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What do you know about the Philippine American War?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
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Nueva Philippines
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What do you know about the Philippine American War?

Postby Nueva Philippines » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:28 am

PHILIPPINE-AMERICAN WAR
Image


Battle of Paceo (Manila)


Source for you to read about the Philippine-American war:

Source for the massacres during the Philippine-American war:

Notes:
If you noticed that some of the sources contradict each other then the reason for that is the same reason why the american government & people want to take down confederate statues and flags.America doesn't teach its children about the Philippine-American War and if they do they sugar coat the whole thing.I made this forum just to hear peoples opinion.

Questions for you to answer:
  • What do you know about the war?
  • What is your opinion on war?
  • Who in your opinion was the bad guy?
Last edited by Nueva Philippines on Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:52 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Nueva Philippines
새로운 필리핀
新菲律賓
Новая Филиппины
영광Mahistrado Heneral of The Srivijayan Consortium전통
Nueva Philippines in a Nutshell:
A Juche Nation under a 21 year old dictator in an alternate universe where Benigno Aquino Jr. Survived the Assassination Attempt on his life and reformed the Philippines in to People's Republic of the Philippines which was later renamed to Nueva Philippines by the 21 year old dictator.

OOC (WIP): Im a 15 year old filipino. My hobbies are vexillography

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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:30 am

You haven't given us a topic for discussion, except for most poster to respond "approximately nothing". Where do you expect to go from here?
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Nueva Philippines
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Postby Nueva Philippines » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:33 am

Kubra wrote:You haven't given us a topic for discussion, except for most poster to respond "approximately nothing". Where do you expect to go from here?

i accidentally posted it to early my bad :(
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[__[____]__]
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Nueva Philippines
새로운 필리핀
新菲律賓
Новая Филиппины
영광Mahistrado Heneral of The Srivijayan Consortium전통
Nueva Philippines in a Nutshell:
A Juche Nation under a 21 year old dictator in an alternate universe where Benigno Aquino Jr. Survived the Assassination Attempt on his life and reformed the Philippines in to People's Republic of the Philippines which was later renamed to Nueva Philippines by the 21 year old dictator.

OOC (WIP): Im a 15 year old filipino. My hobbies are vexillography

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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:38 am

In any case, I've never understood filipino fixation with the war, as delving into it proper does not paint a good picture of the philippines, whose best men were wasted in the dumbest of ways by really vile sorts, Aguinaldo in particular.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Nueva Philippines
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Postby Nueva Philippines » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:41 am

Kubra wrote:In any case, I've never understood filipino fixation with the war, as delving into it proper does not paint a good picture of the philippines, whose best men were wasted in the dumbest of ways by really vile sorts, Aguinaldo in particular.

Thank you very much for sharing your opinion i just made this forum to see what people know about the war and what they think about it
======================
=====================
====================
======================
======================
======================
======================
[__[____]__]
(-_(- >-)_-)
Nueva Philippines
새로운 필리핀
新菲律賓
Новая Филиппины
영광Mahistrado Heneral of The Srivijayan Consortium전통
Nueva Philippines in a Nutshell:
A Juche Nation under a 21 year old dictator in an alternate universe where Benigno Aquino Jr. Survived the Assassination Attempt on his life and reformed the Philippines in to People's Republic of the Philippines which was later renamed to Nueva Philippines by the 21 year old dictator.

OOC (WIP): Im a 15 year old filipino. My hobbies are vexillography

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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:52 am

I know we have an empire and we prolly did bad stuff to maintain it
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:55 am

Internationalist Bastard wrote:I know we have an empire and we prolly did bad stuff to maintain it
Pretty bad. The philippine-american war was America's vietnam before vietnam, except in this case there were no television and media reports to tell everyone the bad shit going down. The only reason the bad shit stopped was before Teddy got elected he realized that this whole imperialism thing wasn't as cracked up as he thought it was going in (which is super ironic), and actually did court martial some folks when he got the presidency.
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:56 am

Kubra wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:I know we have an empire and we prolly did bad stuff to maintain it
Pretty bad. The philippine-american war was America's vietnam before vietnam, except in this case there were no television and media reports to tell everyone the bad shit going down. The only reason the bad shit stopped was before Teddy got elected he realized that this whole imperialism thing wasn't as cracked up as he thought it was going in (which is super ironic), and actually did court martial some folks when he got the presidency.

Ahh Teddy
Call me Alex, I insist
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Slut Pride. So like, real talk, I’m a porn actress. We’re not all bimbos. I do not give out my information or videos to avoid conflict with site policy. I’m happy to talk about the industry or my thoughts on the career but I will not be showing you any goodies. Sorry
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:58 am

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kubra wrote: Pretty bad. The philippine-american war was America's vietnam before vietnam, except in this case there were no television and media reports to tell everyone the bad shit going down. The only reason the bad shit stopped was before Teddy got elected he realized that this whole imperialism thing wasn't as cracked up as he thought it was going in (which is super ironic), and actually did court martial some folks when he got the presidency.

Ahh Teddy
I mean it's no leap to say that Teddy Roosevelt started the war, and yet he's the guy who end the end got yellow-bellied
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
-Comrade Posadas

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:59 am

Stupid war, and Hellen Keller was a prophetess when said America's empire in the Pacific would make war with Japan inevitable
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:00 am

Kubra wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Ahh Teddy
I mean it's no leap to say that Teddy Roosevelt started the war, and yet he's the guy who end the end got yellow-bellied

Id hardly say realizing you fucked up is yellow bellied
Call me Alex, I insist
I am a girl, damnit
Slut Pride. So like, real talk, I’m a porn actress. We’re not all bimbos. I do not give out my information or videos to avoid conflict with site policy. I’m happy to talk about the industry or my thoughts on the career but I will not be showing you any goodies. Sorry
“Whatever you are, be a good one” Abe Lincoln

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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:02 am

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kubra wrote: I mean it's no leap to say that Teddy Roosevelt started the war, and yet he's the guy who end the end got yellow-bellied

Id hardly say realizing you fucked up is yellow bellied
He didn't. He gave a speech in 1902 saying "whatever they were savages anyways".
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:04 am

Kubra wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Id hardly say realizing you fucked up is yellow bellied
He didn't. He gave a speech in 1902 saying "whatever they were savages anyways".

What I mean is that stopping a war should generally be seen as a good thing, even if they started it
Call me Alex, I insist
I am a girl, damnit
Slut Pride. So like, real talk, I’m a porn actress. We’re not all bimbos. I do not give out my information or videos to avoid conflict with site policy. I’m happy to talk about the industry or my thoughts on the career but I will not be showing you any goodies. Sorry
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:06 am

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kubra wrote: He didn't. He gave a speech in 1902 saying "whatever they were savages anyways".

What I mean is that stopping a war should generally be seen as a good thing, even if they started it
I mean I suppose, but he could have at least been a little sorry.
Still, tho, beats how things went for the first "president" of the philippines. He surrendered to the Americans after putting up an extremely poor fight, and then later came back to collaborate with the japanese. He also ordered the execution of his best general. Guy was a piece of fucking work.
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Postby Saiwania » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:07 am

The Filipinos were a bunch of ingrates, surely the US wasn't as bad as the Spanish empire? They were offered protectorate status and a change in lingua franca from Spanish to English, but they squandered it all. What more did they want besides independence? But I can understand that they rebelled probably because it did look like the US would permanently occupy them as opposed to just a few decades.

Yeah, if the US immediately gave independence to the Philippines, then what? Some neighboring power such as China would've filled the vacuum and taken them over. They needed to get built up first, but they didn't seem to understand this.

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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:07 am

Kubra wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:What I mean is that stopping a war should generally be seen as a good thing, even if they started it
I mean I suppose, but he could have at least been a little sorry.
Still, tho, beats how things went for the first "president" of the philippines. He surrendered to the Americans after putting up an extremely poor fight, and then later came back to collaborate with the japanese. He also ordered the execution of his best general. Guy was a piece of fucking work.

Most rebel leaders are
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:10 am

Saiwania wrote:The Filipinos were a bunch of ingrates, surely the US wasn't as bad as the Spanish empire? They were offered protectorate status and a change in lingua franca from Spanish to English, but they squandered it all. What more did they want besides independence? But I can understand that they rebelled probably because it did look like the US would permanently occupy them as opposed to just a few decades.

Yeah, if the US immediately gave independence to the Philippines, then what? Some neighboring power such as China would've filled the vacuum and taken them over. They needed to get built up first, but they didn't seem to understand this.
Interesting, can you source the bit about simple protectorate status?
As for the chinese, the Qing were not exactly in a position for imperial adventures abroad.
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:14 am

Let me summarize it:

America comes in

Spaniards leave

We say "I like this place. This is a nice fucking place. We'll take it." and promise the Filipinos independence down the road.

Filipinos, who were literally just fighting the Spaniards for the cause of independence, understandable do not like this 'compromise'.

Bad things happen, no one knows why

The sun burns out and everyone dies
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:31 am

Conserative Morality wrote:Let me summarize it:

America comes in

Spaniards leave

We say "I like this place. This is a nice fucking place. We'll take it." and promise the Filipinos independence down the road.

Filipinos, who were literally just fighting the Spaniards for the cause of independence, understandable do not like this 'compromise'.

Bad things happen, no one knows why

The sun burns out and everyone dies
Independence down the road, as far as I know, was not initially promised. That was later when war enthusiasm was low.
Aguinaldo had a copy of McKinley's benevolent assimilation speech, and it did not go over well.
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Conserative Morality
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Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:07 am

Kubra wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:Let me summarize it:

America comes in

Spaniards leave

We say "I like this place. This is a nice fucking place. We'll take it." and promise the Filipinos independence down the road.

Filipinos, who were literally just fighting the Spaniards for the cause of independence, understandable do not like this 'compromise'.

Bad things happen, no one knows why

The sun burns out and everyone dies
Independence down the road, as far as I know, was not initially promised. That was later when war enthusiasm was low.
Aguinaldo had a copy of McKinley's benevolent assimilation speech, and it did not go over well.

From the very beginning, United States presidents and their representatives in the islands defined their colonial mission as tutelage: preparing the Philippines for eventual independence.[148] Except for a small group of "retentionists", the issue was not whether the Philippines would be granted self-rule, but when and under what conditions.[148]
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Kubra
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Postby Kubra » Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:29 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Kubra wrote: Independence down the road, as far as I know, was not initially promised. That was later when war enthusiasm was low.
Aguinaldo had a copy of McKinley's benevolent assimilation speech, and it did not go over well.

From the very beginning, United States presidents and their representatives in the islands defined their colonial mission as tutelage: preparing the Philippines for eventual independence.[148] Except for a small group of "retentionists", the issue was not whether the Philippines would be granted self-rule, but when and under what conditions.[148]
So it is writ in the Library of Congress, but do bear in mind the the Schurman commission, the earliest source used, had begun only after the war had begun. Meanwhile, full text of what was sent to Aguinaldo
The destruction of the Spanish fleet in the harbor of Manila by the United States naval squadron commanded by Rear-Admiral Dewey, followed by the reduction of the city and the surrender of the Spanish forces, practically effected the conquest of the Philippine Islands and the suspension of the Spanish sovereignity therein. With the signature of the treaty of peace between the United States and Spain by their respective plenipotentiaries at Paris on the 10th instant, and as a result of the victories of American arms, the future control, disposition, and government of the Philippine Islands are ceded to the United States. In the fulfillment of the rights of sovereignity thus acquired and the responsible obligations of government thus assumed, the actual occupation and administration of the entire group of the Philippine Islands becomes immediately necessary, and the military government heretofore maintained by the united states in the city, harbor, and bay of Manila is to be extended with all possible despatch to the whole of the ceded territory.

In performing this duty the military commander of the United States is enjoined to make known to the inhabitants of the Philippine Islands that in succeeding to the sovereignity of Spain, in severing the former political relations, and in establishing a new political power, the authority of the United States is to be exerted for the securing of the persons and property of the people of the islands and for the confirmation of all their private rights and relations. It will be the duty of the commander of the forces of occupation to announce and proclaim in the most public manner that we come, not as invaders or conquerors, but as friends, to protect the natives in their homes, in their employments, and in their personal and religious rights. All persons who, either by active aid or by honest submission, co-operate with the Government of the United States to give effect to these beneficent purposes will receive the reward of its support and protection. All others will be brought within the lawful rule we have assumed, with firmness if need be, but without severity, so far as possible. Within the absolute domain of military authority, which necessarily is and must remain supreme in the ceded territory until the legislation of the United States shall otherwise provide, the municipal laws of the territory in respect to private rights and property and the repression of crime are to be considered as continuing in force, and to be administered by the ordinary tribunals, so far as practicable. The operations of civil and municipal government are to be performed by such officers as may accept the supremacy of the United States by taking the oath of allegiance, or by officers chosen, as far as practicable, from the inhabitants of the islands. While the control of all the public property and the revenues of the state passes with the cession, and while the use and management of all public means of transportation are necessarily reserved to the authority of the United States, private property, whether belonging to individuals or corporations, is to be respected except for cause duly established. The taxes and duties heretofore payable by the inhabitants to the late government become payable to the authorities of the United States unless it be seen fit to substitute for them other reasonable rates or modes of contribution to the expenses of government, whether general or local. If private property be taken for military use, it shall be paid for when possible in cash, at a fair valuation, and when payment in cash is not practicable, receipts are to be given. All ports and places in the Philippine Islands in the actual possession of the land and naval forces of the United States will be opened to the commerce of all friendly nations. All goods and wares not prohibited for military reasons by due announcement of the military authority will be admitted upon payment of such duties and other charges as shall be in force at the time of their importation. Finally, it should be the earnest wish and paramount aim of the military administration to win the confidence, respect, and affection of the inhabitants of the Philippines by assuring them in every possible way that full measure of individual rights and liberties which is the heritage of free peoples, and by proving to them that the mission of the United States is one of

BENEVOLENT ASSIMILATION

substituting the mild sway of justice and right for arbitrary rule. In the fulfillment of this high mission, supporting the temperate administration of affairs for the greatest good of the governed, there must be sedulously maintained the strong arm of authority, to repress disturbance and to overcome all obstacles to the bestowal of the blessings of good and stable government upon the people of the Philippine Islands under the free flag of the United States.
It's a different text from the actual speech, and let's face it, Bluont really ought to have been court martialled for this version. But it's what Aguinaldo got.
That said, I was certainly wrong about the dating of intention. Have mercy, it's 4 in the morning.
Last edited by Kubra on Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Nueva Philippines
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Postby Nueva Philippines » Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:46 am

Saiwania wrote:The Filipinos were a bunch of ingrates, surely the US wasn't as bad as the Spanish empire? They were offered protectorate status and a change in lingua franca from Spanish to English, but they squandered it all. What more did they want besides independence? But I can understand that they rebelled probably because it did look like the US would permanently occupy them as opposed to just a few decades.

Yeah, if the US immediately gave independence to the Philippines, then what? Some neighboring power such as China would've filled the vacuum and taken them over. They needed to get built up first, but they didn't seem to understand this.

I see your point but the war happened during 1898-1901 so china was still the Qing and the Qing was pretty bad and lost several wars already but their was Japan so yeah
======================
=====================
====================
======================
======================
======================
======================
[__[____]__]
(-_(- >-)_-)
Nueva Philippines
새로운 필리핀
新菲律賓
Новая Филиппины
영광Mahistrado Heneral of The Srivijayan Consortium전통
Nueva Philippines in a Nutshell:
A Juche Nation under a 21 year old dictator in an alternate universe where Benigno Aquino Jr. Survived the Assassination Attempt on his life and reformed the Philippines in to People's Republic of the Philippines which was later renamed to Nueva Philippines by the 21 year old dictator.

OOC (WIP): Im a 15 year old filipino. My hobbies are vexillography

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Arlenton
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Postby Arlenton » Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:44 am

The US was transitioning from blue uniforms to khaki uniforms. An interesting period.

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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:59 am

The 1911 was created in response if I remember correctly.

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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:03 pm

Sadly, not a whole lot. I'll be reading this thread to see what I can learn from it.
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