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Gun Control: Shiny Toy Guns

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Am I Right?

Yeah, mostly, seems agreeable.
156
22%
Dunno/Not sure/Not American and I think that matters
40
6%
Nah, you're crazy. Guns should be more restricted.
187
26%
Nah, you're crazy. Guns should be less restricted.
287
40%
JC Christ CM come back when the meds wear off
54
7%
 
Total votes : 724

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Gig em Aggies
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Gun Control: Shiny Toy Guns

Postby Gig em Aggies » Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:39 pm

Previous incarnations:

Original Post & Thread by Conservative Morality:


Been gone from NSG recovering from a little accident (nothing major) so I thought I'd return to the forums with a true classic - gun control.

I speak on this issue as an American, and thus I necessarily refer back to the 2nd Amendment here. The 2nd Amendment is culturally important - practically, less so. In an age of effective nonlethal self-defense weapons, 'self-defense' rings somewhat hollow as a justification; in an age of the MIC, 'combat readiness' for the civilian population doubly so; and anyone who thinks that their militia is going to resist the tyranny of the Feds with small arms is loony enough that they probably shouldn't own any guns. One must remember that even in the American Revolutionary War it was not private firearms which provided the majority of the firepower of American forces; such firearm ownership was primarily the province of skirmishers and some irregulars.

I could care less, to be honest, about long guns. We aren't the Wild West. We aren't some wartorn third-world country. Even fully automatic long guns don't concern me too much. Our problems with firearms are overwhelmingly concerned with the tracking of individuals who misuse them, not so much the disarmament of individuals with firearms. We don't live in a country where militias and gangs can resist the force of the State without using the institutions of the State (judicial process, presumption of innocence, civil rights).

Registration and tracking of firearms is all-important, as is licensing for individuals. I'm not sure that there are many circumstances I would support a full ban on a person's right to own firearms, but restricting ownership of certain firearms for certain individuals is probably useful. Acquiring a license to own handguns in particular, I think, is a good idea. Criminal activity is overwhelmingly reliant on concealment of weaponry.

I do think a limitation on different 'classes' of weapons is useful - but the current definitions of 'assault' weapons are asinine and borderline useless. Restrictions on semiautomatic long guns should be based primarily on ease of concealment - 'tactical' attachments, bayonet lugs, that shit doesn't matter. Collapsing stocks and shortened barrels and extended magazine capacity is more important, and even then I don't believe in a complete ban on such things.

Private and government property, naturally, can restrict what comes onto their property. Your rights end where another's begin. If the city doesn't want your glock in the local social services department, leave it at home and quitcher bitchin'.

Silencers is a question I struggle with. Any policy on silencers has to be Federal, not piecemeal state-by-state, but... on one hand, the use of silencers to lessen hearing loss and damage is perfectly legitimate and silencers don't work like Hollywood 'plink plink' kind of bullshit. It turns a roar into a bark. It's not exactly a sneaky-beaky murder weapon. On the other hand, turning a roar into a bark is sometimes enough combined with background ambiance to conceal the firing of a gun in circumstances where a gun should not be fired, which is... problematic.

Open carry is an issue that I think should mostly be regulated by the individual states, with some exceptions. There is no fucking reason you need to open carry a fully automatic weapon in public, full stop. Keep that shit on private property. I'd prefer it if people didn't carry their AR-15 dick replacements into the local department stores with tactical webbing and camo from head to toe either, but I guess that's more a personal preference.

So? Agree? Disagree? Am I just rambling?
Last edited by Gig em Aggies on Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:47 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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“The reason that the Aggies does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the Aggies practices chaos on a daily basis.”
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Holy Tedalonia
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Postby Holy Tedalonia » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:47 pm

Yeah second post!
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Republic of Keshiland
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Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:49 pm

I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:50 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

I mean that sounds believable but source
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Gig em Aggies
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Postby Gig em Aggies » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:51 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

Ahem does chicago ring any bells they have some of the most restrictive gun laws yet they have some of the highest gun deaths. Explain that
“One of the serious problems of planning against Aggie doctrine is that the Aggies do not read their manuals nor do they feel any obligations to follow their doctrine.”
“The reason that the Aggies does so well in wartime, is that war is chaos, and the Aggies practices chaos on a daily basis.”
“If we don’t know what we are doing, the enemy certainly can’t anticipate our future actions!”

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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:52 pm

Gig em Aggies wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

Ahem does chicago ring any bells they have some of the most restrictive gun laws yet they have some of the highest gun deaths. Explain that

Chicago sucks?
I do seem to remember gun deaths going down drastically in DC when we started open carry
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Republic of Keshiland
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Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:52 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

I mean that sounds believable but source



States death by gun per capita
Alaska 19.59
Louisiana 19.15
Alabama 17.79
Mississippi 17.55
Wyoming 17.51
Montana 16.94
Arkansas 16.93
Oklahoma 16.41
Tennessee 15.86
New Mexico 15.63
South Carolina 15.60
West Virginia 15.10
Missouri 14.56
Arizona 14.20
Nevada 14.16
Kentucky 14.15
Idaho 14.08
Indiana 13.04
Georgia 12.63
Florida 12.49
North Carolina 12.42
Michigan 12.03
Maine 11.89
North Dakota 11.89
Oregon 11.76
Colorado 11.75
Utah 11.69
Kansas 11.44
Pennsylvania 11.36
Ohio 11.14
Delaware 10.80
Texas 10.50
Virginia 10.46
Vermont 10.37
Wisconsin 9.93
Maryland 9.75
South Dakota 9.47
Washington 9.07
Nebraska 8.99
Illinois 8.67
Iowa 8.19
California 7.89
Minnesota 7.88
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
Rhode Island 5.33
Connecticut 4.48
New York 4.39
Massachusetts 3.18
Hawaii 2.71

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_d ... s_by_state
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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Telconi
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Posts: 12731
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:53 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA


How is it justified again?
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Paddy O Fernature
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Paddy O Fernature » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:53 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:I mean that sounds believable but source



States death by gun per capita
Alaska 19.59
Louisiana 19.15
Alabama 17.79
Mississippi 17.55
Wyoming 17.51
Montana 16.94
Arkansas 16.93
Oklahoma 16.41
Tennessee 15.86
New Mexico 15.63
South Carolina 15.60
West Virginia 15.10
Missouri 14.56
Arizona 14.20
Nevada 14.16
Kentucky 14.15
Idaho 14.08
Indiana 13.04
Georgia 12.63
Florida 12.49
North Carolina 12.42
Michigan 12.03
Maine 11.89
North Dakota 11.89
Oregon 11.76
Colorado 11.75
Utah 11.69
Kansas 11.44
Pennsylvania 11.36
Ohio 11.14
Delaware 10.80
Texas 10.50
Virginia 10.46
Vermont 10.37
Wisconsin 9.93
Maryland 9.75
South Dakota 9.47
Washington 9.07
Nebraska 8.99
Illinois 8.67
Iowa 8.19
California 7.89
Minnesota 7.88
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
Rhode Island 5.33
Connecticut 4.48
New York 4.39
Massachusetts 3.18
Hawaii 2.71

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_d ... s_by_state


And this was already fucking debunked overwhelmingly on the last thread, try again.

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/org ... online.pdf
Last edited by Paddy O Fernature on Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Wysten
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Postby Wysten » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:54 pm

Sorry guys nearly chocked to death on a nacho when Keshi said his strawmen were valid.
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Republic of Keshiland
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Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:54 pm

Gig em Aggies wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

Ahem does chicago ring any bells they have some of the most restrictive gun laws yet they have some of the highest gun deaths. Explain that


That is a lie thanks to the courts and other factors they do not have the strictest gun laws. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/glanton/ct-met-gun-control-chicago-dahleen-glanton-20171003-story.html
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:55 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

List I just looked at put California at #5.
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Republic of Keshiland
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Founded: Oct 21, 2017
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Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:56 pm

Paddy O Fernature wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:

States death by gun per capita
Alaska 19.59
Louisiana 19.15
Alabama 17.79
Mississippi 17.55
Wyoming 17.51
Montana 16.94
Arkansas 16.93
Oklahoma 16.41
Tennessee 15.86
New Mexico 15.63
South Carolina 15.60
West Virginia 15.10
Missouri 14.56
Arizona 14.20
Nevada 14.16
Kentucky 14.15
Idaho 14.08
Indiana 13.04
Georgia 12.63
Florida 12.49
North Carolina 12.42
Michigan 12.03
Maine 11.89
North Dakota 11.89
Oregon 11.76
Colorado 11.75
Utah 11.69
Kansas 11.44
Pennsylvania 11.36
Ohio 11.14
Delaware 10.80
Texas 10.50
Virginia 10.46
Vermont 10.37
Wisconsin 9.93
Maryland 9.75
South Dakota 9.47
Washington 9.07
Nebraska 8.99
Illinois 8.67
Iowa 8.19
California 7.89
Minnesota 7.88
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
Rhode Island 5.33
Connecticut 4.48
New York 4.39
Massachusetts 3.18
Hawaii 2.71

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_d ... s_by_state


And this was already fucking debunked overwhelmingly on the last thread, try again.

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/org ... online.pdf


1. This is about the US states
2. Minus Russia and Ukraine Europe has really low gun ownership and murder rate.
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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Paddy O Fernature
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Paddy O Fernature » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:57 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Paddy O Fernature wrote:
And this was already fucking debunked overwhelmingly on the last thread, try again.

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/org ... online.pdf


1. This is about the US states
2. Minus Russia and Ukraine Europe has really low gun ownership and murder rate.


..........

Read more then the damned opening disclaimer ffs.

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Republic of Keshiland
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Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:57 pm

Sovaal wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:I will start this thread off by pointing out that the states with the most gun freedom have the most gun deaths but the states with the least gun freedom have the least gun deaths. Thus meaning that gun control is not only justified but works in the USA

List I just looked at put California at #5.


It was either alphabetical or raw number not per capita.
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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Internationalist Bastard
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:58 pm

*sigh*
That feel when you're a gun owning liberal who's received death threats from conservatives, so you have no idea where you sit
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Len Hyet
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Len Hyet » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:58 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Paddy O Fernature wrote:
And this was already fucking debunked overwhelmingly on the last thread, try again.

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/org ... online.pdf


1. This is about the US states
2. Minus Russia and Ukraine Europe has really low gun ownership and murder rate.

And I'll start my contribution off with a (new!) peer reviewed published article that checked every U.S. city with a population of at least 25,000 in 1990, assessing the impact of 19 major types of gun control laws, where "Results indicate that gun control laws generally show no evidence of effects on crime rates, possibly because gun levels do not have a net positive effect on violence rates."
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The Greater Ohio Valley
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Greater Ohio Valley » Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:59 pm

I'm pretty pro-gun, I own guns, I like guns and I plan to get more of them. However, I'm increasing unsure how to feel about the gun control debate these days, since both sides seem to be going to the extremes when it comes to gun ownership and I'm here more in the middle wondering what we can do about all the gun violence going on without restricting the rights of law abiding citizens like me who just want to have guns and be merry.
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PRO:
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- Gun rights
- LGBTQ rights
- Liberalism
- Choice
- Separation of church and state/secularism
- Gender/sexual equality
- Racial equality
- Due process
- Equal protection of the laws
- Cannabis legalization
- Capitalism
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ANTI:
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- Racial supremacy
- Authoritarianism
- Conservatism
- Libertarianism
- "States rights"
- Racism
- Sexism
- Religious extremism
- Warmongering
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- War on Drugs
- Originalism
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- Communism
- Anti-Intellectualism
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Republic of Keshiland
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Founded: Oct 21, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:00 pm

Paddy O Fernature wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:
1. This is about the US states
2. Minus Russia and Ukraine Europe has really low gun ownership and murder rate.


..........

Read more then the damned opening disclaimer ffs.


Nothing in there showed anything that makes the US seem good. Conserdering Murder rate is still way higher then just about every country listed. With or without guns.
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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Telconi
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:02 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Paddy O Fernature wrote:
..........

Read more then the damned opening disclaimer ffs.


Nothing in there showed anything that makes the US seem good. Conserdering Murder rate is still way higher then just about every country listed. With or without guns.


Why don't we ban homicide?
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PRO:
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ANTI:
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-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

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Sovaal
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Sovaal » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:03 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:I mean that sounds believable but source



States death by gun per capita
Alaska 19.59
Louisiana 19.15
Alabama 17.79
Mississippi 17.55
Wyoming 17.51
Montana 16.94
Arkansas 16.93
Oklahoma 16.41
Tennessee 15.86
New Mexico 15.63
South Carolina 15.60
West Virginia 15.10
Missouri 14.56
Arizona 14.20
Nevada 14.16
Kentucky 14.15
Idaho 14.08
Indiana 13.04
Georgia 12.63
Florida 12.49
North Carolina 12.42
Michigan 12.03
Maine 11.89
North Dakota 11.89
Oregon 11.76
Colorado 11.75
Utah 11.69
Kansas 11.44
Pennsylvania 11.36
Ohio 11.14
Delaware 10.80
Texas 10.50
Virginia 10.46
Vermont 10.37
Wisconsin 9.93
Maryland 9.75
South Dakota 9.47
Washington 9.07
Nebraska 8.99
Illinois 8.67
Iowa 8.19
California 7.89
Minnesota 7.88
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
Rhode Island 5.33
Connecticut 4.48
New York 4.39
Massachusetts 3.18
Hawaii 2.71

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_d ... s_by_state

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_death_rates_in_the_United_States_by_state

State Rate
Alabama 17.79
Alaska 19.59
Arizona 14.20
Arkansas 16.93
California 7.89
Colorado 11.75
Connecticut 4.48
Delaware 10.80
Florida 12.49
Georgia 12.63
Hawaii 2.71
Idaho 14.08
Illinois 8.67
Indiana 13.04
Iowa 8.19
Kansas 11.44
Kentucky 14.15
Louisiana 19.15
Maine 11.89
Maryland 9.75
Massachusetts 3.18
Michigan 12.03
Minnesota 7.88
Mississippi 17.55
Missouri 14.56
Montana 16.94
Nebraska 8.99
Nevada 14.16
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
New Mexico 15.63
New York 4.39
North Carolina 12.42
North Dakota 11.89
Ohio 11.14
Oklahoma 16.41
Oregon 11.76
Pennsylvania 11.36
Rhode Island 5.33
South Carolina 15.60
South Dakota 9.47
Tennessee 15.86
Texas 10.50
Utah 11.69
Vermont 10.37
Virginia 10.46
Washington 9.07
West Virginia 15.10
Wisconsin 9.93
Wyoming 17.51

https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state
Data summary

Gun crimes by US states
Rates per 100,000 population. Click heading to sort table. Download this data
State
Total firearms murders, 2011
% change, 2010-11
Fire- arms murders as % of all murders
Fire- arms murders rate
Fire- arms robb- eries rate
Fire- arms assaults rate
United States 8,583 -3 68 2.75 39.25 43.77
Alaska 16 -16 55 2.24 18.19 80.47
Arizona 222 -4 65 3.53 50.24 57.36
Arkansas 110 18 72 4.39 45.45 100.56
California 1,220 -3 68 3.25 42.97 45.39
Colorado 73 12 50 1.51 25.74 45.72
Connecticut 94 -3 73 2.71 34.85 20.06
Delaware 28 -26 68 3.09 69.67 81.36
District of Columbia 77 -22 71 12.46 242.56 87.7
Georgia 370 -2 71 3.93 72.48 58.64
Hawaii 1 -86 14 0.07 n/a n/a
Idaho 17 42 53 1.14 3.41 23.43
Illinois 377 4 83 2.93 2.26 5.26
Indiana 183 29 64 3.29 53.14 29.91
Iowa 19 -10 43 0.71 7.31 21.95
Kansas 73 16 66 2.78 24.86 76.87
Kentucky 100 -14 67 2.36 39.77 25.14
Louisiana 402 15 83 10.16 63.48 99.51
Maine 12 9 48 0.9 5.8 4.52
Maryland 272 -7 68 4.7 79.71 41.18
Massachusetts 122 3 67 2.02 27.84 33.19
Michigan 450 9 73 5.06 55.95 86.41
Minnesota 43 -19 61 0.82 20.11 22.52
Mississippi 138 15 74 7.46 60.07 51.69
Missouri 276 -14 76 4.64 52.47 88.9
Montana 7 -42 39 0.76 3.78 29.03
Nebraska 42 31 65 2.5 25.44 33.84
Nevada 75 -11 58 3.07 69.77 53.3
New Hampshire 6 20 38 0.53 9.83 15.14
New Jersey 269 9 71 3.07 49.87 26.94
New Mexico 60 -10 50 2.98 34.96 87.26
New York 445 -14 57 4.12 23.28 20.06
North Carolina 335 17 69 3.87 48.72 67.44
North Dakota 6 50 50 0.93 4.79 4.79
Ohio 344 11 70 3.54 65.45 37.97
Oklahoma 131 18 64 3.64 42.81 58.07
Oregon 40 11 52 1.05 14.57 17.55
Pennsylvania 470 3 74 3.97 54.69 39.44
Rhode Island 5 -69 36 0.57 12.71 17.86
South Carolina 223 8 70 5.41 52.93 127.88
South Dakota 5 -38 33 0.68 4.91 20.6
Tennessee 244 11 65 3.92 72.88 137.58
Texas 699 -13 64 2.91 50.21 58.28
Utah 26 18 51 0.97 10.98 21.32
Vermont 4 100 50 0.75 4.32 12.6
Virginia 208 -17 69 2.58 35.4 21.35
Washington 79 -15 49 1.25 20.72 28.44
West Virginia 43 59 58 2.87 16.08 52.04
Wisconsin 80 -18 59 1.47 43.86 27.4
Wyoming 11 120 73 2.01 3.65 20.44


So it appears that it has more to do with poverty and such then it does with the actual laws, at least that's my theory.
Last edited by Sovaal on Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Republic of Keshiland
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Posts: 2164
Founded: Oct 21, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:04 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:*sigh*
That feel when you're a gun owning liberal who's received death threats from conservatives, so you have no idea where you sit


That means you should join the anti-gunners :) we are friendlier and genuinely want everyone to be safe thus why we are anti-gun.
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Sovaal
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Sovaal » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:04 pm

Len Hyet wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:
1. This is about the US states
2. Minus Russia and Ukraine Europe has really low gun ownership and murder rate.

And I'll start my contribution off with a (new!) peer reviewed published article that checked every U.S. city with a population of at least 25,000 in 1990, assessing the impact of 19 major types of gun control laws, where "Results indicate that gun control laws generally show no evidence of effects on crime rates, possibly because gun levels do not have a net positive effect on violence rates."

Serbia and the Scandinavian countries have high firearms ownership rates.
Freedom of Speech, Freedom of religion, Gun rights, LGBT rights, Equal Rights, Environmentalism, Democracy, Evolution, nuclear power
Gun control, Monarchy, Authoritarianism and Totalitarianism in general, NSA, Fundies, Tankies and Nazis (they're both equally bad), Repubs and Dems, the Establishment, Racists, The KKK (May they all burn in hell)


Don't tread on me libertarian
Unapologetic Jon Snow supporter.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - -George Orwell

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Wysten
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Wysten » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:05 pm

Republic of Keshiland wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:*sigh*
That feel when you're a gun owning liberal who's received death threats from conservatives, so you have no idea where you sit


That means you should join the anti-gunners :) we are friendlier and genuinely want everyone to be safe thus why we are anti-gun.

"We are friendlier" Says the guy who insulted cops the military gun owners republicans Trump and people with PTSD
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Republic of Keshiland
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Ex-Nation

Postby Republic of Keshiland » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:05 pm

Sovaal wrote:
Republic of Keshiland wrote:

States death by gun per capita
Alaska 19.59
Louisiana 19.15
Alabama 17.79
Mississippi 17.55
Wyoming 17.51
Montana 16.94
Arkansas 16.93
Oklahoma 16.41
Tennessee 15.86
New Mexico 15.63
South Carolina 15.60
West Virginia 15.10
Missouri 14.56
Arizona 14.20
Nevada 14.16
Kentucky 14.15
Idaho 14.08
Indiana 13.04
Georgia 12.63
Florida 12.49
North Carolina 12.42
Michigan 12.03
Maine 11.89
North Dakota 11.89
Oregon 11.76
Colorado 11.75
Utah 11.69
Kansas 11.44
Pennsylvania 11.36
Ohio 11.14
Delaware 10.80
Texas 10.50
Virginia 10.46
Vermont 10.37
Wisconsin 9.93
Maryland 9.75
South Dakota 9.47
Washington 9.07
Nebraska 8.99
Illinois 8.67
Iowa 8.19
California 7.89
Minnesota 7.88
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
Rhode Island 5.33
Connecticut 4.48
New York 4.39
Massachusetts 3.18
Hawaii 2.71

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_d ... s_by_state

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_death_rates_in_the_United_States_by_state

State Rate
Alabama 17.79
Alaska 19.59
Arizona 14.20
Arkansas 16.93
California 7.89
Colorado 11.75
Connecticut 4.48
Delaware 10.80
Florida 12.49
Georgia 12.63
Hawaii 2.71
Idaho 14.08
Illinois 8.67
Indiana 13.04
Iowa 8.19
Kansas 11.44
Kentucky 14.15
Louisiana 19.15
Maine 11.89
Maryland 9.75
Massachusetts 3.18
Michigan 12.03
Minnesota 7.88
Mississippi 17.55
Missouri 14.56
Montana 16.94
Nebraska 8.99
Nevada 14.16
New Hampshire 7.03
New Jersey 5.69
New Mexico 15.63
New York 4.39
North Carolina 12.42
North Dakota 11.89
Ohio 11.14
Oklahoma 16.41
Oregon 11.76
Pennsylvania 11.36
Rhode Island 5.33
South Carolina 15.60
South Dakota 9.47
Tennessee 15.86
Texas 10.50
Utah 11.69
Vermont 10.37
Virginia 10.46
Washington 9.07
West Virginia 15.10
Wisconsin 9.93
Wyoming 17.51

https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state
Data summary

Gun crimes by US states
Rates per 100,000 population. Click heading to sort table. Download this data
State
Total firearms murders, 2011
% change, 2010-11
Fire- arms murders as % of all murders
Fire- arms murders rate
Fire- arms robb- eries rate
Fire- arms assaults rate
United States 8,583 -3 68 2.75 39.25 43.77
Alaska 16 -16 55 2.24 18.19 80.47
Arizona 222 -4 65 3.53 50.24 57.36
Arkansas 110 18 72 4.39 45.45 100.56
California 1,220 -3 68 3.25 42.97 45.39
Colorado 73 12 50 1.51 25.74 45.72
Connecticut 94 -3 73 2.71 34.85 20.06
Delaware 28 -26 68 3.09 69.67 81.36
District of Columbia 77 -22 71 12.46 242.56 87.7
Georgia 370 -2 71 3.93 72.48 58.64
Hawaii 1 -86 14 0.07 n/a n/a
Idaho 17 42 53 1.14 3.41 23.43
Illinois 377 4 83 2.93 2.26 5.26
Indiana 183 29 64 3.29 53.14 29.91
Iowa 19 -10 43 0.71 7.31 21.95
Kansas 73 16 66 2.78 24.86 76.87
Kentucky 100 -14 67 2.36 39.77 25.14
Louisiana 402 15 83 10.16 63.48 99.51
Maine 12 9 48 0.9 5.8 4.52
Maryland 272 -7 68 4.7 79.71 41.18
Massachusetts 122 3 67 2.02 27.84 33.19
Michigan 450 9 73 5.06 55.95 86.41
Minnesota 43 -19 61 0.82 20.11 22.52
Mississippi 138 15 74 7.46 60.07 51.69
Missouri 276 -14 76 4.64 52.47 88.9
Montana 7 -42 39 0.76 3.78 29.03
Nebraska 42 31 65 2.5 25.44 33.84
Nevada 75 -11 58 3.07 69.77 53.3
New Hampshire 6 20 38 0.53 9.83 15.14
New Jersey 269 9 71 3.07 49.87 26.94
New Mexico 60 -10 50 2.98 34.96 87.26
New York 445 -14 57 4.12 23.28 20.06
North Carolina 335 17 69 3.87 48.72 67.44
North Dakota 6 50 50 0.93 4.79 4.79
Ohio 344 11 70 3.54 65.45 37.97
Oklahoma 131 18 64 3.64 42.81 58.07
Oregon 40 11 52 1.05 14.57 17.55
Pennsylvania 470 3 74 3.97 54.69 39.44
Rhode Island 5 -69 36 0.57 12.71 17.86
South Carolina 223 8 70 5.41 52.93 127.88
South Dakota 5 -38 33 0.68 4.91 20.6
Tennessee 244 11 65 3.92 72.88 137.58
Texas 699 -13 64 2.91 50.21 58.28
Utah 26 18 51 0.97 10.98 21.32
Vermont 4 100 50 0.75 4.32 12.6
Virginia 208 -17 69 2.58 35.4 21.35
Washington 79 -15 49 1.25 20.72 28.44
West Virginia 43 59 58 2.87 16.08 52.04
Wisconsin 80 -18 59 1.47 43.86 27.4
Wyoming 11 120 73 2.01 3.65 20.44


So it appears that it has more to do with poverty and such then it does with the actual laws, at least that's my theory.


Boy you left it in alphabetical order LOL. Hit the arrow and above the number and it will go from most to least or visa versa
I am pro-life, anti-gun, pro-immigration, pro UHC, pro-free college, pro universal income, anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-financial ade, pro anything that makes children's lives better.

I finally realised how messed up English was when I read a sign in French and could comprehend half of it despite never learning any French

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