by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:31 pm
by Conserative Morality » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:32 pm
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:37 pm
Conserative Morality wrote:Would they not give you a pulpit or something?
by Conserative Morality » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:39 pm
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:42 pm
by Dooom35796821595 » Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:43 pm
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:03 pm
Insaeldor wrote:I remember something similar when I took the semester of philosophy at community college.
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:07 pm
by Naifon » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:10 pm
The Parkus Empire wrote:Naifon wrote:With all due respect, a treatise is no way to begin an argument. Use the traditional format; poll and question, y’hear?
I am not arguing against one position, but several
I also don't see polls as serving any purpose here. They are just a way to express pure opinion with zero content.
by Menassa » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:15 pm
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:16 pm
Naifon wrote:The Parkus Empire wrote:
I am not arguing against one position, but several
I also don't see polls as serving any purpose here. They are just a way to express pure opinion with zero content.
I think an argument of many sides works to the detriment of all sides, as one cannot refrain from remarks on one side that contradict their previous remarks on another side.
As for the prompt, I disagree. Mob rule is not inherently inefficient. Wisdom of the crowd, no?
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:28 pm
Menassa wrote:If I'm understanding this right, if God is the perfect balance of justice and mercy, then he shouldn't have his law be governed by people who are not that. We should not be held to the same standard as God...
by Pope Joan » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:30 pm
by Menassa » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:32 pm
The Parkus Empire wrote:Menassa wrote:If I'm understanding this right, if God is the perfect balance of justice and mercy, then he shouldn't have his law be governed by people who are not that. We should not be held to the same standard as God...
God in Isaac's framework is not a balance. He compares God's justice to his mercy by the image of sand thrown in a raging river. And in a Christian framework, we are held to the same standard as God (incarnate). But I am not suggesting state law be Christian, rather I am rebutting that as even possible. My rebuttal here is not directed toward Jews, but specific Christians I had in mind. In Christianity, virtue is being godly; in Judaism, virtue is correct observance of the law. Judaism could, and indeed historically has, function as the basis of law, but Christianity really cannot, at least I do not believe it can.
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:36 pm
Pope Joan wrote:Despite what St Paul says, some laws and governments are clearly not of God and must not be obeyed. Bonhoeffer said this about Nazi Germany, Tutu said this about apartheid in South Africa, hundreds of northern pulpits preached this about the Fugitive Slave Act, and Jefferson helped found our nation upon that principle.
by Albrenia » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:40 pm
Naifon wrote:The Parkus Empire wrote:
I am not arguing against one position, but several
I also don't see polls as serving any purpose here. They are just a way to express pure opinion with zero content.
I think an argument of many sides works to the detriment of all sides, as one cannot refrain from remarks on one side that contradict their previous remarks on another side.
As for the prompt, I disagree. Mob rule is not inherently inefficient. Wisdom of the crowd, no?
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:45 pm
Menassa wrote:The Parkus Empire wrote:God in Isaac's framework is not a balance. He compares God's justice to his mercy by the image of sand thrown in a raging river. And in a Christian framework, we are held to the same standard as God (incarnate). But I am not suggesting state law be Christian, rather I am rebutting that as even possible. My rebuttal here is not directed toward Jews, but specific Christians I had in mind. In Christianity, virtue is being godly; in Judaism, virtue is correct observance of the law. Judaism could, and indeed historically has, function as the basis of law, but Christianity really cannot, at least I do not believe it can.
Wouldn't Christianity's thing be about Faith in God? Also correct observance in Judaism is a means to a worldly and otherworldly end.
by Shulimai » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:46 pm
by Menassa » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:50 pm
The Parkus Empire wrote:Menassa wrote:Wouldn't Christianity's thing be about Faith in God? Also correct observance in Judaism is a means to a worldly and otherworldly end.
Protestant Christianity is strictly about faith, but Orthodox Christianity is about being godly through uniting one's operations with God's, and by mortifying self-will through things like fasting and mourning one's sinfulness before God. Christ's death is not external to us, in place of ours, but a death we share in, thereby satisfying the curse. While salvation comes to us through faith, we consider salvation to be synonymous with perfect harmony with God's operations.
I understand the function of correct observance in Judaism and why it is taken extremely seriously.
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:52 pm
Shulimai wrote:Though I do agree with most what's been said, I think this argument implodes as it stands on its own. It is a jab against two forms of ideology straight out of the fog. Have you been harassed by leftists and reactionaries lately?
by Aillyria » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:52 pm
Conserative Morality wrote:If RWDT were Romans, who would they be?
......
Aillyria would be Claudius. Temper + unwillingness to suffer fools + supporter of the P E O P L E + traditional legalist
West Oros wrote:GOD DAMMIT! I thought you wouldn't be here.
Well you aren't a real socialist. Just a sociopath disguised as one.
Not to mention that this thread split off from LWDT, so I assumed you would think this thread was a "revisionist hellhole".
by Menassa » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:55 pm
Aillyria wrote:Comparing God (swt) with humans is a bad way to go, Parkus. God is the law because he is justice and is mercy....a man cannot be that. Man is fallible, and so is his law. When that law is flawed to the extension of detriment to society, it should be crushed and replaced promptly. Rule of law is worthless if it doesn't create a suitable environment for progress and harmony.
by The Parkus Empire » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:55 pm
Albrenia wrote:Naifon wrote:I think an argument of many sides works to the detriment of all sides, as one cannot refrain from remarks on one side that contradict their previous remarks on another side.
As for the prompt, I disagree. Mob rule is not inherently inefficient. Wisdom of the crowd, no?
I always found individuals to generally have far more wisdom than the mob.
As for the OP, I'm an Atheist so obviously I'm not concerned by the place of God in the law. Traditions can be changed and in many cases should. Is does not imply ought, after all.
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