[DRAFT] Mind the Wage Gap

[Corneliaburg]

This is an issue I've written. I need all help I can get! Thanks for your time.

Because of an article, written by the famous feminist Snoop Doggy Dog, about men earning more money than women a furious debate has shaken your country.

"I can't accept that my daughter will earn less money than her peers men when she grows up" says Snoop Doggy Dog. "Our society requires a total income equality between men and women. The biggest issue is that workplaces with male-intensive occupation got higher payment. Every workplace should be forced to have 50/50 men and women." Mutters Snoop Doggy Dog between puffs from his tobacco free cigarette. "It may cost to implement the laws and it may be hard to get right man/women in right place. But it will all pay out in the end. Because like my dear friend Feyoncé one said: 'if women received pay equal to their male counterparts, the US. economy would produce 447.6 billion dollars in additional income.' That have to be right. Right?"

"This is crazy! " says someone who introduces him self as Gohn Jray. "There is a reason that women earn less than men. Men needs too feel that they are the provider of the family and women wants to feel protected. A family where a woman is the main provider slowly tears apart by the mans insecurity in his roll and by the lack of the womans emotional work that she, instead of providing her man and children with gentle and sensitive care that a family needs. Instead she puts her energy in her work where she turns into a hard, cold and hideous careerist. It is important for our species that we keep our system."

"What good do men do anyway?" Says Ann Smith, writer at the magasine 'Done with men'. "They start the wars, they stand for the big majority of all rapes and other violence crimes, like hitting their wives and each other." She says with badly hidden rage. "With only nonmen in decisional roles and no men working at all we would have a much more peaceful society. What we will do with all of them will be an issue, but one step at a time."

This is a new edition. Is it necessary to do an issue similar to debates in the US? I mean, our states are fictional and there are countries where women actually have lower wage than men.
I'm really thankful for everybodys input and help .
So please tell me what you think about this!

Because of an article, written by the famous feminist Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@, about men earning more money than women in @@NAME@@, a furious debate has shaken your country.

"I can't accept that my daughter will earn less money than her peers men when she grows up" says Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@. "Our society requires a total income equality between men and women. The biggest issue is that workplaces with male-intensive occupation got higher payment. Every workplace should be forced to have 50/50 men and women." Mutters Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@ between puffs from his tobacco free cigarette. "It may cost to implement the laws and it may be hard to get the right man/women in right place. But it will all pay out in the end. Because like my dear friend Mayonnaicé once said: 'if women received pay equal to their male counterparts, the economy would produce a billion quadrillions @@CURRENCYPLURAL@@ in additional income.' That have to be right. Right?"

"This is crazy!" says someone who introduces him self as Gohn Jray. "First of all, giving women a raise would not necessarily make the economy grow. Second, there is a reason that women earn less than men in the first place. Men needs too feel that they are the provider of the family and women wants to feel protected. A family, where a woman is the main provider, slowly tears apart by the mans insecurity in his roll and by the lack of the womans emotional work. Instead of providing her man and children with gentle and sensitive care that a family needs she puts her energy in her work where she turns into a hard, cold and hideous careerist. It is important for our species that we always let the man earn more than women."

"What good do men do anyway?" Says Ann Smith, writer at the magasine 'Done with men'. "They start the wars, they stand for the big majority of all rapes and other violence crimes, like hitting their wives and each other." She says with badly hidden rage. "With only nonmen in decisional roles and no men working at all we would have a much more peaceful society. What we will do with all of them will be an issue, but one step at a time. Let's clean @@NAME@@ from all the influences from men and make our nation the utopia it could be!"

[Australian rePublic]

Hello and welcome to Got Issues! It's always nice to see a new writer!

Excellent for a first draft

Now, I'm gonna be abrupt and to the point, which is a reflection of my personality, not your work:

Let's see your options:
1. Men are earning more money than women
2. Men are earning more money than women
3. Men are never the victims of rape or domestic violence. There is no such thing as false allegations of rape or domestic violence

Seriously, All that this issue does is deamonise men

[Corneliaburg]

I see your point. I'll think about maybe nuance it a bit. On the other hand it was supposed to be silly, not realistic. Otherwise it feels like one of the options is going to be the 'right" one to chose. The one that nows that the society is not just about gender, that it is other dimensions, and that inequality is something complex to solve, it's not something that you do over a day, and who doesn't think that men are animals, always the predators and never the victim.
Do you have any ideas on how to do different?

[Tinhampton]

A few suggestions/tips:

• Title suggestion: "Mind The Wage Gap?" Include the issue title in your thread title as well!
• All of your options need to have effects (for example, "@@ANIMAL@@skin bags are all the rage in @@NAME@@" - which, in my case, would read "Ballskin bags are all the rage in Tinhampton"). Do NOT include stat effects, however.
• Snoop Doggy Dog and Féyonce - in their names, not actions - are awfully similar to their real world counterparts. Why not give them names that are different enough not to draw immediate comparisons, but close enough to make them look like parodies?
• Do not reference real-world statistics like Snoop Doggy Dog does in Option 1. Instead of "...the US. economy would produce 447.6 billion dollars in additional income", why not use "...the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ economy would produce billions of @@CURRENCYPLURAL@@ in additional income"?
• Option 2: "him self" --> "him self". | "Men needs... women wants" --> "Men need... women want". Is Gohn Jray supposed to be confusing when he speaks?
• Maybe this could do with an option by a person complaining that A - men already have to earn the same as women, B - the wage-gap statistics do not account for people working in different jobs for different wages, and C - womens' maternity leave could account for lower pay?

[Corneliaburg]

Thank you for your advices. I'll work on it and then return.

[Corneliaburg]

And I'll have to add that "Mind the Wage Gap" is the perfect name

[Australian rePublic]

Please put the Issue Title in the Thread Title. Please

[Australian rePublic]

You shouldn't have two options which say that the gender pay gap exists. I think you would benefit from trying to research the other side of the debate

[Corneliaburg]

I've moved my message to the top.

[Egyptian Pharocracy]

There should probably be at least one option that brings up the (extremely unpopular) perspective that the "wage gap" is either nonexistent or brought about by other many factors than merely "we pay women less because we can! (evil laugh)" such as women electing to pursue different career paths and different work choices than men, women not opting for the overtime and long hours that men do, women choosing lower risk careers, etc etc. (Seriously: even a cursory search engine perusal will turn up lots of ammo you can use for the countervailing opinions.)

Having at least one option giving the counter argument will make it less clear cut and less of a "well of course every right thinking person knows that... " weighted, and less easy for a player to pick an "obviously right" option.

It'll also make it less likely for a conservative or libertarian oriented player to just read the setup and options and go, "Pshyeah, riiiigggghhhhttt... Dismissed!" out of hand.

It would be a nice touch if the conservative speaker presenting the opposite viewpoint wasn't presented as being an automatically insane or cackling evil caricature of an "Ebul Raght Winger" like so many are. (Which is a stereotype that generally gets me to hit the Auto-Dismissed button.)

This is a new edition.

New editions should really go in the original post, above the [Spoiler] tag hidden first and other previous drafts, so as to keep all of the drafts in one place for easier finding and reading. That tends to be the accepted convention on drafting issues in this forum, at least that I've seen.

[Fauxia]

Doesn't the title already exist? Can't find it, actually, and Tinhampton tends to know these things.

[Fauxia]

This is a new edition. Is it necessary to do an issue similar to debates in the US? I mean, our states are fictional and there are countries where women actually have lower wage than men.
I'm really thankful for everybodys input and help .
So please tell me what you think about this!

Because of an article, written by the famous feminist Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@, about men earning more money than women in @@NAME@@, a furious debate has shaken your country.

"I can't accept that my daughter will earn less money than her peers men when she grows up" says Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@. "Our society requires a total income equality between men and women. The biggest issue is that workplaces with male-intensive occupation got higher payment. Every workplace should be forced to have 50/50 men and women." Mutters Snoop @@ANIMAL@@y @@ANIMAL@@ between puffs from his tobacco free cigarette. "It may cost to implement the laws and it may be hard to get the right man/women in right place. But it will all pay out in the end. Because like my dear friend Mayonnaicé once said: 'if women received pay equal to their male counterparts, the economy would produce a billion quadrillions @@CURRENCYPLURAL@@ in additional income.' That have to be right. Right?"

"This is crazy!" says someone who introduces him self as Gohn Jray. "First of all, giving women a raise would not necessarily make the economy grow. Second, there is a reason that women earn less than men in the first place. Men needs too feel that they are the provider of the family and women wants to feel protected. A family, where a woman is the main provider, slowly tears apart by the mans insecurity in his roll and by the lack of the womans emotional work. Instead of providing her man and children with gentle and sensitive care that a family needs she puts her energy in her work where she turns into a hard, cold and hideous careerist. It is important for our species that we always let the man earn more than women."

"What good do men do anyway?" Says Ann Smith, writer at the magasine 'Done with men'. "They start the wars, they stand for the big majority of all rapes and other violence crimes, like hitting their wives and each other." She says with badly hidden rage. "With only nonmen in decisional roles and no men working at all we would have a much more peaceful society. What we will do with all of them will be an issue, but one step at a time. Let's clean @@NAME@@ from all the influences from men and make our nation the utopia it could be!"

Put this at the top of the page in the future so that we find it more easily.

Also, check for overlap: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic ... 3&t=88#173

[Tinhampton]

There should probably be at least one option that brings up the (extremely unpopular) perspective that the "wage gap" is either nonexistent or brought about by other many factors than merely "we pay women less because we can! (evil laugh)" such as women electing to pursue different career paths and different work choices than men, women not opting for the overtime and long hours that men do, women choosing lower risk careers, etc etc. (Seriously: even a cursory search engine perusal will turn up lots of ammo you can use for the countervailing opinions.)

This was the point I was trying to make to Corneliaburg in my original suggestions post.

Doesn't the title already exist? Can't find it, actually, and Tinhampton tends to know these things.

No. The only issue to mention the word "wage" in the title is Issue #224 "Minimum Wage War".

[Corneliaburg]

Ok. Point taken. For me, all options are a bit banas so for me it feels weird to do one sane opinion who thinks that we just can't make it this simple. Is it because the subject provoces you or is it cause you really thinks that all issues should have one option who don't want to do that much? It may sound like I am ironic or something but is actually an honest question.
I'll see if I can do something that does not seem too sane, or what I should call it. I would really like some tips. And by the way Gohn Jray is of course John Gray, the author of men are from Mars, women are from Venus. It would be wrong to say that this is he's exact opinions but he is my inspiration, so to speak. And it's not because he is evil but because he believes that men are logic and women emotional, to make a long story short.

[Fauxia]

Ok. Point taken. For me, all options are a bit banas so for me it feels weird to do one sane opinion who thinks that we just can't make it this simple. Is it because the subject provoces you or is it cause you really thinks that all issues should have one option who don't want to do that much? It may sound like I am ironic or something but is actually an honest question.
I'll see if I can do something that does not seem too sane, or what I should call it. I would really like some tips. And by the way Gohn Jray is of course John Gray, the author of men are from Mars, women are from Venus. It would be wrong to say that this is he's exact opinions but he is my inspiration, so to speak. And it's not because he is evil but because he believes that men are logic and women emotional, to make a long story short.

*Bananas

[Trotterdam]

Banananas.

[Harttland]

There should probably be at least one option that brings up the (extremely unpopular) perspective that the "wage gap" is either nonexistent or brought about by other many factors than merely "we pay women less because we can! (evil laugh)" such as women electing to pursue different career paths and different work choices than men, women not opting for the overtime and long hours that men do, women choosing lower risk careers, etc etc. (Seriously: even a cursory search engine perusal will turn up lots of ammo you can use for the countervailing opinions.)

Having at least one option giving the counter argument will make it less clear cut and less of a "well of course every right thinking person knows that... " weighted, and less easy for a player to pick an "obviously right" option.

It'll also make it less likely for a conservative or libertarian oriented player to just read the setup and options and go, "Pshyeah, riiiigggghhhhttt... Dismissed!" out of hand.

It would be a nice touch if the conservative speaker presenting the opposite viewpoint wasn't presented as being an automatically insane or cackling evil caricature of an "Ebul Raght Winger" like so many are. (Which is a stereotype that generally gets me to hit the Auto-Dismissed button.)

This is a new edition.

New editions should really go in the original post, above the [Spoiler] tag hidden first and other previous drafts, so as to keep all of the drafts in one place for easier finding and reading. That tends to be the accepted convention on drafting issues in this forum, at least that I've seen.

How is that an unpopular belief? You do know the wage gap only exists because women tend to choose less high-paying jobs than men, and tend to take many more leaves od absense? Companies don't pay women less judt for the hell of it, otherwise they'd only higher women.

As for the issue, I think you could work on making it a little less bias, and maybe adding an option pointing out the factors that go into women receiving less money.

[Australian rePublic]

This is an issue I've written. I need allhelp I can get! Thanks for your time.

We're trying to help you, but you're not listening to us

[b]This is a new edition. Is it necessary to do an issue similar to debates in the US?

Not just the USA, sweetheart, there are other countries out there. Once again, RESEARCH THE TOPIC. All it takes is a quick Google search. Also, regarding your "gender pay gap", in the USA, there are more unemployed men than what there are unemployed women. Please explain to me how such a great difference in unemployment statistics contributes to your "gender pay gap"
SOURCE: https://www.bls.gov/web/empsit/cpseea10.htm

mean, our states are fictional and there are countries where women actually have lower wage than men.

No. Issues are supposed to take a neutral and even-handed perspective of topics. Please don't fill them with blatent biasty