melania Trump was one. The comment caused outrage among many female commentators, to whom Giuliani responded on CNN: "If you're a (feminist) and you support the porn industry, you should turn in your credentials."

The big question at heart of Stormy Daniels saga
The president and the porn star: Why this matters
Yet again the porn industry is the subject of thorny ethical issues and double standards.

First off, why can't a woman who works in the porn industry also be credible? Just because you act in sex films doesn't mean you are a liar - as Daniels herself said on US TV a few weeks ago. You can perform sex on camera and still know right from wrong.

Second, what about all the men who watch women in porn films? Are they too lacking in moral fibre? If that's the case, then America is a hot bed of reputation-less, non-credible individuals. After all, there is an awful lot of porn made and consumed in this country - who knows, possibly even by high-powered lawyers.

The US porn industry is a multi-billion-dollar industry, with some 600 porn movies made in Hollywood every year

It would be rather hypocritical to suggest people who watch porn are upstanding members of society, but people who star in it are disreputable.

Personally, I'm interpreting it less as "people who watch porn are upstanding members of society" and more as "you can prove she stars in porn, but you can't prove I watch it."

I thought this battle was won the minute live-action pornography was covered under freedom of speech. But no. Apparently prostitution isn't just "selling your body," but so is porn. So selling services you provide, or goods you manufacture, with some of your body parts, isn't selling your body, but selling video of other things you do with other body parts is. Seems a tad arbitrary a distinction.

And what of marrying for money; which many conservatives advocate as the solution to poverty? How is that not ALSO "selling your body?"
Last edited by LimaUniformNovemberAlpha on Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:1. The PRC is not a Communist State, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
2. The CCP is not a Communist Party, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
3. Xi Jinping and his cronies are not Communists, as they have shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.

How do we know this? Because the first step toward Communism is Socialism, and none of the aforementioned are even remotely Socialist in any way, shape, or form.

User avatar
Petrasylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:26 am

It's a cheap attempt to Poison The Well that just happens to cater to the views of quite a few men in the process.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

User avatar
Aclion
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6249
Founded: Apr 12, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Aclion » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:30 am

I think people who sell their bodies are much more respectable than people who sell their integrity.

#someharlot 2020
A popular Government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a Prologue to a Farce or a Tragedy; or, perhaps both. - James Madison.

User avatar
Cekoviu
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16954
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Cekoviu » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:31 am

Aclion wrote:I think people who sell their bodies are much more respectable than people who sell their integrity.

#someharlot 2020

Ooh, that's a good one.
pro: women's rights
anti: men's rights

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:32 am

Well it's certainly surprising to see a woman standing up for other women who work in the porn industry, but this is largely out of convenience rather than standing up for someone whose career is based on the ability to fake things.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Ostroeuropa
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58536
Founded: Jun 14, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:32 am

Sex negativity alongside vilification of male sexuality and so on, has consequences for sex workers too.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

User avatar
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
Senator
 
Posts: 4364
Founded: Apr 05, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:32 am

Costa Fierro wrote:Well it's certainly surprising to see a woman standing up for other women who work in the porn industry, but this is largely out of convenience rather than standing up for someone whose career is based on the ability to fake things.

What career isn't based on the ability to fake things?
Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:1. The PRC is not a Communist State, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
2. The CCP is not a Communist Party, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
3. Xi Jinping and his cronies are not Communists, as they have shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.

How do we know this? Because the first step toward Communism is Socialism, and none of the aforementioned are even remotely Socialist in any way, shape, or form.

User avatar
Aclion
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6249
Founded: Apr 12, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Aclion » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:34 am

LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:Well it's certainly surprising to see a woman standing up for other women who work in the porn industry, but this is largely out of convenience rather than standing up for someone whose career is based on the ability to fake things.

What career isn't based on the ability to fake things?

o/
A popular Government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a Prologue to a Farce or a Tragedy; or, perhaps both. - James Madison.

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:34 am

Petrasylvania wrote:It's a cheap attempt to Poison The Well that just happens to cater to the views of quite a few men in the process.


Yep. No one with any connection to trump can discuss feminism or sexism with any credibility.

Trump is completely untrustworthy because he's a compulsive liar and Giuliani is a tool. She's a former porn star which says nothing about her credibility.
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:35 am

LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:Well it's certainly surprising to see a woman standing up for other women who work in the porn industry, but this is largely out of convenience rather than standing up for someone whose career is based on the ability to fake things.

What career isn't based on the ability to fake things?


The ones that require a demonstration of skills and aptitude that rely on prior experiences and knowledge of how to operate things like complex machinery.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
Senator
 
Posts: 4364
Founded: Apr 05, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:39 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:What career isn't based on the ability to fake things?


The ones that require a demonstration of skills and aptitude that rely on prior experiences and knowledge of how to operate things like complex machinery.

So, the operator on the subway?

What if he has to fake respect for the guy who, when told this train is going out of service, didn't get the message first time?
Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:1. The PRC is not a Communist State, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
2. The CCP is not a Communist Party, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
3. Xi Jinping and his cronies are not Communists, as they have shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.

How do we know this? Because the first step toward Communism is Socialism, and none of the aforementioned are even remotely Socialist in any way, shape, or form.

User avatar
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
Senator
 
Posts: 4364
Founded: Apr 05, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:39 am

Aclion wrote:
LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:What career isn't based on the ability to fake things?

o/

...?
Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:1. The PRC is not a Communist State, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
2. The CCP is not a Communist Party, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
3. Xi Jinping and his cronies are not Communists, as they have shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.

How do we know this? Because the first step toward Communism is Socialism, and none of the aforementioned are even remotely Socialist in any way, shape, or form.

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 163933
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Ifreann » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:40 am

Costa Fierro wrote:Well it's certainly surprising to see a woman standing up for other women who work in the porn industry,

No it isn't.
but this is largely out of convenience rather than standing up for someone whose career is based on the ability to fake things.

What's your problem with actors?
He/Him

beating the devil
we never run from the devil
we never summon the devil
we never hide from from the devil
we never

User avatar
The South Falls
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13353
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The South Falls » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:42 am

She had sex. Billions of people have had sex. The only difference was hers was filmed. That doesn't diminish her credibility. What about porn makes one a liar? If we're being all "Christ n credibility", then Giuliani is a liar for being married three times.
This is an MT nation that reflects some of my beliefs, trade deals and debate always welcome! Call me TeaSF. A level 8, according to This Index.


Political Compass Results:

Economic: -5.5
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.51
I make dumb jokes. I'm really serious about that.

User avatar
Petrasylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:43 am

Tobleste wrote:
Petrasylvania wrote:It's a cheap attempt to Poison The Well that just happens to cater to the views of quite a few men in the process.


Yep. No one with any connection to trump can discuss feminism or sexism with any credibility.

Trump is completely untrustworthy because he's a compulsive liar and Giuliani is a tool. She's a former porn star which says nothing about her credibility.

It's comical how society is expected to hold serial adulterers- one of whom cheated on a cousin- on a higher moral platform than a porn actor.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

User avatar
Aclion
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6249
Founded: Apr 12, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Aclion » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:51 am

LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:
Aclion wrote:o/

...?

I'm saying my career is one of those.
A popular Government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a Prologue to a Farce or a Tragedy; or, perhaps both. - James Madison.

User avatar
The South Falls
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13353
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The South Falls » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:52 am

Petrasylvania wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
Yep. No one with any connection to trump can discuss feminism or sexism with any credibility.

Trump is completely untrustworthy because he's a compulsive liar and Giuliani is a tool. She's a former porn star which says nothing about her credibility.

It's comical how society is expected to hold serial adulterers- one of whom cheated on a cousin- on a higher moral platform than a porn actor.

It's only because Trump is rich, and Daniels is not.
This is an MT nation that reflects some of my beliefs, trade deals and debate always welcome! Call me TeaSF. A level 8, according to This Index.


Political Compass Results:

Economic: -5.5
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.51
I make dumb jokes. I'm really serious about that.

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:53 am

Ifreann wrote:No it isn't.


Yes it is.

What's your problem with actors?


I don't have a problem with actors, unless they're rich Hollywood actors and actresses acting pretentiously. Or people like Story Daniels who decries being threatened for public sympathy, even though she's been previously arrested on charges of domestic violence.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Petrasylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:55 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Ifreann wrote:No it isn't.


Yes it is.

What's your problem with actors?


I don't have a problem with actors, unless they're rich Hollywood actors and actresses acting pretentiously. Or people like Story Daniels who decries being threatened for public sympathy, even though she's been previously arrested on charges of domestic violence.

So her testimony should be dismissed entirely then?
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:57 am

The South Falls wrote:
Petrasylvania wrote:It's comical how society is expected to hold serial adulterers- one of whom cheated on a cousin- on a higher moral platform than a porn actor.

It's only because Trump is rich, and Daniels is not.


Daniels is with $2 million dollars, she's not someone who is hard done by.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
The South Falls
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13353
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby The South Falls » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:57 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Ifreann wrote:No it isn't.


Yes it is.

What's your problem with actors?


I don't have a problem with actors, unless they're rich Hollywood actors and actresses acting pretentiously. Or people like Story Daniels who decries being threatened for public sympathy, even though she's been previously arrested on charges of domestic violence.

Steve Bannon was arrested on those same charges. Trump has done worse, anyway, and we still think he's "Honorable."
This is an MT nation that reflects some of my beliefs, trade deals and debate always welcome! Call me TeaSF. A level 8, according to This Index.


Political Compass Results:

Economic: -5.5
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.51
I make dumb jokes. I'm really serious about that.

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:58 am

Petrasylvania wrote:So her testimony should be dismissed entirely then?


Do bears shit in the woods?
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Petrasylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:59 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Petrasylvania wrote:So her testimony should be dismissed entirely then?


Do bears shit in the woods?

Looks like Giuliani has at least one success on NSG.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19902
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:00 am

The South Falls wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:
Yes it is.



I don't have a problem with actors, unless they're rich Hollywood actors and actresses acting pretentiously. Or people like Story Daniels who decries being threatened for public sympathy, even though she's been previously arrested on charges of domestic violence.

Steve Bannon was arrested on those same charges. Trump has done worse, anyway, and we still think he's "Honorable."


Bannon is no longer in a position of any power or influence and I don't think Trump is an "honourable" person. But I don't believe any of the claims made against him.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Strength and Order
Diplomat
 
Posts: 526
Founded: May 13, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Strength and Order » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:01 am

Aclion wrote:I think people who sell their bodies are much more respectable than people who sell their integrity.

#someharlot 2020


Wow, even I have to say that was pretty brutal.

Kudos.
Are YOU an enemy of HYDRA?
Pro & Anti
This is an ALTERNATE UNIVERSE HYDRA; It was not the Nazi science division nor does it worship Hive, who does not exist in this universe. Please read the factbooks before making ignorant comments chocking it down to "Nazi Cultists".


8 1 9 12 8 25 4 18 1

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ancientania, Czechostan, Ifreann, Immoren, Jetan, Port Carverton, Tungstan

Advertisement

Remove ads