US imposes 220% import tariff on Bombardier airplanes

[Trumptonium]

Canadian manufacturer Bombardier is facing an existential threat after it's biggest importer, the United States, imposed a tariff of 220% on the planes which were previous tariff-free. Alongside this, their rail business will take a hit as the second and third largest players, Siemens and Alstom, announced a merger to create the biggest railcar manufacturer in the world, overtaking Bombardier and having a monopoly in France. But that's not the topic to discuss.

I think it's great that the United States is finally moving away from moronic ideas of free trade, where American blue collar workers lose jobs left right and centre due to either unwarranted and undemocratic trade deals signed by their moral superiors, or due to the lack of action in both making domestic industry competitive, and with taking steps on fundamentally unfair trade with other countries. It's the first sign that Trump is genuinely serious about the end of the economic rape of the middle class and the demise manufacturing industry, and he's not alone with Japan reversing policy by 20 years and having introduced two tariffs two months ago already, including on frozen beef from the US.

https://www.ft.com/content/2de9932c-a31 ... 5e6a7c98a2

What do you think of the tariff?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

It's only going to screw over the American consumer.

Whatever happened to "no one owes you a job?"

[Skyhooked]

Personally I don't like tariffs at all. Tariffs are just some unfair tool of corporations, who ascended to have their loyal men in government, or at least I think so.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Canada is going to be pissed.
And if the USA wants to play the tariffs game then let's all start with it again.
I don't want to hear the USA bitching later that they can't sell their goods.

[Plzen]

Apparently the United States is a developing country trying to do import-substitution industrialisation now. What fun.

What exactly is the United States trying to accomplish by trying to protect an uncompetitive manufacturing sector? They don't want to be a service economy anymore?

This feels more like a populist vote-grabbing measure than an actual, thought-out economic policy.

[Purpelia]

Apparently the United States is a developing country trying to do import-substitution industrialisation now. What fun.

What exactly is the United States trying to accomplish by trying to protect an uncompetitive manufacturing sector? They don't want to be a service economy anymore?

This feels more like a populist vote-grabbing measure than an actual, thought-out economic policy.

Service economies are suicide economies. That's what.

Simple fact is that manufacturing economies produce new value whilst service economies don't. Therefore any and all wealth in a service economy is artificial and true growth is impossible. Service economies also tend to provide less jobs and worse jobs as they are all going to either be uneducated service labor or high education knowledge labor, the former of which is bad and underpaid and the later having a high barrier for entry. Which is the primary reason for your mass unemployment problems. And of course it leaves your country entirely dependent on foreign whims when it comes to industrial production. What happens if in a couple years time China decides that it does not want to sell the west any more semiconductors?

Protectionist measures are good. Industrial economies are good. Service economies are bad.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Protecting domestic jobs is one of the primary duties of a national government.

People's lives and hopes being destroyed through idleness resulting from excessive foreign competition. Cheaper goods for the majority, secured by throwing unfortunate workers under the bus, and then doubling down on squeezing the begrudging welfare payments to the breadline to ensure that the lucky receive only the most minimal taxation burden.

Sign of the selfish and naive internationalist times.

[Fusion Corp]

I mean, it's a great way to make stuff more expensive. Won't do anything else, though.

[Saiwania]

This could be Trump's doing, he's supposedly a protectionist; but I haven't seen him actually go through with it- could this be it?

[Donut section]

Tariffs are bad mkay.
Yeah so is Canada, but tariffs are worse.

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

The Tariff is to combat subsidies. The company was getting a huge competitive edge because the Canadian government was paying for it. This is why American companies couldn't compete.

[Vassenor]

The Tariff is to combat subsidies. The company was getting a huge competitive edge because the Canadian government was paying for it. This is why American companies couldn't compete.

Gonna need some sauce on that one.

Also in response to this I present the American government's subsidising of the US cotton industry to the point where the rest of the world can't compete.

[Albrenia]

I remember not so long ago when the right was all about free trade and the 'invisible hand of the market'. I guess protectionism is cool now?

[Eastfield Lodge]

The Tariff is to combat subsidies. The company was getting a huge competitive edge because the Canadian government was paying for it. This is why American companies couldn't compete.

Gonna need some sauce on that one.

Also in response to this I present the American government's subsidising of the US cotton industry to the point where the rest of the world can't compete.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-41397181

£750m from Quebec, £130m from the Brits. Speaking of which, it's sort of ironic and hilarious that the UK is a little pissed off that the US are putting the 4,100 Northern Irish Bombardier jobs at risk, given the whole 'special relationship' and potential tariff relief the UK were hoping to get from the world post-Brexit.

Also, whose competition is this stifling? Boeing doesn't even produce the type of aeroplanes that have had the tariffs imposed, and they were the main ones complaining about Bombardier in the first place (maybe something to do with Delta buying over £4bn worth of these specific planes).

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

The Tariff is to combat subsidies. The company was getting a huge competitive edge because the Canadian government was paying for it. This is why American companies couldn't compete.

Gonna need some sauce on that one.

Also in response to this I present the American government's subsidising of the US cotton industry to the point where the rest of the world can't compete.

US farming in general and big pharma are heavily subsidized. I am not saying the US doesn't do it just that every poster above me ignored it.

[Saiwania]

I remember not so long ago when the right was all about free trade and the 'invisible hand of the market'. I guess protectionism is cool now?

The US arguably became developed because of protectionism to some extent. Tariffs were crucial for protecting infant industries until it got big enough to not need it anymore. Steve Bannon is right in saying that it is such a crock that immigration is what made the US better off- no, it was clearly a continent full of mineral resources, skilled and competitive labor, and economic nationalism throughout most of the entire 19th century if not early 20th century as well.

[Vassenor]

Gonna need some sauce on that one.

Also in response to this I present the American government's subsidising of the US cotton industry to the point where the rest of the world can't compete.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-41397181

£750m from Quebec, £130m from the Brits. Speaking of which, it's sort of ironic and hilarious that the UK is a little pissed off that the US are putting the 4,100 Northern Irish Bombardier jobs at risk, given the whole 'special relationship' and potential tariff relief the UK were hoping to get from the world post-Brexit.

Also, whose competition is this stifling? Boeing doesn't even produce the type of aeroplanes that have had the tariffs imposed, and they were the main ones complaining about Bombardier in the first place (maybe something to do with Delta buying over £4bn worth of these specific planes).

From the looks of things the CSeries is competing directly with the 737MAX.

[Eastfield Lodge]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-41397181

£750m from Quebec, £130m from the Brits. Speaking of which, it's sort of ironic and hilarious that the UK is a little pissed off that the US are putting the 4,100 Northern Irish Bombardier jobs at risk, given the whole 'special relationship' and potential tariff relief the UK were hoping to get from the world post-Brexit.

Also, whose competition is this stifling? Boeing doesn't even produce the type of aeroplanes that have had the tariffs imposed, and they were the main ones complaining about Bombardier in the first place (maybe something to do with Delta buying over £4bn worth of these specific planes).

From the looks of things the CSeries is competing directly with the 737MAX.

Not according to Delta:

Delta, however, said there was no risk to US businesses as neither Boeing nor any other US firm produced 100-110 seat aircraft to compete with the C-Series.

[Vassenor]

From the looks of things the CSeries is competing directly with the 737MAX.

Not according to Delta:

Delta, however, said there was no risk to US businesses as neither Boeing nor any other US firm produced 100-110 seat aircraft to compete with the C-Series.

The initial suit was filed with the USITC by Boeing with the allegation that Bombardier was selling the planes to Delta at a massive loss in an attempt to price them out of the market.

[Costa Fierro]

I think it's great that the United States is finally moving away from moronic ideas of free trade

Because apparently free and fair competition is OK as long as your country dictates terms?

where American blue collar workers lose jobs left right and centre

What jobs are being lost to Bombardier? Also, do you not realize how prolific Bombardier's products are in the United States? Skywest Airlines alone operates 309 Bombardier aircraft, all of which are less than 100 seats, something which Boeing doesn't make. There's also an additional 217 Bombardier aircraft in commercial service in the United States. Lord knows how many private jets Bombardier sells. And you know which major American aircraft manufacturers compete directly with Bombardier for market share? Three. All of them are in the business jet market, and they certainly do not have any disadvantages when it comes to their products.

or due to the lack of action in both making domestic industry competitive

That's the thing about capitalism: if what you make isn't competitive, you improve it, or you go out of business. That's what keeps American motor companies in business: not because their cars are any good (although they are less shit than they used to be), it's because they have huge captive markets in North America.

and with taking steps on fundamentally unfair trade with other countries.

How is this fair to Canada? The government imposing a 220% tariff on Bombardier only helps three companies, and potentially puts tens of thousands of workers in Canada (which by the way isn't a third world country with low wages, they've been losing manufacturing jobs to places like Mexico) at risk of being unemployed because President Trump thinks that somehow Canada of all countries poses a threat to American economic hegemony in North America.

The CS Series is actually a breath of fresh air in a market that is crowded by Boeing or the European consortium known as Airbus, both of which have a duopoly on the single isle airliner market. It's not going to threaten either of them because they already have a well established and well received product on the market.

It's the first sign that Trump is genuinely serious about the end of the economic rape of the middle class and the demise manufacturing industry

Bull-fucking-shit. Trump doesn't give two shits about the middle classes or the Rust Belt, because those factories are gone and, barring some sort of retarded policy of making Americans work for half of the federal minimum wage (which will never happen even under the GOP), they're not coming back. This doesn't help the middle classes and it certainly doesn't help anyone other than the few thousand people working for Gulfstream Aerospace, Cessna and Learjet (which ironically is owned by Bombardier).

[Costa Fierro]

The initial suit was filed with the USITC by Boeing with the allegation that Bombardier was selling the planes to Delta at a massive loss in an attempt to price them out of the market.

Which would be a retarded move because Boeing no longer makes anything in that particular size range and hasn't done so since the 717 went west in 2006.

From the looks of things the CSeries is competing directly with the 737MAX.

Only the CS300, which can seat a maximum of 160 passengers. It puts it in direct competition with the 737 MAX 7 and the MAX 8.

[Dooom35796821595]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-41397181

Stupid move is stupid. And in an entirely predictable move, the UK threatens Boeing military contracts worth far more then this nonsense.

And wasn't America accused of doing the same thing for Boeing that they are now accusing Canada and the UK of doing?

[Costa Fierro]

And wasn't America accused of doing the same thing for Boeing that they are now accusing Canada and the UK of doing?

Not accused, it already does. Boeing's commercial operations received around $13 billion in state and local subsidies in the fifteen years to 2015, in addition to federal grants. Not only that, the WTO ruled that the company's additional $3.8 billion in subsidies from the Department of Defence was illegal.

[Topoliani]

y doe?

[Polvatsiya]

North Korea goes boom