What is the general consensus on Ben Shapiro?

by **Draica** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:02 pm

This game is known for it's traditionally liberal player base. However, I've noticed as the 2016 political season heated up, an influx of right or centre-right folks poured into NSG, which has been emblematic of the clashes that have been happening lately in this very forum.

A figure of this tumultuous political season (and of the Conservative movement in general) is Ben Shapiro, political commentator, lawyer and author. What is particularly distinctive about Shapiro is that many on the right hail him as a 'master debater', someone who no left wing pundit or academic can beat in an intellectual battle. This sentiment is probably attributed to his quick wit, high analytical and logical reasoning skills, and his clear grasp of the facts of a topic.

Question is, what does NSG, particularly liberals (and conservatives) think of Ben Shapiro? Secondly, do you believe anyone in the academic field can beat him in a debate?

Here's an example of his debating skills:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__Vj3DXwOBI

Here's what I think: I think he's a rather arrogant person, though he may be the future for the intellectual conservative movement. He is in the mold of Von Mises, Alan Keyes, and other prominent conservative intellectuals.

Having said that, I don't believe he is infallible. I believe he can be beat in a debate by a philosophically minded person, as opposed to a pundit who sticks to rehearsed talking points.

by **Pope Joan** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:50 pm

I have never known a debater who was not insufferably arrogant.

by **Vassenor** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:59 pm

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ben_Shapiro

Pretty sure that if that level of insanity is the future of conservatism, that is not a good sign for the movement.

by **The East Marches II** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:02 pm

Vassenor wrote:http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ben_Shapiro

Pretty sure that if that level of insanity is the future of conservatism, that is not a good sign for the movement.

>Rational Wiki

by **Vassenor** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:03 pm

The East Marches II wrote:
Vassenor wrote:http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ben_Shapiro

Pretty sure that if that level of insanity is the future of conservatism, that is not a good sign for the movement.

>Rational Wiki

Is this going to happen every time someone cites a source you don't personally approve of?

Or maybe you can explain how it is wrong rather than hiding behind picspam.

by **The East Marches II** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:10 pm

Vassenor wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
>Rational Wiki

Is this going to happen every time someone cites a source you don't personally approve of?

Or maybe you can explain how it is wrong rather than hiding behind picspam.

Its rationalwiki, thats like using the Daily Mail as a source. It has a very well known bias with many errors. Its going to happen when somebody like you who is so wont to question sources posts something questionable themselves. Standards and all that even despite my dislike of Shapiro.

by **San Marlindo** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:20 pm

Thunder Place wrote:Two threads on the same subject, on the same day? If you have a crush on the man, just call him.

This.

Also I've never heard of this guy and fail to grasp why he's important.

by **Vassenor** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:23 pm

So what bias and errors are present in that article then?

by **Traceynia** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:24 pm

He seems pretty insane.

by **Judah** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:32 pm

Ben is an intelligent and excellent, skilled debater (particularly when facing ignorant leftists). His podcast is great.

You should know better than to ask a question like this on NSG.

by **Italios** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:37 pm

Vassenor wrote:http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ben_Shapiro

Pretty sure that if that level of insanity is the future of conservatism, that is not a good sign for the movement.

Hm, sounds like a good fit for PragerU.

by **The East Marches II** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:45 pm

Thunder Place wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
Its rationalwiki, thats like using the Daily Mail as a source. It has a very well known bias with many errors. Its going to happen when somebody like you who is so wont to question sources posts something questionable themselves. Standards and all that even despite my dislike of Shapiro.

I'm curious to know more about your opposition to rational wiki.

Its the liberal counterpart to Conservapedia. Ideologically based articles with no interest impartial in the slightest. Strawmen everywhere. M8, should we start calling Metapedia a valid source too?

by **Jamzmania** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:46 pm

I like him.

by **The East Marches II** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 5:48 pm

Vassenor wrote:So what bias and errors are present in that article then?

If I dissect it, are you just gonna give a " :eyebrow:

" as a reply?

by **The East Marches II** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:07 pm

Thunder Place wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
Its the liberal counterpart to Conservapedia. Ideologically based articles with no interest impartial in the slightest. Strawmen everywhere. M8, should we start calling Metapedia a valid source too?

I see. Can you think of any examples that demonstrate your point particularly well?

The Apple article for one was very poorly done. It is not a proper wiki, it is a political opinion section. Compare and contrast the normal Wikipedia page and you'll get the idea.

by **Jello Biafra** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:23 pm

There isn't anything about him to distinguish him from any other conservative, other than that he's Jewish.

by **Grave_n_idle** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:55 pm

Draica wrote:This game is known for it's traditionally liberal player base. However, I've noticed as the 2016 political season heated up, an influx of right or centre-right folks poured into NSG, which has been emblematic of the clashes that have been happening lately in this very forum.

A figure of this tumultuous political season (and of the Conservative movement in general) is Ben Shapiro, political commentator, lawyer and author. What is particularly distinctive about Shapiro is that many on the right hail him as a 'master debater', someone who no left wing pundit or academic can beat in an intellectual battle. This sentiment is probably attributed to his quick wit, high analytical and logical reasoning skills, and his clear grasp of the facts of a topic.

Question is, what does NSG, particularly liberals (and conservatives) think of Ben Shapiro? Secondly, do you believe anyone in the academic field can beat him in a debate?

Here's an example of his debating skills:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__Vj3DXwOBI

Here's what I think: I think he's a rather arrogant person, though he may be the future for the intellectual conservative movement. He is in the mold of Von Mises, Alan Keyes, and other prominent conservative intellectuals.

Having said that, I don't believe he is infallible. I believe he can be beat in a debate by a philosophically minded person, as opposed to a pundit who sticks to rehearsed talking points.

He's like a human personification of Fox News - he pretends to be objective and factual while churning out ideological horseshit to an audience happy to accept it without question.

End Gay Erasure · by **Crockerland** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:27 pm

He has a lot of skill when it comes to debating, though his ideas aren't quite as great.

Of course, as his position on the political compass is right of Marxism, the general consensus of NSG will probably be that he's "insane", "arrogant", and/or some other inapplicable ad hominem attack.

by **Grave_n_idle** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:31 pm

Crockerland wrote:He has a lot of skill when it comes to debating, though his ideas aren't quite as great.

Of course, as his position on the political compass is right of Marxism, the general consensus of NSG will probably be that he's "insane", "arrogant", and/or some other inapplicable ad hominem attack.

I don't think it's his position on the spectrum that invalidates his contribution. I think the proof is in the pudding - a phrase which here means that his published work and recorded statements condemn him.

Take his position on Israel, where he has both argued for the relocation of the entire Palestinian population AND argued against it as inhumane and impractical.

Or his completely junky published history. Seriously, have you read any of his books?

Was it fun watching him making Piers Morgan look stupid? Sure. But then... Piers Morgan. That's not a high bar to clear.

by **Donut section** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:32 pm

Haven't heard much from him but he's not bad.

I'm not a fan of his abortion stance though.

by **Ifreann** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:33 pm

Ben Shapiro is a person who exists, probably.

That's all I got.

by **Infected Mushroom** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:42 pm

Never heard of him.

His name sounds like a hitman though.

by **Ifreann** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:46 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:Never heard of him.

His name sounds like a hitman though.

Don't you think that hitmen would have names that don't sound like hitmen, the better to avoid police attention?

by **Xiaodong** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:52 pm

Ben Shapiro is neither an intellectual heavyweight nor very original. If you read his stuff, its fairly standard right wing fluff - go to any post-9/11 right wing thinker and they'll likely have very similar opinions to Shapiro.

However, he is a very good debater and use debating tricks to take control of a debate - if you listen to him debate, he looks like he's winning. Any debater will be good if they copy Shapiro's tactics (some of which are in a handy summary here).

by **Grave_n_idle** » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:53 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:Never heard of him.

His name sounds like a hitman though.

Don't you think that hitmen would have names that don't sound like hitmen, the better to avoid police attention?

If I was a hitman, I'd change my name to Fairy Rhubarb.

And I'd wear a clown outfit everywhere.

No one would ever suspect me of being a hitman.

What is the general consensus on Ben Shapiro?

What is the general consensus on Ben Shapiro?

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