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[MEGATHREAD] Unusual Issue Effects

A place to spoil daily issues for those who haven't had them yet, snigger at typos, and discuss ideas for new ones.
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Candlewhisper Archive
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[MEGATHREAD] Unusual Issue Effects

Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:20 am

This thread is for players to report when issues gave unexpected stat effects.

When reporting these, ideally include the following information:

- The name of the nation that had this effect
- The day that this effect was encountered
- The name of the issue, and if you know it, the number of the issue.


This thread should not be used to propose rewrites of issues, or to complain about issue bias. Those discussions can occur in The Writer's Block (viewtopic.php?f=13&t=159868), then subsequently in their own threads as needed. Yes, I know the Writers Block thread says not to do that. Don't worry - that's now our catch-all miscellaneous conversation place, and nobody is going to worry what posts go on there, so long as they're Issue-related discussions, and within normal forum rules (viewtopic.php?f=16&t=260044).

This thread should not be used to report grammar, punctuation or spelling mistakes, though we do like to hear about those things on the "Fix" thread.(viewtopic.php?f=13&t=158858)

Additionally, please read the following Unexpected Effects FAQ before using this thread. These represent the "bare minimum" of system knowledge required to be able to tell if issues are actually giving unexpected effects. Expect to be mocked mercilessly if your query is covered here, and yes, there will be a test at the end of term. Class dismissed!

------

Unexpected Effects FAQ
"Why did this stat change by X%? That's too much / too little!"
The percentage change depends on your starting point.
If you have a statistic of 5, and the game code says add +2 to this, you'll see an increase of +40%.
If you have a statistic of 100, and the game code says add +2 to this, you'll see an increase of +2%.
If you have a statistic of 0.01, and the game code says add +2 to this, you'll see an increase of +20000%.

The perceived magnitude of effect that you are experiencing often results from being a new nation. The earliest issues you answer always cause massive stat changes, as you're adding small numbers to small numbers. As time goes on you'll find that the same issues will often now barely affect things at all, as you're adding small numbers to very large numbers.

Corollary: If you see NO stat effects, the simulation isn't broken. Rather, the decision was in keeping with where your current stat model suggests you are ideologically and structurally, so no stat changes were needed.

Look on it not so much as a direct cause and effect thing, but rather the game working out the nature of your nation. The more information it gathers, the closer it moves your simulation to where you're likely to truly be. It's kind of a collapsing waveform sort of thing. It's not quite that simple, but the main gist here is not to see the "effects" as part of a direct cause and effect model.

For example, if banning Grand Prix racing drops your tourism by 75%, it's not that Grand Prix racing represented 75% of your tourism, rather that the simulation is gathering information about your priorities, and slowly refining its simulation of those. Later on, when your nation has momentum, only decisions that are out of keeping with your previous direction will upset the overall simulation.

So long as you keep answering issues with a consistent style, and keep playing the game, your nation's simulation will grow more and more stable.

Don't worry about "buyer's regret" either. Early decisions in your nation's lifespan are no more inherently consequential than late ones: its the amalgamated effect of ALL your decisions that matters.


"Why did my civil rights / political freedom / economy move the wrong way?"
Broadly, the game is seeking information from you all the time to define your position on the three main categories.
If you confirm what it already knows about you, then you see no or little change in its recording of your position.

If you go against what it thinks it knows about you, then you can see a sizeable change.

So, for example, if the United States of America were to block its citizenry from the internet for one week, that's be a massive shift in its position on civil liberties. If China were to do the same, it'd be a notable but less dramatic shift. If North Korea were to do it, people would consider it business as usual.

With me so far?

Now add to this that the game uses a lot of invisible stats, and checks each of these in isolation, and that sometimes a single option may effect many of these.

This is where you get the confusing situations. Say, for example, a North Korea like nation embraces an option that arms its populace and tells them to go out and shoot anyone of non heterosexual sexuality.

That sounds like an attack on civil rights, right?

Well yes, except that the game looks at the nation's attitude on homosexuality, and notes that it's already super-bigoted, so a super-bigoted stance has very little effect on civil rights. The game then looks at the people's right to bear arms, and notices that we're going from no right to bear arms, to having the right to bear arms for a specific purpose. This creates a sizeable increase in civil rights.

Thus, you get a spurious and confusing scenario where civil rights increase in an option that sounds anti-civil rights.

The closer your nation is to the extremes, the more pronounced this effect becomes.

Sometimes you can work out the freedom sub-category, sometimes you can't. There's a few things that frequently catch people out so I'll mention them here specifically:

1) The right to privacy is a civil right. Self-explanatory really, but people often associate options that invade privacy with the rights of the invader to do as he pleases, not the rights of the invaded to preserve their privacy.
2) The right to influence politics with bribes / lobbying / money is a political freedom. Political freedom isn't just a "positive".
3) The right of small businesses to have an environment they can survive in (e.g. anti-monopoly legislation), and the right of the worker to unionise / strike etc. are economic freedoms. In other words, the game also considers the economic freedoms of the little guy.

90% of "unexpected effects" on freedoms are from people not realising these three are considered freedoms/rights by the game.

Finally, the Economy score has - in particular - an even more complicated simulation behind it, where your economic output, economic freedoms et al are not always going to correlate with your Economy score as you might expect. Take heart though - the same is true of real world economies, so this is probably weirdly realistic.


"Why didn't tax / unemployment / black market do what I expected it to?"
NS uses a complex model to calculate a lot of things, which can lead to counter-intuitive results.

- Why didn't tax fall when spending was described as reducing (or why didn't it rise when spending was described as rising)?

The answer usually lies in your economic output.
The more economic output you have, the less %tax you need to support your spending.

Bear in mind that economic output is dependent on a lot of interacting factors. Sometimes an option will cause you to shrink your economy by more than you proportionally shrank your spending, causing a tax rise to support the same spending. Sometimes it won't. Often different things will happen to different nations faced with the same issue choice.

- Why didn't tax fall when an option described a corporation tax cut / sales tax cut?

The tax model of the game is very simplistic, and it basically abstracts all spending as income tax and doesn't take into account any idea of government borrowing, deficit spending or tax from sources other than income tax.

That gives us limited tools for simulation.

Corporation tax is rolled into business subsidisation, with lowering of corporate tax representing an effective business subsidisation, and a shifting of tax burden onto the income taxpayer.

Sales tax and VAT, meanwhile, move income tax inversely, as raising more revenue from these forms of taxation decreases the burden on income tax, and vice versa.

This isn't entirely satisfactory, of course, as it means that the descriptions of "Freedom From Taxation" on the graphs aren't accurate, but it's reflective of how the game engine is written and of the simulation's limitations. It basically isn't possible to have burden of taxation and income tax move in opposite directions, as in the simulation all measured tax = income tax.

- Why didn't employment rise/fall when it said we were creating / destroying jobs?

Often, the described effect has taken place, but other changes to your economy could have affected employment elsewhere.
For example, if you create a load of artificial jobs to employ the homeless, you might also weaken your private sector economy through the public sector taking its market share in certain industries. Your economy might shrink, and your net employment could fall, even though you created the jobs you said you would.

- Why didn't black market / state industry / private sector fall or rise like the option said it would?

Again, think whole economy. An option that reduces the market share that goes to the black market but which grows the economy as a whole could result in the absolute market size of the black market increasing, even as you decrease the black market's proportional prominence int he economy.

Finally, remember that issues effects vary according to the nation they effect. The effect it has on your nation is almost certainly not the same effect you'll see on another nation.



"Why did THIS policy switch on or turn off out of line with the issue's story?"
It may be an error, and something to report here.

However, the following policies are not on/off binary flags directed by issue editors, but rather were implemented to change when your nation crosses above or below a certain threshold in various freedoms:

    Theocracy
    Free Press
    State Press
    No Dissent
    Public Protest
    No Marriage
    Arranged Marriage
    Atheism
    Prudity
    State Surveillance

Because these "policies" didn't exist at the time issues were coded, we never considered their activation or deactivation in narratives, and there is some mismatch between how we use certain stats and in these policies interpretations. We've already had multiple reports regarding Theocracy and Free Press.

These things are in discussion backstage, as there is a broad need for fine tuning to take place to make these more reflective and descriptive of nation choices. For now, consider this to be a known bug.


What's going on with doping the water supply and recreational drug use? (December 2017 changes)
Coding changes have moved doping of water out of drug-related freedoms, and instead made this a question of bodily autonomy. Net result is that civil rights drop a little, and the game tends to correlate falling civil rights with falling recreational drug use.

In narrative terms, forced ingestion of drugs is not recreational drug use, it's compulsory drug ingestion. The unit of recreational drug use is Pineapple Fondness Rating, indicating how much the citizenry seek recreational drug use. Indeed, the presence of all those drugs in the water make the population more docile and complaint, and less inclined to - say - have a good time by going out and getting high.

The last step of this process was for the technical team to migrate stats on nations that historically have squiffed stats from this. This has involved basically eliminating the compulsory drug use scale. One unfortunate side effect of this, because math, is that nations who were previously maximally compulsory drug users are now maximally anti-drug. This is the best solution in game stat terms, as it gives the exact same civil rights position as before, though it does mean of course that liberal drug moves will now improve your freedoms rather than leaving them unchanged. This also means that nations that thought they were as pro-drug as they could be (forcing everyone to take drugs) suddenly have a "No Drugs" policy flag, and a much lower recreational drug use than was previously registering.

Just make a single drug-liberal decision, and that policy will disappear. Look on it as previously you having been inappropriately gated from increasing your drug freedoms because of a bad editing/design decision, and now that barrier being removed, so you can show that your nation is pro-drugs, and actually have those choices register. Likewise, look on the change in Recreational Drug Use as the measurement becoming more accurate than before, as it is no longer categorising forced ingestion of any and all chemicals as a tendency towards drugs for recreation.



Some known bugs...
These things are commonly reported unexpected effects, which the technical bods know about, but the fixes for which are held back by technical reasons. Being worked on!
For now, they're just technical flaws that there's no need to re-report, and which we just have to live with. Sorry!

1) Tourism doesn't always go up when you expect it to.
Tourism is excessively dependent on the environment in the current simulation, so an issue that trades environment for additional tourism will normally result in a spurious fall in tourism.

2) Allowing bribes decreases corruption.
The freedom to bribe is a political freedom. Corruption decreases when political freedoms increase.
Therefore the game believes that if you increase freedom to bribe, you decrease corruption. A frequent "manwhut?" moment.
Last edited by Candlewhisper Archive on Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:24 am, edited 19 times in total.
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Jutsa
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Postby Jutsa » Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:54 pm

*Poke*

Thank goodness this is now a sticky. :clap:
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Fauxia
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Postby Fauxia » Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:11 pm

Yay, first query two queries is are mine!

Why did banning bungees on Autocracian Lands decrease its already low lifespan? Albeit only slightly? This was today, issue 376

Also, why does 417.2 always decrease political freedom? It seems unfair to the player, who commonly will use the leader as a representation of themself. Yet when they don't have an affair and say so to their people, corruption skyrockets, and political freedom decreases. What if my leader just, didn't have an affair?
Last edited by Fauxia on Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:28 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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La Badlandoj
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Postby La Badlandoj » Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:41 pm

Thanks for your answer in the last one!

193.1 (giving jobs back to workers after automation kicked them out) lowered my Employment by 3.6%, the inverse of my prediction. What happened with that? Are the employers now habitually outsourcing? Do the newly unemployed robots count as citizens?

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Ransium
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Postby Ransium » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:45 pm

Fauxia wrote:Yay, first query two queries is are mine!

Why did banning bungees on Autocracian Lands decrease its already low lifespan? Albeit only slightly? This was today, issue 376


Lifespan is a funny stat. The answer with lifespan, as with so many other stats is secondary effects. Just spitballing, but I think narratively it's something like, you hurt your economy, which lowered the standard of living, which lowered life spans.

Fauxia wrote:Also, why does 417.2 always decrease political freedom? It seems unfair to the player, who commonly will use the leader as a representation of themself. Yet when they don't have an affair and say so to their people, corruption skyrockets, and political freedom decreases. What if my leader just, didn't have an affair?


Ah, yeah. I'm not a huge fan of that issue and many others aren't either. Go bug Drasnia, we asked him to re-write it months ago.

La Badlandoj wrote:Thanks for your answer in the last one!

193.1 (giving jobs back to workers after automation kicked them out) lowered my Employment by 3.6%, the inverse of my prediction. What happened with that? Are the employers now habitually outsourcing? Do the newly unemployed robots count as citizens?


Check out the third spoiler in CWA's first post, and then let us know if you still have questions.
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Postby The Atlae Isles » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:43 am

*poke*

My issues have totally ruined my stats!!!!!! Someone needs to do something about them!!!!!!1!!1

:bow:
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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:32 pm

The Atlae Isles wrote:*poke*

My issues have totally ruined my stats!!!!!! Someone needs to do something about them!!!!!!1!!1

:bow:


No problem, on it now. Your nation should be deleted within the next 24 hours, and you'll be clear to start again. :)
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Ransium
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Postby Ransium » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:43 pm

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:
The Atlae Isles wrote:*poke*

My issues have totally ruined my stats!!!!!! Someone needs to do something about them!!!!!!1!!1

:bow:


No problem, on it now. Your nation should be deleted within the next 24 hours, and you'll be clear to start again. :)


That's pretty harsh, we could just delete the issues.
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Fauxia
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Postby Fauxia » Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:12 pm

@Ransium how could Drasnia rewrite an issue? He isn't an editor
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Ransium
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Postby Ransium » Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:34 pm

He drafts it here I suppose and then we implement the edits.
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Jutsa
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Postby Jutsa » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:06 pm

507.3: I know it's supposed to rebuild the cheese industry, but mine shot from the negatives to the top 2% of the world in one issue, from -3 or so to roughly 7.5k.
It's in The Final Conglomerated Order - maybe it's because it had pretty much no industry whatsoever?
Last edited by Jutsa on Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Luna Amore » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:45 pm

Jutsa wrote:507.3: I know it's supposed to rebuild the cheese industry, but mine shot from the negatives to the top 2% of the world in one issue, from -3 or so to roughly 7.5k.
It's in The Final Conglomerated Order - maybe it's because it had pretty much no industry whatsoever?

Pashaw, it's only a 94,860% increase! :p

I think it's a combo of there not being an industry beforehand + that nations general pro-business attitude. So you created an industry and then immediately propped it up with subsidies. It'd be a big boost for most nations, you got an even bigger due to how your nation was arranged beforehand.
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Postby Flanderlion » Fri Sep 29, 2017 2:44 am

How come in #700, I picked the option by the Anti-Culture minister and it didn't decrease my culture? Only retail and freedom from taxation went down. I liked the rhymes though, I was almost about to pick option 2 until I saw 4.

Option Picked 4: “This sounds like POETRY!” screams your Minister of Anti-Culture while storming into your office. “All these rhymers must be executed immediately. And don’t forget after they die who’ll get their property: the state. Why, just think of all the jobs killing would-be poets would crea— er, jobs it would make.”

Description/Happening: It is unwise to be a poet even if things rhyme and you don't know it.

Stats:
Black Market
Denarii 4,942,609,050,000,000 → 4,975,430,020,000,000 0.66%

Taxation
Effective Tax Rate 65.83 → 66.18 0.53%

Industry: Pizza Delivery
Pepperoni Propulsion Productivity Index 4,248.61 → 4,254.90 0.15%

Law Enforcement
Orwell Orderliness Index 1,945.68 → 1,948.56 0.15%

Industry: Basket Weaving
Hickory Productivity Index 16,713.75 → 16,738.48 0.15%

Industry: Book Publishing
Bella Potter Productivity e-Index 1,250.34 → 1,252.19 0.15%

Business Subsidization
Gilded Widget Scale 16,012.03 → 16,035.72 0.15%

Industry: Arms Manufacturing
Charon Conveyancy Index 87,243.24 → 87,372.30 0.15%

Industry: Information Technology
Fann-Boi Productivity Index 81,221.18 → 81,341.33 0.15%

Sector: Manufacturing
Gooback-Jerbs Productivity Index 118,374.20 → 118,549.31 0.15%

Defense Forces
Total War Preparedness Rating 36,585.26 → 36,639.38 0.15%

Industry: Furniture Restoration
Spitz-Pollish Productivity Index 20,158.57 → 20,188.39 0.15%

Industry: Gambling
Kelly Criterion Productivity Index 43,920.66 → 43,985.63 0.15%

Industry: Insurance
Risk Expulsion Effectiveness Rating 21,396.16 → 21,427.81 0.15%

Industry: Mining
Blue Sky Asbestos Index 34,065.44 → 34,115.83 0.15%

Industry: Timber Woodchipping
Tasmanian Pulp Environmental Export Index 32,789.58 → 32,838.08 0.15%

Sector: Agriculture
Mu-Bah-Daggs Productivity Index 13,205.14 → 13,224.67 0.15%

Industry: Beverage Sales
Addison-Fukk Productivity Rating 2,819.65 → 2,823.82 0.15%

Industry: Automobile Manufacturing
Henry Ford Productivity Index 14,417.21 → 14,438.53 0.15%

Industry: Cheese Exports
Mozzarella Productivity Index 6,736.54 → 6,746.50 0.15%

Industry: Trout Fishing
Nemo Depletion Efficiency Index 561.38 → 562.21 0.15%

Public Healthcare
Theresa-Nightingale Rating 7,176.71 → 7,187.32 0.15%

Public Transport
Societal Mobility Rating 3,349.13 → 3,354.08 0.15%

Public Education
Edu-tellignce® Test Score 2,743.10 → 2,747.15 0.15%

Economic Output
Denarii 4,366,262,000,000,000 → 4,372,083,000,000,000 0.13%

Average Income of Rich
Denarii 1,500,340.82 → 1,502,340.77 0.13%

Average Income of Poor
Denarii 145,710.21 → 145,904.44 0.13%

Average Income
Denarii 524,035.34 → 524,733.87 0.13%

Corruption
Kickbacks Per Hour 845.17 → 846.03 0.10%

Industry: Retail
Shrinkwrap Consignment Productivity Index 12,299.28 → 12,240.81 0.48%

Freedom From Taxation
Hayek Index -67.70 → -69.82 3.1%
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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:25 am

Ransium wrote:
Candlewhisper Archive wrote:
No problem, on it now. Your nation should be deleted within the next 24 hours, and you'll be clear to start again. :)


That's pretty harsh, we could just delete the issues.


Or the game. That could work too. Let's shut the site down from the end of the week. Anyone wants to know why, it's Atlae Isles' fault.
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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:25 am

Flanderlion wrote:How come in #700, I picked the option by the Anti-Culture minister and it didn't decrease my culture? Only retail and freedom from taxation went down. I liked the rhymes though, I was almost about to pick option 2 until I saw 4.

Option Picked 4: “This sounds like POETRY!” screams your Minister of Anti-Culture while storming into your office. “All these rhymers must be executed immediately. And don’t forget after they die who’ll get their property: the state. Why, just think of all the jobs killing would-be poets would crea— er, jobs it would make.”

Description/Happening: It is unwise to be a poet even if things rhyme and you don't know it.

Stats:
Black Market
Denarii 4,942,609,050,000,000 → 4,975,430,020,000,000 0.66%

Taxation
Effective Tax Rate 65.83 → 66.18 0.53%

Industry: Pizza Delivery
Pepperoni Propulsion Productivity Index 4,248.61 → 4,254.90 0.15%

Law Enforcement
Orwell Orderliness Index 1,945.68 → 1,948.56 0.15%

Industry: Basket Weaving
Hickory Productivity Index 16,713.75 → 16,738.48 0.15%

Industry: Book Publishing
Bella Potter Productivity e-Index 1,250.34 → 1,252.19 0.15%

Business Subsidization
Gilded Widget Scale 16,012.03 → 16,035.72 0.15%

Industry: Arms Manufacturing
Charon Conveyancy Index 87,243.24 → 87,372.30 0.15%

Industry: Information Technology
Fann-Boi Productivity Index 81,221.18 → 81,341.33 0.15%

Sector: Manufacturing
Gooback-Jerbs Productivity Index 118,374.20 → 118,549.31 0.15%

Defense Forces
Total War Preparedness Rating 36,585.26 → 36,639.38 0.15%

Industry: Furniture Restoration
Spitz-Pollish Productivity Index 20,158.57 → 20,188.39 0.15%

Industry: Gambling
Kelly Criterion Productivity Index 43,920.66 → 43,985.63 0.15%

Industry: Insurance
Risk Expulsion Effectiveness Rating 21,396.16 → 21,427.81 0.15%

Industry: Mining
Blue Sky Asbestos Index 34,065.44 → 34,115.83 0.15%

Industry: Timber Woodchipping
Tasmanian Pulp Environmental Export Index 32,789.58 → 32,838.08 0.15%

Sector: Agriculture
Mu-Bah-Daggs Productivity Index 13,205.14 → 13,224.67 0.15%

Industry: Beverage Sales
Addison-Fukk Productivity Rating 2,819.65 → 2,823.82 0.15%

Industry: Automobile Manufacturing
Henry Ford Productivity Index 14,417.21 → 14,438.53 0.15%

Industry: Cheese Exports
Mozzarella Productivity Index 6,736.54 → 6,746.50 0.15%

Industry: Trout Fishing
Nemo Depletion Efficiency Index 561.38 → 562.21 0.15%

Public Healthcare
Theresa-Nightingale Rating 7,176.71 → 7,187.32 0.15%

Public Transport
Societal Mobility Rating 3,349.13 → 3,354.08 0.15%

Public Education
Edu-tellignce® Test Score 2,743.10 → 2,747.15 0.15%

Economic Output
Denarii 4,366,262,000,000,000 → 4,372,083,000,000,000 0.13%

Average Income of Rich
Denarii 1,500,340.82 → 1,502,340.77 0.13%

Average Income of Poor
Denarii 145,710.21 → 145,904.44 0.13%

Average Income
Denarii 524,035.34 → 524,733.87 0.13%

Corruption
Kickbacks Per Hour 845.17 → 846.03 0.10%

Industry: Retail
Shrinkwrap Consignment Productivity Index 12,299.28 → 12,240.81 0.48%

Freedom From Taxation
Hayek Index -67.70 → -69.82 3.1%



Yeah, seems like a gap. We'll discuss then implement something.

edit: Aaaaand done.
Last edited by Candlewhisper Archive on Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Flanderlion
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Postby Flanderlion » Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:48 am

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:
Flanderlion wrote:How come in #700, I picked the option by the Anti-Culture minister and it didn't decrease my culture? Only retail and freedom from taxation went down. I liked the rhymes though, I was almost about to pick option 2 until I saw 4.

Option Picked 4: “This sounds like POETRY!” screams your Minister of Anti-Culture while storming into your office. “All these rhymers must be executed immediately. And don’t forget after they die who’ll get their property: the state. Why, just think of all the jobs killing would-be poets would crea— er, jobs it would make.”

Description/Happening: It is unwise to be a poet even if things rhyme and you don't know it.

Stats:
Black Market
Denarii 4,942,609,050,000,000 → 4,975,430,020,000,000 0.66%

Taxation
Effective Tax Rate 65.83 → 66.18 0.53%

Industry: Pizza Delivery
Pepperoni Propulsion Productivity Index 4,248.61 → 4,254.90 0.15%

Law Enforcement
Orwell Orderliness Index 1,945.68 → 1,948.56 0.15%

Industry: Basket Weaving
Hickory Productivity Index 16,713.75 → 16,738.48 0.15%

Industry: Book Publishing
Bella Potter Productivity e-Index 1,250.34 → 1,252.19 0.15%

Business Subsidization
Gilded Widget Scale 16,012.03 → 16,035.72 0.15%

Industry: Arms Manufacturing
Charon Conveyancy Index 87,243.24 → 87,372.30 0.15%

Industry: Information Technology
Fann-Boi Productivity Index 81,221.18 → 81,341.33 0.15%

Sector: Manufacturing
Gooback-Jerbs Productivity Index 118,374.20 → 118,549.31 0.15%

Defense Forces
Total War Preparedness Rating 36,585.26 → 36,639.38 0.15%

Industry: Furniture Restoration
Spitz-Pollish Productivity Index 20,158.57 → 20,188.39 0.15%

Industry: Gambling
Kelly Criterion Productivity Index 43,920.66 → 43,985.63 0.15%

Industry: Insurance
Risk Expulsion Effectiveness Rating 21,396.16 → 21,427.81 0.15%

Industry: Mining
Blue Sky Asbestos Index 34,065.44 → 34,115.83 0.15%

Industry: Timber Woodchipping
Tasmanian Pulp Environmental Export Index 32,789.58 → 32,838.08 0.15%

Sector: Agriculture
Mu-Bah-Daggs Productivity Index 13,205.14 → 13,224.67 0.15%

Industry: Beverage Sales
Addison-Fukk Productivity Rating 2,819.65 → 2,823.82 0.15%

Industry: Automobile Manufacturing
Henry Ford Productivity Index 14,417.21 → 14,438.53 0.15%

Industry: Cheese Exports
Mozzarella Productivity Index 6,736.54 → 6,746.50 0.15%

Industry: Trout Fishing
Nemo Depletion Efficiency Index 561.38 → 562.21 0.15%

Public Healthcare
Theresa-Nightingale Rating 7,176.71 → 7,187.32 0.15%

Public Transport
Societal Mobility Rating 3,349.13 → 3,354.08 0.15%

Public Education
Edu-tellignce® Test Score 2,743.10 → 2,747.15 0.15%

Economic Output
Denarii 4,366,262,000,000,000 → 4,372,083,000,000,000 0.13%

Average Income of Rich
Denarii 1,500,340.82 → 1,502,340.77 0.13%

Average Income of Poor
Denarii 145,710.21 → 145,904.44 0.13%

Average Income
Denarii 524,035.34 → 524,733.87 0.13%

Corruption
Kickbacks Per Hour 845.17 → 846.03 0.10%

Industry: Retail
Shrinkwrap Consignment Productivity Index 12,299.28 → 12,240.81 0.48%

Freedom From Taxation
Hayek Index -67.70 → -69.82 3.1%



Yeah, seems like a gap. We'll discuss then implement something.

edit: Aaaaand done.

Thanks, was a ton quicker than I expected.
As always, I'm representing myself as a citizen, rather than as part of the Government, if I am at the time.

User avatar
Bear Connors Paradiso
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 63
Founded: Jan 03, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bear Connors Paradiso » Sat Sep 30, 2017 2:07 pm

Issue 257, option 1. Leader assassined....almost, give the people a tax break to make them happy and not want to murder you.

Taxes went unchanged. Freedom of taxes went up and all of my businesses dependent on taxes went down. In the past, this issue would decrease taxes.

EDIT: After reading the OP I guess I'm still confused, haha. Which kind of tax in this issue were they planning on cutting ? Maybe it needs to be reworded/updated.
Last edited by Bear Connors Paradiso on Sat Sep 30, 2017 2:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Fauxia
Minister
 
Posts: 2402
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Fauxia » Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:31 pm

Bear Connors Paradiso wrote:Issue 257, option 1. Leader assassined....almost, give the people a tax break to make them happy and not want to murder you.

Taxes went unchanged. Freedom of taxes went up and all of my businesses dependent on taxes went down. In the past, this issue would decrease taxes.

EDIT: After reading the OP I guess I'm still confused, haha. Which kind of tax in this issue were they planning on cutting ? Maybe it needs to be reworded/updated.
You May find it difficult to decrease taxation when you don’t collect any already
Citizen of the Rejected Realms. Got Issues-er. You name it, as long as it isn’t “relevant”
Ambassador: Benedict Corwin, Intern: Nicholas Cantor

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Drasnia
Minister
 
Posts: 2248
Founded: Feb 02, 2012
Anarchy

Postby Drasnia » Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:41 pm

Fauxia wrote:
Bear Connors Paradiso wrote:Issue 257, option 1. Leader assassined....almost, give the people a tax break to make them happy and not want to murder you.

Taxes went unchanged. Freedom of taxes went up and all of my businesses dependent on taxes went down. In the past, this issue would decrease taxes.

EDIT: After reading the OP I guess I'm still confused, haha. Which kind of tax in this issue were they planning on cutting ? Maybe it needs to be reworded/updated.
You May find it difficult to decrease taxation when you don’t collect any already

Au contraire

User avatar
Fauxia
Minister
 
Posts: 2402
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Fauxia » Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:11 am

Drasnia wrote:
Fauxia wrote:You May find it difficult to decrease taxation when you don’t collect any already

Au contraire
Not saying you can’t, but it isn’t easy
Citizen of the Rejected Realms. Got Issues-er. You name it, as long as it isn’t “relevant”
Ambassador: Benedict Corwin, Intern: Nicholas Cantor

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Jadefall
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 7
Founded: Sep 03, 2017
Corporate Police State

Postby Jadefall » Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:31 am

Why did issue 406, nuking Brasilistan, do this:

https://www.nationstates.net/nation=jad ... ensusid=60

(increase of 9.6 to 372)

to my recreational drug use? Did everyone suddenly fall into a pit of guilt and depression and head to the opium dens, or did we celebrate a bit too hard and and accidentally wind up with long term drug addictions?

Cheers.
Last edited by Jadefall on Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:49 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Sanctaria
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 6660
Founded: Sep 12, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Sanctaria » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:10 am

Jadefall wrote:Why did issue 406, nuking Brasilistan, do this:

https://www.nationstates.net/nation=jad ... ensusid=60

(increase of 9.6 to 372)

to my recreational drug use? Did everyone suddenly fall into a pit of guilt and depression and head to the opium dens, or did we celebrate a bit too hard and and accidentally wind up with long term drug addictions?

Cheers.

Issue 406 has nothing to do with the increase in your recreational drug score. That happened when you answered issue 641.
Divine Republic of Sanctaria

Ideological Bulwark #258
Member of UNOG

Dr. Katherine Saunders ORD DSJ, Sanctarian Ambassador to the World Assembly
Author of:
GA#109 GA#133 GA#176 GA#201 GA#222 GA#297
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User avatar
Jadefall
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 7
Founded: Sep 03, 2017
Corporate Police State

Postby Jadefall » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:23 am

"Issue 406 has nothing to do with the increase in your recreational drug score. That happened when you answered issue 641."

Oh, I see. Apologies, my mistake - grateful for your response Sanctaria, wild goose chase averted!
Last edited by Jadefall on Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Candlewhisper Archive
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 11342
Founded: Aug 28, 2015
Corporate Bordello

Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:16 am

Bear Connors Paradiso wrote:Issue 257, option 1. Leader assassined....almost, give the people a tax break to make them happy and not want to murder you.

Taxes went unchanged. Freedom of taxes went up and all of my businesses dependent on taxes went down. In the past, this issue would decrease taxes.

EDIT: After reading the OP I guess I'm still confused, haha. Which kind of tax in this issue were they planning on cutting ? Maybe it needs to be reworded/updated.


Taxes did decrease, but not a large enough change to register, given your nations starting point. As you noted, the 0.09% increase in Freedom from Taxation and the -0.33% change in government size was measuring the same change, but at 14 billion souls, your nation is so well established and set in its ways that it's hard to see a lot of stat changes unless you go against your usual style.
Editors like linguistic ambiguity more than most people.

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Trotterdam
Senator
 
Posts: 4451
Founded: Jan 12, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Trotterdam » Sun Oct 01, 2017 3:11 pm

Why did the last option on #755 (about abolishing government secrets) lower Integrity? And by so much?

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