[PASSED] Ban on Conversion Therapy

[Grenartia]

<snip>

You obviously haven't read any of the sources that I've posted.

I have. Have you?

[Zone 71]

<snip>

You obviously haven't read any of the sources that I've posted.

The resources you cited? That wikipedia article on "Selection Bias," or the defunct and inconclusive study on gender dysphoric youth that Sciongrad refuted with an article written one year later by the same author?

[Gumbanna]

Gumbanna has been doing conversion therapy for years. We're a Christian nation and it's how we do things.

[Grenartia]

Gumbanna has been doing conversion therapy for years. We're a Christian nation and it's how we do things.

Being "a Christian nation" is no excuse for torturing people.

[Gumbanna]

It's not torture. It's helping people turn away from sin.

[Grenartia]

It's not torture. It's helping people turn away from sin.

1. Its questionable whether or not its even a sin. Many Christian denominations reject the assertion that its a sin.

2. I'm sure if you asked the Catholic Church during the Spanish Inquisition if it was torturing people, it would say the same thing as you, ambassador. Doesn't make it any less of a lie. Which, the last I checked, actually is a sin.

[Prydania]

It's not torture. It's helping people turn away from sin.

"Well Ambassador in less then 24 hours it will become illegal to sanction it in any WA member nation. So take that under consideration."

[Wester Kippielaw]

"Ambassadors, whilst the government and people of Wester Kippielaw support the noble intentions of this resolution we do not believe the text even begins to address the issues surrounding conversion therapy.

Firstly, this resolution does not even try to constitute an outright 'ban' on conversion therapy, as the title would suggest. It merely seeks to prevent the coercion of young LGBT people into undergoing the therapy, ostensibly against their will. This means that in practice, it would still be legal for conversion therapy to be offered in WA nations.

Why is this important?

Because the term 'coercion' is not correctly defined. Extreme views on the nature of sexuality often begin in the home and are reinforced from the pulpit. By saying that homosexuality is immoral, parents and preachers – who are in positions of trust – can plant the seed in the mind of a youngster that their sexuality is wrong in the eyes of whichever god they claim to represent. If this youngster then comes of age and 'volunteers' to undergo conversion therapy, does this planted seed constitute coercion?

Secondly, although the people of Wester Kippilaw have long since outgrown the need for religion, we tolerate the need of some to cling to their primative beliefs. This resolution, as drafted, infringes upon the rights of certain religious groups to practice their beliefs as they see fit. In order to satisfy the convention that human rights outweigh religious belief, this resolution must identify and define which human rights are being breached by conversion therapy.

Wester Kippielaw will grudgingly vote through this resolution, and we do expect it will pass by a good margin. However we wish to note our objections and will continue to enforce our own, more robust laws on the matter.

[Prydania]

Secondly, although the people of Wester Kippilaw have long since outgrown the need for religion, we tolerate the need of some to cling to their primative beliefs. This resolution, as drafted, infringes upon the rights of certain religious groups to practice their beliefs as they see fit. In order to satisfy the convention that human rights outweigh religious belief, this resolution must identify and define which human rights are being breached by conversion therapy.

“The need to respect religious liberties while also respecting personal freedoms is a tough balancing act. It requires tact and compromise and mutual respect. Your attitude here lacks all of these things. You do your position more harm than good by insulting those of faith.”

“Further? If I am frank? I am suspect of any government that insists on the university of its populace to this degree. To be frank? Claiming your nation in its totality has outgrown religion strikes me as being similar to those despots who claim LGBT peoples do not exist within their borders. It usually hints at a dark and sinister agendas the state has against its own citizens who do not conform to the regime’s ideology.”

“Simply put, Ambassador, it would not shock me if Wester Kippielaw was in violation of a number of other WA Resolutions.”

[Grand Empire of Luxembourg]

WTF, I need to cure my Homosexuals

[The Eternal Kawaii]

In the Name of the Eternal Kawaii, may the Cute One be praised

We really do not see the point in this proposal. "Sexual orientation" and "gender identity" are subjective thoughts; the law deals with objective acts. One cannot legislate a person's inner demons, only the way he or she behaves in response to them.

That said, we oppose this proposal because the phrase "attempt to change the sexual orientation or gender identity of an individual through psychological, physical, or coercive spiritual intervention" can be interpreted as a ban on teaching sexual morality. We hold that this proposal is an illegal infringement on the right of religious nations to teach on the subject.

[New Min]

WTF, I need to cure my Homosexuals

"Are you suggesting that homosexuality is a disease, Mr Ambassador?"

[Sierra Lyricalia]

...we oppose this proposal because the phrase "attempt to change the sexual orientation or gender identity of an individual through psychological, physical, or coercive spiritual intervention" can be interpreted as a ban on teaching sexual morality. We hold that this proposal is an illegal infringement on the right of religious nations to teach on the subject.

"Happy as we are to see the Kawaiian representative active in these halls, I have to question your interpretation of the resolution at vote. Nothing herein prevents the teaching of adolescents about safe sex, non-coercion, being a selfless partner, keeping one's promises, some cultures' formal commitment requirements, or how to part ways amicably. Beyond those necessities, there's simply no compelling curriculum of sexual morality - certainly none that can possibly considered cut off by this entirely reasonable bedrock resolution."

"We hope you'll reconsider your opposition, ambassador - though it's agreeable to see you even if not."

[Christian Democrats]

You obviously haven't read any of the sources that I've posted.

The resources you cited? That wikipedia article on "Selection Bias," or the defunct and inconclusive study on gender dysphoric youth that Sciongrad refuted with an article written one year later by the same author?

This post again shows that you haven't been looking at people's sources. As I told Sciongrad, the literature does not support any position on the treatment of gender dysphoria in children. If you look at the so-called refutation article -- the author doesn't actually contradict himself one year later -- the author reiterates, "'Opinions vary widely among experts.'" Then, he writes that there are "three general approaches to child treatments in the professional literature": (1) "[w]orking with the child and caregivers to lessen gender dysphoria and to decrease cross-gender behaviors and identification," (2) "[n]o direct effort to lessen gender dysphoria or gender atypical behaviors," and (3) "[a]ffirmation of the child's cross-gender identification by mental health professionals and family members."

The author also notes, "There is no empirical evidence demonstrating that a prepubescent child who is permitted to transition gender role but then desists can simply and harmlessly transition back to the natal gender," and "efforts to encourage public early childhood cross-gender roles may be experienced as hurtful and possibly even traumatic by children who do not persist into adolescence and adulthood."

[Communaccord]

I can’t bring myself to vote on this one. It feels a bit repetitive since I’m pretty sure child abuse is already covered...but at the same time this does add a layer of protection for adults I am 70% sure was not covered already. The mild strength is also a mixed bag for me, since I don’t know what that actually looks like in practice, or in other words, wether this bill is more talk than action.

Anyway, due to the already overwhelming support for the bill in the WA, I was initially going to cast a protest vote on the basis of my uncertainties, but decided ‘abstain’ was more appropriate since I don’t actively oppose this resolution...but at the same time this bill seems more symbolic, like it’s meant to send a political message more than anything else, rather than solving an issue. On Principle, I believe legislation is meant to and should be for presenting the best possible solutions for the pertinent issues facing a legislative body, and to use the power of legislation (or in our circumstances resolutions), for any other purposes is obscene and degrading to their integrity as an institution of governance.

That is why I ultimately refuse to vote on this resolution, as it serves mainly a politically symbolic purpose.

[United Cities of Australia]

This Motion is Ludicrous we are trying to fix these people and your going to ask us to stop.
For the stake of theses poor people we will not stop. We have a 80% success rate on curing these poor people. The United Cities saids no

[Grenartia]

This Motion is Ludicrous we are trying to fix these people and your going to ask us to stop.
For the stake of theses poor people we will not stop. We have a 80% success rate on curing these poor people. The United Cities saids no

You can't fix something that isn't a problem. And there's no way you have an 80% success rate. The more accurate figure would be 0%.

[East Gondwana]

This Motion is Ludicrous we are trying to fix these people and your going to ask us to stop.
For the stake of theses poor people we will not stop. We have a 80% success rate on curing these poor people. The United Cities saids no

You can't fix something that isn't broken.

I don't understand how you can have an 80% "success" rate for curing something that isn't an illness and therefor cannot be cured.

[Tinhampton]

Ban on Conversion Therapy was passed 14,123 votes to 2,300.

[Kenmoria]

Ban on Conversion Therapy was passed 14,123 votes to 2,300.

That’s a surprisingly high margin, given the large number of people who protested here against the resolution. Now I await the tides of people who wish to non-comply with this on the grounds of Nat-sov.

[New Min]

"Congratulations to the delegation of UM!"

[United Massachusetts]

Ban on Conversion Therapy was passed 14,123 votes to 2,300.

That’s a surprisingly high margin, given the large number of people who protested here against the resolution. Now I await the tides of people who wish to non-comply with this on the grounds of Nat-sov.

I was shooting for 85%. Looks like that happened, as 86% voted for.

[Separatist Peoples]

That’s a surprisingly high margin, given the large number of people who protested here against the resolution. Now I await the tides of people who wish to non-comply with this on the grounds of Nat-sov.

I was shooting for 85%. Looks like that happened, as 86% voted for.

Ooc: Color me impressed. I thought for sure the summer crowd would keep it below 80%.

[Zone 71]

Ban on Conversion Therapy was passed 14,123 votes to 2,300.

Congratulations, United Massachusetts and everyone who has been fighting so relentlessly to pass this monumental bill. This is a massive step towards equality, and puts in check the powers with the gall to harass and oppress the LGBT community.

[Grenartia]

Ban on Conversion Therapy was passed 14,123 votes to 2,300.

That’s a surprisingly high margin, given the large number of people who protested here against the resolution. Now I await the tides of people who wish to non-comply with this on the grounds of Nat-sov.

I guess the anti-ban crowd was something of a tempest in a teacup.

That’s a surprisingly high margin, given the large number of people who protested here against the resolution. Now I await the tides of people who wish to non-comply with this on the grounds of Nat-sov.

I was shooting for 85%. Looks like that happened, as 86% voted for.

I commend your efforts.